[Archived] The General Election 2015

[Stuart]

I wonder how long it will be befire the general election is actually decided by the debate itself - X-Factor style. Each week the party with the fewest electoral votes is booted off.

A hung parliament could itself be a vote. Where numbers for the final two remaining candidates are too close, they could have the option of agreeing to give the electorate the 'coalition' option.

Politics for the X-Factor generation - get British youth involved/interested. The trouble is that much like the TV show, actual talent would come second to personality and media hype. Although thinking about it, is that really much different than today?

"Press the red button on your remote, or via the app, for Britain's Govt Rhetoric - this week's debate theme as chosen by the electorate during the week is... Immigration ... don't forget to Instagram those screenshots of the candidates pulling gargoyle expressions to help ruin their images... and it's over to your hosts Ant and Dec..." [applause]

[thenodrog]

Even that's massively bumped up by the super rich earners. I've hardly met a person in Blackburn and locality on anywhere near that.

Bloody hell husky! And how many have actually showed you their payslip?

[ABBEY]

i can catogorically swear on my kids life i dont earn anywhere near this 120k mark.

[thenodrog]

I know how builders operate - one lives next door - and most of it is downright cheating. There needs to be a universal law that covers all the scams they get up to because at the moment it is wide open to abuse. Perhaps HMRC should assume every builder is on the fiddle and tax them at a higher rate than everyone else.

Really? So can we assume that you are strong enough in your principles to have challenged him about it and reported him to the good people at HMRC? Or have you just hidden out of sight twitching your curtains to check every time he sets off and comes home from work?

[thenodrog]

You're right - the poorest pay more tax pro rata than the rich. It needs to be addressed.

What you mean is that the poorest depend on the wealthier to subsidise their lives by funding the nations services including nhs, defence, welfare etc etc that they can't afford. Make more sense to address that first. The wealthier the society the more everyone benefits. You policies would just make everyone poorer. The bigger the mammoth the hunter gatherers kill the more there is for the entire tribe to feast on.

In fact here....

May as well have been written today. What goes around comes around eh? The same lame socialist principles were outed 30 years ago by the lady who you wrote about in these glowing terms all those years ago Quote "Amid scenes of great jubilation Margaret Thatcher was returned as MP for Finchley at Hendon Town Hall in the early hours of Friday". Are you still miffed that she not deem that good enough for an OBE?

[Wiggy]

The 50% tax rate debate shows how dishonest politics is in this country.

The rate was brought in by Gordon Brown FOUR weeks before he left office after having been at 40% throughout his 13 years as Chancellor and PM. As with much of Gordon Brown's politics it was dripping with political calculation and designed to leave a trap for the Conservatives.

The two Eds have been largely successful in using the sound bite ' Tax breaks for millionaires' . It isn't , it's for people earning over £150,000 (not the same). Even though the tax rate is 5% higher than when the two of them were Gordon Brown's closed aides.

Finally, it doesn't actually bring in any more revenue. Higher earners find ways around the tax, by increasing pension contributions to the maximum etc.

They know all this and the arguments are facile, puerile and playing to the politics of envy.

[thenodrog]

Amazon are one of the greatest abusers of zero- hours contracts. It wouldn't be missed because it would be replaced by another (hopefully more responsible) company that employed people on decent wages and with decent contracts. Your way of thinking is just a race to the bottom. These companies need to be brought to account.

As I said yesterday two thirds of the people on zero hours contracts are quite happy and do not want to work any more hours. Two thirds constituting a significant majority!

All this 'zero hours' guff is just a convenient soundbyte constantly repeated by Labour along with 'NHS' and simply because with their recent record they dare not commment on anything else! Have you forgotten that in his speech to the Labour Party Conference just 6 months back that Ed neglected to say one single word about the economy? Well we all know why that was don't we? He bloody well daren't!

Narrow minded eh? Let's run a poll, you'd lose by a country mile.

People on big wages should help the poorest in society, it's just common decency in my book.

If I earned 100k a year I'd be more than happy to pay more tax if that was going to help the poorest.

Then again I acknowledge we have a problem, food banks etc, Cameron doesn't.

But if the tax rate was a standard 20% for example for every taxpayer on every pound earned (for easy reckoning) you already would be paying 4x the amount of someone on 25k. And thats even without the 40% rate kicking in. It's blood from a stone you want Gav.

Lets run a poll and punish a minority is what you are effectively saying.

[Mercer]

Only the Tories can manage the economy.

They've proved it time and again mopping-up Labour's mess - remember Liam Byrne's infamous note 'there's no money left'.

Miliband and Labour talking about the economy is like Venky's talking about football common sense - it's total nonsense.

[thenodrog]

I'd have to disagree. He's making stopping immigration sound like it's going to solve everything.I'm liking what Sturgeon's saying a lot. It's just a shame she wants to split the UK up.

Luckiest woman alive!!! Sturgeon says a lot of things but what she never says is that she owes her political career to a majority of scots voting a resounding 'No' to independence last Autumn! The SNP pinned EVERYTHING on their greed to grab North Sea oil. They never ever considered that the price of Brent crude might crash as it has done did they? They thought by now they'd all be rolling in it. Truth is Scotland would now be bankrupt with the shutters down and in a worse state than Greece if they had got their independence that day.

[ABBEY]

What you mean is that the poorest depend on the wealthier to subsidise their lives by funding the nations services including nhs, defence, welfare etc etc that they can't afford. Make more sense to address that first. The wealthier the society the more everyone benefits. You policies would just make everyone poorer. The bigger the mammoth the hunter gatherers kill the more there is for the entire tribe to feast on.

In fact here....

May as well have been written today. What goes around comes around eh? The same lame socialist principles were outed 30 years ago by the lady who you wrote about in these glowing terms all those years ago Quote "Amid scenes of great jubilation Margaret Thatcher was returned as MP for Finchley at Hendon Town Hall in the early hours of Friday". Are you still miffed that she not deem that good enough for an OBE?

that you tube is more offensive than what maj posted.

Only the Tories can manage the economy.

They've proved it time and again mopping-up Labour's mess - remember Liam Byrne's infamous note 'there's no money left'.

Miliband and Labour talking about the economy is like Venky's talking about football common sense - it's total nonsense.

The rich get richer the poor get poorer ..the Tory Law

[thenodrog]

Farage lost my support when he talked about immigrants with HIV draining the Nhs, he must have lost thousands of votes with that one. Yes he's genuine, answers questions but he's a bit mad and voters should beware.

What on earth is wrong with that? Something has to be done with the NHS funding. We can't afford where we are heading and sticking ones head in the sand is no good. We might manage a NHS for ourselves but we simply can't operate a free health service for the bloody world. Tough decisions need to be made in govt. Any govts first responsibility is to it's own citizens.

I know nothing of builders but what I have observed over the years is the significant untaxed benefits owners of small businesses enjoy.

From what I've seen it's not deliberate tax evasion but simply a lack of appreciation by the owner of the untaxed benefits small business owners gain when those benefits would be taxed for an employee. I've a feeling this is much more substantial than appreciated.

As far as sole traders / builders etc go I do have some sympathy. it's not all a bowl of cherries is it? No one guarantees them a pay packet come what may every week do they? No one pays them when the weather freezes for a few weeks in winter and they can't work, no one gives them holiday or sick pay either.

I didn't know that. Your £120k is closer in that case.

It's the principle that concerns me over the detail. It cannot be fair can it?

At least with Sturgeon, Bennett, and Farage, you know exactly who they stand for. I suppose this time it's a bit more clear as to who Ed stands for, as opposed to previous New Labour times, but something tells me we're heading for another hung parliament as the whole country carries on its decade of political apathy.

I agree and if thats the case then the only answer is that the financial disaster and economic crash under Labour did not hurt enough people significantly enough.

Point was I'd be happy to pay more than 40% Yoda.

yeah yeah yeah! blah, blah, blah. Just like people saying I don't want to live past 85...... until they are 84! Ask em then Gav.

Hard work is one thing. Having the opportunity to exorcise that in the first place is another. I'm happy to pay back my share and then some, to at least help others starting with zero to do the same. Clearly you aren't, but that's your choice.

Quite happy to pay my share BUT I'm not happy to pay more than my share. Why tf should I?

[yoda]

Point was I'd be happy to pay more than 40% Yoda.

I am sure you would be, still no one has posted how much someone would pay in £'s if they were on the higher tax rate !

[thenodrog]

i can catogorically swear on my kids life i dont earn anywhere near this 120k mark.

According to jim thats your own fault then Abbey....... according to him you simply have to move to the South East.

[Mercer]

that you tube is more offensive than what maj posted.

The rich get richer the poor get poorer ..the Tory Law

That is a myth.

Even those on the minimum wage are now paying almost a £1,000 / year less in income tax from 2010.

Wealth has first to be created before it can be redistributed and those who create jobs and security for folk should be handsomely rewarded.

[thenodrog]

that you tube is more offensive than what maj posted.

The rich get richer the poor get poorer ..the Tory Law

Can you explain that Abbey? It doesn't make sense. I can understand the rich wanting to be richer but why would anyone want people to be poorer? It's much easier to create wealth if everybody was wealthy (see mercerman post above). I feel you've commented without even bothering to watch or trying to understand that clip.

[scotchrover]

What you mean is that the poorest depend on the wealthier to subsidise their lives by funding the nations services including nhs, defence, welfare etc etc that they can't afford. Make more sense to address that first. The wealthier the society the more everyone benefits. You policies would just make everyone poorer. The bigger the mammoth the hunter gatherers kill the more there is for the entire tribe to feast on.

In fact here.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okHGCz6xxiw

May as well have been written today. What goes around comes around eh? The same lame socialist principles were outed 30 years ago by the lady who you wrote about in these glowing terms all those years ago Quote "Amid scenes of great jubilation Margaret Thatcher was returned as MP for Finchley at Hendon Town Hall in the early hours of Friday". Are you still miffed that she not deem that good enough for an OBE?

Is this not the woman who covered up the massive pedaphilia, by refusing to do anything about those close to her, including Leon Brittan? I find it disgusting how her name is still held highly!

If many kids didn't just suffer through being plunged into poverty during that era, they got laughed at when they tried to report such appalling crimes.

[den]

Can you explain that Abbey? It doesn't make sense. I can understand the rich wanting to be richer but why would anyone want people to be poorer?

Then you need to understand what conservatism actually is Gord. Politics is simply about taking control of the nations finances and diverting it towards the people who they represent. It's about power. Its about creating and controlling wealth. Their priorities are only restricted by the electorate.

I'll leave it to you to decide exactly whose interests each of the parties represent, but it's obvious to me. I honestly think that at the grass roots, many people enter politics because they want a fairer country. However, at the very top, the parties must serve their backers as far as they dare.

[yoda]

This may not be exactly correct but here goes just to make a start

10k a year = no tax/week or no tax/year

20k a year = £38.50/week or £2,002/year

40k a year = £115.40/week or £6,000.80 tax/year

60k a year = £269.30/week or £14,003.60 tax/year

120k a year =£730.80/week or £38,001.60 tax/year

[Gav]

I thought Peter Hitchens made a good point last night on question time.

The Tories currently exist to line the pockets of the rich and big business. Labour exists because of their hatred for the Tories. Both parties should be disbanded and smaller parties created that are interested in real people's lives, go back to a system when the electorate is the focus.

I couldn't agree more.

[den]

I thought Peter Hitchens made a good point last night on question time.

The Tories currently exist to line the pockets of the rich and big business. Labour exists because of their hatred for the Tories. Both parties should be disbanded and smaller parties created that are interested in real people's lives, go back to a system when the electorate is the focus.

I couldn't agree more.

Errr, labour exist to divert the wealth away from big business and the rich, and further towards their backers

[Gav]

Errr, labour exist to divert the wealth away from big business and the rich, and further towards their backers

Maybe in years gone by den, now they exist to mainly hate the Tories, I agree with that.

[thenodrog]

Is this not the woman who covered up the massive pedaphilia, by refusing to do anything about those close to her, including Leon Brittan? I find it disgusting how her name is still held highly!

If many kids didn't just suffer through being plunged into poverty during that era, they got laughed at when they tried to report such appalling crimes.

Where's that come from?

[otto man]

Is this not the woman who covered up the massive pedaphilia, by refusing to do anything about those close to her, including Leon Brittan? I find it disgusting how her name is still held highly!

If many kids didn't just suffer through being plunged into poverty during that era, they got laughed at when they tried to report such appalling crimes.

Harriet Harman, Patricia Hewitt mean anything?

[thenodrog]

Then you need to understand what conservatism actually is Gord. Politics is simply about taking control of the nations finances and diverting it towards the people who they represent. It's about power. Its about creating and controlling wealth. Their priorities are only restricted by the electorate.

I'll leave it to you to decide exactly whose interests each of the parties represent, but it's obvious to me. I honestly think that at the grass roots, many people enter politics because they want a fairer country. However, at the very top, the parties must serve their backers as far as they dare.

What do you see as particularly unfair about this country den?

I'll start the ball rolling with the ridiculously high level of cumulative taxation that people in employment must pay. Income tax, higher rate, NI, VAT, duty on alcohol, Community charge, stamp duty, duty on tobacco, inheritence tax, fuel duty etc. The list is never ending. How much out of every £ we earn ends up in the Chancellor's kitty? My wild guess would be at least 80p in every pound is tax of one sort or another. That is one issue and what the buggers spend it on is another entirely. It's just easier to say yes to every request from people with their begging bowls out and then simply lump it on to their favourite milch cow..... the nations taxpayers.

[K-Hod]

Harriet Harman, Patricia Hewitt mean anything?

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/dec/19/cameron-aide-patrick-rock-in-court-child-abuse-images

'Patrick Rock, 63, who was one of the government’s advisers on policy for online pornography filters' ....

Though I'm not one to think this just a Tory problem, there seems to be an unsettling amount of these revelations emerging in the last few years.