[Archived] Transfer Talk

[Amo]

Bowyer loves a trier.

If we keep Varney, I'm committing seppuku.

[roverzee]

King played up front with Rhodes in a home game that ended 0-0. He had a good game and worked his nuts off, the end pass, shot was missing but his display was similar to that v Swansea in terms of his runs and the problems he caused. I remember being quite surprised in him but he was quickly a bit part player again after that.

Bowyer clearly doesn't fancy him as he goes against his miserable style of one paced football. Having played him in the cups and he did so well he was then under a bit of fan pressure to use him. He just isn't a Bowyer type player and he knows it so i'll be amazed if he signs.

In this case it's not about the manager, it's about the player.

His time at Rovers is summed up by the Stoke hattrick and the following Tuesday night game away at Cardiff. He'd earned the right to start and got all 90 minutes, but he was the least effective player on the pitch, and consequently was back on the bench against Blackpool.

He's wanted to play up front, but he's been competing with Rhodes and Gestede for that right, and given they've both got 20+ goals then you can't really push King's case, or blame Bowyer - it's down to inconsistent form.

Having said that, I do hope he signs the deal he's been offered because he does have his qualities, and I don't see how the club could replace him with anyone as good under FFP.

[tomphil]

So who would you have dropped to accommodate King - Rhodes or Gestede ?

I remember King having a spell of about 4 or 5 matches last season where he played well - before getting injured and never really being the same player. This season - he has had probably fewer good matches - though played less.

Though I would like him to stay - a lot of people saying they want him to stay is based around the FA Cup matches where I think the opposition were basically caught out by our change in tactics - no guarantee that he would have the same impact if played regularly (even if injuries allowed that) as teams would set up to nullify his main threat of pace (though personally I think this would help the whole team, even if it nullified his threat).

I wouldn't have dropped anyone for him but he'd have been higher up in the pecking order from the bench. Obviously injury messed it up after his cup heroics or we may have seen him utilised a bit more, not that sure though.

[cesus]

As a few others have said Josh King's problem was not Bowyer it was he was behind two absolutely fantastic forwards in Rhodes and Gestede. The two cup games he was on fire, a few weeks later he was back injured and unfortunately that's how his time here has gone. He should have never have been picked ahead of Rhodes or Gestede (both better/more consistent) so that left him 3rd choice when actually fit, his lack of final ball negated his threat from wide so was rightly behind Conway on the left so his lack of games is actually quite justified. The problem we have now is FFP has hit home combined with the fact both our top strikers look to be heading out, for me this couldn't have been played out any differently ... Simply could he justifiably played more times ahead of Gestede and Rhodes no. Will he play more next season due to probable exits yes. Only he can decide if he has been badly treated with lack of games, I don't personally think he has due to better options but next season he will be further up the list due to exits. It's his choice.

[tomphil]

In this case it's not about the manager, it's about the player.

His time at Rovers is summed up by the Stoke hattrick and the following Tuesday night game away at Cardiff. He'd earned the right to start and got all 90 minutes, but he was the least effective player on the pitch, and consequently was back on the bench against Blackpool.

He's wanted to play up front, but he's been competing with Rhodes and Gestede for that right, and given they've both got 20+ goals then you can't really push King's case, or blame Bowyer - it's down to inconsistent form.

Having said that, I do hope he signs the deal he's been offered because he does have his qualities, and I don't see how the club could replace him with anyone as good under FFP.

It is a bit to do with the manager though who tried to play the same way v Cardiff as we had v Stoke. Some have called for a Rudy/King partnership in the league but imo that won't work very well in the Championship. Not many play that high up and so casual as the Prem sides thinking they just had to turn up. I just think he could have been used better in the squad when fit this season. In GB's defence though It probably is a 50/50 with King but he didn't appear to go about getting the best out of him the right way and that's because I reckon he just doesn't fancy his type of player.

[Bucksrover]

I think that Bowyer could have used Rhodes, King and Gestede a lot better throughout the season.

I know King is often injured, but when all those three are fit, their very different strengths could have been devastating in the championship.

Little value in discussing it now though as it looks like we will be doing well to have one of them still here next season

[tomphil]

As a few others have said Josh King's problem was not Bowyer it was he was behind two absolutely fantastic forwards in Rhodes and Gestede. The two cup games he was on fire, a few weeks later he was back injured and unfortunately that's how his time here has gone. He should have never have been picked ahead of Rhodes or Gestede (both better/more consistent) so that left him 3rd choice when actually fit, his lack of final ball negated his threat from wide so was rightly behind Conway on the left so his lack of games is actually quite justified. The problem we have now is FFP has hit home combined with the fact both our top strikers look to be heading out, for me this couldn't have been played out any differently ... Simply could he justifiably played more times ahead of Gestede and Rhodes no. Will he play more next season due to probable exits yes. Only he can decide if he has been badly treated with lack of games, I don't personally think he has due to better options but next season he will be further up the list due to exits. It's his choice.

Yes but we have to remember Rhodes & Gestede have been subbed regularly and dropped and rotated so my argument is King should maybe have had more of a look in.

[frosty]

Yes but we have to remember Rhodes & Gestede have been subbed regularly and dropped and rotated so my argument is King should maybe have had more of a look in.

Aye, it's important to remember that there was a run of games where Bowyer inexplicably kept picking Brown instead of Gestede.

If King was only behind Rhodes and Gestede in the pecking order then that'd be fair enough and he couldn't have any complaints, but seeing Brown lumbering about in front of him must have been pretty frustrating.

[rog of the rovers]

The King is dead, long live the king.

I'm so torn when it comes to Joshua King I really can't make my mind up on whether him leaving would be the travesty it appears on the surface.

Firstly, do I think he's a Premier League striker? No

Therefore if he thinks he can be the pacy striker for a lower/mid table Premier League team over the likes of Jamie Vardy, Yannick Bolasie, Sadio Berahino etc I think he'll quickly be found out.

Looking at his Rovers statistics

36 starts

26 sub appearances

5 league goals

3 cup goals

7 league assists

1 cup assist

TOTAL

62 Appearances, 8 Goals, 8 Assists.

For comparisons sake, Rudy Gestede in one and a half seasons

66 Appearances, 35 Goals, 9 Assists.

Of course it would be naive to look at statistics alone, and his performances against Swansea and Stoke were fantastic, BUT these are one off games. 2 good games in 62 doesn't make you a world beater.

In fact I'd argue outside of those two games and a stretch at the start of the 2013/14 campaign, Bolton at home springs to mind, he's been average to poor in most games. Poor decision making, poor final ball.

Even the most optimistic of fans however can't argue with this brutal fact.

August - October - Unused or substitute in games, arguments that Bowyer didn't want to pick him, but......

October 25th - December 20th - INJURED

Stoke - 3 goals, wonderful performance.

10 days later

Norwich - In an effort to protect him from injury, and after a lengthy warm up during half time. King lasts 2 minutes before yet more hamstring issues.

From 24th February - 25th April - INJURED

Missing a total of 21 games (that includes the Cup matches vs Liverpool) BUT is nearly half of a season!!

I'm so undecided, potential yes, but with wages and registered players at a premium can we survive having a player unavailable for half the season on our books?

I'll be relatively happy if he stays, but if he doesn't we may have dodged a bullet.

[RevidgeBlue]

The King is dead, long live the king.

I'm so torn when it comes to Joshua King I really can't make my mind up on whether him leaving would be the travesty it appears on the surface.

Firstly, do I think he's a Premier League striker? No

Therefore if he thinks he can be the pacy striker for a lower/mid table Premier League team over the likes of Jamie Vardy, Yannick Bolasie, Sadio Berahino etc I think he'll quickly be found out.

Looking at his Rovers statistics

36 starts

26 sub appearances

5 league goals

3 cup goals

7 league assists

1 cup assist

TOTAL

62 Appearances, 8 Goals, 8 Assists.

For comparisons sake, Rudy Gestede in one and a half seasons

66 Appearances, 35 Goals, 9 Assists.

Of course it would be naive to look at statistics alone, and his performances against Swansea and Stoke were fantastic, BUT these are one off games. 2 good games in 62 doesn't make you a world beater.

In fact I'd argue outside of those two games and a stretch at the start of the 2013/14 campaign, Bolton at home springs to mind, he's been average to poor in most games. Poor decision making, poor final ball.

Even the most optimistic of fans however can't argue with this brutal fact.

August - October - Unused or substitute in games, arguments that Bowyer didn't want to pick him, but......

October 25th - December 20th - INJURED

Stoke - 3 goals, wonderful performance.

10 days later

Norwich - In an effort to protect him from injury, and after a lengthy warm up during half time. King lasts 2 minutes before yet more hamstring issues.

From 24th February - 25th April - INJURED

Missing a total of 21 games (that includes the Cup matches vs Liverpool) BUT is nearly half of a season!!

I'm so undecided, potential yes, but with wages and registered players at a premium can we survive having a player unavailable for half the season on our books?

I'll be relatively happy if he stays, but if he doesn't we may have dodged a bullet.

The King is dead, long live the king.

I'm so torn when it comes to Joshua King I really can't make my mind up on whether him leaving would be the travesty it appears on the surface.

Firstly, do I think he's a Premier League striker? No

Therefore if he thinks he can be the pacy striker for a lower/mid table Premier League team over the likes of Jamie Vardy, Yannick Bolasie, Sadio Berahino etc I think he'll quickly be found out.

Looking at his Rovers statistics

36 starts

26 sub appearances

5 league goals

3 cup goals

7 league assists

1 cup assist

TOTAL

62 Appearances, 8 Goals, 8 Assists.

For comparisons sake, Rudy Gestede in one and a half seasons

66 Appearances, 35 Goals, 9 Assists.

Of course it would be naive to look at statistics alone, and his performances against Swansea and Stoke were fantastic, BUT these are one off games. 2 good games in 62 doesn't make you a world beater.

In fact I'd argue outside of those two games and a stretch at the start of the 2013/14 campaign, Bolton at home springs to mind, he's been average to poor in most games. Poor decision making, poor final ball.

Even the most optimistic of fans however can't argue with this brutal fact.

August - October - Unused or substitute in games, arguments that Bowyer didn't want to pick him, but......

October 25th - December 20th - INJURED

Stoke - 3 goals, wonderful performance.

10 days later

Norwich - In an effort to protect him from injury, and after a lengthy warm up during half time. King lasts 2 minutes before yet more hamstring issues.

From 24th February - 25th April - INJURED

Missing a total of 21 games (that includes the Cup matches vs Liverpool) BUT is nearly half of a season!!

I'm so undecided, potential yes, but with wages and registered players at a premium can we survive having a player unavailable for half the season on our books?

I'll be relatively happy if he stays, but if he doesn't we may have dodged a bullet.

Spot on Rog. Even if King were to stay and condescend to put in his usual 3-4 performances next season, can't see he'll ever be anything other than a permanent sick note.

Get his wages off the payroll asap imo.

[Don Said]

I know that we could afford to take risks back then, but I remember Rovers fans rolling their eyes when we signed Bellamy due to his injuries.

And speaking of injuries, look how many muscle related absences we had last year. Bad luck or fault within the staff?

[thenodrog]

I think Bowyer was taken by surprise by just how good King was against Stoke. Outstanding. He was played up top in the FA cup as Bowyer, rightly, thought the oppo were complacent and vulnerable to pace. He put in two wonderful performances.

King was so good that made Bowyers life difficult as suddenly a lot of clubs sat up and notice him. Our best hope of keeping King was if no one else wanted him. After Stoke he now looks a talent and the likes of QPR etc will make him strong offers we can't compete with.

The root cause is fundamentally Bowyer has preferred Rhodes and Gestede as strikers (can't blame him for that) and Cairney, Marshall and Conway on the wing (more blame here, but then King had not played well this season on the wing, nor does he want to play there).

I think it would be harsh to give Bowyer grief on this score.I don't think many supporters would have given King more game time than Bowyer has.

I can't help but judge players as it I was their opposite number. If I was a centre half for a strong team facing the Rovers then in order of strikers I'd least like to face it would be King then Gestede, then Rhodes, then Brown, and it'd be happy days if they were all injured / suspended and the only man left was Varney. If I played for a poor team facing the Rovers then It would be Gestede, Rhodes, King, Brown, Varney.

Make of that what you will.

I agree it's harsh to blame bowyer about last seasons. Before the fa cup run nobody was on here pushing for king to start games. Infact most people felt he was useless! Bowyer was going to start the season with gestede and Rhodes after the way the finished the season before.

Il love king to sign but still don't think we can pin all our hopes on a striker that will probably be injured for half the season

In fairness all we'd seen of him was out on the wing as JR was always preferred.... for one reason or another. I never saw him playing in his best position until the Swansea match. Also I am left with the distinct impression that Bowyer wanted to take Hull City's offer for Rhodes so it's quite possible that Bowyer did fancy King over Rhodes but was overruled from India. Would make sense to me.

In relation to Josh King, my big concern is his fitness. If he was capable of staying fit throughout the season then I would be anxious to do whatever we could to keep him at the club. He's undoubtedly a talent who could be a very useful player in this division. However, he's been at the club for more than 2.5 years and played 50 odd games. I've lost count of the number of times he's been unavailable for prolonged spells due to injury. With this in mind I won't be losing too much sleep if he doesn't stay. Compare his injury record to that of Rhodes, Conway or Cairney for example and those are far more reliable. Unfortunate but true.

It's blistering pace makes em injury prone. Not much chance of those three you mentioned pulling a hamstring is there?

As a few others have said Josh King's problem was not Bowyer it was he was behind two absolutely fantastic forwards in Rhodes and Gestede. The two cup games he was on fire, a few weeks later he was back injured and unfortunately that's how his time here has gone. He should have never have been picked ahead of Rhodes or Gestede (both better/more consistent) so that left him 3rd choice when actually fit, his lack of final ball negated his threat from wide so was rightly behind Conway on the left so his lack of games is actually quite justified. The problem we have now is FFP has hit home combined with the fact both our top strikers look to be heading out, for me this couldn't have been played out any differently ... Simply could he justifiably played more times ahead of Gestede and Rhodes no. Will he play more next season due to probable exits yes. Only he can decide if he has been badly treated with lack of games, I don't personally think he has due to better options but next season he will be further up the list due to exits. It's his choice.

You are under 18 right?

Aye, it's important to remember that there was a run of games where Bowyer inexplicably kept picking Brown instead of Gestede.

may be an unpopular viewpoint but I could see Brown and King providing a real threat. Especially if we still had Dunny's quality and invention behind them.

[Amo]

I'd daresay Rhodes & King would be far more effective.

[JAL]

I think that Bowyer could have used Rhodes, King and Gestede a lot better throughout the season.

I know King is often injured, but when all those three are fit, their very different strengths could have been devastating in the championship.

Little value in discussing it now though as it looks like we will be doing well to have one of them still here next season

Totally agree Bucks but Gary does seem to like his weak central midfielders that can hold hands with his weak centre halves and just hope to sneak a result here and there.

I'd daresay Rhodes & King would be far more effective.

Its a good combination but also the Conway to Gestede is another bonus combination.

[cesus]

You are under 18 right?

No my friend, but there is absolutely no point me comparing Rhodes & Gestede to the championship winning team or Simon Garner etc when talking about Josh King. In 2015 with the current state of the club and how far we are likely to fall I'd say they are relatively speaking absolutely fantastic strikers.

[Neal]

Don't follow much on here but King has spoken out again in the Norwegian press...

http://thepeoplesperson.com/2015/05/21/ex-red-king-hesitant-to-stay-at-blackburn-96354/

[The Rover of Finland]

Don't follow much on here but King has spoken out again in the Norwegian press...

http://thepeoplesperson.com/2015/05/21/ex-red-king-hesitant-to-stay-at-blackburn-96354/

Doesn't sound like staying. Nothing wrong for being honest.

[EgyptianPete]

Doesn't trust people, well that's a great indictment of Bowyer. Couldn't man manage a duck.

[Tom]

King is going - which I don't blame him for and Varney isn't going to stay either thankfully, he won't be offered a deal and he clearly wouldn't sign one he's said he fell out of love with the game here.

Hope we don't waste wages on Paul Taylor but I think he will sign.

[Neal]

Can see King heading off to Germany personally, he's the sort of signing that would be typical of smaller bundesliga clubs

[glen9mullan]

Tbh , King had the odd good game and you wouldn't need a dingles hand to count them .

He can't trap a ball , can't tackle , can't head , can't pass and his shooting ain't to accurate either . What he does have is an abundance of speed and a terrible injury record .

I recall Shaw saying in a meeting that he was good enough to play for Barcelona when we first signed him full time , which even back then I nearly fell off my chair .

We've had better, and moved them on .

So no big loss IMO

[thenodrog]

Can't rem .... who was the player who didn't figure pre season? Brown was it?

[Waggy76]

I think that Bowyer could have used Rhodes, King and Gestede a lot better throughout the season.

I know King is often injured, but when all those three are fit, their very different strengths could have been devastating in the championship.

Little value in discussing it now though as it looks like we will be doing well to have one of them still here next season

To make matters worse ,Bowyer will still be here , which is far more worrying !

[AJW]

The love in with King is down to him being the only player we have with pace , if we had others then this would not be worth discussing

[glen9mullan]

Can't rem .... who was the player who didn't figure pre season? Brown was it?

Was it not Marshall? I seem to recall he was playing for a Sunday league team in salford to keep fit as he was not part of Bowyers plans , and then got in team and had great start to season