[Archived] Gary Bowyer Discussion

[thenodrog]

The only quality you have is your golf handicap

You've done it again. Tiresome to say the least, most definitely not funny and illustrative of the paucity of your opinion.

[Parsonblue]

It has been garbage anyone saying different hasn't been an Ewood regular this season

The only quality you have is your golf handicap

Totally disagree about it being garbage and I've seen every game this season. As theno said, in terms of the League we are slightly above average but expectation levels are so high that we have fallen short in terms of promotion. Whilst the manager takes responsibility the players also have to take some and as Conway said in the paper today they have simply not been ruthless enough in terms of finishing teams off. Too many players have been inconsistent this season - playing well for a couple of months and then struggling. Mistakes at both ends of the pitch have proved costly. However, even a new manager in the summer will have to bring in free transfers and loans and will be unable to replace the likes of Rhodes and Gestede with cash signings due to the embargo. Until the embargo is lifted it is difficult to see how we can do much better than we have this season. People have been critical of Brown and Varney but, at the end of the day, the free transfer market is where any new manager will be shopping.

[ABBEY]

The team is/has gone backwards though.

[den]

Been like that for two years now Parson. He's either good enough, or he isn't. FFP doesn't come into it.

[DE.]

Ipswich aren't under embargo but they might as well be considering the financial restraints McCarthy is working under. Despite that, the team has improved year on year. Why shouldn't we aim to do the same?

[ABBEY]

because stability is all that matters and nothing else matters.

[Mattyblue]

In the second half of the season our home performances have declined massively, routinely outplayed or beaten by decent teams and struggling to even put the likes of Blackpool away. Aimless long punts, no support from the midfield, standing off the oppostion, subs by numbers- in essence, it's been crap.

Yey away from home, we often look a solid side with a decent counter-attacking threat. It once again gives me the impression that Bowyer still cannot set up a team to be on the front foot, something expected from a home side, this coupled with the seemingly weekly ricket from either Duffy or Hanley has ensured a rapid nosedive post Boxing Day.

[Andyblue2]

Totally disagree about it being garbage and I've seen every game this season. As theno said, in terms of the League we are slightly above average but expectation levels are so high that we have fallen short in terms of promotion. Whilst the manager takes responsibility the players also have to take some and as Conway said in the paper today they have simply not been ruthless enough in terms of finishing teams off. Too many players have been inconsistent this season - playing well for a couple of months and then struggling. Mistakes at both ends of the pitch have proved costly. However, even a new manager in the summer will have to bring in free transfers and loans and will be unable to replace the likes of Rhodes and Gestede with cash signings due to the embargo. Until the embargo is lifted it is difficult to see how we can do much better than we have this season. People have been critical of Brown and Varney but, at the end of the day, the free transfer market is where any new manager will be shopping.

thing is Parson, I'd rather have another manager getting those frees in and asking a few favours...to say we fell short of promotion is stretching even your powers of bullshiit. We are closer to avoiding relegation than falling short of promotion, but then you are the GB press officer for this site. The cheek of you to spin this carp to prop up a manager who is well above his station. disgraceful

[tomphil]

There's been some good stuff in patches and some poor stuff but overall to be it's been frustrating rather than crap for me. It is the championship after all and that's what this league throws up. Just been really irritating for me seeing the manager flounder about with the team sometimes without the need to and returning to the same bland style time and again despite some success when it's been occasionally altered.

[yoda]

There's been some good stuff in patches and some poor stuff but overall to be it's been frustrating rather than crap for me. It is the championship after all and that's what this league throws up. Just been really irritating for me seeing the manager flounder about with the team sometimes without the need to and returning to the same bland style time and again despite some success when it's been occasionally altered.

Agreed, on limited occasions we have looked like we should beat anyone in this division, then it all goes pear shaped.

That suggests to me with the right motivation and tactics we should have done far better this season

[OJRovers]

How is becoming FFP compliant suddenly going to make Bowyer a decent manager?

If anything it is going to expose his weaknesses even more.

We've missed the boat this season and that is failure on Bowyer's part. It's only going to get harder.

[Gav]

thing is Parson, I'd rather have another manager getting those frees in and asking a few favours...to say we fell short of promotion is stretching even your powers of bullshiit. We are closer to avoiding relegation than falling short of promotion, but then you are the GB press officer for this site. The cheek of you to spin this carp to prop up a manager who is well above his station. disgraceful

Bunkum.

Thats Parsons view Andy, you should respect it instead of insulting the guy.

[mustard]

If we can get rid of Rhodes, Gestede and King and replace with better then we should. If we replace with worse it's bad. We'd not know for sure until it's happened which would be too late in the one instance. Exactly the same with a manager. If there are better out there then we should ruthlessly pursue them BUT it must also be recognised that there is always an element of risk.

I guess this is the issue. With the embargo and FFP to comply with, I'd say we have little to no chance of replacing with better. Hell, even though we only spent under £500k on each Gestede and King, we might not even have that to spend on a player this summer. I imagine Brown will be our main striker under Bowyer next season and that's worrying.

The last sentence of yours I wholeheartedly agree with. There will be risk involved in appointing a new manager, however I believe there is more risk in sticking with Bowyer. We're all pretty much in agreement that we will lose Rhodes and Rudy in summer. Considering how Bowyer has done with two of the best strikers in the league who have contributed the vast majority of our goals the last few seasons, I really struggle to see how Bowyer will do better without them. Can you see him implementing tactics that bring out the best in the squad, draw goals from midfield and even get Brown on the scoresheet? I can't.

Blueboy argues the football hasn't been rubbish. I'd argue perhaps results haven't been rubbish, they have been average. Below what we all expected but still average. I'd argue performances on the whole have been poor. The football on display, bar the odd 5min spell each game, has been really shoddy imo. Worse than any other long-ball merchants I've seen as at least their football is effective. I think we've shown up to Forest away second half, Leeds away and very few other games.

As for the league this season. I'd say the league quality as a whole has been poor. I'd agree with DE.'s assessment further up. The other teams aren't terribly strong in terms of player quality (bar Norwich and the odd other) but the bottom half of the table is REALLY poor. I think the top 8, with talented managers, have found it easy to pick up points from the minnows as a whole and hence the gulf. Unfortunately, we find ourselves on the wrong side of this, with us being unable to beat the teams above us and often failing to capitalise against the lesser teams (Blackpool, Millwall, Rotherham). Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure we've only done the double over Leeds and Fulham? The majority of the teams we've got results against have been teams we were expected to do so. It's why we've only won 1 of the 15 games against teams above us. I'd argue the only reason we've got a respectable points tally is because our squad is largely better than most and that has carried us through. Bowyer just doesn't seem to be able to outwit the best in this league. I think people are over exaggerating the 8 games unbeaten on the road. It's 7 unbeaten away in the league with a cracking draw at Liverpool on top of that. Of those 7 we have won 3 and drawn 4. It's a very good return but means diddly squat if we aren't picking up the points at home. Of those teams we played, just one of them is above us (Bournemouth) where we got a draw.

I truly think a good manager would have us in with the play-off chasing pack, when the fact is we have been nowhere near for 99% of Bowyer's tenure. Bar the FA cup games, I'd say there's enough to suggest Bowyer is lacking tactically. The Hanley situation, the chopping and changing, the downright negative tactics. Playing Cairney on right wing vs a strong Norwich side with overlapping fullbacks an example of him not having the brains to set up to counter a team on a consistent basis. There have been numerous other occasions. Sticking to hoofball up to Rhodes when there are 6'5 centre halves up his backside and no one within 20 yards of him, even hoofing up to Rudy/Brown when there's no one nearby. I'm pretty sure they don't even work on this in training as 90% of the time the flick ons go nowhere near any of our players. With the fact we play nothing football I really do wonder what goes on at Brockhall. All these niggling little injuries. Players who can play the odd game then need resting. Stinks of either poor fitness or the players not being arsed. Such things rest on the manager, as he should have the team fired up and committed, which our players (as a whole) do not look. The players look beefed up and stronger but a hell of a lot slower (IMO). Too much strength training or something? Cairney, Rhodes, Conway, hell even Hanley etc have all lost at least a yard of pace. Could explain the injury situation. Not meaning to come up with wacky theories but I am stumped as to why the players are always chopped and changed or rested, why there are so many little niggles.

Under Bowyer, I can't see progress and I truly worry for next season. I'm not saying he's a terrible manager, but he isn't good enough for what we NEED to achieve. Had we have appointed someone else decent last summer (like I wanted) I think we could have been truly in a play-off race but I truly worry we've missed our real chance. I just don't understand the logic of some posters who readily acknowledge Bowyer doesn't seem to have what it takes to get us up and that we are likely to go drift down the league unless something changes, yet don't believe at least gambling on a change at the helm. I'd rather the team put up a fight. Unfortunately, we can't get rid of the Venky's, Shaw seems to be untouchable but with a change of manager it could still galvanise the team. Don't ask me who I'd want in charge as I'm sure there'd be plenty of suggestions that could have holes picked in them and plenty of names would apply who I might never have heard of but might be what we need. Someone who can whip these lot into shape and someone with a bit of tactical knowledge would be good.

[K-Hod]

Totally disagree about it being garbage and I've seen every game this season. As theno said, in terms of the League we are slightly above average but expectation levels are so high that we have fallen short in terms of promotion. Whilst the manager takes responsibility the players also have to take some and as Conway said in the paper today they have simply not been ruthless enough in terms of finishing teams off. Too many players have been inconsistent this season - playing well for a couple of months and then struggling. Mistakes at both ends of the pitch have proved costly. However, even a new manager in the summer will have to bring in free transfers and loans and will be unable to replace the likes of Rhodes and Gestede with cash signings due to the embargo. Until the embargo is lifted it is difficult to see how we can do much better than we have this season. People have been critical of Brown and Varney but, at the end of the day, the free transfer market is where any new manager will be shopping.

Expectation levels aren't unreasonably high when you've got strikers we have, Bowyer has been able to bring in his own players but imo has prioritised areas where we have adequate cover (i.e. defensive mids/centre halves), when we've been crying out for some flair or forward running in the middle of the park for a long time.

That smacks of poor management to me.

We fell short of the play-offs last season, and have done so again, so in terms of the league, progress simply hasn't been made and in isolation it's a failure. If we don't finish higher than we did in the league last season, then by definition, it's impossible for us to have progressed, I really don't see how that point can be argued.

The same goes for McLaren at Derby if they don't go up this time, as JBizzle correctly highlighted.

[Parsonblue]

thing is Parson, I'd rather have another manager getting those frees in and asking a few favours...to say we fell short of promotion is stretching even your powers of bullshiit. We are closer to avoiding relegation than falling short of promotion, but then you are the GB press officer for this site. The cheek of you to spin this carp to prop up a manager who is well above his station. disgraceful

It's called having an opinion Andy. I make no apologies for having a different opinion to yourself and if you find it disgraceful that someone has the temerity to have a different opinion to your good self I would suggest you put me on ignore.

[broadsword]

If everyone had the same view on here, it would be far too clubby and cosy.

Certainly I've become frustrated at times and handed out some spiky retorts, I wish I hadn't now. I'm much happier coming on here now that I tolerate other viewpoints more readily, even if I find them utterly perplexing. I've completely emptied out my ignore list as well.

Trying to shut other people down because you don't like their point of view isn't the way forward. everyone has a right to a genuinely-held opinion.

[barry_]

what's all this 'transfer embargo' rubbish being spouted about why we haven't been good enough? It's been in place for one mid-season period.

[Iceman]

has nobody realised, that Bowyer just isnt a good manager, i mean coach? there have been quite a few times, where the players actually bailed him out by grinding out a result. His post match interviews are horrible to listen to as well

[gumboots]

has nobody realised, that Bowyer just isnt a good manager, i mean coach? there have been quite a few times, where the players actually bailed him out by grinding out a result. His post match interviews are horrible to listen to as well

That last bit is just cos he's rubbish in front of camera. Some people are. His press conferences, my daughter assures me, are better than that

[DE.]

Hopefully somebody reports on them instead of his post match interviews in future then...

[Rover_Shaun]

A new manager could actually have the ability to manage

[Gav]

A new manager could actually have the ability to manage

How did you think he performed as our caretaker manager?

[den]

How did you think he performed as our caretaker manager?

As he has done since.

[Rover_Shaun]

Apart from taking us into the relegation zone and giving us all a heart attack he did ok in the last few games

[Gav]

Some would say he actually saved us from relegation, I would agree.

Anyone that saw the side under Berg, with only 1 win in 10 games, would have probably put money on us going down. Bowyer saved us from relegation that season, not a bad feat for a man who apparently can't manage.

As he has done since.

Admirably?