[Archived] Transfer Talk

[RevidgeBlue]

You "suppose" Shaun? Dead right it does, just as not being able to maintain possession anywhere on the pitch does - including the front men. There in lies the answer to those folk who don't understand how we can have two 20 goal a season strikers, yet struggle to win games.

I used to play centre half at an amateur level, but even there, if any of the guys in front of me didn't get involved in the game for the whole 90 minutes, it made the task of the back four very difficult. Put us under consistent pressure. Decent managers know that. Heck, everyone should know it. It should be obvious to everybody, but it's not.

Scoring a goal then watching the rest of the game from the half way line didn't help me and the back four one little bit.

I take it this is your customary dig at Rhodes but a blind man on a galloping horse could see that the vast majority of our problems stem from central midfield which is neither creative enough nor does it offer the defence adequate protection, hence the reason we ship so many goals. I'd go as far to say that any pairing of any two of of /Williamson/Evans/Spearing would struggle at League 2 level and that unless the manager addresses this fundamental problem we'll struggle whether the strikers score 40 + goals or not.

Unfortunately as others have said I get the feeling the manager thinks our problems will be solved by the return of "Lowey" or "Lower" as I think I'll call him from now on and that central midfield will once again go unadressed.

[den]

I take it this is your customary dig at Rhodes but a blind man on a galloping horse could see that the vast majority of our problems stem from central midfield which is neither creative enough nor does it offer the defence adequate protection, hence the reason we ship so many goals. I'd go as far to say that any pairing of any two of of /Williamson/Evans/Spearing would struggle at League 2 level and that unless the manager addresses this fundamental problem we'll struggle whether the strikers score 40 + goals or not.

It's not a customary dig at Rhodes, it's a footballing point that applies to any player that can't do the basics of keeping possession Rev. Gestede included if you want. The midfield is pretty poor, but a point I've consistently made - which I guess you don't get - is that it is folly to spend multi millions in this league, on any player with the inability to do the footballing basics, when the rest of the squad isn't good enough.

Wouldnt you agree?

[thenodrog]

Well said re: the bit in bold. All the talk is of the strikers.

Those who support Bowyer totally dismiss his pathetic defensive record, the confusion he fostered in goal, his insistance on playing Hanley, the lack of a quality right-back / dumping Baptiste out there, uncertainty at left-back, and lack of an automatic starter in defensive midfield. Many of our better performances came in the Cup, when ironically playing our second string and when our lilly livered players could be bothered trying their hardest in the spotlight! For nigh on two years we have conceeded almost as many as we score, glossed over as acceptable by those who claim he has done a really good job. My biggest gripe with Bowyer. We should not have to score three to win and until such time as we address our defence professionally we will plod around in mid-table losing just as many as we win.

easy I'll address it right now. When the opposition has the ball we need to have 11 defenders. Make of that what you will.

[onlyonejackwalker]

easy I'll address it right now. When the opposition has the ball we need to have 11 defenders. Make of that what you will.

Its hard to make sense of much you say. Spouting random phrases with informed certainty in response like they actually mean something remains as dull as dishwater.

You have said elsewhere Bowyer has done a very decent job. Well you obviously don't have much complaint or clue about how he has addressed our defence to make such sweeping statements. Your like most of his supporters who can't get past the Rhodes / Gestede debate. You need to ask yourself why there are two nets on a football pitch. Once you have worked it out you might give a bit of thought to the main objectives before a ball is even kicked.

[RevidgeBlue]

easy I'll address it right now. When the opposition has the ball we need to have 11 defenders. Make of that what you will.

Not a completely unfair point in general terms but to use an extreme hypothetical example, if you were to insert Tugay or a young David Dunn and Batty into last season's starting eleven, we go up imo.

Also I think your statement would read slightly better as "We need a manager who can ensure that when the opposition has the ball we have eleven defenders."

[Neal]

You couldn't be more wrong. I never derided anyone, but i did defend myself from the half-wits on here that don't allow others an opinion that differs from theirs.

Absolute nonsense. I actually left this message board for a while because of you and your behaviour. On many occasions I expressed my opinions about Bowyer which may have been similar to the opinions given by Abbey and because of that and the fact that you and him don't exactly get along, you chose to have patronising unprovoked digs and pretty much pick childlike arguments with me even though we hadn't conversed on here before... All because you didn't agree with me. THEN at one point you chose to apologise in a PM and then carried on anyway.

Now after a time out, I come back and it turns out that you want a change of manager like I have done for over 2 years!

Unbelievable.

[ABBEY]

Haha so true

[onlyonejackwalker]

Absolute nonsense. I actually left this message board for a while because of you and your behaviour. On many occasions I expressed my opinions about Bowyer which may have been similar to the opinions given by Abbey and because of that and the fact that you and him don't exactly get along, you chose to have patronising unprovoked digs and pretty much pick childlike arguments with me even though we hadn't conversed on here before... All because you didn't agree with me. THEN at one point you chose to apologise in a PM and then carried on anyway.

Now after a time out, I come back and it turns out that you want a change of manager like I have done for over 2 years!

Unbelievable.

Nutshell.

[roverstdt]

Being one who still supports Bowyer (A little bit), I don't dismiss his defensive record one bit, my main criticism with Bowyer is that his defensive record is awful, his tactics at times are completely wrong and he is unable to adapt to a situation, and he doesn't play to Rhodes strength (In my view). However, I do think there is a chance he can still get us up, and I don't believe there is any other manager out there at the moment who would be willing to come Rovers who would be better than what we have, and who would be able to work with the Venky's regime.

[Rover_Shaun]

my main criticism with Bowyer is that his defensive record is awful, his tactics at times are completely wrong and he is unable to adapt to a situation, and he doesn't play to Rhodes strength (In my view). However, I do think there is a chance he can still get us up

How. By magic?

Your post was not exactly glowing. Even his supporters think he's sh1.t. Poor Gaz :/

[Dunnfc]

George green released from Everton.

Hope we are all over this one! Big potential there, surprised he has not got a new deal there.

[blueboy3333]

Absolute nonsense. I actually left this message board for a while because of you and your behaviour. On many occasions I expressed my opinions about Bowyer which may have been similar to the opinions given by Abbey and because of that and the fact that you and him don't exactly get along, you chose to have patronising unprovoked digs and pretty much pick childlike arguments with me even though we hadn't conversed on here before... All because you didn't agree with me. THEN at one point you chose to apologise in a PM and then carried on anyway.

Now after a time out, I come back and it turns out that you want a change of manager like I have done for over 2 years!

Unbelievable.

can't believe you're claiming you left the board because of 'my behaviour'. Mard arse.

and for the last time, i haven't called for Bowyers head, i've said if we could get McCarthy now then it would be worth looking into. Are you bright enough to see the difference? I haven't said sack him regardless of who comes in.

Unbelievable!

[thenodrog]

Being one who still supports Bowyer (A little bit), I don't dismiss his defensive record one bit, my main criticism with Bowyer is that his defensive record is awful, his tactics at times are completely wrong and he is unable to adapt to a situation, and he doesn't play to Rhodes strength (In my view). However, I do think there is a chance he can still get us up, and I don't believe there is any other manager out there at the moment who would be willing to come Rovers who would be better than what we have, and who would be able to work with the Venky's regime.

He plays a 4-4-2 to suit JR imo. This usually means that against a 4-5-1 we are out numbered in midfield which effectively hands territorial advantage to the opposition, which in turn leads to unecessary pressure on our defence. Our goals against rather backs this up. Compare this to when we played against Swansea, Stoke and Lpool in the cup. We played more of a 4-5-1 and let in just 3 goals in 4 games against top half Premier League opposition. (yes I know Swansea were down to 10 men for 80 odd mins).

[blueboy3333]

Well said re: the bit in bold. All the talk is of the strikers.

Those who support Bowyer totally dismiss his pathetic defensive record, the confusion he fostered in goal, his insistance on playing Hanley, the lack of a quality right-back / dumping Baptiste out there, uncertainty at left-back, and lack of an automatic starter in defensive midfield. Many of our better performances came in the Cup, when ironically playing our second string and when our lilly livered players could be bothered trying their hardest in the spotlight! For nigh on two years we have conceeded almost as many as we score, glossed over as acceptable by those who claim he has done a really good job. My biggest gripe with Bowyer. We should not have to score three to win and until such time as we address our defence professionally we will plod around in mid-table losing just as many as we win.

10th best defensive record in the league last season, the same as the season before. Hardly 'pathetic'.

'Confusion he fostered in goal'. WTF does that even mean? He brought in Steele and Eastwood, one played in the league, one in the cup, and then raya came back to the club and he gave him a shot at the end of the season, just like he said he would. How do you find that confusing?

'Uncertainty at left-back'. Again, what does that mean? Olsson has played there all season. Spurr has been injured.

'lack of a certain starter in defensive midfield'. Williamson has played there all season, along with Evans. Lowe has been injured.

'dumping baptiste at right-back'. Henley is the right-back. He's been injured most of the season so Baptiste has played there and done well. That's why he was brought in, because he can play centre back and right-back. Bowyer even said he was looking for that type of player before he brought him in. someone who can play in both positions. How does that equate to 'dumping him out there'?

Remember when i said some people try to blame everything on Bowyer? Well, you've just gone one better and just started inventing things

[ABBEY]

can't believe you're claiming you left the board because of 'my behaviour'. Mard arse.

and for the last time, i haven't called for Bowyers head, i've said if we could get McCarthy now then it would be worth looking into. Are you bright enough to see the difference? I haven't said sack him regardless of who comes in.

Unbelievable!

and you dont deride ..aye ok then

[blueboy3333]

George green released from Everton.

Hope we are all over this one! Big potential there, surprised he has not got a new deal there.

any good? is he a forward?

[DE.]

'Confusion he fostered in goal'. WTF does that even mean? He brought in Steele and Eastwood, one played in the league, one in the cup, and then raya came back to the club and he gave him a shot at the end of the season, just like he said he would. How do you find that confusing?

I'd assume he's talking about the season before, when the Jake Kean experiment went badly wrong and Eastwood struggled as well. I thought Steele was fine last season, and goalkeeper is the least of our worries with Eastwood and Raya as backup.

[blueboy3333]

and you dont deride ..aye ok then

only morons who talk @#/? when they weren't involved in the convo to begin with.

I'd assume he's talking about the season before, when the Jake Kean experiment went badly wrong and Eastwood struggled as well. I thought Steele was fine last season, and goalkeeper is the least of our worries with Eastwood and Raya as backup.

exactly, there's been absolutely no confusion about the goalkeeping situation. Kean was never mentioned.

[ABBEY]

Reel em in ,I got me a live one

[blueboy3333]

Reel em in ,I got me a live one

that's original

[T J Hooker]

I think all of our senior keepers are adequate at best ability wise and they're all lacking in presence and authority, Id be a lot happier with an experienced commanding keeper back there and Raya and possibly young Raya as cover, I'm sure there's lots of veteran keepers loitering around the reserves at prem clubs that would be ideal for us on loan.

[DE.]

That are on £10k a week or less?

[Hasta]

Good comment. Ings for sure but the rest I doubt.

By the same token neither Rhodes nor Gestede would have put Ings on the bench either. Is that a also a good comment Hasta?

Yes that is a fair comment. Ings and Gestede would be interesting together though. However the whole point renders the comparison of the current crop to the team of 2001 a bit pointless. You don't have to be man for man as good as that team to get promoted. There is a reason why the three teams promoted that year (rovers, Fulham and Bolton) stayed in the Premier league far longer than any other promoted trio. It was a vintage year for the championship. In many other years, Rovers would have won the league quite comfortably. However it's worth remembering Souness hadn't been there that long at the start of the season and Rovers didn't hit top gear till after we spanked Burnley in December (not sure we were even top 6 until then)

There have been many teams promoted since then with a far poorer team who went up because they bridged the skill deficiency gap with work ethic and tactical nouse. Were Burnley man for man better than we are when they went up? I'm not so convinced to be honest I just think they probably had a stronger central midfield which is the area that still hasn't been addressed since relegation.

[T J Hooker]

on loan with 10k contribution towards his wage.

oh! wait its only us that do that.

[Neal]

can't believe you're claiming you left the board because of 'my behaviour'. Mard arse.

and for the last time, i haven't called for Bowyers head, i've said if we could get McCarthy now then it would be worth looking into. Are you bright enough to see the difference? I haven't said sack him regardless of who comes in.

Unbelievable!

"You don't deride" then call me a 'mard arse' and then question MY intelligence???

I'm not claiming anything, I'm just being honest... I left because of your attitude and it quite obviously hasn't improved.