[Archived] Brum, Brum, 29/12/13, the debate goes on!

[thenodrog]

Played some nice football today but we had left ourselves too much to do. At ht I reckond that the team bus must have run over a black cat. Brum seemed to score almost at will 1st half whilst JR hit the post and we had afew goal bound attempts blocked or saved, plus Dann missed the chance of the Month.

Just a bad day at the office all around.

[K-Hod]

Things have generally calmed down but once a rat always a rat (captain marvel Dann).

Let's hope he's the first to desert the sinking ship..

[FGS5635]

Let's hope he's the first to desert the sinking ship..

Disgrace what he did. Eastwood should have sparked him out.

[Howler]

Seriously left scratching my head after that match .

At half time I'd usually be fuming being 3-0 down , but not today .

First half we dominated the match , moved the ball well and was full of movement , yet conceded 3 goals out of nothing.

Not sure what the stats where first half , but possession wise it must of been really high in Rovers favour .

Second half was pretty much the same , Rovers dominant.

Birmingham did a serious Dick Turpin job on us , thanks to some insane defending and awful goalkeeping.

Positives , Marshall was outstanding second half and is looking much fitter, he is showing signs of getting his game back together .

Negatives - Williamson should be no-where near the first team and hopefully Bowyer learns lessons from that today .

1 point from 6 from these two home games is not good enough , Bowyers team selection and substitutions in both games is highly questionable.

After these two games , we will probably now beat Leeds , which shows where we are , heavily inconsistent

Sums up what I was going to write and saves me the job. We passed it round well at tmes In the 1st half and 3-0 was a travesty. Rhodes played well and his goals were typically clinical but should have buried a sitter in the first half at 2-0.

[JAL]

Gift any away team three goals in the first half without replying and its always going to be an up hill task.

Looking at it, Rovers desperately need a top keeper, ( the Birmingham keeper would be an improvement on our lot) then a new centre half to replace Dann.

Why on earth are Judge and Williamson in this league when they are clearly league one players at best is a mystery.

Gestede on today's showing, jumps up and misses the ball, has no positive attacking aspects to his game except hes tall.

Rochina very poor today.

Marshall average first half, got into a one on one with the defender then shot straight at the keeper when he should have scored though definitely more positive in the second half, though he was poor in defence when backing Spurr up.

Similar with Jordan Rhodes, first half when he should have scored from inside the six yard area only to hit the post then second half he scores two of which the second was a delightful chip over the Brum keeper - top class finish

[Paul]

Dann, Hanley and Rhodes will almost certainly go in the summer but I'd expect most of our other first team players to remain. I genuinely think we can be strong promotion contenders next season if GB continues to build, players cut out individual errors and we make a few astute signings.

So ship out a good central defensive partnership and the player who scores at least 50% of our goals and we have the makings of a very good team?

Bizarre.

Today was one of those days, it happens we all know it and no amount of analysis or navel gazing will change it. Play like that against Birmingham another 9 times and we would win them all.

Equally bizarre.

[rovers11]

Seriously left scratching my head after that match .

At half time I'd usually be fuming being 3-0 down , but not today .

First half we dominated the match , moved the ball well and was full of movement , yet conceded 3 goals out of nothing.

Not sure what the stats where first half , but possession wise it must of been really high in Rovers favour .

Second half was pretty much the same , Rovers dominant.

Birmingham did a serious Dick Turpin job on us , thanks to some insane defending and awful goalkeeping.

Positives , Marshall was outstanding second half and is looking much fitter, he is showing signs of getting his game back together .

Negatives - Williamson should be no-where near the first team and hopefully Bowyer learns lessons from that today .

1 point from 6 from these two home games is not good enough , Bowyers team selection and substitutions in both games is highly questionable.

After these two games , we will probably now beat Leeds , which shows where we are , heavily inconsistent

Brum had 33% possession first half and scored 3 goals. One of those freak results today. It would be far more worrying if they battered us and scored 3 goals but just one of those days where everything they hit went in. Fluke result

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

Just back from the game. 1st things 1st Dann is a disgrace and should be stripped of the captaincy. WTF he is hoping to achieve with eastwood there is mind blowing. Absolute keaning prat. Its debatable if the goal was even eastwoods fault, what hanley is doing there god only knows.

Dann needs to take a long hard look at himself. His performance was unacceptable. He was all at sea for the first goal and won nothing in the air all game. His passing (Rhodes goal apart) was absolute Kean. As for the complete miss kick at the end....

First goal was defensively shocking. The second was a worldie but followed a player losing a 50-50 then no one closing down (familiar story).

The third goal was the killer. Keeper should have come out and claimed it but Hanley just as responsible for goal. You're taught age 6 to put the ball in the stand if in any doubt. To play it back was suicidal.

Game itself was strange. They had some big lads who we couldn't cope with at set pieces. That aside, they offered little threat and looked shaky at the back. Rochina should have buried the early chance and we wasted a lot of good situations first half by taking an extra touch/pass instead of shooting.

Williamson was a waste of space. As others have said we can't play with THAT combination. Bowyer clearly wants us to knock it round yet all that Lowe/Williams do is play the ball back to the CB who then (yes you Dann) give it away. We looked much better when Cairney came deep to pick up the ball and carry it a bit.

Second half was a big improvement and it's fair to say we had a good go. Well done Marshall and Rhodes. Thought Gestede did well and caused them some problems. Judge looked lively as well.

All the stats suggest this was one of our most dominant home performances - Typical!

If I was Bowyer my first priority would be signing Cairney, my second would be signing a dominant warrior of a centre back - someone like Hudson from Cardiff. Going into the last five minutes you couldn't help but think...if only Hendry or Samba were up for this corner!

Finally, I heard Bowyers interview on RR after the game. He was prattling on about being cheered off today after losing - yet being booed off for drawing. Couldn't seem to get his head around it.

Simple Gary. In the second half today we had a really good go. We showed commitment and passion. All the things that were lacking on Thursday.

[bobbarton]

After the last two home games, against two poor sides, I am VERY concerned about GB as a a manger who can lead us to promotion.

poor team selection, poor substitutions, poor tactical awareness

Hopefully GB can reflect on these two games, see his shortcomings, realize the positives and develop as a manager.

even more worrying is the prospect of JR leaving in Jan....54% of goals would go with him and relegation would become a real prospect.

By the end of Jan our fate will not be sealed but I do believe we will know what it is to be....... i.e. GB's ability to be a successful manager and whether or not we've sold 54% of our league goals.

COYB
RTID

[rovers11]

So ship out a good central defensive partnership and the player who scores at Lear 50% of our goals and we have the makings of a very good team?

Bizarre.

Today was one of those days, it happens we all know it and no amount of analysis or navel gazing will change it. Play like that against Birmingham another 9 times and we would win them all.

Dann and Hanley are replaceable. Plenty of good central defenders out there and we ready have one in Kilgallon. It's about defending as a unit anyway.

Rhodes would obviously be harder to replace but if we could sign 2 or 3 strikers to replace his goals then we'd be ok. Best and DJ are hopeless and contribute nothing so it falls on Jordan to score all of our goals. If we could get rid of DJ, Best and reluctantly sell Rhodes then if we can sign 3 decent strikers then hopefully that will compensate for having 1 excellent striker and two useless ones. I also think his poor all round game contributes to a lack of goals from other parts of the team.

[adsfortheblues]

The comparisons to the Peterborough home game last season were very evident.

The team isn't good enough, get used to it people. Going forward we have one single player doing it all on his own and defensively we are a shambles, people can say "oh we have had so many clean sheets" but the matter of the fact is, we have been extremely lucky to keep so many clean sheets recently, it's more down to poor finishing from the opposition.

[EWOODACE1]

Absolute rubbish - no matter what your opinion of Lowe he never hides, always makes himself an option for a pass.

no he doesn't. Watch him closely and he hides from the ball unless he shows to first time pass it back to the central defender. I don't understand the obsession with some fans like yourself to defend one of our worst ever players till your blue in the face

[Paul]

Dann and Hanley are replaceable. Plenty of good central defenders out there and we ready have one in Kilgallon. It's about defending as a unit anyway.

Rhodes would obviously be harder to replace but if we could sign 2 or 3 strikers to replace his goals then we'd be ok. Best and DJ are hopeless and contribute nothing so it falls on Jordan to score all of our goals. If we could get rid of DJ, Best and reluctantly sell Rhodes then if we can sign 3 decent strikers then hopefully that will compensate for having 1 excellent striker and two useless ones. I also think his poor all round game contributes to a lack of goals from other parts of the team.

You believe Venkys are going to sanction the purchase of three strikers and two central defenders? Don't forget we need a keeper and a decent creative midfielder as well.

So that's 7 new first team players plus their salaries. According to you we already have the makings of a very good team but you want to buy a defence and strike force?

Like I said. Bizarre

[darrenrover]

After the last two home games, against two poor sides, I am VERY concerned about GB as a a manger who can lead us to promotion.

poor team selection, poor substitutions, poor tactical awareness

Hopefully GB can reflect on these two games, see his shortcomings, realize the positives and develop as a manager.

even more worrying is the prospect of JR leaving in Jan....54% of goals would go with him and relegation would become a real prospect.

By the end of Jan our fate will not be sealed but I do believe we will know what it is to be....... i.e. GB's ability to be a successful manager and whether or not we've sold 54% of our league goals.

COYB

RTID

What should GBs starting eleven today have been?

I thought it was a positive tbh and an effort to gain 3 points. I thought his team selection, tactics and substitutions today were spot on and far removed from Boxing Day.

For 45 minutes he was sadly let down by several of the starting eleven. You can't legislate for that but hopefully you can learn from it.

We need a couple of dominant characters, leaders in the team. Currently we don't have one. Dann's captaincy can only best be described as spineless!

[rovers11]

You believe Venkys are going to sanction the purchase of three strikers and two central defenders? Don't forget we need a keeper and a decent creative midfielder as well. So that's 7 new first team players plus their salaries. According to you we already have the makings of a very good team but you want to buy a defence and strike force? Like I said. Bizarre

If we sell those 2 centre halves and 3 strikers then, yes, of course we'll replace them. Venkys won't plough all the money from those sales to replace them coz we can't afford that but we will replace them.

Even without replacing them we have Kilgallon who is just as good as Dann so that covers that position. We also have Alex O`Connell who many at Rovers rate highly and think will be better than Hanley. DJ and Best offer nothing so any replacement for them will be an improvement. Rhodes` goals will be impossible to replace with one striker but hopefully can be shared around more.

Robbo will be sold and then we can bring in another GK on far less wages. Can't afford another Gk at the moment with robbo sitting on massive wages.

Cairney is a creative midfielder and will hopefully sign permanently. I agree that the creativity still needs adding to in the squad as without Dunn we don't have any magic.

[Waggy76]

Venkys out !

Until that happens everything is irrelavant ...

There will be no promotion only another relegation...within 18months.

They dont take their stwardship of the club seriously and never will. ?..

[JAL]

. We also have Alex O`Connell who many at Rovers rate highly and think will be better than Hanley.

Very worrying seeing someone post something like this, who are you and who at Rovers thinks hes better than Hanley.

Are you and the Dale fan two of Simon Conning plants by anychance ?

[Tom]

Eastwood again making a shocking mistake, he definitely isn't the answer and I would reluctantly bring back Kean until we can rush back Robinson.

I

So drop Eastwood for making a mistake and bring back Kean who makes them all the time, do we want to destroy all our keepers confidence?

Eastwoods mistake was a howler (with Hanley equally to blame) but he did make two world class saves after more poor defending

Either way each keeper has flaws but flip flopping between them after each mistake won't help anyone

[Majiball]

What happened to JAL's post i was trying to quote it and can't.

I wouldn't put it past him either.

[aletheia]

A few observations from today.

Is GB a slow learner? Playing Cairney out wide is pointless –he is neither a winger nor a player who wants to track back –he was blowing hard after 20. It seems he is trying hard to accommodate too many -Marshall/Cairney/Williamson –he has to be firmer. On Cairney, he is clearly better in the middle and let’s hope he stays. But let’s also not get carried away –today his first touch was often lacking and he is no Tugay in terms of vision.

Our fans don’t help at times. When we went 3-0 down, Brum simply sat deep with often 5 or even 6 across the back and invited us to take our best shot. Launching it quickly forward was pointless, yet fans were screaming behind me to ‘get it forward’ when the only way was to be patient, with the personnel we had on the pitch at the time. Any pass back to retain possession was treated by more screams. Second half was different with the introduction of Gestede as we then had the option to launch –in fact, that quickly seemed to become the only option, the more hysterical the crowd became.

The third goal was obviously a shocker in slow motion. Eastwood should have come but then Hanley could just have taken charge and found row Z. On the second goal –great strike but 2 things. It was a very long way out –Eastwood seemed to shuffle across very slowly. And where were those 2 defensive midfielders to snuff out the strike?

GB certainly needs to think more positively. The team needs 3 central players who can play in triangles comfortably –this has not been the case for a while. Also, it is painfully obvious that with Rhodes up front on his own, there HAS to be a competent player in the hole to offer options to the back 4 and Lowe. This also has been painfully lacking for a while.

[yoda's brother]

If we sell those 2 centre halves and 3 strikers then, yes, of course we'll replace them. Venkys won't plough all the money from those sales to replace them coz we can't afford that but we will replace them.

Even without replacing them we have Kilgallon who is just as good as Dann so that covers that position. We also have Alex O`Connell who many at Rovers rate highly and think will be better than Hanley. DJ and Best offer nothing so any replacement for them will be an improvement. Rhodes` goals will be impossible to replace with one striker but hopefully can be shared around more.

Robbo will be sold and then we can bring in another GK on far less wages. Can't afford another Gk at the moment with robbo sitting on massive wages.

Cairney is a creative midfielder and will hopefully sign permanently. I agree that the creativity still needs adding to in the squad as without Dunn we don't have any magic.

what makes you think the things in bold could happen. who would want them. and whats the point of selling our players to buy cheaper worse ones. decent replacements would cost more than we could get for our players anyway.

[rovers11]

what makes you think the things in bold could happen. who would want them. and whats the point of selling our players to buy cheaper worse ones. decent replacements would cost more than we could get for our players anyway.

Why would we sell those players? We can't afford them as they are on prem wages. Plus, DJ and Best offer nothing so why keep them. We could easily get cheaper and better result placements in for those two. Dann and Hanley are good championship defenders but are replaceable.

Who would want them? Well, yes you have a point there. Hanley is on a long term contract so would imagine he'd cost a fortune to buy. Not sure how long Dann has left on his contract but a lower prem team will probably buy him for 3m. DJ and Best will prob have to be paid off (or sacked!). Rhodes will also cost a fortune so, again, I'm not convinced anyone will pay the fee needed to buy him. Robbo is a decent gk so I imagine a few teams would take him on a free transfer.

[Majiball]

You say in your previous post sell them and replace and now say no-one will pay for them?

[yoda's brother]

Why would we sell those players? We can't afford them as they are on prem wages. Plus, DJ and Best offer nothing so why keep them. We could easily get cheaper and better result placements in for those two. Dann and Hanley are good championship defenders but are replaceable.

Who would want them? Well, yes you have a point there. Hanley is on a long term contract so would imagine he'd cost a fortune to buy. Not sure how long Dann has left on his contract but a lower prem team will probably buy him for 3m. DJ and Best will prob have to be paid off (or sacked!). Rhodes will also cost a fortune so, again, I'm not convinced anyone will pay the fee needed to buy him. Robbo is a decent gk so I imagine a few teams would take him on a free transfer.

but you can only sell players if someone wants them. not sure anybody would.

[Majiball]

but you can only sell players if someone wants them. not sure anybody would.

Dann was available for 3m ish in the summer and yet?