[Archived] Gary Bowyer Discussion

[broadsword]

The last time we had a decent youth keeper on the book was Given I think. We may have started him once or twice when he was nineteen? He then git fed up of being behind Flowers and left for Newcastle. We missed a trick there because I think flowers left us not long after.

In any case, my main point is that this whole goalkeeper audition thing is a misbegotten wrongheaded fudge. He's basically admitted he doesn't know who his number one keeper is. The whole thing is such a mess for a club in our circumstances. A number one keeper, a backup and a youth prospect on loan is the conventional model i believe. But why have that when you can have five goalkeepers, the one with the best pedigree sidelined on big wages, one persisted with when low on confidence, and then perm one from the other three based on what the gypsy says down the funfair.

Sounds totally reasonable to me

[LDRover]

I fear the two Burnley games next season with Bowyer in charge. I'd love to hear his positive spin following a dicking by the apes, because I feel that it's coming.

[tomphil]

If Preston do get over the line I fear both derby games home and away will end in defeat. We should still have enough to take a point or 3 off Bolton at home though so that's something I suppose.........

[Proudtobeblue&white]

He's a lovely bloke in a lovely job given to him by idiots. Idiots will give lovely bloke more time to make things worse with less money as big bloke up front will make idiots a profit, whilst making their baby less valuable. But that doesn't matter because Mrs Loon likes lovely bloke, and that means failure is acceptable in Loon land. Sell big bloke who scores lots of goals, because that is good, and we finished 9th, and, that is good. And Loons will always be loons?

[RevidgeBlue]

Raya is only 19 years old. I don't think it's a good idea to throw him in as second choice goalkeeper at such an early stage in his career. If Steele gets injured and Raya has to play, we could end up with another Jake Kean situation.

I'd rather we kept Steele/Eastwood as our 1/2 pairing and sent Raya out on loan to get some experience in the lower leagues. Ideally we'd sell Kean this summer, too... we don't need 4 goalkeepers on the books.

I wouldn't say making him 2nd choice keeper would be "throwing him in" particularly! He only has to sit on the bench!

What are these young lads meant to do? Wait until they're 25 before they get a chance?

[DE.]

I wouldn't say making him 2nd choice keeper would be "throwing him in" particularly! He only has to sit on the bench!

What are these young lads meant to do? Wait until they're 25 before they get a chance?

Go on loan somewhere to get first team experience, as my post says.

If Steele gets injured do you want a 19 year old between the sticks?

[roverandout]

Didn't do casillas or Buffon any harm

[bob fleming]

K-Hod the first three words would have sufficed to describe the whole club at present (apart from the strikers)

.

[Mike E]

Didn't do casillas or Buffon any harm

Or Lloris, or Hart, or DeGea.

[RevidgeBlue]

Go on loan somewhere to get first team experience, as my post says.

If Steele gets injured do you want a 19 year old between the sticks?

I couldn't care less how old he is if he's good enough. Furthermore if he's good enough to start at somewhere else, why not for us?

[chaddyrovers]

After Yesterday game, Gary Bowyer came over to away support even tho some Huddersfield fans were on the pitch ,kissed the Rovers badge and spent few mins applauding the Rovers fans

[Tom]

Oh that makes finishing 9th better then

Why are they having a pitch invasion anyway Just cause they seen other people on tv do it?

[Amo]

If Steele gets injured do you want a 19 year old between the sticks?

Couldn't you pose that same question to the team loaning him?

I think it's become something of a myth that goalkeepers 'peak' later than outfield players. If they're good enough, they're old enough.

[Parsonblue]

I think yesterday showed that Eastwood is definitely not good enough to be the number one. Raya is young and will make mistakes, but surely he has to be the future for the club. What we don't want is another Given situation, where we allow a good, young keeper to leave because he's becomes frustrated by lack of opportunities. Personally, I'd let Raya and Steele fight it out for the number one berth with Eastwood as cover.

[Stuart]

Couldn't you pose that same question to the team loaning him?

I think it's become something of a myth that goalkeepers 'peak' later than outfield players. If they're good enough, they're old enough.

Goalkeepers live and die by how many individual mistakes they make. That comes with experience. It's no coincidence that the best goalkeepers are consistently in their 30s - certainly at the highest level. Jake Kean has probably been ruined by being thrown in so early.

Joe Hart is the exception that proves the rule.

[Amo]

Goalkeepers live and die by how many individual mistakes they make. That comes with experience. It's no coincidence that the best goalkeepers are consistently in their 30s - certainly at the highest level. Jake Kean has probably been ruined by being thrown in so early.

Joe Hart is the exception that proves the rule.

Isn't it a more parsimonious explanation that Kean simply wasn't good enough?

De Gea, Lloris, Valdes, Courtois, have all established themselves at a young age.

Also, "exception that proves the rule" is nonsensical. I think you mean he's "an exception to the rule".

[tomphil]

The Kean comparisons are wrong imo as he had half as season and did well proving he was capable. Changes in tactics slightly maybe ? but he looked shaky right at the start of the next season and then made that gaff and was soon booted out. Seems he may just have had a default setting that didn't cope too well and he was found out. I liked Kean but

fact is Eastwood was the keeper coaches man and Kean wasn't, same with Robbo to a certain extent. Think it might be different with Raya.

[Stuart]

Isn't it a more parsimonious explanation that Kean simply wasn't good enough?

De Gea, Lloris, Valdes, Courtois, have all established themselves at a young age.

Not sure if you mean parsimonious but I think it shows he wasn't good enough yet.

Also, "exception that proves the rule" is nonsensical. I think you mean he's "an exception to the rule".

[Al]

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/12895522.Gary_Bowyer__Blackburn_Rovers_unlikely_to_have_FFP_embargo_lifted_in_summer

Bowyer thinks we'll be under an embargo next season. Well Sherlock I could have told you months ago that we will. Frankly there isn't much point talking about it because the embargo will be here for years yet. Unless FFP is changed to £20m losses a year it ain't leaving Ewood Park.

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I was talking to the Outlaw last night about Rovers and, from his position in the JW stand, he was very indignant about Mr Bowyer. About how he doesn't have any semblance of a plan. The team has no playing style. His transfer policy is scatter-gun. His loans are donkeys from clubs below us that can't even get in their teams. Signed too many wingers. Wouldn't know a midfielder if it punched him in the gob. Perseveres with Cairney when he hasn't got it. Needs shooting for picking Evans and Williamson in the same midfield. Wasted his time on signing a team of wingers and ignored more important positions when he know an embargo was coming. And thinks Brockhole must be a holiday camp.

He was also very indignant about Hanley and pointed out about how we have stumbled upon a "slightly" stronger defence because "his pet" was injured and how he thinks "he'll just pick the big donkey again next season".

He pointed to teams like Brentford and Bournemouth. Yes those "behemoths of football who have had 5 minutes in this league in donkeys years". He mentioned about how they are where they are because they have a game plan, stick to it and have a settled team. They play a certain way if it's 0-0, 1-0 to them or 0-2 down. Whereas "our clown" doesn't even know his best side, alters his team, unnecessarily, to match the opposition...."I can understand it if you are playing the top of the league but why do it when you are playing struggling teams?", and wouldn't know a tactical sub if it bit him on the arse. And how teams like Middlesbrough "were never great shakes but now they have a manager who can get the best out of them"

So even the OAP's under their rugs in the JW are getting restless. And they have never even heard of BRFCC's (where some would have you think the only discontent are moaners on here)

There are no rugs in the JW but of course you would not know any different as you don't ever go there. Criticism from supporters I can take but from non attenders it's a bit much.

[Amo]

Not sure if you mean parsimonious but I think it shows he wasn't good enough yet.

parsimony - Adoption of the simplest assumption in the formulation of a theory or in the interpretation of data, especially in accordance with the rule of Ockham's razor.

You are right in what you say, inexperienced players invariably make mistakes, and a goalie's are costlier. However, a truly talented goalkeeper will make less goofs than most and will have the maturity and mentality to overcome them.

[Stuart]

Every day's a school day!

There are very, very few players let alone goalkeepers who have such maturity so young. Even less frequent is the first team game time they'd get under Bowyer - although they can expect to miss out on cup finals for the U21s. (Just to get it back on topic ).

[Amo]

Every day's a school day!

There are very, very few players let alone goalkeepers who have such maturity so young. Even less frequent is the first team game time they'd get under Bowyer - although they can expect to miss out on cup finals for the U21s. (Just to get it back on topic ).

But how are players supposed to gain experience if they never play?

What's to stop him making these mistakes whilst on-loan at another club?

[Stuart]

But how are players supposed to gain experience if they never play?

What's to stop him making these mistakes whilst on-loan at another club?

I'd be all for sending these players out on loan to get that experience and learn from their mistakes without it costing points.

I guess the downside is that some decent players can get comfortable there, make a name for themselves and get picked up by other clubs. The key there is to make sure that our management/scouting team keep in touch with them to make sure they now that it's all part of the plan. I'm thinking about O'Connor at Rochdale, and can't help but feel that we handled that badly.

Alan Judge is another case in point. Bowyer couldn't get a tune out of him here despite picking him out as a decent player but he's doing well in a better organised team.

Let Bowyer run the scouting and youngsters and find the talent and hand them over to a proper manager to do the business on match days. Win-win.

[DE.]

Couldn't you pose that same question to the team loaning him?

Yeah, but as the team is likely to be in a lower league it's probably less of an issue for them.

Loaning young players out for experience isn't exactly new. I find it odd that so many would apparently be happy to have Raya as direct back up to the first team, when we already have a backup keeper with some experience in Eastwood.

[roverandout]

Stuart, Buffon and casillas both played at the highest level at 19, played at world cups and in champion league games, age shouldn't matter