[Archived] Back Or Sack?

[Baz]

I can only speak for myself, but it's mainly one born of frustration at the points we've wasted due to the manager's unduly conservative mindset and dubious selection policy. We're facing an uncertain future financially, about to be hit by FFP, possible transfer embargoes, reduced parachute payments, and need we forget our batsh*t owners. If Venky's are going to cover the debt for another season, remain in the background, and let the manager get on with the job, whilst assuming Bowyer will be wiser for the experience, then yes, but why are people taking all of that for granted?

Remember next season to retain status quo (maintaing a very large and well paid squad) Venky's need to cover the reduction in PL tv income too. (c£5m more iIRC). Or are they just going to add that to club debts? Or maybe we could sell one/some of our assets to cover that (Rhodes/ Hanley/ Gestede?).

[gumboots]

As always, the best candidate from those who apply. We don't know who would apply, we're just fans.

See above.

But they aren't bothered who applies- they just appoint whoever someone persuades them might do a job. If you're flavour if the month with them you get to choose. So looking at who might apply is irrelevant. Imagine moyes applying - it's perfectly possible with this lot that they'd think he was useless because Man U got rid and unless my favourite of the day could persuade them otherwise they would reject him in favour of some upcoming(is cheap) newcomer

[Stuart]

But they aren't bothered who applies- they just appoint whoever someone persuades them might do a job. If you're flavour if the month with them you get to choose. So looking at who might apply is irrelevant. Imagine moyes applying - it's perfectly possible with this lot that they'd think he was useless because Man U got rid and unless my favourite of the day could persuade them otherwise they would reject him in favour of some upcoming(is cheap) newcomer

This next appointment will be the first which isn't shrouded in suspicion of agent influence though, won't it?

If it isn't then it doesn't matter who's in the dugout.

[47er]

But they aren't bothered who applies- they just appoint whoever someone persuades them might do a job. If you're flavour if the month with them you get to choose. So looking at who might apply is irrelevant. Imagine moyes applying - it's perfectly possible with this lot that they'd think he was useless because Man U got rid and unless my favourite of the day could persuade them otherwise they would reject him in favour of some upcoming(is cheap) newcomer

Then there is no point anyone asking who'd come or who do we want.

[RevidgeBlue]

I'm far from impressed woth the way we've performed overall this season. Is making the play offs really that momentous an achievement. In ball park terms if you were to win one and draw one all season you would be on 69 points which is usually more or lesson the edge of the play offs. Is that actually that good? I would say iit's pretty ordinary form and far from having to perform well to get in the play offs I always think you have to perform pretty poorly NOT to get in them and that's certainly the case as far as we're concerned imo. Nor am I mpressef with the fact we seem to have put far more of a shift in after it was too late.

Nevertheless the late rally tends to show GB deserves another crack at it next season imo.

[joey_big_nose]

Explained it all more than once. Those 19 players - and I believe it's actually 21 players, meant the owners have backed Bowyer with a cash outlay of around £16m over two years.

I understand some people want to push the "poor Bowyer, he's had no money" line, but these are the figures that we're looking at. Scoff if you like, but is that not true? Remember as well, that he's only had to sell one player that he probably would have liked to keep.

Sounds like heaven to me, for a championship manager.

Can you point me to a post where you spell this out? I don't follow at all. Bowyer has enormously cut the cost base of the club, and brought in players for very low fees or free on low wages compared to who we had before, and the majority of them will have greatly increased in value (Gestede, Conway, Kilgallion, Evans, Cairney, Spurr).

Financially he is doing very very well for the club. Don't get the 16 million number at all? Do you have something that breaks it down? Are you suggesting Bowyer is liable for the players and contracts he inherited, if so that seems strange. I don't see how we can be committed to 16 million if we just look at Bowyer's signings and sales.

[Neil Weaver]

In ball park terms if you were to win one and draw one all season you would be on 69 points which is usually more or lesson the edge of the play offs.

Am I understanding this right? If I am, where did you learn maths Rev? 23 * 3 points = 69 points, 23 * 1 point = 23 points. Total = 92 points which I'd wager is pretty close to automatic promotion.

[JAL]

I'm far from impressed woth the way we've performed overall this season. Is making the play offs really that momentous an achievement. In ball park terms if you were to win one and draw one all season you would be on 69 points which is usually more or lesson the edge of the play offs. Is that actually that good? I would say iit's pretty ordinary form and far from having to perform well to get in the play offs I always think you have to perform pretty poorly NOT to get in them and that's certainly the case as far as we're concerned imo. Nor am I mpressef with the fact we seem to have put far more of a shift in after it was too late.

Nevertheless the late rally tends to show GB deserves another crack at it next season imo.

There should be a club by club wage bill table and then let the supporters see who has actually offered the best value for money.

[Doug]

There should be a club by club wage bill table and then let the supporters see who has actually offered the best value for money.

But in our case we know that it's not as black and white as that. We have the previous management mistakes to take into account.

[Black Burn]

I'm far from impressed woth the way we've performed overall this season. Is making the play offs really that momentous an achievement. In ball park terms if you were to win one and draw one all season you would be on 69 points which is usually more or lesson the edge of the play offs. Is that actually that good? I would say iit's pretty ordinary form and far from having to perform well to get in the play offs I always think you have to perform pretty poorly NOT to get in them and that's certainly the case as far as we're concerned imo. Nor am I mpressef with the fact we seem to have put far more of a shift in after it was too late.

Nevertheless the late rally tends to show GB deserves another crack at it next season imo.

Am I understanding this right? If I am, where did you learn maths Rev? 23 * 3 points = 69 points, 23 * 1 point = 23 points. Total = 92 points which I'd wager is pretty close to automatic promotion.

Ditto, I agree with Neil. How on earth do you get 69 points, unless you mean win 1 game and lose 1 game?

And by your logic, it means 18 teams underperform every season. That means you have pretty high expectations, doesn't it? So according to you, the other 18 teams including us have performed poorly this season.

This includes Bournesmouth, who just got promoted, Brighton who might possibly miss out, Wigan who is in the same boat as Brighton, Nottingham Forest, Ipswich Town, us and the other teams who are trailing the playoffs by 3 points or less! (or thereabouts) Are you saying all these teams performed badly this season as well?

[pk1875]

There should be a club by club wage bill table and then let the supporters see who has actually offered the best value for money.

You couldn't use that to gauge GB to be fair, may huge wage earners lingering from the previous mistakes. I hink GB has done well overall in the transfer market.

[JAL]

But in our case we know that it's not as black and white as that. We have the previous management mistakes to take into account.

Doesnt matter about supposed mistakes, the full amount per club would give the supporters far more clarity to understanding how their club is being run against others they are competing against and would expose wastage.

[DE.]

Can you point me to a post where you spell this out? I don't follow at all. Bowyer has enormously cut the cost base of the club, and brought in players for very low fees or free on low wages compared to who we had before, and the majority of them will have greatly increased in value (Gestede, Conway, Kilgallion, Evans, Cairney, Spurr).

Financially he is doing very very well for the club. Don't get the 16 million number at all? Do you have something that breaks it down? Are you suggesting Bowyer is liable for the players and contracts he inherited, if so that seems strange. I don't see how we can be committed to 16 million if we just look at Bowyer's signings and sales.

I'd like an explanation too, as I must have also missed it.

[JAL]

You couldn't use that to gauge GB to be fair, may huge wage earners lingering from the previous mistakes. I hink GB has done well overall in the transfer market.

Absolutely nothing to do with whoever the manager is.

[RevidgeBlue]

Ditto, I agree with Neil. How on earth do you get 69 points, unless you mean win 1 game and lose 1 game?

And by your logic, it means 18 teams underperform every season. That means you have pretty high expectations, doesn't it? So according to you, the other 18 teams including us have performed poorly this season.

This includes Bournesmouth, who just got promoted, Brighton who might possibly miss out, Wigan who is in the same boat as Brighton, Nottingham Forest, Ipswich Town, us and the other teams who are trailing the playoffs by 3 points or less! (or thereabouts) Are you saying all these teams performed badly this season as well?

Sorry, I typed the wrong word in and did of course mean win one lose one. I would have thought that would be obvious from reading my pot in its enrire context, there's nothing at all wrong with my maths thank you very much.

On your other point apart from Bournemouth who are the exception that proves the rule and have probably overachieved are you saying the others you've mentioned have performed particularly well?

[Gav]

Bowyers going nowhere and rightly so, he deserves another season at least after what's he's achieved this.

Time to get behind him for the promotion push next season.

[onlyonejackwalker]

No real suprise our newly created and hugely bloated squad has put a run together at the back end of the season. I always thought we would come on strong as others tired and our players improved as they settled at the club. I guess the season has gone much as expected really.

Not sure fans should be reading too much into the recent run of results. Squad depth at this level was always going to be highly advantageous at this stage of the season and so it is proving.

If the target this year was to solidify mid-table, then job done. I cannot believe that however for one moment as we continue to lose millions each month and who would possibly set such a pathetic target? With the likes of Yeovil, Doncaster, Barnsley, Blackpool, Charlton and Birmingham embarrasing the division mid table was the very least we could expect this season.

Mid-table security our target? Congrats if so. If not, the whole group has underachieved including Bowyer.

[Riverside67]

Gav we did get that message this year from the club so I cannot help be a bit cynical given the approach to some games.

Nonetheless defifite signs of progress recently

Robbo

Keane - Hanley - Kilgallon - Spurr

Marshall - Evans - Cairney - Conway

Gestede - Rhodes

That should be a competitive starting eleven next season and get me renewing my season ticket for the three of us once more.

[Gav]

Gav we did get that message this year from the club so I cannot help be a bit cynical given the approach to some games.

Nonetheless defifite signs of progress recently

Robbo

Keane - Hanley - Kilgallon - Spurr

Marshall - Evans - Cairney - Conway

Gestede - Rhodes

That should be a competitive starting eleven next season and get me renewing my season ticket for the three of us once more.

The club couldn't really saying anything else, but to expect a promotion push this season was living in cloud cuckoo land for me after all the turmoil over the past few years.

From what I can gather Bowyer told the owners top 10 this season with promotion push next, so he's well on track.

Not had a season ticket for 3 seasons now, but will probably get one next. Glory hunter that I am!!

[Gally]

No real suprise our newly created and hugely bloated squad has put a run together at the back end of the season. I always thought we would come on strong as others tired and our players improved as they settled at the club. I guess the season has gone much as expected really.

Not sure fans should be reading too much into the recent run of results. Squad depth at this level was always going to be highly advantageous at this stage of the season and so it is proving.

If the target this year was to solidify mid-table, then job done. I cannot believe that however for one moment as we continue to lose millions each month and who would possibly set such a pathetic target? With the likes of Yeovil, Doncaster, Barnsley, Blackpool, Charlton and Birmingham embarrasing the division mid table was the very least we could expect this season.

Mid-table security our target? Congrats if so. If not, the whole group has underachieved including Bowyer.

We supposedly had lots of squad depth last season and only narrowly avoided going down. For all the frustrating results, there has obviously been significant progress this term.

[Black Burn]

Sorry, I typed the wrong word in and did of course mean win one lose one. I would have thought that would be obvious from reading my pot in its enrire context, there's nothing at all wrong with my maths thank you very much.

On your other point apart from Bournemouth who are the exception that proves the rule and have probably overachieved are you saying the others you've mentioned have performed particularly well?

I didn't say anything about your math, that was Neil. Like I said, I contemplated the possibility that you mean 1 win and 1 loss, but that's not even a fair reflection of our form. We've gone on an unbeaten run of 11 games with 5 wins and 6 draws, so 23 wins and 23 draws is a closer assessment of our form than 23 wins and 23 losses. Nonetheless, I can't and will not predict the future, so I don't know if we'll get playoffs next season or not, or how many points we'll get.

I'm not saying Brighton and the other teams have performed particularly well. I'm saying they are not performing poorly. There's a slight difference there. Not everything is black and white that it has to be divided into perform well and perform poorly. No, I don't think they were excellent performances, but I also think calling them poor performances is a tad too critical and unfair.

[gumboots]

Then there is no point anyone asking who'd come or who do we want.

And of course there is no point. You can speculate all you want of course. Nobody can stop you, but you do have to know that in our case it's unlikely to happen even were bowyer sacked. They haven't got much right so far so with or without the suspicion or suggestion of agent involvement Stuart talks about it's highly improbable that a good sensible appointment would be made.

[Darwen Rover 007]

Replacing bowyer is a huge risk... He's done v well for 75% of the time... Would be foolish to twist...

[magicalmortensleftpeg]

No real suprise our newly created and hugely bloated squad has put a run together at the back end of the season. I always thought we would come on strong as others tired and our players improved as they settled at the club. I guess the season has gone much as expected really.

Not sure fans should be reading too much into the recent run of results. Squad depth at this level was always going to be highly advantageous at this stage of the season and so it is proving.

If the target this year was to solidify mid-table, then job done. I cannot believe that however for one moment as we continue to lose millions each month and who would possibly set such a pathetic target? With the likes of Yeovil, Doncaster, Barnsley, Blackpool, Charlton and Birmingham embarrasing the division mid table was the very least we could expect this season.

Mid-table security our target? Congrats if so. If not, the whole group has underachieved including Bowyer.

Thats about a quarter of the league?

We're going to fall just short of the play offs. It might come down to goal difference. You take where we were last year, off the pitch and on the pitch, and its clear that this season has been a significant improvement. No one can argue about that.

If we don't improve next season then a change might be for the best. In the mean time I really don't see the point.

[Fife Rover]

And who would you replace him with?

Lots of shouts for McCarthy but his clubs was staying down before ours, Billy Davis has disappeared, Freedman, Howe, McDermott all sunk without trace.

Foolish not to look before you leap, so whose it to be then?

Either KMD or Souness !!

I wish. But then again Venky's can easily afford it, so why not go for it?