[Archived] Jordan Rhodes

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

HALLELUJAH! Someone else has spotted this! Many strikers would find it difficult playing up top solo with their nearest team mate about 40 yards away......

I played up front from time to time. The thing you need is service, service and more service. That's the be all and end all of playing at the point of the attack. No service that plays to your strengths and it's a real arse kicking job. Some players like it played up to them and some like it played into the channels . I liked it in the channels so I could use my pace advantage over the centre halves. i wanted some pace on the ball as well, so you can use the pace of the ball to roll your opponent. Just chipping it forward slowly gives the centre half time to really nail you.

Having said that you can't bomb forward to support the striker if the ball isn't sticking to him at least some of the time. You find yourself bombing forward with the ball going back past you the other way.

[tomphil]

Rhodes is a predator type striker NOT a target man and his strengths are finishing and lurking on/between defenders shoulders and making little movements. I really don't know why the debate keeps going over and over again, just play to his strengths and ask him to improve by working harder to close down off the ball EVERY game. The other stuff we'll just have to find someone else to do it.

Asking him to charge about like a bull in a china shop and get across the defender with his back to goal for every long ball is taking him away from what he does best. It's like going on a building site and asking the skilled joiner to be a hod carrier for the day, he might do it but it won't be very effective and the skilled job you pay him for will suffer.

[JBiz]

I think the problem with rhodes in terms of 442 is his limitations in terms of being neither a target man or last defender pacey player.

IMO - playing Gestede next to him made us give up possession a lot more without quality midfield. However, both excellent players would take limited chances.

If I was the manager, I'd want JR on his own in a 451/433 to ensure a more regimented and controlled possession game. With quality support and driving runs from midfield and wing play, JR would have plenty of scraps and penalties to convert without playing directly through him.

I agreed with Stuarts assertions about JR making defenders paranoid and drawing them away or into man marking, so having quality players who can also score goals around him is necessary going forward.

I think it's also worth mentioning, even though I don't have the stats to proove it; JR seems to clear a fair chunk of set pieces against us. Maybe an early change to his utilisation would be never letting him past the half way line so he's always available on the counter.

[tonyoz]

Hey! I have just heard that a quality striker may be available. Apparently the club’s fans don’t rate him even though he has been their top-scorer( with over 20 goals per season) over the past three seasons!

This guy is special because he is consistent:

At 18 he became Brentford’s youngest ever hat-trick scorer.

At his last club, he scored the fastest ever headed hat-trick (8 minutes) – beating the previous record of Dixie Dean.

He scored an all-time League One record 36 goals - which was also the highest number of goals scored in England in 2011-12. This included 3 hat-tricks, a 4-some and a 5-some!

His 36 goal tally was also an all-time season record for his club. Not surprisingly, he was voted the League One Player of the Year too.

He holds the all-time scoring record (8 in 8) for the Scottish Under-21 side.

He holds (jointly) the all-time record for scoring in 7 consecutive matches for his present club.

This season, he has already scored two-thirds of his team’s goals.

He was Player of the Month in September.​

Oh yes, I nearly forgot – he is a great penalty taker!

Where else would you find quality like this?

​

[Amo]

Couldn't help thinking at the time that was how Rhodes must have felt playing under Bowyer.

And Kalinic under Allardyce.

EDIT: That's a disturbing mental image.

[DE.]

Hey! I have just heard that a quality striker may be available. Apparently the club’s fans don’t rate him even though he has been their top-scorer( with over 20 goals per season) over the past three seasons!

This guy is special because he is consistent:

At 18 he became Brentford’s youngest ever hat-trick scorer.

At his last club, he scored the fastest ever headed hat-trick (8 minutes) – beating the previous record of Dixie Dean.

He scored an all-time League One record 36 goals - which was also the highest number of goals scored in England in 2011-12. This included 3 hat-tricks, a 4-some and a 5-some!

His 36 goal tally was also an all-time season record for his club. Not surprisingly, he was voted the League One Player of the Year too.

He holds the all-time scoring record (8 in 8) for the Scottish Under-21 side.

He holds (jointly) the all-time record for scoring in 7 consecutive matches for his present club.

This season, he has already scored two-thirds of his team’s goals.

Oh yes, I nearly forgot – he is a great penalty taker!

Where else would you find quality like this?

​

Yeah, but can he run the channels?

[den]

I haven't read back very far in this thread, but why are you all seemingly talking about how to get Rhodes scoring more goals? He does score goals - you all think getting him to score even more gets us promotion? You think the way forward for rovers is to get him scoring 40 goals a season? Crazy. Most of you are missing the point entirely.

Getting promoted depends on TEAM performances, not on Rhodes. This is what Lambert is talking about. He's talking about improving results by improving intensity - just like all good teams do. The question is which players can perform to the required level - and which can't? The question is also can Lambert deliver what he wants?

[tonyoz]

Yeah, but can he run the channels?

Damn!

[mustard]

I haven't read back very far in this thread, but why are you all seemingly talking about how to get Rhodes scoring more goals? He does score goals - you all think getting him to score even more gets us promotion? You think the way forward for rovers is to get him scoring 40 goals a season? Crazy. Most of you are missing the point entirely.

Getting promoted depends on TEAM performances, not on Rhodes. This is what Lambert is talking about. He's talking about improving results by improving intensity - just like all good teams do. The question is which players can perform to the required level - and which can't? The question is also can Lambert deliver what he wants?

I do think Rhodes has looked incredibly isolated throughout Bowyer's reign. If Lambert can get the midfield supporting him quickly and get balls into his feet then I believe Rhodes will not only flourish in his goals return (as per) but in his performances also. I do think he's looked a touch fed up and shot of confidence under Bowyer but I have faith in Lambert fixing this.

[K-Hod]

I haven't read back very far in this thread, but why are you all seemingly talking about how to get Rhodes scoring more goals? He does score goals - you all think getting him to score even more gets us promotion? You think the way forward for rovers is to get him scoring 40 goals a season? Crazy. Most of you are missing the point entirely.

Getting promoted depends on TEAM performances, not on Rhodes. This is what Lambert is talking about. He's talking about improving results by improving intensity - just like all good teams do. The question is which players can perform to the required level - and which can't? The question is also can Lambert deliver what he wants?

The intensity has to come from all the players though, not just Rhodes. To get the most out of Rhodes we need to get players near to him when we attack. We can't maximise Rhodes' effectiveness if we don't do this. The more goals we score, the easier it should be to win games. He can't carry the whole goalscoring burden on his own, other players need to chip in, like he perhaps needs to chip in with more defending from the front.

A high pressing game is vital in this league, and whilst Rhodes could probably improve in this department, so could everyone else.

[tonyoz]

Hi den, hope you are keeping well.

I haven't read back very far in this thread, but why are you all seemingly talking about how to get Rhodes scoring more goals? He does score goals - you all think getting him to score even more gets us promotion? You think the way forward for rovers is to get him scoring 40 goals a season? Crazy. Most of you are missing the point entirely.

Getting promoted depends on TEAM performances, not on Rhodes. This is what Lambert is talking about. He's talking about improving results by improving intensity - just like all good teams do. The question is which players can perform to the required level - and which can't? The question is also can Lambert deliver what he wants?

I think it would be a goodly contribution. Some make the argument that his goals kept us up last season??

I don't think we have ever made the best use of his talents. I think PL will AND he will increase the intensity of the whole team. From his comments so far, he seems to be thinking that Rhodes is his diamond.

[garnersfags]

I haven't read back very far in this thread, but why are you all seemingly talking about how to get Rhodes scoring more goals? He does score goals - you all think getting him to score even more gets us promotion? You think the way forward for rovers is to get him scoring 40 goals a season? Crazy. Most of you are missing the point entirely.

Getting promoted depends on TEAM performances, not on Rhodes. This is what Lambert is talking about. He's talking about improving results by improving intensity - just like all good teams do. The question is which players can perform to the required level - and which can't? The question is also can Lambert deliver what he wants?

The reason we are discussing Rhodes is not that promotion depends on him or otherwise, but the viewpoint of many that we could do just as well, or better, without him.

Having said that, I do believe he would score even more goals if the service to him was better, regardless of his lack of pace or whether he can hold the ball etc.

A decent, forward-looking midfielder will know the strengths of his striker and how he needs the ball playing through to give him the best chance of scoring.

So, I agree that improving TEAM performances is vital, no more so than in defence (although I know recently we have been conceding 1 goal a game rather than the average of 2 per game under GB), but that will probably result in more chances for Jordan which will guarantee even more goals. His conversion rate of one in 3 or 4 chances (if not better) will not change, whoever the manager.

If he feels he is receiving the service he deserves by January, I believe he will decide he is happy to stay longer term.

.........oh, and I'm off now to watch him make Wednesday even more likely to try and buy him in January.......

COYB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

If Lambert plays 1 up front it isn't going to work with present personnel.

[den]

If Lambert plays 1 up front it isn't going to work with present personnel.

Lambert knows how he wants his team to play. It probably won't suit every player. I hope he doesn't doesn't fall between the two stools.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Lambert knows how he wants his team to play. It probably won't suit every player. I hope he doesn't doesn't fall between the two stools.

I hope he's smart enough to suss that out Den. Our system of play doesn't suit the strengths of our players at the moment. I suppose he had to give the lads with the shirts their chance to impress him. How many have do you think ?

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

If he is being honest, not many.

centrebacks have done ok. Evans decent, Hope tries to get forward at times. Think our stella performers such as Marshall,Rhodes and Conway have been poor for a few games now.

[den]

I hope he's smart enough to suss that out Den. Our system of play doesn't suit the strengths of our players at the moment. I suppose he had to give the lads with the shirts their chance to impress him. How many have do you think ?

Like WWWM says, probably not many.

Hopefully Lambert will set the bar at a level that would make us competitive with the best teams in this league. Hopefully every player will be given 90 minute fitness/stamina targets that are as tough as at any other club - along with personal performance targets. It's no good just running around for 90 mins but making no impact on the game. I hope he doesn't lower his demands if the current players can't reach it.

So set standards high, demand that players contribute every minute they're on the park. For me, Bowyers bar was set at whatever happened on the park. He dropped it to their level, rather than the other way round. He never believed we played badly because his standards were too low.

[DE.]

Like WWWM says, probably not many.

Hopefully Lambert will set the bar at a level that would make us competitive with the best teams in this league. Hopefully every player will be given 90 minute fitness/stamina targets that are as tough as at any other club - along with personal performance targets. It's no good just running around for 90 mins but making no impact on the game. I hope he doesn't lower his demands if the current players can't reach it.

So set standards high, demand that players contribute every minute they're on the park. For me, Bowyers bar was set at whatever happened on the park. He dropped it to their level, rather than the other way round. He never believed we played badly because his standards were too low.

Spot on den. The players take their standards from the manager - if his are low, so will theirs be. At this level, at least, players generally won't do much above the required minimum. For Bowyer that was just giving it a right good go.

Lambert has made it clear in his interviews that standards aren't high enough and I have no doubt he'll be setting much higher targets. Should players fail to match those targets, I expect them to be moved on and others brought in or promoted from the academy to get a chance. It's the only way we'll get anywhere. Chronic underperformers simply cannot be tolerated.

[sambo]

Hoping I'm not resurrecting the Rhodes debate, but good to see Lambert's comments on Rhodes today.

Acknowledged his all round play can improve, but made it clear that Rhodes' strengths are inside the box, with plans to ensure more of a supply to him.

Hopefully that is reflected in the coming weeks.

[tomphil]

Come on Jordan lad you need to get a couple soon or the vultures will be out again

[sambo]

Come on Jordan lad you need to get a couple soon or the vultures will be out again

Let's hope not (about the vultures). He works hard, is respectful and scores consistently.

I love the guy, and fully expect him to score tomorrow.

Hopefully we can take some of the burden off him and just let him focus on doing what he does best - scoring goals.

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

Anyone who went today, how did Rhodes do?

[47er]

Well he didn't score yet we still won!

According to the MB, this is impossible!

[arbitro]

Anyone who went today, how did Rhodes do?

He has looked a bit 'leggy' under Lambert and I thought did so today too. He is being asked to do a lot more intense work by closing defenders down, sometimes on his own. Perhaps he was one of the more unfit players and it will take him longer to get up to speed and make the necessary adjustments to his game.

[DE.]

Well he didn't score yet we still won!

According to the MB, this is impossible!

It was under Bowyer (don't think we won a game this season without Rhodes scoring with Bowyer in charge, would be interesting to know how often that was the case over the course of his tenure), but it's undoubtedly a huge positive that we're able to win games even when Rhodes isn't sticking it into the net.

Conversely, it's also a slight worry that Rhodes hasn't found the net as often since Lambert came to the club. Only three games so far, but he often seems isolated and struggles to have an impact on the game. That was true often under Bowyer as well, though, so I'll take Rhodes scoring less if it means as a team we win more often.