[Archived] MISSION FAILED COMPLETE

[JBiz]

So your happy for them to build up debts on a daily basis ? How much debt are you happy with ?

Yea course he is, sending love letters to Balaji thanking him.

Why so black and white? You need to accept that there is more to this discussion than either pro or against.

Take the reality that PB outlines- who pays the bills if they walk like you want? Nobody, admin.

If they continue to run up debts and then walk, the end game is the same. If you think we are working with a cheap squad now, be prepared to be amazed.

A question to answer for you or anyone desperate for them to walk, no matter the consequence;

Is it a good move if Venkys continue to cut the wage bill to address finances at the cost of a promotion push?

Or is better they carry on paying your JRs of this world trying to get us up and building debts?

I'll gladly accept an answer that's in the middle of both :-)

[thenodrog]

ok ,Beckham ,ronny, champions league and fa cup win ..all now failed in the lunatic world of the horrible turds in india,

fans now supporting these idiots and forgiving what they have done. Tonight could be my last time on Ewood until these scumbags go. Fans openly supporting them . Well your welcome to them . They can rot in hell for me enough is enough ..

IS THIS WHAT FANS WANT OR JUST GLORY HUNTERS ?

Abbey wasn't it you coined the phrase 'haters gotta hate'?

[Gav]

Crikey.... It's not long ago you were blaming everything bad about the club on Sam Allardyce!

Just the football Gordon.

[Stuart]

But if the present club folds and another is started up under the tag Blackburn Rovers 2015 or whatever, playing at the Anchor or wherever, then it wouldn't be Blackburn Rovers for me but simply some pale imitation. I suspect that the majority of fans would see it as such and that it would struggle to make a mark. Fair play to those who want to go down that route, but I suspect the majority would rather take a chance with the present owners in the hope that at some point something better comes along. Where there is life there is hope. Once it folds the club as we know it is gone for good.

I'm not sure I agree with this.

Any club that forms now, e.g. a protest club, such as FC United, would still be in the shadow of BRFC. With no town club, there would be another club that would naturally take it's place which would by definition represent the town. A new Blackburn Rovers 20xx FC would be born with no town club in its way, only a vacuum.

Granted, some marketing would be required but with enough sponsorship (not necessarily commercial) for a RoversTrust-backed club, and a reasonable groundshare arrangement, we would definitely have two or three thousand on - if not more. I would definitely be there. With that kind of support and a reasonable income, we would have to follow Chorley FC's example. We'd certainly have more fans than a Dog and Duck Sunday league team. Chorley fans seem to enjoy what they have - why wouldn't we? With the greatest of respect, I'm sure we have 10 Parsonblues, 10 GAVs and 10 Abbeys, for every 1 CharlieMagpie.

It would be something that was 'ours' again, maybe borrowing from neighbours and scrimping and saving, and sitting on beanbags eating a takeaway, but still 'ours'.

Who wouldn't want a piece of that? It would be much more fun than being slaves grovelling at the feet of owners who are holding us to ransom.

Do you think Bowyer would stick around like Ally McCoist did in the Scottish version of Sunday league?

[Parsonblue]

So your happy for them to build up debts on a daily basis ? How much debt are you happy with ?

Whilst you might be happy to see eleven guys running around Pleasington pretending to be Blackburn Rovers, it's not something that appeals to me.

[ABBEY]

Answer the question please ... How much debt are you happy for us to accrue before you have enough ?

[Gav]

Blackburn Rovers will not fold or go out of business if Venkys walk away, I'm sure of that.

I asked earlier how many clubs have gone to the wall due to crippling debts, hardy any, and certainly non with an illustrios hstory like us.

We have a number of local business men interested in the club and it will be available for £1, they just need a plan to service any debts, and the 100m isn't secured on the club YET, so you just need to find running costs, no mean feat I'm sure.

People seem to think the club will cease to exist, thats simply bunkum, history shows that.

[Parsonblue]

Answer the question please ... How much debt are you happy for us to accrue before you have enough ?

I don't need to answer the question Abbey. I don't know what the plans of the owners are. All I know is that watching a pretend Blackburn Rovers club aspiring to be Chorley FC has little appeal. If Blackburn Rovers folds then the club with a history dating back to 1875 is at an end and a new club is born. Fair play if you want to start a new club Abbey but for me it's not Blackburn Rovers.

[Athlete]

I don't need to answer the question Abbey. I don't know what the plans of the owners are. All I know is that watching a pretend Blackburn Rovers club aspiring to be Chorley FC has little appeal. If Blackburn Rovers folds then the club with a history dating back to 1875 is at an end and a new club is born. Fair play if you want to start a new club Abbey but for me it's not Blackburn Rovers.

Are Hearts not Hearts Middlesbrough not Middlesbrough bristol city not bristol city etc etc... Do you want me to go on

Clubs which went bang.... All going very very strong

[Amo]

Too much short-termism from certain corners on here. The debt mountain is growing at an alarming rate. Trimming the wage bill here, cashing in the odd player there won't even scratch the surface. The only way to get the debt down to a serviceable level would be to downsize the club even further, slash the wage bill completely and restructure the playing staff. Players like Rhodes, Rudy, et al. will soon be a thing of the past. Varney might even be out of our league at that point. I know this sounds like Mercerman-esque doom-mongering but I'd prefer to think of it as a dose of 'realism'.

[Gav]

I really do think we have a good number of fans that think out of some sort of warped obligation venkys are going to pull out all the stops to turn this debacle into a success. Who knows a semi final appearance may have been a good time to get out, we'll never know.

But you only need to look at the board room to know they have absolutely no chance of turning things around. The clubs a poison chalice for them now, and I'm sure they're trying to offload us as soon as possible with as little financial impact on them as possible.

[T J Hooker]

leeds have one of the best fan bases around, but that clubs still a horror show long after Ridsdales departure, so with our small fan base we'd be right up shi# creek if the venkys pulled out now(like it or not) especially when you look at the little league chancers waiting in the wings to try and take us over.

[Ricky]

Will we see the reruns of Hereford United knocking Newcastle out of the cup anymore as they ceased to be last year? There's one for you Gav.

Only a few years ago in the league below we currently find ourselves in and now gone completely.

[Rover_Shaun]

Aldershot, stanley, chester (nearly), newport they all came back. Even Darlo are going strong. Sad for maidstone though

[Gav]

Will we see the reruns of Hereford United knocking Newcastle out of the cup anymore as they ceased to be last year? There's one for you Gav.

Only a few years ago in the league below we currently find ourselves in and now gone completely.

They're hardly a Blackburn Rovers though Ricky, didn't they fall to pay HMRC?

Still they're one example I guess, but it won't happen to us, far to many people to get involved should Venky's sod off.

[chris_h]

They're hardly a Blackburn Rovers though Ricky, didn't they fall to pay HMRC?

Still they're one example I guess, but it won't happen to us, far to many people to get involved should Venky's sod off.

You'd hope so. The outcome really doesn't bare thinking about if you're wrong.

[Ricky]

Got embroiled with dodgy ownership Gav. Someone came in with plans of using the club as a money making tool. PS, talking about Hereford not Rovers

You say there's too many people around for it to happen to us, just remember that Hereford were wound up with debts of less than £1m. We find ourselves with debts of approx £100m. Something has to give at some stage. If the owners walk away we will still have that debt.

[Gav]

You'd hope so. The outcome really doesn't bare thinking about if you're wrong.

Absolutely Chris.

Got embroiled with dodgy ownership Gav. Someone came in with plans of using the club as a money making tool. PS, talking about Hereford not Rovers

You say there's too many people around for it to happen to us, just remember that Hereford were wound up with debts of less than £1m. We find ourselves with debts of approx £100m. Something has to give at some stage. If the owners walk away we will still have that debt.

The debt as of this moment isn't Blackburn Rovers debt according to Ian Battersby, but we'd all be very surprised if they took the debt with them if they walked away.

[ABBEY]

Got embroiled with dodgy ownership Gav. Someone came in with plans of using the club as a money making tool. PS, talking about Hereford not Rovers

You say there's too many people around for it to happen to us, just remember that Hereford were wound up with debts of less than £1m. We find ourselves with debts of approx £100m. Something has to give at some stage. If the owners walk away we will still have that debt

that's what I'm getting at. As it stands there may be some way out of it all but if we carry on debtting up every month then when will it be terminal? 150m , 500m or 10000000m?

Absolutely Chris.

The debt as of this moment isn't Blackburn Rovers debt according to Ian Battersby, but we'd all be very surprised if they took the debt with them if they walked away.

it will be I wouldn't trust venkys to pluck my chicken.

[OscarRaven]

Answer the question please ... How much debt are you happy for us to accrue before you have enough ?

He won't answer because it's a stupid question. The amount of debt only becomes important if you do not have the means to service and repay the debt.

So you have choice 1) Continue with the owners servicing the debt or choice 2) Owners leave, club stops servicing the debt and goes bust.

The amount is largely irrelevant now, the result is the same. It's just that many of us see option 1 as a better situation than option 2 - childishly calling us "Venky lovers" in my opinion speaks to your lack of understanding of the situation. No-one loves Venky's, no-one disputes they have made this mess but it has happened, it can't un-happen, we have to face up to who we are and where we are NOW. That's not forgiveness that's living in the real world!

It must be nice to use your heart to think, I don't question your passion or objectives, I simply question why you think closing the doors of the club you love and handing the keys to the clubs debtors is a solution and why you belittle and abuse those who don't agree.

So rant, rave, storm out the ground and call names but don't expect intelligent grown-ups, used to paying their own way in the world to come round to some fantasy that everything is going okay if the money walks away or worse still walks away requesting repayment of debt (as they are perfectly entitled to do under the law, like it or not).

It stinks but we have to be pragmatic!

[T J Hooker]

Excellent post oscar

[Andyblue2]

if the money walks away or worse still walks away requesting repayment of debt (as they are perfectly entitled to do under the law, like it or not).

It stinks but we have to be pragmatic!

How do you know how the terms of the debt is stacked up.? You can't possibly know, so you can't possible make this statement. Unless you are Madam herself, or shelfy

[ABBEY]

He won't answer because it's a stupid question. The amount of debt only becomes important if you do not have the means to service and repay the debt.

So you have choice 1) Continue with the owners servicing the debt or choice 2) Owners leave, club stops servicing the debt and goes bust.

The amount is largely irrelevant now, the result is the same. It's just that many of us see option 1 as a better situation than option 2 - childishly calling us "Venky lovers" in my opinion speaks to your lack of understanding of the situation. No-one loves Venky's, no-one disputes they have made this mess but it has happened, it can't un-happen, we have to face up to who we are and where we are NOW. That's not forgiveness that's living in the real world!

It must be nice to use your heart to think, I don't question your passion or objectives, I simply question why you think closing the doors of the club you love and handing the keys to the clubs debtors is a solution and why you belittle and abuse those who don't agree.

So rant, rave, storm out the ground and call names but don't expect intelligent grown-ups, used to paying their own way in the world to come round to some fantasy that everything is going okay if the money walks away or worse still walks away requesting repayment of debt (as they are perfectly entitled to do under the law, like it or not).

It stinks but we have to be pragmatic!

BELITTLE/ABUSE? AS OPPOSED TO "STUPID QUESTION" ?

MUST BE GREAT BEING IN THE KNOW .

[Stuart]

I don't quite understand this whole "Venkys or nothing" mentality, "because they could leave at any time". They will leave whenever they like regardless of what the fans think or do, and it is only getting worse for us the longer that takes. Finances have been worse every season since our masters took charge and at some point the debt will become unserviceable - if it hasn't already now the parachutes have run out.

I also notice that Parson and others sidestepped my post about there only being one 'town club' even if the current version fails. There are complaints about fans walking away because of relegation from the PL but many would not support a Phoenix club - any more than a Red Lion FC - "because it wouldn't be Rovers as we know it". Well for the last 20-plus years (the most part of thousands of Rovers fans' lives, in fact) we have been a PL-standard club, so the current version isn't "Rovers as they know it". What's the difference? It would be hypocritical of people to blame them for leaving if they themselves would not support the next version, post-Venkys.

Even worst case, e.g. Portsmouth, the end really means continuing with League football. There are enough people - with cash and/or contacts - to make sure that this club does not go to the wall so let's not be afraid of, or worse fight against, those who want Venkys out because one day you'll be relying on them.

One thing is for certain we cannot rely on Venkys.

[chris_h]

I think that Stuart has me on ignore so I'm not sure how I'm going to get an answer to this but is he suggesting that the club is not 'Rovers as we know it' because we are not currently in the Premier League? Also, is he suggesting that those of us who would not support a 'Pheonix club' are 'hypocrites' for some reason that I can't fathom? Maybe 'Parson and others' 'sidestepped' because they didn't know what he was on about?

As for the last paragraph I'm a bit out of the loop having moved overseas but I'm not aware of any Rovers minded individual or individuals with the wherewithal to fund a football club in the modern day. I know that Mr Battersby and Mr Currie are astute business men but haven't they distanced themselves from a takeover? If there is a 'fit and proper' person out there with the requisite financial clout to fund Rovers then I'd welcome them with open arms.

I dont personally believe such a person exists and so the consequences of Venkys chucking in the keys would be catastrophic.