[Archived] Times article

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Out of everybody appalled at the way things began to take shape under Venkys then surely it was the Walker Trust/Family who had a good case for legal action. It was obvious early on that some terms of the sale were being ignored, even more so 12 mnths later when Barclays were threatening to pull the plug. I wonder if they ever considered doing anything ?

When did they ever give a @#/? anyway ?

[TBTF]

Then why put terms of sale in there if your not going to act when they are broken?

Well FG it made the act of selling a bit more pleasant in the PR stakes and much more presentable to the fans.

The fact is that over the last 3 years these idiot owners have proved not bothered about anything the fans have done or threaten to do.So all talk of what protests might have achieved is a bit academic really.Short of a nuclear attcak on Ewood not sure what would have given it the attention it deserved.

But we are stuck with these morons . We are completely at their mercy in every respect. The dont talk to anyone or reply to anything. They have been approached in friendly terms by the Ian's , by the Trust and by various politicians and local leaders and yet not a jot.

You really do wonder where thsi will end and more importantly , when will it end.But one thing is certain, as every day goes by, more and more fans are switching off and completely losing interest and we will soon be at a point where there is nothing left to save.

Like many mnay others i am completely and utterly at a loss with all this. What the feck are they still doing here??

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

I can never forget nor forgive the idiots sat in front of me who cried in protest like spoilt babies to the steward in the BBE to have their own supporters thrown out of the ground for having the cheek the wear Kean out shirts and unfolding a banner.

It made me cringe at the time and still does.

Shameful really and poor jack must be turning in his grave that his own family could let this happen

So much kean gone on I never even considered the trust/family in all of this

This.

20+ years of hard work on and off the field of play smashed to f'kin pieces..unforgivable.

[47er]

Agreed, I think all fans ideally should unite now. All stay aways in an ideal world would return and try and make ewood a fortress and help us possibly get promoted.

But you can also see why some stay away. Its just a messy situation

Its a pity fans were not united in protest......

Bit late for the "rah,rah,rah" bit now. Promotion? You're aving a laff.

Well yeah..........

John Williams was no great loss either.

And fans in the stands actually turning on those wanting Kean Out! Incredible.

[Bucksrover]

Agreed, I think all fans ideally should unite now. All stay aways in an ideal world would return and try and make ewood a fortress and help us possibly get promoted.

I agree with this, our club has been treated very badly, and maybe we are now in a financial spiral we won't get out of. But the only positive thing fans can do is go to matches and support.

[Leonard Venkhater]

Oh come on what Leonard????

OK, Theno, I apologise for the impatience of my reply.

I guess my problem with the post is in what it seems to imply:

1 that other, good, loyal, passionate Rovers fans have somehow lost the right to feel sorrow/anger towards the b****s, who have so damaged our club for their own greedy ends.

2 that the author is somehow superior, more worldly wise, more deserving (?)than other supporters, who genuinely did not see the enormity of the crimes until later.

3 that the responsibility for this tragedy belongs to those supporters, who did not protest, rather than the real enemy.

It is important not to underestimate the power of secrecy, disinformation and lies in deceiving so many fans and creating the setting for the abuse.

Most of all, my concern about this post -like so many other similar posts-is that its messages only serve to maintain the damaging divide in the fanbase-between the deserving, righteous, worldly wise, and the undeserving.

We really do have to find a way for us all to be on the same side against the real enemy.

Love,

Leonard!

[FGS5635]

You really cant underestimate how little you actually know if you don't do message boards or social media. I've only started posting on here very recently really and I've learned a lot about the whole mess I never knew or considered and I had twitter at the height of the mess and followed a lot of rovers guys including a lot of the protesters. Newspapers and sky really don't give you anything for the obvious legal threats etc and the culprits having access to the media

[tomphil]

When did they ever give a keans anyway ?

I think one or two of them did but those one or two were powerless in the grand scheme of things. I was thinking it would be more of a business/legal thing i.e the pride aspect and reputation aspect. The Trust sell under certain assurances then those are ignored or overturned as soon as the buying business gets it's feet under the table and all the snouts in the trough. You'd assume it's been sold in good faith and it makes them look a little stupid never mind angry that all their millions and steady work of their colleagues over 20 years was being ripped up. Venkys were taking the p##s out of them as well.

[FGS5635]

Was the trust made up of all family members?

[Leonard Venkhater]

You really cant underestimate how little you actually know if you don't do message boards or social media. I've only started posting on here very recently really and I've learned a lot about the whole mess I never knew or considered and I had twitter at the height of the mess and followed a lot of rovers guys including a lot of the protesters. Newspapers and sky really don't give you anything for the obvious legal threats etc and the culprits having access to the media

Me too!

[tomphil]

You really cant underestimate how little you actually know if you don't do message boards or social media. I've only started posting on here very recently really and I've learned a lot about the whole mess I never knew or considered and I had twitter at the height of the mess and followed a lot of rovers guys including a lot of the protesters. Newspapers and sky really don't give you anything for the obvious legal threats etc and the culprits having access to the media

Well pointed out. That was a big problem. I have friends who are Rovers mad yet just don't bother for whatever their reasons with internet MB's etc. A lot just weren't aware of the dubious goings on behind the scenes. Lost count of the times i talked about stuff and they just stand there looking bemused.

[tomphil]

Was the trust made up of all family members?

As far as im aware not all family members. Mainly some Jacks long term business colleagues / lawyers / accountants etc as well as probably a few prominent family members. Although i stress that's as far as im aware. Sadly im not one of em lol

[thenodrog]

2 that the author is somehow superior, more worldly wise, more deserving (?)than other supporters, who genuinely did not see the enormity of the crimes until later.

This.

If you had been around here in 2010/2011 you would hardly have believed the crap that was dished out on here to people who dared to criticise and question the methods and motives of the new owners and the key players, never mind those that actually took part in the protests. Some wounds still fester. As with the law of the land ignorance is no defence. If you don't believe me go back and read some of the threads from that time.

I'd like to think lessons have been learned but I'd be dreaming.

[Stuart]

This.

If you had been around here in 2010/2011 you would hardly have believed the crap that was dished out on here to people who dared to criticise and question the methods and motives of the new owners and the key players, never mind those that actually took part in the protests. Some wounds still fester. As with the law of the land ignorance is no defence. If you don't believe me go back and read some of the threads from that time.

I'd like to think lessons have been learned but I'd be dreaming.

I was trying to think of a way to post similar without getting into my usual ranting. Although I think 'superior' is the wrong word.

The protesters were right and the apologists were wrong.

It's noticeable too that the main ones who dished it out have gone very quiet indeed. They backed the wrong horse(s) and just want to slip away into the background.

People are posting on a mb to people who DID have access to info, strong rumour and COULD make their mind up. I feel no sympathy to those who were ignorant and now feel enlightened. Some of the posts from some folk this week have been almost insulting.

It's too late.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

IMO part of the problem was that there was so much c*** written at the time it was difficult to distinguish between what was true and what was total rubbish. If you believed everything written on here we would have been in administration at least 5 times, the Venkys would have sold all our players twice over and Kean would now be back up in Glasgow running the mob up there.

There has also been constant references to a smoking gun type dossier that was to be released at least twelve months ago.

Yes - unfortunately lots has turned out to be true - but it is only a small percentage of some of the rubbish that has hit social media that has shown to be rubbish.

[FGS5635]

lol some fans have such high opinions of themselves

I was trying to think of a way to post similar without getting into my usual ranting. Although I think 'superior' is the wrong word.

The protesters were right and the apologists were wrong.

It's noticeable too that the main ones who dished it out have gone very quiet indeed. They backed the wrong horse(s) and just want to slip away into the background.

People are posting on a mb to people who DID have access to info, strong rumour and COULD make their mind up. I feel no sympathy to those who were ignorant and now feel enlightened. Some of the posts from some folk this week have been almost insulting.

It's too late.

Booo hooo dont be so mean, we all come on here looking for your sympathy...dont deny us.

[thenodrog]

lol some fans have such high opinions of themselves

True ..... and some have very low opinions of others.

[FGS5635]

True ..... and some have very low opinions of others.

Touche

[thenodrog]

IMO part of the problem was that there was so much c*** written at the time it was difficult to distinguish between what was true and what was total rubbish. If you believed everything written on here we would have been in administration at least 5 times, the Venkys would have sold all our players twice over and Kean would now be back up in Glasgow running the mob up there.

Grief! Let the scales fall from thine eyes DTMP. What is the matter with your instincts?

There was plenty of evidence that was not heresay. We should all have had our guards raised and our wits sharpened re: the precarious nature of our position as a small town, small time club surviving in the bear pit of the Prem by our recent experience of the ludicrous appointment of Paul Ince. Good God.. JW's embarrassed demeanour at Ince's press conference made me doubt whether JW had even met him previously. But for the appointment of Allardyce the season almost ended in relegation (as I predicted widely at the time of Ince's appointment to all manner of criticism from amongst the Rovers Fans on here).

BUT I'm intruiged. Why do you need someone else to tell you that ....

1. The embarrassment brought on the club by Mrs D's statement that 4/5m pa would be enough for CL qualification was just wrong?

2. That the rumours surrounding Maradona and Beckham etc were just wrong?

3. The appearence of Balaji on the pitch was just wrong?

4. That the summary dismissal of one of the most experienced managers in the Prem and a man who was perfectly qualified to manage a small club on a shoestring budget was just wrong?

5. That the involvement of Anderson conducting contractual business and player signings was just wrong? His role should have been to find talent and thats that... not negotiate their contracts and deal with their middle men to boot.

6. That the disposal of JW was just wrong?

7. Ditto Tom Finn was just wrong?

8. Ditto Martin Goodman was just wrong?

9. That the effective sacking of EHD at the apparent behest of an opposing manager was just wrong? Warnock just provided a convenient excuse for the pair of them to get rid of Sams man.

10. The record losing streak and plummet down the Prem with what had been a mid table squad was just wrong ?

11. The disposal of our 5 strongest players who stood tallest during our spring escape act namely Jones and Jones with obvious disgruntlement and a decidedly terminal feeling about Hoillet, N'Zonzi and Samba was just wrong?

All bad news, one after another with not one bit of good! I had had enough of lies and deceit and at this point I decided that I would not renew my ST and show any support for the venky circus whatsoever yet incredibly still the the town was full of people who did not even admit to seeing a glimpse of the writing that was on the wall! I doubt some have even now.

[FGS5635]

People get different things out of football clubs. To some its just a hobbie or weekend entertainement. None of this matters to them. If it stops being fun they will just find a new hobbie.

Thats just life, people dont all care the exact same amount. I suspect a good many dont even know who Tom Finn is or care for that matter. You cant expect your passion and commitment to rovers from everyone who passes through the turnstile, its just not realistic

[Majiball]

Surely just by going throughthe turnstiles week in week out every fan is showing their commitment to the club? Everyone cares about Rovers, said care will just transpire in different ways. Does every fan jump up and punch the air when we score? Do some sit and smile? Even those who have left have done so because they care about the club, they have just reacted differently to those that have stayed.

PS It truly doesn't matter who predicted what, all that matters now is we find common ground so we as a fanbase can move forward and aid the coming situation.

[K-Hod]

Talk about being wise after the event! Some utter tripe being spewed on here.

NOBODY could have foreseen just how catastrophic Venky's stewardship would have been, unless your pal Doc Brown was lending you his Delorean!

As for the people getting all 'high and mighty' that did nothing themselves, but criticise others for 'not being passionate' enough for not invading the pitch et al, you're absolutely full of it. In the 80s, there weren't cameras everywhere, and it wasn't the age of information that we have now, where information spreads like wildfire via social media and the web.

Think back to the London riots- how many convictions were there MONTHS later?

This is all the fault of Venky's, Steve Kean, and Jerome Anderson- and it's a disgrace that our own country's football association, would rather protect some faceless Indians with a bag of cash than one of its founder members.

As for the Premier League- they couldn't wait for us to be relegated so we were no longer their issue. Regardless of how palpable the beads of sweat were on Richard Scudamore's forehead when handed the information from BRFCAG (who by the way deserve a knighthood for all of their efforts).

Yet again, a club is about to go to the wall- and the criminals, owners and agents get away scott free and the fans have to suffer, pick up the pieces and rebuild. But it's alright, we'll just be a footnote in English football, as we deserved what's happened to us for not backing the worst manager in our club's history. I'm absolutely sick and tired of the mess our club is in, the bickering between fans about who's right for what they did or didn't think, gettting laughed at by football fans and the media alike, those clowns down the other end of the M65, but most of all, of being sick and tired.

Whatever happens, we are all Blackburn Rovers supporters, and all the 138 years of memories, tangible or intangible, can never be taken away from us.

ARTE ET LABORE

[yoda]

Surely just by going throughthe turnstiles week in week out every fan is showing their commitment to the club? Everyone cares about Rovers, said care will just transpire in different ways. Does every fan jump up and punch the air when we score? Do some sit and smile? Even those who have left have done so because they care about the club, they have just reacted differently to those that have stayed.

PS It truly doesn't matter who predicted what, all that matters now is we find common ground so we as a fanbase can move forward and aid the coming situation.

As normal fans all we can do is be very vocal and hope a large amount of money is forth coming from genuine sources, the doors in Pune are firmly shut though, what the lock is no one knows, maybe pride, saving face, heads buried in the floor behind the doors, Balajis bling trapped behind it, who knows

[Fife Rover]

Surely just by going throughthe turnstiles week in week out every fan is showing their commitment to the club? Everyone cares about Rovers, said care will just transpire in different ways. Does every fan jump up and punch the air when we score? Do some sit and smile? Even those who have left have done so because they care about the club, they have just reacted differently to those that have stayed.

PS It truly doesn't matter who predicted what, all that matters now is we find common ground so we as a fanbase can move forward and aid the coming situation.

Probably the most sensible post in this entire thread so far. Well said Majiball!

[onlyonejackwalker]

Decent article, but nothing we have not read, or known already.

As an aside and in line with other comments, back then I was actually accused of racism by more than one Rovers fan for daring to express my concerns and suggesting the new owners would relegate us after Allardyce was removed. Nasty comment without foundation. I was only wrong in thinking it would be the first season, not the second and I assure you it had nothing to do with skin colour.

Looking back I can't help feeling that so many of our fans were absolutely clueless to the possible implications of moronic owners and relegation from the top tier. I was banging my head in frustration trying to get all and sundry to understand that remaining in the PL was the only thing that mattered for the time being due to our perilous finances, small crowds, cheap tickets and the huge income it guaranteed to the club.

Many knew better however as they dreamed of a playing change, complete with pretty little triangles and pass and move football. Barely a whimper was raised at the sacking of a top rate, proven PL manager and the subsequent replacement with a drunken chancer, complete with his blank CV. In fact the decision was celebrated by way too many and suddenly we were lumbered with that total maniac and in complete freefall. Our fans have a lot to answer for in that respect, as too many wanted SA gone and were prepared to risk our PL survival in the hope of a more aesthetically pleasing viewing experience. Ask them to pay more for that realistic pleasure however and they would have baulked.

The saga continued and again somewhat bizarrely, many crazily thought we had immediately achieved the desired style of football under the classless one after beating a struggling Liverpool under Hodgson at home 3-1. Torres missed a sitter at the BE, I think they also missed a penalty, Hodgson was potted the following week, but still our fans swallowed the spin which followed the win.

So many of our supporters were taken in, hook line and sinker.

For me, it is ok now stating we all gather round, hold hands and unite for the common good, but in reality it is two years way too late. Most knew the vital importance of uniting the fan base way back then, at a time it may have helped, but for a myriad of reasons it proved impossible. Yes we can find common ground now. Pretty easy when there is little left to worry about or concern ourselves with, as we pick the bones off our rotting carcass.

I don't claim to a footballing oracle, but equally I am not going to sit here and pretend much of this was hard to figure or imagine and align myself with those who were unable to see past the end of their noses. Beckham, Ronaldinho, 5 million per window, Champions League football, sacking Allardyce, installing a nobody, selling our top players, removing the administration... the list goes on and on. Exactly what was confusing many of our fans? When things don't add up or make any sense at all there is normally a reason for that and as 'theno' said earlier when your spider sense starts tingling and natural instinct kicks in it is foolish to dismiss it.

Amazed by many of our fans this last year or two and it has become abundantly clear most of them know very little about professional football. Just saying it how it is.