[Archived] Back Or Sack?

[thenodrog]

dont do faceache smartarse. didnt want ince especially after THAT unveiling comment about relegation

'faceache'?

Too bloody late then wasn't it?

Your late opposition to ince combined with your constant attempts to ridicule me over my suggestions to provide financially sustainable top level football to the people of the north west displays a chronic lack of vision.

Your overly simplistic commments are admirable in a way but no matter where you choose to stick your head the fact remains that we have a massive unsustainable debt. Effectively we are insolvent. How can that be addressed? If the worst happens which it easily could then what will your solution be? Support pne? Burnley perhaps? Or will you nail your colours to the mast of a big club of choice like i expect most ex BRFC fans will do?

[Al]

Beattie would most likely be another Berg. There is no evidence that he'll be anything special.

Berg never got a proper chance. Given a bit of time and the backing in the transfer market that the current manager has had he may have come good.

[tomphil]

Just think if they'd have let Berg have a bit of movement and bring in his own backroom staff it may have saved a 2 million compen payout. Another effort at doing something on the cheap spectacularly back fired, did they learn ? As if .

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

Berg never got a proper chance. Given a bit of time and the backing in the transfer market that the current manager has had he may have come good.

Played 10 Won 1 Drew 3 Lost 6

That is diabolical for a club that's just been relegated. Then add on that he he was sacked in what is practically a part-time league. Give Berg a bit of time and backing, we'd be in League 1 right now with even more debt.

Great player, shocking manager. One of thousands who've followed the same path. There's pretty much no correlation between playing ability and managing ability, and it always puzzles me when people assume there is.

[stanhillrover]

I find it astonishing that after what has gone on in the last three years and the massive improvement on and off the pitch that has taken place under Bowyer's management this year that so many people would be seemingly quite happy to get rid of him and jump on the merry go round once again. This season must have been far too boring!

12 months ago people were crying out for stability, organisation, a plan, a club that went about its business properly and general acceptance that rebuilding the club would take time. Here we are having spent the whole season on the fringes of the play-offs, with a young squad assembled in two transfer windows at little cost and has shown glimpses of being a very good Championship side. I seem to remember the vast majority of people last summer demanding Bowyer be given the job on a permanent basis, the owners went with him.

I would have to ask what has happened this season that has been so terrible that opinions seem to have changed so much. Presumably one factor is that we haven't secured a play-off place or won promotion. Compare and contrast the chaos at Blackburn over the last 3 years to the relative harmony and stability at places like Leicester, Burnley, Derby and there is your answer. All those clubs have been at this level for years and have assembled settled squads.

People keep referring to the 'promotion or bust' theory. I would suggest that the actions of the club over the last 12 months suggest the opposite. Nothing that the manager/board/owners have said or done suggests that Armageddon awaits next season if we don't go up. Action has been taken to drastically reduce the wage bill, and will continue wherever possible. Bowyer's signings have all been players who have been on a Championship wage, which seems a more sensible approach. Most theories about the clubs finances are based on guesswork and speculation. The truth is only really Venkys know, but they are still here and covering costs.

Frankly some of the suggestions of replacements for Bowyer in the event he is sacked are laughable. It seems some people simply obliterate recent history from their memories and hark back to the 80s when Kendall came in or a decade ago when Hughes came in. Since then we've have Ince (success as a lower league manager), Kean (no mark coach), Berg (legendary player) and Appleton (highly rated young manager). All four were unmitigated disasters during their time at the club.

Yet people on here are advocating sacking Bowyer and replacing him with James Beattie or Keith Hill! Beattie has done well to keep Stanley up by the skin of their teeth after a disastrous start, but so far really has done no more than Coleman, Cook or Richardson before him. Hill has done very well in League Two with Rochdale but was last seen in the Championship when he was sacked with Barnsley adrift at the bottom of the league.

Other than their Rovers connections there is little that sets Hill/Beattie aside from other League Two managers. We might as well start looking at Wayne Burnett from Dagenham or Gary Rowett at Burton if a good season in League Two is the acid test for becoming the next Blackburn Rovers manager.

Bowyer has done well this season, and deserves the chance to keep making progress.

[yoda's brother]

'faceache'?

Too bloody late then wasn't it?

Your late opposition to ince combined with your constant attempts to ridicule me over my suggestions to provide financially sustainable top level football to the people of the north west displays a chronic lack of vision.

Your overly simplistic commments are admirable in a way but no matter where you choose to stick your head the fact remains that we have a massive unsustainable debt. Effectively we are insolvent. How can that be addressed? If the worst happens which it easily could then what will your solution be? Support pne? Burnley perhaps? Or will you nail your colours to the mast of a big club of choice like i expect most ex BRFC fans will do?

didnt want ince at all but his comments proved my doubts.

you know exactly what i would do as we have been here before. i would do my gardening. no interest at all in any other club.

As you put it to me a while ago. i (me) am a rovers fan not a football fan.

[No Nay Never]

I find it astonishing that after what has gone on in the last three years and the massive improvement on and off the pitch that has taken place under Bowyer's management this year that so many people would be seemingly quite happy to get rid of him and jump on the merry go round once again. This season must have been far too boring!

12 months ago people were crying out for stability, organisation, a plan, a club that went about its business properly and general acceptance that rebuilding the club would take time. Here we are having spent the whole season on the fringes of the play-offs, with a young squad assembled in two transfer windows at little cost and has shown glimpses of being a very good Championship side. I seem to remember the vast majority of people last summer demanding Bowyer be given the job on a permanent basis, the owners went with him.

I would have to ask what has happened this season that has been so terrible that opinions seem to have changed so much. Presumably one factor is that we haven't secured a play-off place or won promotion. Compare and contrast the chaos at Blackburn over the last 3 years to the relative harmony and stability at places like Leicester, Burnley, Derby and there is your answer. All those clubs have been at this level for years and have assembled settled squads.

People keep referring to the 'promotion or bust' theory. I would suggest that the actions of the club over the last 12 months suggest the opposite. Nothing that the manager/board/owners have said or done suggests that Armageddon awaits next season if we don't go up. Action has been taken to drastically reduce the wage bill, and will continue wherever possible. Bowyer's signings have all been players who have been on a Championship wage, which seems a more sensible approach. Most theories about the clubs finances are based on guesswork and speculation. The truth is only really Venkys know, but they are still here and covering costs.

Frankly some of the suggestions of replacements for Bowyer in the event he is sacked are laughable. It seems some people simply obliterate recent history from their memories and hark back to the 80s when Kendall came in or a decade ago when Hughes came in. Since then we've have Ince (success as a lower league manager), Kean (no mark coach), Berg (legendary player) and Appleton (highly rated young manager). All four were unmitigated disasters during their time at the club.

Yet people on here are advocating sacking Bowyer and replacing him with James Beattie or Keith Hill! Beattie has done well to keep Stanley up by the skin of their teeth after a disastrous start, but so far really has done no more than Coleman, Cook or Richardson before him. Hill has done very well in League Two with Rochdale but was last seen in the Championship when he was sacked with Barnsley adrift at the bottom of the league.

Other than their Rovers connections there is little that sets Hill/Beattie aside from other League Two managers. We might as well start looking at Wayne Burnett from Dagenham or Gary Rowett at Burton if a good season in League Two is the acid test for becoming the next Blackburn Rovers manager.

Bowyer has done well this season, and deserves the chance to keep making progress.

Wayne Burnett for me! Ex Rover and one of Kenny's first signings

[ABBEY]

I find it astonishing that after what has gone on in the last three years and the massive improvement on and off the pitch that has taken place under Bowyer's management this year that so many people would be seemingly quite happy to get rid of him and jump on the merry go round once again. This season must have been far too boring!

12 months ago people were crying out for stability, organisation, a plan, a club that went about its business properly and general acceptance that rebuilding the club would take time. Here we are having spent the whole season on the fringes of the play-offs, with a young squad assembled in two transfer windows at little cost and has shown glimpses of being a very good Championship side. I seem to remember the vast majority of people last summer demanding Bowyer be given the job on a permanent basis, the owners went with him.

I would have to ask what has happened this season that has been so terrible that opinions seem to have changed so much. Presumably one factor is that we haven't secured a play-off place or won promotion. Compare and contrast the chaos at Blackburn over the last 3 years to the relative harmony and stability at places like Leicester, Burnley, Derby and there is your answer. All those clubs have been at this level for years and have assembled settled squads.

People keep referring to the 'promotion or bust' theory. I would suggest that the actions of the club over the last 12 months suggest the opposite. Nothing that the manager/board/owners have said or done suggests that Armageddon awaits next season if we don't go up. Action has been taken to drastically reduce the wage bill, and will continue wherever possible. Bowyer's signings have all been players who have been on a Championship wage, which seems a more sensible approach. Most theories about the clubs finances are based on guesswork and speculation. The truth is only really Venkys know, but they are still here and covering costs.

Frankly some of the suggestions of replacements for Bowyer in the event he is sacked are laughable. It seems some people simply obliterate recent history from their memories and hark back to the 80s when Kendall came in or a decade ago when Hughes came in. Since then we've have Ince (success as a lower league manager), Kean (no mark coach), Berg (legendary player) and Appleton (highly rated young manager). All four were unmitigated disasters during their time at the club.

Yet people on here are advocating sacking Bowyer and replacing him with James Beattie or Keith Hill! Beattie has done well to keep Stanley up by the skin of their teeth after a disastrous start, but so far really has done no more than Coleman, Cook or Richardson before him. Hill has done very well in League Two with Rochdale but was last seen in the Championship when he was sacked with Barnsley adrift at the bottom of the league.

Other than their Rovers connections there is little that sets Hill/Beattie aside from other League Two managers. We might as well start looking at Wayne Burnett from Dagenham or Gary Rowett at Burton if a good season in League Two is the acid test for becoming the next Blackburn Rovers manager.

Bowyer has done well this season, and deserves the chance to keep making progress.

I stopped reading at the 2nd Stabilty .

[Al]

Played 10 Won 1 Drew 3 Lost 6

That is diabolical for a club that's just been relegated. Then add on that he he was sacked in what is practically a part-time league. Give Berg a bit of time and backing, we'd be in League 1 right now with even more debt.

Great player, shocking manager. One of thousands who've followed the same path. There's pretty much no correlation between playing ability and managing ability, and it always puzzles me when people assume there is.

10 matches with no transfer window is no way to judge a manager especially following the creep that he did. He was never given a chance. What happened before is of no consequence once it was decided to give him the gig.

[RibbleValleyRover]

I wonder what those that keep preaching this stability mantra are going to say when the club falls off the cliff and into the abyss. On the current path It's coming, it might not happen at the end of this season or even the following season but it will eventually happen unless the club sees some major improvement on the pitch and a promotion pretty soon. You just can't keep racking up the debt that this club is currently doing.

On Bowyer he should never have gotten the job unopposed in the first place. There should have been a proper managerial search and interview process (which Bowyer could have applied for) to find the right man to meet the club's objectives. One win in seven and a defence leaking goals for fun at the 'business end' of the season, it's just not good enough.

[martonrover]

I find it astonishing that after what has gone on in the last three years and the massive improvement on and off the pitch that has taken place under Bowyer's management this year that so many people would be seemingly quite happy to get rid of him and jump on the merry go round once again. This season must have been far too boring!

12 months ago people were crying out for stability, organisation, a plan, a club that went about its business properly and general acceptance that rebuilding the club would take time. Here we are having spent the whole season on the fringes of the play-offs, with a young squad assembled in two transfer windows at little cost and has shown glimpses of being a very good Championship side. I seem to remember the vast majority of people last summer demanding Bowyer be given the job on a permanent basis, the owners went with him.

I would have to ask what has happened this season that has been so terrible that opinions seem to have changed so much. Presumably one factor is that we haven't secured a play-off place or won promotion. Compare and contrast the chaos at Blackburn over the last 3 years to the relative harmony and stability at places like Leicester, Burnley, Derby and there is your answer. All those clubs have been at this level for years and have assembled settled squads.

People keep referring to the 'promotion or bust' theory. I would suggest that the actions of the club over the last 12 months suggest the opposite. Nothing that the manager/board/owners have said or done suggests that Armageddon awaits next season if we don't go up. Action has been taken to drastically reduce the wage bill, and will continue wherever possible. Bowyer's signings have all been players who have been on a Championship wage, which seems a more sensible approach. Most theories about the clubs finances are based on guesswork and speculation. The truth is only really Venkys know, but they are still here and covering costs.

Frankly some of the suggestions of replacements for Bowyer in the event he is sacked are laughable. It seems some people simply obliterate recent history from their memories and hark back to the 80s when Kendall came in or a decade ago when Hughes came in. Since then we've have Ince (success as a lower league manager), Kean (no mark coach), Berg (legendary player) and Appleton (highly rated young manager). All four were unmitigated disasters during their time at the club.

Yet people on here are advocating sacking Bowyer and replacing him with James Beattie or Keith Hill! Beattie has done well to keep Stanley up by the skin of their teeth after a disastrous start, but so far really has done no more than Coleman, Cook or Richardson before him. Hill has done very well in League Two with Rochdale but was last seen in the Championship when he was sacked with Barnsley adrift at the bottom of the league.

Other than their Rovers connections there is little that sets Hill/Beattie aside from other League Two managers. We might as well start looking at Wayne Burnett from Dagenham or Gary Rowett at Burton if a good season in League Two is the acid test for becoming the next Blackburn Rovers manager.

Bowyer has done well this season, and deserves the chance to keep making progress.

Massive improvement on and off the pitch?

Totally disagree.

A bit quieter off it, (but still made a ridiculous boardroom appointment in Myers), and mediocrity on it.

[mattjansen]

Massive improvement on and off the pitch?

Totally disagree.

A bit quieter off it, (but still made a ridiculous boardroom appointment in Myers), and mediocrity on it.

Who in their right mind would choose the squad we had in april last year compared to the present?

[Parsonblue]

I find it astonishing that after what has gone on in the last three years and the massive improvement on and off the pitch that has taken place under Bowyer's management this year that so many people would be seemingly quite happy to get rid of him and jump on the merry go round once again. This season must have been far too boring!

12 months ago people were crying out for stability, organisation, a plan, a club that went about its business properly and general acceptance that rebuilding the club would take time. Here we are having spent the whole season on the fringes of the play-offs, with a young squad assembled in two transfer windows at little cost and has shown glimpses of being a very good Championship side. I seem to remember the vast majority of people last summer demanding Bowyer be given the job on a permanent basis, the owners went with him.

I would have to ask what has happened this season that has been so terrible that opinions seem to have changed so much. Presumably one factor is that we haven't secured a play-off place or won promotion. Compare and contrast the chaos at Blackburn over the last 3 years to the relative harmony and stability at places like Leicester, Burnley, Derby and there is your answer. All those clubs have been at this level for years and have assembled settled squads.

People keep referring to the 'promotion or bust' theory. I would suggest that the actions of the club over the last 12 months suggest the opposite. Nothing that the manager/board/owners have said or done suggests that Armageddon awaits next season if we don't go up. Action has been taken to drastically reduce the wage bill, and will continue wherever possible. Bowyer's signings have all been players who have been on a Championship wage, which seems a more sensible approach. Most theories about the clubs finances are based on guesswork and speculation. The truth is only really Venkys know, but they are still here and covering costs.

Frankly some of the suggestions of replacements for Bowyer in the event he is sacked are laughable. It seems some people simply obliterate recent history from their memories and hark back to the 80s when Kendall came in or a decade ago when Hughes came in. Since then we've have Ince (success as a lower league manager), Kean (no mark coach), Berg (legendary player) and Appleton (highly rated young manager). All four were unmitigated disasters during their time at the club.

Yet people on here are advocating sacking Bowyer and replacing him with James Beattie or Keith Hill! Beattie has done well to keep Stanley up by the skin of their teeth after a disastrous start, but so far really has done no more than Coleman, Cook or Richardson before him. Hill has done very well in League Two with Rochdale but was last seen in the Championship when he was sacked with Barnsley adrift at the bottom of the league.

Other than their Rovers connections there is little that sets Hill/Beattie aside from other League Two managers. We might as well start looking at Wayne Burnett from Dagenham or Gary Rowett at Burton if a good season in League Two is the acid test for becoming the next Blackburn Rovers manager.

Bowyer has done well this season, and deserves the chance to keep making progress.

Couldn't agree more stanhillrover. I find it staggering that some folk want to roll the dice again just as we seem to be getting some stability within the dressing room.

[Al]

Couldn't agree more stanhillrover. I find it staggering that some folk want to roll the dice again just as we seem to be getting some stability within the dressing room.

That bloody word again. AAARRRGGGHHHH!!!

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

How much time and how many new players did Allardyce need to sort out the Ince mess? None and barely any.

How much did Souness need to sort out Kidd's mess? None and barely any.

Phrases like "give him time to assemble a squad/put his stamp on the team/get rid of the deadwood" are just plain old fashioned excuses. And as for stability...ahhhhh!

[den]

Stability in the dressing room? What's that mean?

[broadsword]

Hardcore, foundations and concrete?

[perthblue02]

Stability in the dressing room? What's that mean?

Folded cardboard under the benches and treatment table rather than getting somebody in to fix it properly?

[roversfan99]

For the first few months, I can understand that he was trying to settle in his new team.

Its the last few months that have irritated me about him:

He still looks no closer to stumbling upon a style of play.

He never seems to learn from his mistakes even now.

We still have never put any consistent runs together. Or even look like doing so.

He still doesn't outwit other managers.

The word stability in this instance is seemingly accepting that we stick behind a rookie manager who doesn't learn.

[davulsukur]

Just think if they'd have let Berg have a bit of movement and bring in his own backroom staff it may have saved a 2 million compen payout. Another effort at doing something on the cheap spectacularly back fired, did they learn ? As if .

Did Berg actually have any staff to bring? Seems like he turned up completely clueless.

Always seemed odd that he didn't bring anyone else with him.

[arbitro]

Couldn't agree more stanhillrover. I find it staggering that some folk want to roll the dice again just as we seem to be getting some stability within the dressing room.

But that dice keeps coming up one, two and the occasional three. I'm intrigued to know how, on the evidence of this season some how some fans see Bowyer improving. He has made the same mistakes several times over this season, to me a clear sign that he is not improving. Things are better on the field and he does have a decent eye for a player. It's fitting these players into a winning system and other aspects of the footballing side he is struggling with. He seems to be a decent and honest man but in the results driven industry he works in I don't think he can cut it.

[West Yorks Rover]

Did Berg actually have any staff to bring? Seems like he turned up completely clueless.

Always seemed odd that he didn't bring anyone else with him.

He never really seemed that interested to me, I think he was here for the inevitable pay-off only.

Nice work if you can get it !

[K-Hod]

For the first few months, I can understand that he was trying to settle in his new team.

Its the last few months that have irritated me about him:

He still looks no closer to stumbling upon a style of play.

He never seems to learn from his mistakes even now.

We still have never put any consistent runs together. Or even look like doing so.

He still doesn't outwit other managers.

The word stability in this instance is seemingly accepting that we stick behind a rookie manager who doesn't learn.

'Style' being the operative word....

[Amo]

Berg never got a proper chance. Given a bit of time and the backing in the transfer market that the current manager has had he may have come good.

Would you be saying that if he wasn't an ex-Rover and just a mediocre manager from Norway?

[DE.]

Some excellent posts in the past few pages, enjoyed reading this thread recently. Nothing to add but very interesting debate