Academy & U21s

[Bigdoggsteel]

49 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

He sits on the bench every week and gets a few minutes at the end of a game.

He started the last game or the one before it. I remember seeing it on Twitter 

[Stuart]

4 minutes ago, Oldgregg86 said:

Joe nuttall will never be good enough for our first 11. The last thing we need is him in the squad when we're trying to move forward. I guarantee mowbray is trying to get him a loan with a view to get him moved on and off the books. He simply isn't good enough and doesn't have the attitude and mentality to make it at championship level. He was poor enough in league one. He's cameos in the first team  this season have been poor also

I’ll ask again, what does Brereton offer that Nuttall can’t?

[Oldgregg86]

26 minutes ago, Stuart said:

I’ll ask again, what does Brereton offer that Nuttall can’t?

Financial disappointment

[Parsonblue]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

He started the last game or the one before it. I remember seeing it on Twitter 

He plays when Nuttall is not available.  He may get more game time if Nuttall goes on loan but to be honest he's not a patch on Mansell and Mansell has struggled in the last eighteen months.  Simmonds has poor work rate, too fond of the stepover - even when there is nobody near him he can't help but do a stepover or two - and offers very little.  Butterworth is a far better player, scores more goals, is quicker and has a tremendous attitude in terms of work rate.  He's another who will probably go out on loan in January.  

[Parsonblue]

8 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

No, but I read the following players are out of contract in the summer

Charley Doyle, Jack Doyle, Tyler Magloire, Lewis Hardcastle, Willem Tomlinson, Stefan Mols, Okera Simmonds and Lewis Mansell.

Of those I would think only Charley Doyle, Stefan Mols and possibly Tyler are likely to be retained.

[Stuart]

7 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

Of those I would think only Charley Doyle, Stefan Mols and possibly Tyler are likely to be retained.

Where has it gone wrong for Tomlinson do you think?

[Bigdoggsteel]

Wasn't there talk of "personal issues" just after he got around the first team last year? I don't know what they were, nor should anyone say what they were on here, but they seem to have derailed him. 

[Stuart]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Wasn't there talk of "personal issues" just after he got around the first team last year? I don't know what they were, nor should anyone say what they were on here, but they seem to have derailed him. 

Thought that was Wharton?

[Bigdoggsteel]

18 minutes ago, Stuart said:

Thought that was Wharton?

It was definitely Tomlinson I heard. Mowbray said it in an interview. Maybe it was both though. 

[islander200]

1 hour ago, Parsonblue said:

He plays when Nuttall is not available.  He may get more game time if Nuttall goes on loan but to be honest he's not a patch on Mansell and Mansell has struggled in the last eighteen months.  Simmonds has poor work rate, too fond of the stepover - even when there is nobody near him he can't help but do a stepover or two - and offers very little.  Butterworth is a far better player, scores more goals, is quicker and has a tremendous attitude in terms of work rate.  He's another who will probably go out on loan in January.  

Have you seen much of the lad we got from Walsall at the end of the window Parson?Impressions?

[Parsonblue]

2 hours ago, Stuart said:

Where has it gone wrong for Tomlinson do you think?

I've heard there are personal issues which have impacted on the lad.  I wouldn't be surprised if he is allowed to move on in January.

[Parsonblue]

50 minutes ago, islander200 said:

Have you seen much of the lad we got from Walsall at the end of the window Parson?Impressions?

 He's usually on the bench for the Under-23's and I think he's had the odd game for the Under-18's.   To be honest he's not really had the game time to make much impression at the moment.  I think this is a lad who was signed with a view to the future.  If Nuttall goes out on loan he might figure more after Christmas when younger lads tend to get more time with the Under-23's with a view to next season. 

[Stuart]

24 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

I've heard there are personal issues which have impacted on the lad.  I wouldn't be surprised if he is allowed to move on in January.

Shame. Gambling?

[RevidgeBlue]

2 hours ago, Stuart said:

Shame. Gambling?

Yes. I have been told that the Club got him out of the trouble he was in (which was pretty serious) and this  led me to hope that he was one the Club had high hopes for as I think he looks a very handy player. However since then I believe he may have strayed off the straight and narrow again and whilst I don't think he's currently in the same sort of difficulty he was originally it  would appear he's fallen out of favour.

[Stuart]

7 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Yes. I have been told that the Club got him out of the trouble he was in (which was pretty serious) and this  led me to hope that he was one the Club had high hopes for as I think he looks a very handy player. However since then I believe he may have strayed off the straight and narrow again and whilst I don't think he's currently in the same sort of difficulty he was originally it  would appear he's fallen out of favour.

Something needs to be done about young people getting into it. He won’t be the only one. Such a waste.

[blueboy3333]

8 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Yes. I have been told that the Club got him out of the trouble he was in (which was pretty serious) and this  led me to hope that he was one the Club had high hopes for as I think he looks a very handy player. However since then I believe he may have strayed off the straight and narrow again and whilst I don't think he's currently in the same sort of difficulty he was originally it  would appear he's fallen out of favour.

Maybe he opened an account with our shirt sponsor. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

That's the bloody thing. Football is the biggest promoter of sports and football in the UK and Ireland. Who finds it surprising when young football players with too much money and free time would get in trouble with it? Plenty of my mates are flat out on the app, getting in trouble with their partners and all for it. Personally I have a €20 max bet each week, sometimes its less. It's a slippery slope and as the saying goes "the bookie always wins" 

Edited December 19, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Stuart]

Football has absolutely normalised gambling. It has become the culture for young lads to have a flutter. TV matches are filled with lad-targeting betting ads. The more money you have, the more you do it. The bitter irony is when ‘football’ comes down hard (or even disposed of) players and officials when they gamble.

Clubs won’t take a stand though because it’s all about money. Even a family club (award winning) like Rovers endorses gambling and smoking (vaping) so what hope is there?

[Dreams of 1995]

The problem with modern gambling is the ease to which one can keep the addiction private. With the advances in phone technology somebody could be gambling huge sums of money over the phone whilst sitting in the same room as you and you wouldn't even know. In years gone by you'd have to physically walk to the bookies and you'd know the person behind the counter, who would possibly know your wife, cousin, brother or mother and, I would assume, if you became a bit too regular then word would get out about it.

Nowadays, the young lads are using their phones to secure pay day loans, using their phones to transfer the funds into an app and then spending it without ever having to leave their sofa. The problem of gambling goes above and beyond simply banning the advertisements or sponsorship but technology needs to advance in such a way that enables strict monitoring of such activity.

[JacknOry]

7 hours ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

The problem with modern gambling is the ease to which one can keep the addiction private. With the advances in phone technology somebody could be gambling huge sums of money over the phone whilst sitting in the same room as you and you wouldn't even know. In years gone by you'd have to physically walk to the bookies and you'd know the person behind the counter, who would possibly know your wife, cousin, brother or mother and, I would assume, if you became a bit too regular then word would get out about it.

Nowadays, the young lads are using their phones to secure pay day loans, using their phones to transfer the funds into an app and then spending it without ever having to leave their sofa. The problem of gambling goes above and beyond simply banning the advertisements or sponsorship but technology needs to advance in such a way that enables strict monitoring of such activity.

Spot on.

I have known a few mates that have had some really serious issues with it and they do not have the kind of spare cash floating around that these kids do. I guess its all relative though, 1/4, 1/2, 2/3  of your salary is 1/4, 1/2, 2/3  of your salary no matter what you're earning.

For many it is not so much the possible financial gains, it is more that high when you win. Of course, once you get behind you then start to chase the losses and things get worse there on in. 

Never been much of a gambler me - tenner on the grand national and a few friendly games of low stakes poker is about as far as I go. 

 

[Stuart]

7 hours ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

The problem with modern gambling is the ease to which one can keep the addiction private. With the advances in phone technology somebody could be gambling huge sums of money over the phone whilst sitting in the same room as you and you wouldn't even know. In years gone by you'd have to physically walk to the bookies and you'd know the person behind the counter, who would possibly know your wife, cousin, brother or mother and, I would assume, if you became a bit too regular then word would get out about it.

Nowadays, the young lads are using their phones to secure pay day loans, using their phones to transfer the funds into an app and then spending it without ever having to leave their sofa. The problem of gambling goes above and beyond simply banning the advertisements or sponsorship but technology needs to advance in such a way that enables strict monitoring of such activity.

That’s an excellent post.

Handheld computers have become a real problem. The ease of financial transactions and the social media access have great potential for good but have insidious side effects.

[Mattyblue]

Bielsa has handed debuts to 5 homegrown players this season. That’s a team going for promotion to the PL and the high stakes that go with it. Mid table Rovers? 0.

For all the talk of our ‘model’, when are the next crop of academy players going to make a mark here? Is it due to the manager not being willing to blood them or the players in the academy not being of the required standard? Though an earlier graduate, I can say I’ve not seen Travis, as an example put a foot wrong when called upon.

If it’s the later, why? Why is the Cat 1 academy not producing?

Edited December 24, 2018 by Mattyblue

[RoversClitheroe]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

Bielsa has handed debuts to 5 homegrown players this season. That’s a team going for promotion to the PL and the high stakes that go with it.

For all the talk of our ‘model’, when are the next crop of academy players going to make a mark here? Is it due to the manager not being willing to blood them or the players in the academy not being of the required standard? Though I can say I’ve not seen Travis, as an example put a foot wrong when called upon.

If it’s the later, why? Why is the Cat 1 academy not producing?

I personally think we have a lot of talent in our under 23s that could potentially make the step up.

[Stuart]

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

Bielsa has handed debuts to 5 homegrown players this season. That’s a team going for promotion to the PL and the high stakes that go with it.

For all the talk of our ‘model’, when are the next crop of academy players going to make a mark here? Is it due to the manager not being willing to blood them or the players in the academy not being of the required standard? Though I can say I’ve not seen Travis, as an example put a foot wrong when called upon.

If it’s the later, why? Why is the Cat 1 academy not producing?

Our Academy won their division last season (as a League One club) against their equals or betters at other Championship clubs. Johnson can’t do much better than that.

My observation would be though that Johnson takes the game to the opposition and attacks whereas Mowbray tries to counter them. Either they are not on the same wavelength or one of them has got it wrong.

I’ll get pellets for saying it but I think finishing second last season has clouded people’s judgement of Mowbray. With our squad and budget - and the likes of Graham, Dack and Mulgrew - we should have won the division.

Mowbray is not the messiah, he just followed Coyle and his first gig made him one of the favourites. If he had stayed up that season, would we have kicked on and turned things around - without the bounce. I don’t think he would. I expect we would have struggled.

[JBiz]

48 minutes ago, Stuart said:

LI’ll get pellets for saying it but I think finishing second last season has clouded people’s judgement of Mowbray.

Not pellets, just disagreed with.

The fact we are arguing about transfers, promotion to the prem expectations, being in a “slide” but still safe says it all.

20 months ago the arguments are about direction of club, agents, ownership, Senior, league one.

Promotion was the minimum expectation, and whilst you may prefer to watch Damien Johnson’s reserves go all out to win - the pressure and expectation on both positions is incomparable.