[Archived] Gary Bowyer Discussion

[McClarky]

When GB talks about his much anticipated trip to Pune you have to wonder if he is saying that this is the only time he has contact with Venkys. You would think with all the hunners of millions of pounds they have wasted they could have invested in a telepresence or video conferencing facility so they could have these meetings more regularly. The lack of any kind of management at the club is and has been alarming for 4 years and doesn't seem to be improving at all.

[Rover_Shaun]

The part about "catching up" irked me the most. It was like we are still living in a pre-war world where travel and communications were severly limited.

So Bowyer is saying the owners haven't a scooby doo what's going on until Bowyer gives them their opinion?

[Tom]

I don't mind him flying out to India, sure it comes across as a bit sickly but I don't blame him for wanting to keep his job - and anyone who wants to keep a job in his position has to make allowances for their bizarre nature

[Blue blood]

More Pune propaganda? I've checked it twice and can't see it.

Come on Jbiz, that's a fair and encouraging interview. But let's be honest how many have been like that. Credit for where it's due, and this is an encouraging sign. But let's not get so entrenched that just as not acknowledging this as encouraging is poor, not admitting that other interviews have sounded very much like "excuses to Pune". Let's have a bit of transparency here.

[Andyblue2]

Tonight again, showed that we becoming harder to beat away from home - remember this was a Brum side who beat Wolves on Saturday.

Same game last season we battered them and looked miles ahead of them, now they have caught us up and we look similar. how can that be progress?

[A cup of beans]

I was referring to the press release that said all fans were against him

Oh. I missed that.

Sorry. My apologies.

[DE.]

One thing I find bizarre about the arguments for progression, is that they inevitably hark back to our first season in the Championship and pretty much ignore last season entirely. By that logic we weren't regressing under Souness in 2004 because we were still in a better position than when he was first appointed. Whilst I can understand club progress being measured in a non-linear fashion, managerial and on-pitch progress surely has to follow a linear pattern to make sense?

[tomphil]

Same game last season we battered them and looked miles ahead of them, now they have caught us up and we look similar. how can that be progress?

it's all the FFP's fault didn't you know.

[Athlete]

What???? Which of the above are in hock to almost 100m and under a transfer embargo?

All different scenarios but ask each club would they take Rovers facilities and player riches.. Blackpools training ground doesn't even have running water in the showers.. Wigan train at a local near by college.. Of which you may have played a round or two on the course next door instead of frequenting Ewood

a decent manager - clearly better than those below us in the division. Too many folk have unrealistic expectations and if Bowyer was replaced, the first time a new man went to Pune he would be accused of being a puppet of the owners. The simple fact is many won't accept any manager whilst Venkys are the owners. However, as nobody is likely to buy us they are the only game in town and the best hope of the club continuing at least at Championship level. Tonight again, showed that we becoming harder to beat away from home - remember this was a Brum side who beat Wolves on Saturday. Decent foundations are being put down at Academy and Under-21 level which will, hopefully, benefit us in time to come. After the mess we were in there are definite signs of progress since Bowyer took over. FFP hasn't helped and is likely to hinder immediate progress until wages can be brought into line with income - we simply can't afford £30,000 and £40,000 a week players on our income levels. We could so easily have imploded like Wigan but we haven't. We have maintained a decent position within this League and have a foundation on which to build.

FFP is an excuse everyone knew it was coming..

You're defending the undefendable

IYO how long would you give GB before saying it's not working out or are you happy were we at...

[RibbleValleyRover]

Rovers had an unbeaten run towards the end of last season or had one for quite a while before it ended. It was lauded at the time by Bowyer as a sign that Rovers would be taking that run into next season ready for a strong promotion push.

15 points off 6th place is the result.

Bowyer has got to go and replaced with someone competent, the future of the club depends on it.

[thenodrog]

McDermott, warburton ,soey/tugs

One failed dismally at LUFC although he's not alone there, the other is a mystery dismissal which suggests possibly something smelly under the radar, souey prob made as much money out of the club through dodgy transfer deals as Steve Kean, and Tugay is like Bowyer was 3 years ago very inexperienced. Not only that he can be a moody fecker. Very miguided to appoint a manager based on his ability as a player.

[McClarky]

I keep coming back to my opinion that if we sack GB it'll make no diffeence as the club is set up to fail and so will inevitably fail. You can't have a club run by a failing manager and a failing MD (who seems to be part time) and then owners who sem to rely on an annual visit from the manager to keep them up to speed. No other business in the world could function like that. No matter who the manager is next year we will finish near or at the bottom of the league becuase we are going backwards while all the proper clubs in the league are not.

[thenodrog]

I don't mind him flying out to India, sure it comes across as a bit sickly .......

Well he would say that wouldn't he? Mandy Rice Davies

Funny but nobody as yet from the FF has admitted that they were wrong to go all those years ago. Not sure what would have happened if you lot had taken my advice and not gone (... prob nowt tbh. ) but your tactical naivety was breathtaking. Still a nice jolly for those animals 'more equal than others' eh?

Same game last season we battered them and looked miles ahead of them, now they have caught us up and we look similar. how can that be progress?

Silly and churlish comment. There are lots of reasons results differ from season to season.

[jim mk2]

Same game last season we battered them and looked miles ahead of them, now they have caught us up and we look similar. how can that be progress?

Pretty daft comment as Birmingham have improved and the outcome of any match is uncertain from week to week, never mind from one season to another. Overall though, we have gone backwards from last season in terms of league position but the league is also much stronger than last season.

[Amo]

There is no argument for progress. No matter how anyone tries to twist it, we're well off last season's points tally and even further from the playoffs. It's apparent that the debate has become deeply personal for some posters, so much so that they feel the need to accuse others of having an 'agenda' against the manager. As if people have just taken an irrational dislike to the man. Perhaps some fans do go a little overboard at times, but after the way Kean operated here, they could be forgiven for being overly critical about every interview our manager makes when they see that history is repeating itself. Venky's business model hasn't changed, we've got another coach promoted from the backroom who puts an emphasis on developing players for a profit in spite of results on the pitch.

[Gav]

There is no argument for progress. No matter how anyone tries to twist it, we're well off last season's points tally and even further from the playoffs. It's apparent that the debate has become deeply personal for some posters, so much so that they feel the need to accuse others of having an 'agenda' against the manager. As if people have just taken an irrational dislike to the man. Perhaps some fans do go a little overboard at times, but after the way Kean operated here, they could be forgiven for being overly critical about every interview our manager makes when they see that history is repeating itself. Venky's business model hasn't changed, we've got another coach promoted from the backroom who puts an emphasis on developing players for a profit in spite of results on the pitch.

You're giving them far to much credit Toppers.

[Amo]

You're giving them far to much credit Toppers.

Well, by "business model" I obviously meant:

[den]

Perhaps some fans do go a little overboard at times, but after the way Kean operated here, they could be forgiven for being overly critical about every interview our manager makes when they see that history is repeating itself. Venky's business model hasn't changed, we've got another coach promoted from the backroom who puts an emphasis on developing players for a profit in spite of results on the pitch.

We're still operating exactly the same way that we did when Kean was here. I put this post on another thread as a reply to Theno. I'll repost it here:-

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Don't be silly Gordon, Toms feeling just the same as most rovers fans. Apathy is the right word. The problem with our club is that our problems aren't just down to a single deficiency, there are problems with the manager, the losses, the debt, FFP, the owners, Shaw etc, etc. there are so many things wrong it makes trying to turn the club around very difficult. We as fans can't do anything about any of those problems, never mind all of them. That's where the apathy comes in.

What's going to happen in the summer? Well Bowyer is going out to Pune to meet the owners. There's absolutely no doubt that he's going to tell them how FFP, injuries and the cup run have denied us a shot at the playoffs. He's going to tell them how he's going to get us in the playoffs next season, or maybe the season after that, provided that he can get another couple of transfer windows under his belt. How lucky is he, that all he has to do to continue down his personal road to a fortune he'd never have got, is to firstly convince an old Indian woman - and secondly the brothers who I guess are still confused as to how we were relegated under Kean, that he's got the answers. I mean, how many Indian women know the first thing about how to bring success to an English championship club? I bet there are plenty of managers around the country who wished that was all they had to do, to keep their job.

So, for all the things against us at the moment, there's one move more than any other, that would help to turn us around. Appoint an experienced CEO and make the manager responsible to him. that would be best for the owners, best for the club and would focus the entire club on putting results to the fore. It would possibly, also give the fans some sense that progress is possible.

[JBiz]

Come on Jbiz, that's a fair and encouraging interview. But let's be honest how many have been like that. Credit for where it's due, and this is an encouraging sign. But let's not get so entrenched that just as not acknowledging this as encouraging is poor, not admitting that other interviews have sounded very much like "excuses to Pune". Let's have a bit of transparency here.

I didn't say it, GB did. I don't see this propaganda, never have. I could dig up some quotes where he's had a sly dig at the fans- those would be more worrying to me.

Thing is though, the reasoning behind the post is to actually show what he said rather than someone come in here and slag it off without quoting- it's a discussion at the end of the day and I'd rather take it away from "defending/attacking" (as some see it!) to a discussion on Gary Bowyer.

[OJRovers]

Seems like this thread is almost in agreement that the club needs to change for any manager to move it forward.

Question to all is: Why aren't we protesting against the way Venkys are running the club?

I'm not talking a 'Venkys OUT' protest, but more to show them that no-one is happy with the way they are running the club. They will go nowhere with the way they are running the club. This will be what Bowyer/Shaw is telling them.

Newcastle fans are doing it.

[Amo]

Seems like this thread is almost in agreement that the club needs to change for any manager to move it forward.

Question to all is: Why aren't we protesting against the way Venkys are running the club?

I'm not talking a 'Venkys OUT' protest, but more to show them that no-one is happy with the way they are running the club. They will go nowhere with the way they are running the club. This will be what Bowyer/Shaw is telling them.

Newcastle fans are doing it.

Most fans are choosing to protest with their feet.

What would you suggest?

[ABBEY]

Seems like this thread is almost in agreement that the club needs to change for any manager to move it forward.

Question to all is: Why aren't we protesting against the way Venkys are running the club?

I'm not talking a 'Venkys OUT' protest, but more to show them that no-one is happy with the way they are running the club. They will go nowhere with the way they are running the club. This will be what Bowyer/Shaw is telling them.

Newcastle fans are doing it.

because there is a lot of VENKYSCUM love out there .As seen v scousers. I was shocked to be honest.

Most fans are choosing to protest with their feet.

What would you suggest?

AN IPSWICH BOYCOTT LAST GAME. Not a chance of it happening . Fans couldn't be arsed protesting against Kean apart for 10 mins that night v pie scoffers.

[den]

Question to all is: Why aren't we protesting against the way Venkys are running the club?

Too many problems that need addressing, plus the fans know they would be ignored. Far easier to drift away?

[OJRovers]

Most fans are choosing to protest with their feet.

What would you suggest?

Yes agreed.

It was more a question of why there doesn't seem to be any appetite to try to get Venkys to see sense and change their business model?

The way they run the club hasn't worked, it won't ever work.

The only dialogue they hear is from Shaw/Bowyer and they will be telling them that the strategy IS working.

I guess 'managament' has won in the end. The communication channels with Venkys have been cleverly managed from day 1.

Alan Myers coming in as communications director with a job to do exactly the opposite i.e. stop venkys getting the truth.

[Amo]

Yes agreed.

It was more a question of why there doesn't seem to be any appetite to try to get Venkys to see sense and change their business model?

There's probably a variety of factors at play, ranging from apathy to fear of upsetting the applecart. At the end of the day, fans don't want to be at odds with their football club. People go to watch football for escapism from the stress of everyday life. If they can find a reason not to protest, they'll take it. Why do you think chaddy was so quick to climb back on the Bowyer bandwagon?

If the masses couldn't be motivated into action when Kean was brazenly taking the p*ss out of them, there's no chance it'll happen now.