[Archived] Times article

[jim mk2]

Yet it is not slander or libel if it is true what is printed. There is more than enough evidence that could be put into print, that would not be either libel or slander. Yet still nobody dares put the truth into print. The FA / prem all know the truth, yet also do nothing.

Protests were always doomed to fail. For one simple reason. Outside of the town of Blackburn and the Rovers fan base - nobody really gives a dam. To the media it is just a story to make a buck from. Folk will only care when the club they support suffers the same as clubs such as Pompey and Rovers.

But the powers that be will continue to remain silent and do nothing. Yet often they charge managers etc for bringing the game into disrepute for speaking out against a refs performance.

But it is the powers that be that bring the game into disrepute. When the head is sick, the rest of the body will be also. The corruption in football starts at the top and works itself down - sadly I can't ever see that picture ever changing.

Protest brought attention to the club's plight just like the booings at matches. They did not achieve their aims because they did not go far enough.

Please explain how doing absolutely nothing and not protesting while pontificating from the south coast helped the cause ?

[Roverall]

The willingness of so many thousands to sit and take the stab wounds from Team Kean and his Puppet Master was sickening to those with a few brain cells.

I mean, if you were to target a club whose fan base would allow such defilement, you couldn't do much better than Rovers could you?

[J*B]

If what happened to us happened at Newcastle, Millwall and the like there would have been full scale riots. If it happened in Madrid, or Argentina, there would have been deaths. The fact that when push came to shove, most people where too upset about their "group", and not being willing to back active protests to hold a position and appease "members", is shambolic. It didn't take a genius to see what was happening. A real effort would have made Anderson, SEM and Kean's position 'untenable' whilst we where still a premiership side. But instead we all squabbled between each other.

"We don't believing negativity in the stands whilst games are happening will do any good whatsoever." - BULLSHIT.

We where totally @#/? the minute we stayed up at Wolves and Kean span it as a success story. First pre season game should have been electrified with passion and hatred toward what was going on behind the scenes. But no. We'll protest by walking from a pub to the ground. And no more than 500 will even bother doing that. Because that will REALLY tell them. We should have been blocking Kean from entering Brockhall. No sodding wonder he span it as 1%. He had a point. Whilst 95% wanted him gone, only 1% would attempt to stop him.

Congratulations to every person that stood outside Brockhall that cold, wet 24 hours. At least you tried. All 15 of you.

[jim mk2]

Good stuff J*B. You're a throwback to the 1970s.

[J*B]

Good stuff J*B. You're a throwback to the 1970s.

You should see my haircut.

[PAFELL]

People who were always against protesting, would say that Pafell. I seem to remember the argument at the time wasn't because no-one would listen, it was because it would affect the players. If more people had been prepared to stand up and shout louder (and I include myself in this), then we might not be facing the avalanche about to hit us. One thing is obvious, - not protesting, did nothing to divert the avalanche.

Because only the powers that be, the FA / PREM, could have done something. but as with all other clubs they did and will continue to do nothing. Yes I did believe in match protests would effect things on the pitch. I was always against in match protests.

But I also believed all protests were futile. The FA / PREM are only interested in protecting the game, not individual clubs. But until pressure is brought against the FA etc - we will always have venky type owners in the game. It is the pathetic fit and proper ownership test that allows these folk to own football clubs. Until that is addressed the same thing will happen over and over again.

[Leonard Venkhater]

Protest brought attention to the club's plight just like the booings at matches. They did not achieve their aims because they did not go far enough.

Please explain how doing absolutely nothing and not protesting while pontificating from the south coast helped the cause ?

An interesting point, this one. I often used to wonder things like: how many would it have taken to invade the pitch to get a match abandoned? how many should have boycotted a TV game to make a real impression..etc

A significant, enabling condition for the dark lord those( closer to home) doing the abuse was ( and is) the divided fan base.This was achieved and maintained through spin, secrecy, but also- ironically- supporters wanting to apply normal football supporting standards to what was a disgracefully abnormal situation.etc..etc...

BUT the only real questions that matter NOW is ....knowing what we know ...what should be the aims of the fan base and what should fans do to attain these aims? ...how do Rovers fans get a consensus, when -even on this very site- they are in conflict, sarcastically dismissing and de-valuing those with different opinions?

Discuss...

[thenodrog]

.... First pre season game should have been electrified with passion and hatred toward what was going on behind the scenes. But no. We'll protest by walking from a pub to the ground. And no more than 500 will even bother doing that. Because that will REALLY tell them. We should have been blocking Kean from entering Brockhall. No sodding wonder he span it as 1%. He had a point. Whilst 95% wanted him gone, only 1% would attempt to stop him.

Congratulations to every person that stood outside Brockhall that cold, wet 24 hours. At least you tried. All 15 of you.

No rain but there was a bloody cold one at ewood I rem. I did a 3 hour shift on a Fri night and it was like being locked in a bloody freezer. Fair play to anyone who stayed longer.

Didn't do the slightest bit of good mind.

[jim mk2]

Because only the powers that be, the FA / PREM, could have done something. but as with all other clubs they did and will continue to do nothing. Yes I did believe in match protests would effect things on the pitch. I was always against in match protests.

But I also believed all protests were futile. The FA / PREM are only interested in protecting the game, not individual clubs. But until pressure is brought against the FA etc - we will always have venky type owners in the game. It is the pathetic fit and proper ownership test that allows these folk to own football clubs. Until that is addressed the same thing will happen over and over again.

It's a jolly good thing that Emily Pankhurst and the woman who threw herself under the Queen's horse were around 100+ years ago otherwise women still wouldn't have the vote. Protest is good, protest is right, and if peaceful protest doesn't work then protest has to get stronger. Pitch invasions and the like wouldn't have forced the FA to reform the ownership rules but they would have brought to the world's attention the insanity going on at Ewood and just might have frightened the owners into acting differently and maybe selling. As it was we went down with a whimper. And I expect you are very pleased.

[thenodrog]

It's a jolly good thing that Emily Pankhurst and the woman who threw herself under the Queen's horse were around 100+ years ago otherwise women still wouldn't have the vote. Protest is good, protest is right, and if peaceful protest doesn't work then protest has to get stronger.

Pity you didn't see fit to throw yourself under Madam Desai's roller Jim. Better luck next time she's here eh?

[PAFELL]

It's a jolly good thing that Emily Pankhurst and the woman who threw herself under the Queen's horse were around 100+ years ago otherwise women still wouldn't have the vote. Protest is good, protest is right, and if peaceful protest doesn't work then protest has to get stronger. Pitch invasions and the like wouldn't have forced the FA to reform the ownership rules but they would have brought to the world's attention the insanity going on at Ewood and just might have frightened the owners into acting differently and maybe selling. As it was we went down with a whimper. And I expect you are very pleased.

Yes you wanted folk to get a criminal record for invading the pitch - advocating such on a public messageboard is also a crime - Pitch invasions, if they had happened, would have eventually ended up with matches being played behind close doors. The powers that be would have protected themselves, as they always do.

It is the system that we have that is wrong. It is the system that allows for dodgy owners of football clubs. I have no intention of starting any debate of rights or wrongs of past protests - that was debated to death at the time.

Until pressure is put on the football authorities, things won't change. Possible the only way of that happening, is via parlimentary intervention.

[Waggy76]

The best protest is a boycott of the games ...

Pick a game and boycott it , should have been done when in Prem cos now nobody is bothered !

[Bucksrover]

From my understanding those looking to leech off our club like Anderson and Kean, then complete idiots like Shebby, have had Venky's ear throughout their ownership right up until Bowyer and Shaw have taken on running a football club by themselves. The english media, prominant managers like Ferguson, and the fans have been raising concern since Big Sam was sacked, but Anderson etc could have told Venky's anything they wanted about what was going on.

In hindsight, it might have been worth every fan refusing to go into Ewood after big Sam was sacked (the first crazy action) - before Williams went, before Etuhu, Murphy, Best, half of Portugal etc were given their contracts, when we were still a Premiership club. If we'd had 15000 stood outside an empty stadium, week after week they might have been prompted to look closer.

But no fan has screwed our club over. Anderson and Co. did that all by themselves.

[thenodrog]

Circular argument Pafell. Pitch invasions would put pressure on football authorities and parliamentarians alike, totally empty grounds too..... problem is BRFC would need scores of them to do that whilst the likes of Arsenal and MU would just need one.

Pretty soon we might all wish that the worm had turned and we had followed jim's advice..... although tbh I believe jim would be at the back pushing and marshalling others and when he was the last man not on the pitch would head for the safety of the concourse himself.

The best protest is a boycott of the games ...

Pick a game and boycott it , should have been done when in Prem cos now nobody is bothered !

I suggested that at the time but was met with suggestions ranging from .....

a. not showing proper support when 'the lads' were playing.

b. 'I've bought my ST so I will damned well use it'.

No matter, hindsight is a wonderful thing but it's all too late now.

[FGS5635]

Trouble is many didn't see this doom coming. I know many on here claim they did, but most never thought things would get this bad.

Yeah venkys were idiots, yeah kean was useless, but many didn't see 60 million plus debts and a club in absolute chaos.

If you don't visit MB's like this or use social media then you only really have sky sports or newspapers for info and neither of them painted the picture we know now.

[Rover_Shaun]

The best protest is a boycott of the games ...

Pick a game and boycott it , should have been done when in Prem cos now nobody is bothered !

Should have been the Arsenal home game or Man U. No point doing it against the lesser lights.

[jim mk2]

Yes you wanted folk to get a criminal record for invading the pitch - advocating such on a public messageboard is also a crime - Pitch invasions, if they had happened, would have eventually ended up with matches being played behind close doors. The powers that be would have protected themselves, as they always do.

It is the system that we have that is wrong. It is the system that allows for dodgy owners of football clubs. I have no intention of starting any debate of rights or wrongs of past protests - that was debated to death at the time.

Until pressure is put on the football authorities, things won't change. Possible the only way of that happening, is via parlimentary intervention.

Thousands of people wouldn't get arrested. And if matches were played behind closed doors - so what ? Another victory for the protesters in my book. Nothing is going to happen to change the "system" because there is too much money and too many powerful people have vested interests in the current set-up. Changing the system is not going to help Rovers now either. The problem is, the time has passed for fans to make a meaningful protest and we are now left with a meek acceptance of our fate. The bottom line is not enough fans care about the club to want to take strong action. I expect you find that very pleasing.

[FGS5635]

I think a decent % protested, the trouble is we don't have a large fanbase

[Rover_Shaun]

Edmund Burke - "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

[thenodrog]

Trouble is many didn't see this doom coming. I know many on here claim they did, but most never thought things would get this bad.

Yeah venkys were idiots, yeah kean was useless, but many didn't see 60 million plus debts and a club in absolute chaos.

If you don't visit MB's like this or use social media then you only really have sky sports or newspapers for info and neither of them painted the picture we know now.

Bloody hell FG!!!! I couldn't see it any other way. Rather ironic imo that you consider the venkys to be idiots.

BRFC became ..... a club totally addicted to Prem League income (and more from the Trust besides) with a costly infrastructure way in excess of gate receipts even before football salaries are entered into the equation, good players out the door and a number of overpaid and disgruntled key players renegotiated long contracts (by people with vested interest) with no relegation clauses (we have been led to believe) , a few thousand hard core supporters proven unwilling to pay half the going rate for Prem football, owners from half way around the globe who have completely and totally no previous link whatsoever with the club. KEY individuals disposed of like as many green bottles, and stupid expensive contracts given to a random collection of has beens and never ever will be's. We are following a runaway train.

A number on here knew that what we had was precious and that one slip could and likely would spew the lot and worse foretold what was coming (frequently to criticism and even derision). As one poster memorably put... "observing the events at BRFC is like watching a car full of close relatives crash in slow motion".

Tell me FG through all the events of that first few months just where tf did you think we were heading? Top 4 and CL qualification perhaps?

[den]

Edmund Burke - "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

Or.......

"When you get to Hasteengs, you haff conquered Eengland."

- Adolfo Hitler Austria 1942.

[yoda]

Bloody hell FG!!!! I couldn't see it any other way. Rather ironic imo that you consider the venkys to be idiots.

BRFC became ..... a club totally addicted to Prem League income (and more from the Trust besides) with a costly infrastructure way in excess of gate receipts even before football salaries are entered into the equation, good players out the door and a number of overpaid and disgruntled key players renegotiated long contracts (by people with vested interest) with no relegation clauses (we have been led to believe) , a few thousand hard core supporters proven unwilling to pay half the going rate for Prem football, owners from half way around the globe who have completely and totally no previous link whatsoever with the club. KEY individuals disposed of like as many green bottles, and stupid expensive contracts given to a random collection of has beens and never ever will be's. We are following a runaway train.

A number on here knew that what we had was precious and that one slip could and likely would spew the lot and worse foretold what was coming (frequently to criticism and even derision). As one poster memorably put... "observing the events at BRFC is like watching a car full of close relatives crash in slow motion".

Tell me FG through all the events of that first few months just where tf did you think we were heading? Top 4 and CL qualification perhaps?

I think he means to many had rose tinted glasses and had been spoon fed by Jack Walkers millions, they don't have the experience of the 60's, 70's and 80's to learn from, then again the really successful learn from other peoples strive

[FGS5635]

I said many where spoon fed the sky sports version of events, where the fans are idiots and everything is ok. LIS if you don't visit message boards or use social media then you know a fraction of what we know. Cant blame fans for that, that's just life. If you saw this day coming at the start then well done you, but Im not ashamed to admit I didn't and many many others didn't. I don't think it makes me or a lot of others any less of a fan. Touch naïve, maybe to much glass half full, but it is what it is.

[thenodrog]

I think he means to many had rose tinted glasses and had been spoon fed by Jack Walkers millions, they don't have the experience of the 60's, 70's and 80's to learn from, then again the really successful learn from other peoples strive

The difference between intelligence and wisdom is age isn't it yoda?

I said many where spoon fed the sky sports version of events, where the fans are idiots and everything is ok. LIS if you don't visit message boards or use social media then you know a fraction of what we know. Cant blame fans for that, that's just life. If you saw this day coming at the start then well done you, but Im not ashamed to admit I didn't and many many others didn't. I don't think it makes me or a lot of others any less of a fan. Touch naïve, maybe to much glass half full, but it is what it is.

I accept that. People learn most from mistakes but few admit it as you have done FG.

[yoda]

The difference between intelligence and wisdom is age isn't it yoda?

I accept that. People learn most from mistakes but few admit it as you have done FG.

In most cases

I would say that we are the next Accy Stanley (if we are lucky), on a bigger scale maybe but that won't be the case when someone pulls the plug