[Archived] Have The Germans Weakened The Euro?

[yoda]

Have the Germans weakened the Euro by bending the Greeks over ?

Is Cameron in a stronger negotiating position as a result of it ?

I think it is yes to both.

[Al]

Have the Germans weakened the Euro by bending the Greeks over ?

Is Cameron in a stronger negotiating position as a result of it ?

I think it is yes to both.

I'm not qualified to comment on that but hopefully it could make holidays in Europe cheaper for the British.

[yoda]

I'm not qualified to comment on that but hopefully it could make holidays in Europe cheaper for the British.

Good point

Not good when trying to sell a house though.

[thenodrog]

Or sell anything tbh.

[jim mk2]

I'm not qualified to comment on that but hopefully it could make holidays in Europe cheaper for the British.

Talk about I'm all right Jack.

A proud country is facing possible bankruptcy - and far worse - its people could be on the brink of a humanitarian crisis as they run out of money for food and the essentials of living, and all this person is bothered about is cheaper foreign holidays.

[Baz]

The euro in my opinion can't work unless all member countries follow a universal fiscal policy, i.e. impossible.

Greece need to manage an organised exit of the euro, devalue, and start growing their economy again. As for austerity, how on earth does anyone think that having 50% youth unemployment because of cut backs will in anyway help pay the bills. The most growth we have had in the past few years was when the tories and libdems couldnt agree on any more cuts.

[yoda]

Talk about I'm all right Jack.

A proud country is facing possible bankruptcy - and far worse - its people could be on the brink of a humanitarian crisis as they run out of money for food and the essentials of living, and all this person is bothered about is cheaper foreign holidays.

I bet the Germans are thinking the same (about the holidays) and ordering larger towels as we type.

They forget that Greece was one of the countries that helped fix Germany after the 2nd world war.

[ABBEY]

Did I read something that the Germans actually owe Greece billions from loans from after the war ?

[thenodrog]

Indeed so. The spoils of war. Problem is that forcing Germany to pay severe reparations for WW1 led directly to the rise of the Nazi's under Hitler and on to WW2. I think post WW2 Europe was wary of following down the same road.

[jim mk2]

Opponents of European integration forget that the EEC was formed out of the ashes of the second world war and the desire to prevent future wars.

[Al]

Talk about I'm all right Jack.

A proud country is facing possible bankruptcy - and far worse - its people could be on the brink of a humanitarian crisis as they run out of money for food and the essentials of living, and all this person is bothered about is cheaper foreign holidays.

You would twist anything to have a go at a Conservative voter wouldn't you Jim. I have every sympathy for the Greeks. It's the devaluation of the Euro that we were discussing. That could even have the effect of reducing the Greek debt in real terms. Although I'm no expert on international finance. You are better than that Jim!

[K-Hod]

Talk about I'm all right Jack.

A proud country is facing possible bankruptcy - and far worse - its people could be on the brink of a humanitarian crisis as they run out of money for food and the essentials of living, and all this person is bothered about is cheaper foreign holidays.

Bit harsh that, I'll be honest.

[thenodrog]

Talk about I'm all right Jack.

A proud country is facing possible bankruptcy - and far worse - its people could be on the brink of a humanitarian crisis as they run out of money for food and the essentials of living, and all this person is bothered about is cheaper foreign holidays.

What does 'pride' come before Jim?

[Al]

Bit harsh that, I'll be honest.

It's more than harsh it's a downright twisting of the facts.

[DE.]

The Euro was arguably never sustainable in the first place, something our politicians have always been wary of. The Eurozone was ill-conceived at the time and the issues faced by not only Greece but the likes of Spain, Portugal and Ireland were inevitable.

For the Greeks, this bailout is just a stay of execution. Without some radical changes to either Eurozone policy or attitude towards the Greek debt this scenario is destined to play out all over again in the very near future.

[yoda]

Opponents of European integration forget that the EEC was formed out of the ashes of the second world war and the desire to prevent future wars.

Well seeing as we saved Europe it should have included us at the time, but the big nosed commie blocked it. When we eventually did join it was sold on the idea of a "common market" not the UK being governed from Brussels

The Euro was arguably never sustainable in the first place, something our politicians have always been wary of. The Eurozone was ill-conceived at the time and the issues faced by not only Greece but the likes of Spain, Portugal and Ireland were inevitable.

For the Greeks, this bailout is just a stay of execution. Without some radical changes to either Eurozone policy or attitude towards the Greek debt this scenario is destined to play out all over again in the very near future.

The IMF are already saying the bail figure is not enough to fix Greece

[DE.]

Anybody with any remote understanding of the situation knows this bailout is nothing more than chucking a few buckets of water out of a rapidly sinking ship. The situation is already at the point of absolute farce, but it will somehow go through because the future of the Euro depends on this fracture not breaking.

It may already be too late though.

[Al]

Well seeing as we saved Europe it should have included us at the time, but the big nosed commie blocked it. When we eventually did join it was sold on the idea of a "common market" not the UK being governed from Brussels

Amen to that yoda. I certainly never voted for a federal Europe. It was sold to me as the forgiving of import duties within Europe.

[yoda]

Amen to that yoda. I certainly never voted for a federal Europe. It was sold to me as the forgiving of import duties within Europe.

I wonder what the proportion of the electorate is now (2015) that voted originally, that also thought the very same, could be very unpredictable for the referendum now that it is clear as daylight that the bureaucrats in Brussels think the European "state" is more important than individuals well being in a member country.

[Mike E]

The crises for smaller countries basically means cheaper trading for the more prosperous countries. As long as the troubled countries remain with the Euro, the Germans are lapping it up!

The Fourth Reich.

[thenodrog]

Germany didn't become the country that it is by sitting on their arses in the sun all day and eating olives and sipping ouzo / grappa / sherry or port* all day did they?

*delete as appropriate.

Odd thing though.... Useless as they are now the greeks and Romans once ruled the known world whilst the Spanish and Portuguese were driven to find the new one. Has anybody ever wondered whats happened to them and their national psyche?

[Al]

The crises for smaller countries basically means cheaper trading for the more prosperous countries. As long as the troubled countries remain with the Euro, the Germans are lapping it up!

The Fourth Reich.

Absolutely Mike. The Krauts tried twice to conquer Europe by military means and failed but now they have succeeded economically. Incidentally what happened to the loans they got to rebuild their country after the war. Were they forgiven or do they still owe billions to everybody, including Greece?

[Al]

Anybody know the answer to the above?

I see from the BBC News site that many militants in Europe are proposing a boycott of German goods due to the painful and impossible conditions that woman has imposed on the Greeks.

[DE.]

Germany didn't become the country that it is by sitting on their arses in the sun all day and eating olives and sipping ouzo / grappa / sherry or port* all day did they?

*delete as appropriate.

Odd thing though.... Useless as they are now the greeks and Romans once ruled the known world whilst the Spanish and Portuguese were driven to find the new one. Has anybody ever wondered whats happened to them and their national psyche?

The Greek debt has largely come about through tax avoidance, national budget mismanagement and Government corruption, not the lifestyle of the people themselves. That's a fairly old and inaccurate stereotype.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31803814

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/world-affairs/2012/05/exploding-myth-feckless-lazy-greeks

A couple of links if you fancy a read.

[thenodrog]

Anybody know the answer to the above?

I see from the BBC News site that many militants in Europe are proposing a boycott of German goods due to the painful and impossible conditions that woman has imposed on the Greeks.

Question we got in the pub quiz last week...........

Greece signed off half (?) the German debt in 53.

http://greece.greekreporter.com/2015/07/09/germany-can-write-off-greek-debt-like-greece-did-for-germany-in-1953/