[Archived] Gary Bowyer Discussion

[DE.]

divide and conquer eh DE? Very mature. Pro-this, anti-that blah blah blah. The FACT is that the embargo will affect the manager/club in an adverse way compared to those who aren't under it. If Bowyer uses it to say that he isn't able to bring in the players he wants then i don't see the problem. It is a FACT.

Also the FACT you see the season as a 'disaster' means you may not be the best judge of what is happening at Ewood.

Thanks for that, Rafa.

You're absolutely right - falling crowds, worsening finances, our best players attempting to leave, season-long inconsistent performances and crowned off with a transfer embargo we are seriously going to struggle to get out of. What a season.

But we had a good FA Cup run, at least.

[ABBEY]

Rafa Shaw

[Gav]

So I am not allowed any redress as well as no opinion on Rovers? Figures. What's wrong has Abbey logged off?

---------------------------------------------------

Anyway back on topic........

You can, and do, say what you like Shaun but they do have a point.

I've read recently you talking about the mood at Ewood on match days and Bowyers body language on the touchline. This is why you're getting stick because you've never been to Ewood under Bowyer, so how can you comment on such things?

[Blue blood]

Give over Parson. FFP hasn't hit us at all yet. One January transfer window and he hasn't had to sell anybody. He even admits to not planning for it.

Bowyer -

""Bournemouth went and bought (Callum) Wilson and backed it up by signing Kenwyne Jones. Its good business, its a plan, its a structure in place, and were now working very, very hard to put that in place here but it takes time.

what an incredibly strange and inaccurate comment. Last season we got Gestede in the january window which gave the team a massive boost. this season we got no-one. Other teams managed to bring in some cracking loans which would have cost a fee, Bent, Ince, Dorrans, K Jones etc.

Blueboy! Let's look at the majority of Den's post which is very worrying rather than nit-picking one bit. It is clear from the statement Bowyer didn't plan or factor in FFP - pretty criminal don't you think? Doesn't suggest Bowyer is in touch with the situation all that well at all.

I agree a bit more flexibility to bring in players would've made a big difference in January but I doubt that there are huge fees flying about for those loans - Ince for example couldn't get in the Hull team and was rotting away on the sidelines, Lambert (who knows why) was ridiculously keen to get rid of Bent - doubt there'd be a fee involved in either of those examples.

However, as I said before, the biggest point - Bowyer does not get our situation. He wants time to install a plan, yet FFP and lack of promotion means that we didn't have time to build, especially over the time scale he wants us to. I think every Rovers fan knew that - that our manager didn't is a little bit worrying.

[Rover_Shaun]

Before the pack descends I very much doubt that and think you are getting me mixed up this time with those who have commented first hand on that Gav.

I wouldn't even comment on it had I been there. I'm long enough in the tooth to know that what a manager does on the touchline means nowt. For example Kidd was a hand waver and he was useless. Woy was more sedate and had mixed success. As long as the message get's to the players and they act on it that's all that matters. Managers don't need to rant and rave.

If I did comment, and I am 99.9% sure I haven't, I was probably repeating what someone had said in a glib comment. (someone will probably dig something up now lol)

Being a long term consistent Bowyer doubter does make me more prominent but don't put words in my mouth if you can help it.

Life under Bowyer would be acceptable if this was 1987 and we were just poor with no gargantuan debt, people running the club who were both competent, qualified and gave a stuff above se

[K-Hod]

Now more than ever, we need a BRFCC Sportsman's dinner

[broadsword]

I think people would end up getting forks stuck in them.

It would be like a scene from the Raid

[K-Hod]

I think people would end up getting forks stuck in them.

It would be like a scene from the Raid

I doubt it, I reckon in person, folk would actually get on! (For the most part....)

[Rover_Shaun]

Blueboy! Let's look at the majority of Den's post which is very worrying rather than nit-picking one bit. It is clear from the statement Bowyer didn't plan or factor in FFP - pretty criminal don't you think? Doesn't suggest Bowyer is in touch with the situation all that well at all.

I agree a bit more flexibility to bring in players would've made a big difference in January but I doubt that there are huge fees flying about for those loans - Ince for example couldn't get in the Hull team and was rotting away on the sidelines, Lambert (who knows why) was ridiculously keen to get rid of Bent - doubt there'd be a fee involved in either of those examples.

However, as I said before, the biggest point - Bowyer does not get our situation. He wants time to install a plan, yet FFP and lack of promotion means that we didn't have time to build, especially over the time scale he wants us to. I think every Rovers fan knew that - that our manager didn't is a little bit worrying.

Putting a fair head on. "For once" they all shout. Bowyer would have planned based on the information, or lack of it, he was given. For as much as some would like to spin he isn't responsible for finances. He isn't responsible for contracts nor paying off players nor reducing the wage bill. He is responsible for the team. He may or may not have been given factual information from those above him and frankly it's not hard to disbelieve because they are all a bunch of cluless shysters. BUT the stick he can be beaten with is that he didn't necessarily strengthen the positions that needed strengthening at particular times. Was £1m on another winger a higher priority than a porous defence bereft of a right back and a central midfield with all the guile and creativity of a wrecking ball?

[broadsword]

I doubt it, I reckon in person, folk would actually get on! (For the most part....)

Oh you do, do ya! You Bowyer-lover!

Well, go and fork yourself, chum, eh? Have a right good go at it! etc etc

[K-Hod]

Putting a fair head on. "For once" they all shout. Bowyer would have planned based on the information, or lack of it, he was given. For as much as some would like to spin he isn't responsible for finances. He isn't responsible for contracts nor paying off players nor reducing the wage bill. He is responsible for the team. He may or may not have been given factual information from those above him and frankly it's not hard to disbelieve because they are all a bunch of cluless shysters. BUT the stick he can be beaten with is that he didn't necessarily strengthen the positions that needed strengthening at particular times. Was £1m on another winger a higher priority than a porous defence bereft of a right back and a central midfield with all the guile and creativity of a wrecking ball?

I think that Henley has made the right back spot his own in recent matches, though by God do we need some flair or forward running in the middle of the park. It's beyond frustrating that we let Judge go, and he's had a cracking season for Brentford (above us in the league), when he didn't get a sniff here. In favour of crab central midfielders......

Oh you do, do ya! You Bowyer-lover!

Well, go and fork yourself, chum, eh? Have a right good go at it! etc etc

Thanks, I think?....

[Rover_Shaun]

Judge may have fitted in and he may not K-Hod. Like managers at clubs at the right/wrong times. Different courses for different horses

[K-Hod]

Judge may have fitted in and he may not K-Hod. Like managers at clubs at the right/wrong times. Different courses for different horses

This is true Shaun, BUT, I still maintain he was what we were crying out for, a busy player with some skill and a good deliverer of a dead ball.

The excuses used for his departure still rankle- 'too small', 'not physical enough', yep, but good enough for a team placed higher than us in the league!

[Blue blood]

Putting a fair head on. "For once" they all shout. Bowyer would have planned based on the information, or lack of it, he was given. For as much as some would like to spin he isn't responsible for finances. He isn't responsible for contracts nor paying off players nor reducing the wage bill. He is responsible for the team. He may or may not have been given factual information from those above him and frankly it's not hard to disbelieve because they are all a bunch of cluless shysters. BUT the stick he can be beaten with is that he didn't necessarily strengthen the positions that needed strengthening at particular times. Was £1m on another winger a higher priority than a porous defence bereft of a right back and a central midfield with all the guile and creativity of a wrecking ball?

Couple of things make me disagree with this. If it was obvious to us, and anyone who read the accounts that FFP was coming, surely Bowyer should have known it was coming regardless of what the board said. In fact it was the only way it was going to go.

Also it's a big assumption that the board didn't think it was coming - I think they did, there was some mention of it at fans forum or something? I think Shaw was mouthing off about it at least a year or so ago, so not quite sure we can give Bowyer the benefit of the doubt on this one.

Thirdly, and most significantly, looking at the debt and our situation - what other solution could there be other than a quick return to the Prem? The debt was growing, the only thing that'd solve that is premiership tv money - what other solution could solve the massive debt other than promotion asap? Good players won't wait 3 or 4 seasons to get promoted, even if we could afford them to. The most stupid thing about the whole problem is that the solution was obvious (although not simple) - get promoted asap. But from appointing Bowyer to the way he's gone about things this totally hasn't been our strategy. No one it seems within the club has a clue what they are doing...

[Rover_Shaun]

It was probably a toss up between him and Cairney K-Hod and we backed the wrong horse (up to now)

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/12896376.Gary_Bowyer__Modern_football_____and_not_just_Blackburn_Rovers_____lack_on_pitch_leaders/?ref=mac

Bowyer's right about leaders. He sounds despondent and to me he comes across as someone who would bin off most of them if he had money. I think he's finding a few of them aren't quite there mentally

EDIT: Can't seem to quote. Says website blocked)

[Parsonblue]

Blueboy! Let's look at the majority of Den's post which is very worrying rather than nit-picking one bit. It is clear from the statement Bowyer didn't plan or factor in FFP - pretty criminal don't you think? Doesn't suggest Bowyer is in touch with the situation all that well at all.

I agree a bit more flexibility to bring in players would've made a big difference in January but I doubt that there are huge fees flying about for those loans - Ince for example couldn't get in the Hull team and was rotting away on the sidelines, Lambert (who knows why) was ridiculously keen to get rid of Bent - doubt there'd be a fee involved in either of those examples.

However, as I said before, the biggest point - Bowyer does not get our situation. He wants time to install a plan, yet FFP and lack of promotion means that we didn't have time to build, especially over the time scale he wants us to. I think every Rovers fan knew that - that our manager didn't is a little bit worrying.

I think there has been a plan in place for the past couple of seasons. Spending as little as possible to bring in decent youngish players - Marshall, Cairney, Gestede, Duffy - and back them up with more experienced players on frees or loans - Varney, Baptiste, Brown, Kilgallon, Conway. At the same time we have begun to make changes to the Academy to try to improve the quality of players brought into the club in the first place.

[Parsonblue]

It was probably a toss up between him and Cairney K-Hod and we backed the wrong horse (up to now)

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/12896376.Gary_Bowyer__Modern_football_____and_not_just_Blackburn_Rovers_____lack_on_pitch_leaders/?ref=mac

Bowyer's right about leaders. He sounds despondent and to me he comes across as someone who would bin off most of them if he had money. I think he's finding a few of them aren't quite there mentally

EDIT: Can't seem to quote. Says website blocked)

I wouldn't disagree with that about leaders Shaun, I suspect you are right in the manager finding one or two do seem to bottle it at times. It's one of the reasons why I like Williamson and would give him another twelve months. He's not the greatest footballer you'll ever see but he has experience, is prepared to put his foot in when required and will give one hundred per cent and battle all day in the centre of the park when some of our more highly rated guys go missing.

[DE.]

I think there has been a plan in place for the past couple of seasons. Spending as little as possible to bring in decent youngish players - Marshall, Cairney, Gestede, Duffy

Wasn't Marshall over £1m? Hardly small change for a club already grossly in debt at that point. Cairney, Gestede and Duffy combined must have been over a million as well. All on decent wages, one would assume, too.

[K-Hod]

Wasn't Marshall over £1m? Hardly small change for a club already grossly in debt at that point. Cairney, Gestede and Duffy combined must have been over a million as well. All on decent wages, one would assume, too.

£1.25M if memory serves. I reckon the signings we've made post-Kean will be on £10kp/w max.

Still, a fair bit more than your average Joe takes home every month!!

[DE.]

£1.25M if memory serves. I reckon the signings we've made post-Kean will be on £10kp/w max.

Still, a fair bit more than your average Joe takes home every month!!

I know Paul Taylor was Ipswich's highest paid player on £10k. I reckon we have a few slightly above that in the current team, though I agree the max for most current signings is probably between £5-10k.

[tomphil]

It was probably a toss up between him and Cairney K-Hod and we backed the wrong horse (up to now)

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/12896376.Gary_Bowyer__Modern_football_____and_not_just_Blackburn_Rovers_____lack_on_pitch_leaders/?ref=mac

Bowyer's right about leaders. He sounds despondent and to me he comes across as someone who would bin off most of them if he had money. I think he's finding a few of them aren't quite there mentally

EDIT: Can't seem to quote. Says website blocked)

The one thing he has done with most of them is give them a fair chance and stood by them. If he is realising this and maybe his gentle approach doesn't help this then it's a good sign for me. If he could step away from his youth coach attitude and put a bit of distance between himself and the players for next season it would help. Get tougher on them and give the responsibility to those who are up for it. They need a shock to the system some of them and it needs to start pre season on the training ground and would be a step in the right direction if he is to stay as manager.

[JBiz]

His gentle approach...

How do you know how he talks to them in the dressing room and training pitch?

Speculation is one thing, but just assuming that GB is "mr nice" without a shred of evidence, and then suggesting this is a place he needs to improve!

Realistically, I think that the hair dryer is well and truly a thing of the past. Footballers are a different breed these days, even second division players are likely to be millionaires.

I don't know how I'd motivate the squad, but you can guarantee many would switch off knowing they've still got a heated swimming pool to jump in with the mrs later on!

[Rover_Shaun]

"I don't know how I'd motivate the squad, but you can guarantee many would switch off knowing they've still got a heated swimming pool to jump in with the mrs later on!"

Singing wouldn't be the best solution

You are right (apart from the Nice Guy bit as that's a label first used by his supporters) up to a point but I'd still like to think that many of them have too much personal pride to purposely slack off.

[Gav]

Before the pack descends I very much doubt that and think you are getting me mixed up this time with those who have commented first hand on that Gav.

I wouldn't even comment on it had I been there. I'm long enough in the tooth to know that what a manager does on the touchline means nowt. For example Kidd was a hand waver and he was useless. Woy was more sedate and had mixed success. As long as the message get's to the players and they act on it that's all that matters. Managers don't need to rant and rave.

I wouldn't make it up Shaun, maybe I took it out of context, its not really important, but I'm not the only one thats taking you to task over such things so we can't all be wrong.

But regardless of that, posters enjoy reading your comments I'm sure and thats what really matters

[Rover_Shaun]

Ooh you mean bugger