[Archived] Ffp Embargo

[chaddyrovers]

Thanks for response Kamy

[Athlete]

I think a few need to calm down as there is nothing at present to suggest that Venky's are about to bail out.

The sale of Rudy is hardly a surprise, it was always on the cards as the player wants to leave. If someone matches Rovers valuation of Rhodes then again that sale would hardly be a surprise.

The sale of Cairney is a surprise but it seems from what I have heard from very reliable sources that this was a decision that Gary has made and which the owners have approved. Marshall hasn't gone yet although bids are expected.

Let's see what happens over the next few weeks before we all get suicidal.

Promotion doesn't seem to be on the agenda the next best thing is Venky's do one and let someone elsetake it from there without the puppet board and a manager out his depth

[tomphil]

No idea why Gary decided to sell Cairney.

They want circa £7 million up front for Rudy. Rhodes will surely have to be a £10 million plus bid, as per last year Rhodes is relaxed about the situation and isn't pushing for a move at present (unlike Rudy who is).

The Wonga that Jordan is allegedly on here will always keep him relaxed plus he genuinely likes the club and feels comfortable here, that's from a very good source

It's going to take a hell of an offer the match it, something probably only a Prem team could or would pay. It doesn't help with keeping the cost down but it's what keeps him here in reality plus as far as goals go he's proved worth it.

[blueboy3333]

Things haven't changed. We were always going to fall foul of FFP and we were always going to have to sell key players and bring in scraps.

I'm not saying "I told you so" on that issue as it was blindingly obvious. I did also say that Bowyer's supporters would change the goalposts on what their definition of success was which is what is happening.

so you're not saying 'i told you so' on that issue but you're saying 'i told you so' that people would change their definition of success.

What exactly was the 'Bowyer fans' definition of success? When exactly did you know we would fall foul of FFP and when exactly did you pinpoint that we would go into an embargo in January 2015?

Any predictions of your own for the coming season, or when we will get out of the embargo?

[blueboy3333]

Apart from Parson who's BFFs with Bowyer, I don't think they are Bowyer supporters, per se. Just a contingent of fans who don't want to admit the critics were right.

Right about what? i still think Bowyers done a good job.

bit of a childish dig at Parson just because his opinion differs to yours.

[blueboy3333]

I think a few need to calm down as there is nothing at present to suggest that Venky's are about to bail out.

The sale of Rudy is hardly a surprise, it was always on the cards as the player wants to leave. If someone matches Rovers valuation of Rhodes then again that sale would hardly be a surprise.

The sale of Cairney is a surprise but it seems from what I have heard from very reliable sources that this was a decision that Gary has made and which the owners have approved. Marshall hasn't gone yet although bids are expected.

Let's see what happens over the next few weeks before we all get suicidal.

TBF Kamy, if you're going to tweet about escalators and people forming a queue to leave then the posts about Venky's having a fire sale and then selling up that followed were pretty predictable.

[Mercer]

I think a few need to calm down as there is nothing at present to suggest that Venky's are about to bail out.

The sale of Rudy is hardly a surprise, it was always on the cards as the player wants to leave. If someone matches Rovers valuation of Rhodes then again that sale would hardly be a surprise.

The sale of Cairney is a surprise but it seems from what I have heard from very reliable sources that this was a decision that Gary has made and which the owners have approved. Marshall hasn't gone yet although bids are expected.

Let's see what happens over the next few weeks before we all get suicidal.

And there is nothing to suggest that Venky's are in for an unprofitable long haul. In fact their behaviour, IMV, bears all the hallmarks of parents trying shake off an unwanted prospective son in law.

The complacency of some fans is quite staggering when you look at the destruction our owners have managed to wreak in 5 short years. Their complacency reminds me of Chamberlain waving that piece of paper back in 1938 and declaring "peace for our time" - we know what happened next !

[Hasta]

What exactly was the 'Bowyer fans' definition of success? When exactly did you know we would fall foul of FFP and when exactly did you pinpoint that we would go into an embargo in January 2015?

Any predictions of your own for the coming season, or when we will get out of the embargo?

Success was promotion for Bowyer overall. I believed Venkys thought this and turning down the Rhdoes bid indicates this. This is a very difficult league to get out of so realistically I just wanted to see us seriously challenge for it.

I can't remember the exact date I knew we would fall foul of FFP but we all knew it was coming and it was obvious that we were going to fail the criteria as we still had players on mega contracts and the parachute money had just dropped. Not knowing the ins and outs, i expected it would come in July but it arrived earlier than that.

As for when the embargo will be lifted, if we sell Rhodes and Gestede then I would guess next summer unless legal issues arise. As for next season, it completely depends on the squad. If we went into it with the current set of layers then I'd guess about 8th or 9th. If we lose the two up front then, unless Bowyer pulls a rabbit out of the hat, probably about 17th or 18th. Bowyers transfer record has been mixed, and I worry that the £10000 per week cap may make it more difficult for him. However I do think a decent defensive mid would help us a lot. It is a position we have numerous options in but the fact most people cant agree on who to play there tells us none are really good enough. Season ticket renewed yesterday so just got to wait till August for the carnival to begin.

[tomphil]

If behind closed doors his remit was really more about player development to just increase value, everything from the way he's gone about it with the team last season and what he says at times points to just that then they'll be seeing it as a relative success so far. Although the rewards are huge if successful constantly chasing promotion would cost loads of money and increase the debt even quicker. This plan costs peanuts and will yield enough probably to run the club, stop costing them as much and eventually stem the debt a bit.

Welcome to our future. I really think they've lost interest but I fear they can't be bothered bailing and all the hassle it will bring whilst the club is able to just amble along. Plus look at the meeting the Queen situation, owning Rovers still has the ability to open some big doors for them.

[thenodrog]

Kamy, do you know why Bowyer made the decision to sell Cairney?

Obvious. Cairney and his agent made the decision when Fulham approached them. Players who want away hold all the aces because all the power is with them and their agents.

[thenodrog]

Right about what? i still think Bowyers done a good job.

The issue is that he hasn't done a bad enough job to be sacked. He's been required to bin off all the big earners and cut costs by the club and at the same time gain promotion by the supporters. Not an easy task. Like Warburton's sacking by Brentford it would be harsh and difficult to comprehend by anyone employing a reasoned train of thought. Pretty obvious that he needs to address the goals against column if the goals for is going to diminish though. Our brittlen defending has gone on long enough.

[K-Hod]

Good news. Who did that?

btw Can I assume that it was you who locked the 'news comment' thread Paul? There doesn't appear to be anyone else around. If so on what grounds given the importance of the current events?

I think it was due to the handbags.

[Paul]

Good news. Who did that?

btw Can I assume that it was you who locked the 'news comment' thread Paul? There doesn't appear to be anyone else around. If so on what grounds given the importance of the current events?

In the first instance re the ACV it was me who wrote and made the entire application.

In the second point you jump, as usual, to an entirely in accurate and 100% incorrect conclusion. As I stated just a few days ago the running of this site has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with me. I hope that is plain enough for you.

[Amo]

Right about what? i still think Bowyers done a good job.

Yes, midtable mediocrity stability and a transfer embargo. Let the good times roll.

bit of a childish dig at Parson just because his opinion differs to yours.

Ridiculous opinions leave themselves open to ridicule.

This idea that Bowyer deserves four seasons to 'rebuild' when the embargo was imminent, pointless comparisons to the pre-Walker era, and the willing acceptance of our 'natural position' is a joke to any self-respecting fan and furthermore an insult to Uncle Jack's memory.

[Parsonblue]

Yes, midtable mediocrity stability and a transfer embargo. Let the good times roll.

Ridiculous opinions leave themselves open to ridicule.

This idea that Bowyer deserves four seasons to 'rebuild' when the embargo was imminent, pointless comparisons to the pre-Walker era, and the willing acceptance of our 'natural position' is a joke to any self-respecting fan and furthermore an insult to Uncle Jack's memory.

Amarillo you seem to have difficulty in accepting opinions that don't fall into line with your own perhaps it's something that will come with age. My point about the manager - any manager - has not altered. Unless you are faced with relegation - as under Iley and Ince - then a manager should be given time to implement changes rather than chopping and changing. Whether you like it or not we are very much back to the pre-Walker era - second tier football and a mountain of debt. Whilst the debt in the 70s was smaller the fact remains that the club in those days was in a perilous position and there was a real possibility of it going under. After relegation in 1966 we spent a quarter of a century outside of the top flight - not through lack of ambition but because of economic circumstances - low income and mounting debt. When, and if, Venkys decide to leave any new owner is going to need very deep pockets to simply maintain the club in its present position never mind trying to return to the heights Jack Walker took us to. The reality of our position is that the coming years are going to be tough - irrespective of who the owners are, irrespective of who the manager is and irrespective of who sits in the boardroom. The mistakes that have been made over the past few years aren't going to be waved away with some magical wand. It's a long hard road ahead and there are no guarantees that we won't fall further at some point but, with respect, I suggest you are deluding yourself if you think that a new manager is suddenly going to solve all our problems at this point.

[den]

Bowyer certainly isn't.

That's a whole lot of post to basically say that there's no hope whoever is manager Parson.

[tomphil]

Whilst the situation the V's have created is going to make it tough for years even if they sold I don't agree on the regardless of who the manager or those running the club are at all, that's rollocks. A good team running the club and a decent manager, coaching set up can make a massive difference. Could also make a bad situation a bit easier to stomach for supporters as well.

[Parsonblue]

Bowyer certainly isn't.

That's a whole lot of post to basically say that there's no hope whoever is manager Parson.

The problems are far deeper than who is manager den as you know. Whoever comes after Venkys will need very deep pockets to simply maintain our present position. Two big training complexes at Brockhall, a modern stadium and all that goes with it. All needing to be staffed and maintained and that's before you get to the three playing squads - senior, under-21 and under-18 - and coaching staff for each. All to be funded on low gates and low ticket prices. My point den was that it is going to be a long haul to rebuild what we have lost and ultimately, we are going to need to attract an owner who is willing to pour a huge amount of money into the club as it is never going to be self sufficient.

[Mattyblue]

I think we are all agreed Parson that the club is in a right old state.

However, where you seem to differ from most is that you don't seem to believe that changing manager over the last couple of years wouldn't have made a difference, indeed you were talking about a 4 year term for Bowyer last season.

I for one believe that an experienced manager would have got more out of the squad, in particular last season.

You talk about the PL infrastucture the club somehow has to support, in what way is Gary Bowyer the right man with the right skilset to help that cause? The last two seasons have been a complete waste as normal circumstances; i.e. give the manager 4/5 years at the helm unless we were to be relegated did not apply when BRFC had a very small window to aim for promotion with the onset of FFP, drying up of parachute money and so on.

[gumboots]

If changing manager had got marginally better results out of each player last year, we could have challenged for promotion. Yes, it could have got less, but we'd probably still have been safe. Was it genuinely not worth trying? GB is a decent bloke. I've no doubt about that, even if many others on here have, but he couldn't squeeze more out of players when we needed it last season. Why should things be any different this year when he'll need to get even more from them? How will he suddenly manage it with his hands tied by the ffp handcuffs and owners and board who couldn't care less or who haven't a clue what to do if they do care. That's when managerial experience counts. We don't need a learner. We need someone who can find a wAy of getting more from less, and I don't see how GB is going to do that.

[Parsonblue]

I think we are all agreed Parson that the club is in a right old state.

However, where you seem to differ from most is that you don't seem to believe that changing manager over the last couple of years wouldn't have made a difference, indeed you were talking about a 4 year term for Bowyer last season.

I for one believe that an experienced manager would have got more out of the squad, in particular last season.

You talk about the PL infrastucture the club somehow has to support, in what way is Gary Bowyer the right man with the right skilset to help that cause? The last two seasons have been a complete waste as normal circumstances; i.e. give the manager 4/5 years at the helm unless we were to be relegated did not apply when BRFC had a very small window to aim for promotion with the onset of FFP, drying up of parachute money and so on.

I think Steve McClaren proved at Derby that no amount of experience can guarantee you promotion. As for the present manager, clearly opinions differ as to whether he could have got promotion with last season's squad. Personally, I don't believe they were good enough for a top six finish and whilst I would have like to have seem them higher, I don't believe that, all things considered, last season was the disaster that some seem to think it was. I would agree with you that things are going to get even tougher next season and probably for a few more to come and whether Bowyer can guide us through these choppy waters only time will tell but for the moment I'm more than happy to back him.

[roverzee]

Have a look at the photographs of Shelfy, Bowyer etc. Does any one of them, look capable of understanding a legal document never mind finding ways around the legislation. It's simple enough really but too much for any of these clowns.

Oh so we judge people on how they look now do we?

I'd love to hear you attempt an intelligent chat about physics with this guy ...

[roverzee]

Abandon all hope, ye who enter Ewood.

What about "ye who have never been near Ewood" ?

[Mattyblue]

I think Steve McClaren proved at Derby that no amount of experience can guarantee you promotion. As for the present manager, clearly opinions differ as to whether he could have got promotion with last season's squad. Personally, I don't believe they were good enough for a top six finish and whilst I would have like to have seem them higher, I don't believe that, all things considered, last season was the disaster that some seem to think it was. I would agree with you that things are going to get even tougher next season and probably for a few more to come and whether Bowyer can guide us through these choppy waters only time will tell but for the moment I'm more than happy to back him.

In isolation it wasnt a disaster at all, if we were a normal club I could imagine myself saying:

'no improvement on the season before, however, hopefully he's learned from his mistakes and we go again next season, pressure's on him now though'

However, we can't look at it in isolation or believe these are normal circumstances. In the context of BRFC in 2015, it was a disaster, not because Bowyer was utterly terrible, he did his best and as a first job I've certainly seen worse, but because we've probably blown our chance to get out this league and save the club from who knows what.

An experienced manager had to be appointed after the debacles post Allardyce, to have FOUR managers in a row with little to no experience at any level when the club was crying out for leadership is negligent in the extreme and we will pay dearly for it.

[Mercer]

Have a look at the photographs of Shelfy, Bowyer etc. Does any one of them, look capable of understanding a legal document never mind finding ways around the legislation. It's simple enough really but too much for any of these clowns.

When interviewing for jobs, you always look for someone with a bit of spark, a bit of edge and a 'can do' attitude.

After listening to these two frequently and having personally met them, they would fail my tests miserably.

IMV, both are way out of their depth.

If changing manager had got marginally better results out of each player last year, we could have challenged for promotion. Yes, it could have got less, but we'd probably still have been safe. Was it genuinely not worth trying? GB is a decent bloke. I've no doubt about that, even if many others on here have, but he couldn't squeeze more out of players when we needed it last season. Why should things be any different this year when he'll need to get even more from them? How will he suddenly manage it with his hands tied by the ffp handcuffs and owners and board who couldn't care less or who haven't a clue what to do if they do care. That's when managerial experience counts. We don't need a learner. We need someone who can find a wAy of getting more from less, and I don't see how GB is going to do that.

Spot on.

Look how Sam transformed Ince's shambles.

Just get bemused how the Bowyerettes fail to see this.