[Archived] Charlton Away 23.1.2015

[onlyonejackwalker]

Yes, and it makes me more fed up to think the rest of this season is a write off!

I completely understand that aspect about getting characters involved, but we've heard the same before - I do trust Lambert but that can always involve questioning. The results matter more than anything - they are simply not good enough at present, and it's depressing to consider we've signed a couple of players who are unlikely to change those results.

I'm more positve about Graham though, considering that there is still a few days left - another addition of this ilk could make the rest of the season more interesting at least. Bennett still has time to make a difference but after watching both halves on Rovers player from Charlton - I'm almost pining for Conway and Marshall on the flanks again, especially with Danny G.

The season was a write off after 7 games and I said so at the time. Crap cup exit as well. I was very annoyed with Bowyer with nothing to look forward to all year. What did he not understand about hitting the ground running after pre-season?

It was certainly over after 16 games. Pleasingly this was recognised and we hopefully do not need to suffer the same dull as dishwater problems next season.

[RevidgeBlue]

Yes, and it makes me more fed up to think the rest of this season is a write off!

You almost make it sound like that's Lambert's fault!!

Seventeen points from he first sixteen games did for any realistic play off hopes we may have harboured this season. Yes we could have made the play offs with an excellent run over 30 games but sadly the "holiday camp" mentality prevalent under GB appears to be deeply entrenched amongst the dressing room and will take some shifting. As others have said hopefully PL is trying to stir things up a bit short term by bringing in characters he knows. If the signings aren't a bit more ambitious in summer I might share your concerns.

[DE.]

Last year our season was over by this time as well. Difference was that Bowyer was well into his tenure and using the team he had built. Gestede and Cairney yet to be sold, I hasten to add.

[Mike E]

Why all of a sudden is it a priority to defend PL? I'm saying what I think, argue as you will but ultimately nothing you say is going to change my opinion that the club (not pl singularly) is letting me down by signing more lower league bargain bin signings.

I said that they will get there chance, but I can't see how I'm not allowed to criticise the signings? They are more of what we've done since the money was spunked - bargain bin signings where the actual reasoning has come from circumstance as opposed to quality.

If we could've made one decent money signing in a position we are desperate in - surely that would make more sense than filling up on more to release come July 1.

It's evident that we gave no money to spend, so why waste what little we have on wages of people who do not better the first team. I don't care about what GB did or anything else - the aim of promotion/good football ain't happening if we can't invest properly,

Can we leave this "defending/attacking" malarkey out also - if I think PL is making pointless signings, what has that to do with any previous managers? The context of signing Taylor Marrow and Judge is completely different to the scenario we currently find ourselves in.

3 of our 4 signings to date have come from the Premier League...

[Amo]

It's interesting how Bowyer's most ardent apologists are the ones who are hypercritical of Lambert. Yes, I understand that with a proven manager comes a higher level of expectation, but it's not hard to see the obvious double-standard here.

[JAL]

Some great pics in the LT with regards to this game from which a question posed. Should a professional footballer have his eyes open or eyes closed when heading the ball to achieve maximum effectiveness ?

[JBiz]

3 of our 4 signings to date have come from the Premier League...

Touche!

You almost make it sound like that's Lambert's fault!!

Seventeen points from he first sixteen games did for any realistic play off hopes we may have harboured this season. Yes we could have made the play offs with an excellent run over 30 games but sadly the "holiday camp" mentality prevalent under GB appears to be deeply entrenched amongst the dressing room and will take some shifting. As others have said hopefully PL is trying to stir things up a bit short term by bringing in characters he knows. If the signings aren't a bit more ambitious in summer I might share your concerns.

Again - I've no interest or need to reply because it's harping back to stuff that's been done. To death. You are welcome to you're opinion but what has GB or you're view of his methods got to do with me being less than enamoured by the signings we've made?

Last year our season was over by this time as well. Difference was that Bowyer was well into his tenure and using the team he had built. Gestede and Cairney yet to be sold, I hasten to add.

Again, I'm not being drawn into comparing with last year because it just leads to being described as;

It's interesting how Bowyer's most ardent apologists are the ones who are hypercritical of Lambert. Yes, I understand that with a proven manager comes a higher level of expectation, but it's not hard to see the obvious double-standard here.

Which is not true in any sense. It could be flipped as those who vehemently wanted a change for 18 months ignoring the obvious issues at hand and choosing personal jibes as opposed to reason when discussing.

[Amo]

Which is not true in any sense. It could be flipped as those who vehemently wanted a change for 18 months ignoring the obvious issues at hand and choosing personal jibes as opposed to reason when discussing.

Nope. I haven't seen anyone ignoring our recent slump, notwithstanding that we're in a transition period and have to cut our cloth accordingly until the summer.

Yourself, and several others, would bend over backwards to defend Bowyer despite the mediocre offerings he served up on a weekly basis. Lambert's been in the job two seconds, and in what can only be described as a feeble attempt to validate your own bias, the knives are already out.

[47er]

Why all of a sudden is it a priority to defend PL? I'm saying what I think, argue as you will but ultimately nothing you say is going to change my opinion that the club (not pl singularly) is letting me down by signing more lower league bargain bin signings.

I said that they will get there chance, but I can't see how I'm not allowed to criticise the signings? They are more of what we've done since the money was spunked - bargain bin signings where the actual reasoning has come from circumstance as opposed to quality.

If we could've made one decent money signing in a position we are desperate in - surely that would make more sense than filling up on more to release come July 1.

It's evident that we gave no money to spend, so why waste what little we have on wages of people who do not better the first team. I don't care about what GB did or anything else - the aim of promotion/good football ain't happening if we can't invest properly,

Can we leave this "defending/attacking" malarkey out also - if I think PL is making pointless signings, what has that to do with any previous managers? The context of signing Taylor Marrow and Judge is completely different to the scenario we currently find ourselves in.

You have done nothing but criticise PL since his appointment. Obliquely, indirectly but definitely. You argued vociferously for GB to be retained and you still wish he had been. You have been disingenuous on this subject all along and its time to give it up.

As you correctly say, its been done to death.

New manager, new times, something to be hopeful about again-----at last.

[JBiz]

I'm afraid I cannot accept those personal slants based on nothing more than sweeping statements of past stance.

7. No flaming

Board members must refrain from posting anything that is designed to insult or provoke others, regardless of subject.

I've had to take numerous posts that break this basic part of the rules. Only sambo really made any attempt to discuss without making the same type of remarks that I wouldn't expect from "community managers" making discussions from PMs public from 2014.

I have only posted the opinion I have. Nobody has the right to publicly provoke anyone by making a personal remark- ie disingenuous.

If you believe that, why not pm and ask?

Edit - I forgot to add, all this from arbitro's initial post- which if you read back made reference to the whole saga which I (and seemingly everyone else) wants to move on from.

[tomphil]

Bowyer helped turn a poor side into an average one whilst cutting some costs. Then he kept it average despite being able to add some to that cost. As a result of this, his inexperience and the embargo plus player sales we became poor again.

Without money like what was spent on Marshall/Evans etc and acquiring 30 odd players Lambert has to first make us average again. He's in his stage 1. Bowyer was beyond stage 3.

He needs to get halfway before we can really see what's happening.

[onlyonejackwalker]

Bowyer helped turn a poor side into an average one whilst cutting some costs. Then he kept it average despite being able to add some to that cost. As a result of this, his inexperience and the embargo plus player sales we became poor again.

Without money like what was spent on Marshall/Evans etc and acquiring 30 odd players Lambert has to first make us average again. He's in his stage 1. Bowyer was beyond stage 3.

He needs to get halfway before we can really see what's happening.

It's a shame we have suffered this succession of one nil defeats. The early wins were fortunate and I knew that wouldn't last, but you don't lose 1-0 if you are mentally fragile and not trying your best. Your 2-0 down after 15 minutes and get battered 4-0.

It's tough getting results whilst instigating change. It's normally one step back, to go two steps forward, changing structure and technique, improving fitness and stamina, drills, patterns of play and positioning. Not easy at all with a new group, whilst also getting results. Plus integrating new players. It rocks everyone's world and new manager bounce is I'm pretty sure a cute little fairy tale.

On the subject of new players, I think many are wary of the people signed. With good reason after the last five years.

But personally speaking I think that's more down to my own ignorance not knowing enough about the new lads. Although I have seen Graham play a number of times. (Normally badly).

So you therefore trust the man who knows them, recruits them, trains them, picks them and rewards them, or you don't.

I don't care about these recent narrow losses. It's been shocking for years. I genuinely believe having gone one step backwards, whilst still achieving similar points to the previous manager, we are now to see phase two as we settle into the new year and get back to level board. Phase three can only come in the summer with new recruits and time to work on the cultural change required.

Onwards and upwards. I've been negative for years but can see when things are improving at the club, not just in the continued support and added investment, but in the general behaviour and decency of the club. But don't get carried away. Never mind one step, this lot took us 101 steps backwards.

[Amo]

I'm afraid I cannot accept those personal slants based on nothing more than sweeping statements of past stance.

7. No flaming

Board members must refrain from posting anything that is designed to insult or provoke others, regardless of subject.

I've had to take numerous posts that break this basic part of the rules. Only sambo really made any attempt to discuss without making the same type of remarks that I wouldn't expect from "community managers" making discussions from PMs public from 2014.

I have only posted the opinion I have. Nobody has the right to publicly provoke anyone by making a personal remark- ie disingenuous.

If you believe that, why not pm and ask?

Edit - I forgot to add, all this from arbitro's initial post- which if you read back made reference to the whole saga which I (and seemingly everyone else) wants to move on from.

Don't try to take the moral highground, Bizzle. You're the only master baiter on here.

[arbitro]

I'm afraid I cannot accept those personal slants based on nothing more than sweeping statements of past stance.

7. No flaming

Board members must refrain from posting anything that is designed to insult or provoke others, regardless of subject.

I've had to take numerous posts that break this basic part of the rules. Only sambo really made any attempt to discuss without making the same type of remarks that I wouldn't expect from "community managers" making discussions from PMs public from 2014.

I have only posted the opinion I have. Nobody has the right to publicly provoke anyone by making a personal remark- ie disingenuous.

If you believe that, why not pm and ask?

Edit - I forgot to add, all this from arbitro's initial post- which if you read back made reference to the whole saga which I (and seemingly everyone else) wants to move on from.

I did comparisons between several Bowyer signings and four by Lambert of which you said you were underwhelmed. So are you saying we cannot debate the last three and a half years because of your fixation with Bowyer? You opened the debate up and now don't want to carry it. I find that strange.