[Archived] Rhodes To Boro

[Stuart]

I completely agree with the last two sentences. Unquestionable.

However in transfers where the player has an interest in leaving (without a request), then the selling club will pay very little. Certainly not his entire contract.

SpeedieDived started this by saying Rovers would definitely have to pay his entire contract up if he had been sold today.

Do you agree with that?

I'm not sure that's what Speedy Dived was actually saying. If it is then I'd be surprised, but in that scenario assuming he is right, and assuming that any such costs were passed on to Boro:

3.5 years left x £40k per week = £7.3m

5 year deal at Boro @ £40k per week = £10.4m

Signing on bonus, say, £250k

Loyalty bonus from Rovers, say, £250k

Promotion bonus, £500k

Goals target bonus, £500k

Rovers fee, £9m

Promotion payment, £2m

Performance payment, £2m

Total, £32.2m

Is this where Gibson got his figures from? Did Speedie Dived phone him with spurious football compo regulations that nobody else knows about? Damn you Speedie Dived!

Doesn't sound right that we'd pay Rhodes' contract up if he had another club lined up. Although he may be entitled to sue I think that courts would not entertain it because Rovers could counter that he wasn't out of picket because of the arrangement with Boro. But Rhodes would still have to agree to sign for Boro for that to follow - undermining any potential legal action. If he didn't agree then he'd just carry on being paid his weekly wage by Rovers as their player.

[adsfortheblues]

You do realise you just completely proved my point?

My understanding that Rovers have received a bid, they've not accepted but they've informed the player, the player has expressed a desire to leave and therefore been granted permission to speak to boro. Therefore the transfer is instigated by the player and not the club. Unless this isn't the case, then I would agree with you completely.

Anything otherwise and this would completely reverse everything that has been in place under contractual as well as employment law for years.

[Speedie Dived]

So when a player has a transfer release clause in their contract and clause is met giving the club no choice but to accept,then the club are forcing him out?

No because both parties have agreed to that being there.

[Pedro]

So from what some are saying in here if i was a player on £100,000 a week and had a 5 year contract with a buy out clause of £10,000,000 if i bought myself after 1 year, for £10,000,000 the club would have to pay me the rest of my contract so that would

make me £10,800,000 just do the maths

Yep, that's what they are saying. Just plain daft and for the sake of not admitting that actually, maybe they've read something wrong.

[Stuart]

But Stuart Rhodes has shown a desire to leave.According to Lambert Rhodes was asked if he wanted to talk to Boro.He wasn't forced too.Il ask again if the transfer had gone through in your opinion would he have been entitled to having his contract paid up?

What does a desire to leave even mean? He will simply have expressed a desire to speak to another interested club. A lawyer would make mincemeat of that.

To express a desire to leave, there is a contractual instrument to do so: written transfer request or resignation letter.

[DE.]

My understanding that Rovers have received a bid, they've not accepted but they've informed the player, the player has expressed a desire to leave and therefore been granted permission to speak to boro. Therefore the transfer is instigated by the player and not the club. Unless this isn't the case, then I would agree with you completely.

To be fair, according to PL himself: “After a fee was agreed between the two clubs, Jordan asked to go and speak to Middlesbrough."

Does this not suggest we agreed the fee first?

[philipl]

Think Gibson's been a good owner actually though it isn't that long since he was being criticised. So much for Middlesbrough suddenly being the pinnacle of ambition. Though they are lucky to have had an owner that cares for the last 30 years. As for the 96-97 incident you never know what could have happened. If any of their usual first team squad had been fit (don't know if any were) they could have shown up and broken their leg during the game. Then the other fixtures would have worked out differently.

Sorry but your reading of the 96/7 incident is completely wrong.

They asked for a postponement, not granted and unilaterally cried off resulting in a 3 point penalty deduction in addition to losing the replayed game at Ewood 1-0. The 3 point penalty was the difference between relegation and survival...

Oh and them not turning up arguably ruined our season as we would have gone top and we had beaten them 1-0 and that would have maintained our momentum.

Gibson has made a good appointment in the current manager but by and large he has been average to rubbish.

[Speedie Dived]

My understanding that Rovers have received a bid, they've not accepted but they've informed the player, the player has expressed a desire to leave and therefore been granted permission to speak to boro. Therefore the transfer is instigated by the player and not the club. Unless this isn't the case, then I would agree with you completely.

Anything otherwise and this would completely reverse everything that has been in place under contractual as well as employment law for years.

The club accepting the bid is the trigger, Rovers tell Rhodes they have accepted a bid for him.

If it was other way round it's different.

[Mani]

Ok, here's my take on it....

Jordan was bought by Shebby to score the goals to fire us out of the Championship. There was a plan (ish) but that plan failed. Since then several managers have been and gone, Rhodes has continued to score goals but to absolutely no competitive advantage. Now whether you want to blame the teams failings on Venkys, Bowyer or the players it IS clear that a change of direction was needed.

In fairness, the previous regime were aware that Rhodes head had been turned and bearing mind what they saw in training (where Rhodes footballing ability has been known to be described as embarrassing semi regularly) they were chomping at the bit to sell for £10m+ and strengthen the team...this was always vetoed by Venkys.

The recruitment of Lambert et al signals the change of direction the club badly needed. Lambert only sees what everyone else has seen and is more than happy to sell. Glen, your judgement of Lambert is extremely harsh.

Fast forward to Friday's bid. Rhodes wants out. Full stop. So why should Lambert roll over and welcome him back with open arms when it goes south? He wasn't disrespectful, he just told the truth...why not? Do we want to be lied to?

I don't know about you but ALL of the players he's brought in are better than the ones he's replaced. So Iv got no issue. In addition I get the impression that if you're not committed to the cause then you're a goner...and I like that too. I'm not bothered if he has to play in the ressies. Sometimes you have to make an example of the star man to show the rest that you will not accept anything less.

if the winning secret is that no one person is greater than the cause, then judging by the doughy eyed 'welcome home' attitude of some on here, it's little surprise that we've failed so many times!!

Get some self respect I say. If we're not good enough for you Jordan...see ya!

[Hasta]

It's basically one or the other.

Transfer request handed in or club accepts bid.

They are basically just terms for who owes who.

Transfer request =waive any payment

Fee accepted = player negotiates remainder of contract

Last post on this.

In the vast majority of cases when a player is sold, the selling club will not end up paying his wages. Players are generally sold because they thnk they are going upwards, want more game time or they have little contract left. In all of these cases then because it is in the players interests to move, they will take nothing in wages from the seller.

In cases like Fowler where the club wants the player out,for either financial reasons or other reasons, they may agree to subsidise wages. In these instances, the player doesn't want to move and will be financially worse off by the move hence why the seller needs to pay I t make it happen.

If a waster like Murphy is no longer wanted, and the club want shut, then they have to pay his contract out in full.

Not a cat in hells chance Rovers would have to pay Rhodes £1.5 mill if this went through as you implied.

[Pedro]

I will be. Look forward to reading about Koita's shots being spilled by the goalie.

Maybe huddle around rhe laptop and make a night of it with the guy who works for the FA and one of the players from various levels (translated as an ex-ref from the Burnley and district league and big John who twice subbed for Huncoat).

[yoda]

Ok, here's my take on it....

Jordan was bought by Shebby to score the goals to fire us out of the Championship. There was a plan (ish) but that plan failed. Since then several managers have been and gone, Rhodes has continued to score goals but to absolutely no competitive advantage. Now whether you want to blame the teams failings on Venkys, Bowyer or the players it IS clear that a change of direction was needed.

In fairness, the previous regime were aware that Rhodes head had been turned and bearing mind what they saw in training (where Rhodes footballing ability has been known to be described as embarrassing semi regularly) they were chomping at the bit to sell for £10m+ and strengthen the team...this was always vetoed by Venkys.

The recruitment of Lambert et al signals the change of direction the club badly needed. Lambert only sees what everyone else has seen and is more than happy to sell. Glen, your judgement of Lambert is extremely harsh.

Fast forward to Friday's bid. Rhodes wants out. Full stop. So why should Lambert roll over and welcome him back with open arms when it goes south? He wasn't disrespectful, he just told the truth...why not? Do we want to be lied to?

I don't know about you but ALL of the players he's brought in are better than the ones he's replaced. So Iv got no issue. In addition I get the impression that if you're not committed to the cause then you're a goner...and I like that too. I'm not bothered if he has to play in the ressies. Sometimes you have to make an example of the star man to show the rest that you will not accept anything less.

if the winning secret is that no one person is greater than the cause, then judging by the doughy eyed 'welcome home' attitude of some on here, it's little surprise that we've failed so many times!!

Get some self respect I say. If we're not good enough for you Jordan...see ya!

Have you got a buyer lined up ?

[Stuart]

Ok, here's my take on it....

Jordan was bought by Shebby to score the goals to fire us out of the Championship. There was a plan (ish) but that plan failed. Since then several managers have been and gone, Rhodes has continued to score goals but to absolutely no competitive advantage. Now whether you want to blame the teams failings on Venkys, Bowyer or the players it IS clear that a change of direction was needed.

In fairness, the previous regime were aware that Rhodes head had been turned and bearing mind what they saw in training (where Rhodes footballing ability has been known to be described as embarrassing semi regularly) they were chomping at the bit to sell for £10m+ and strengthen the team...this was always vetoed by Venkys.

The recruitment of Lambert et al signals the change of direction the club badly needed. Lambert only sees what everyone else has seen and is more than happy to sell. Glen, your judgement of Lambert is extremely harsh.

Fast forward to Friday's bid. Rhodes wants out. Full stop. So why should Lambert roll over and welcome him back with open arms when it goes south? He wasn't disrespectful, he just told the truth...why not? Do we want to be lied to?

I don't know about you but ALL of the players he's brought in are better than the ones he's replaced. So Iv got no issue. In addition I get the impression that if you're not committed to the cause then you're a goner...and I like that too. I'm not bothered if he has to play in the ressies. Sometimes you have to make an example of the star man to show the rest that you will not accept anything less.

if the winning secret is that no one person is greater than the cause, then judging by the doughy eyed 'welcome home' attitude of some on here, it's little surprise that we've failed so many times!!

Get some self respect I say. If we're not good enough for you Jordan...see ya!

Lambert is paid to think like a manager not a partisan fan.

He should have said nothing, officially, let alone give direct quotes. That said, I bet Rhodes' agent doesn't get much sleep tonight.

[eire3382]

Realistically this is an awful situation for the club. A player who has no interest and who really is hard to fit into any system. Now his value will drop as he wont get as much game time (I think). Bloody disaster we needed the money

[Stuart]

The saddest thing in all of this is that Rhodes has become the bad guy. If it does fall through then we are still paying him £40k per week (or whatever the figure is) until the end of the season - and not getting the best out of him.

Let's hope Rhodes and his agent drop some of their demands. If he wants a promotion attempt this season then he will have to. The thing is, doing so could cost him millions.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Ok, here's my take on it....

Jordan was bought by Shebby to score the goals to fire us out of the Championship. There was a plan (ish) but that plan failed. Since then several managers have been and gone, Rhodes has continued to score goals but to absolutely no competitive advantage. Now whether you want to blame the teams failings on Venkys, Bowyer or the players it IS clear that a change of direction was needed.

In fairness, the previous regime were aware that Rhodes head had been turned and bearing mind what they saw in training (where Rhodes footballing ability has been known to be described as embarrassing semi regularly) they were chomping at the bit to sell for £10m+ and strengthen the team...this was always vetoed by Venkys.

The recruitment of Lambert et al signals the change of direction the club badly needed. Lambert only sees what everyone else has seen and is more than happy to sell. Glen, your judgement of Lambert is extremely harsh.

Fast forward to Friday's bid. Rhodes wants out. Full stop. So why should Lambert roll over and welcome him back with open arms when it goes south? He wasn't disrespectful, he just told the truth...why not? Do we want to be lied to?

I don't know about you but ALL of the players he's brought in are better than the ones he's replaced. So Iv got no issue. In addition I get the impression that if you're not committed to the cause then you're a goner...and I like that too. I'm not bothered if he has to play in the ressies. Sometimes you have to make an example of the star man to show the rest that you will not accept anything less.

if the winning secret is that no one person is greater than the cause, then judging by the doughy eyed 'welcome home' attitude of some on here, it's little surprise that we've failed so many times!!

Get some self respect I say. If we're not good enough for you Jordan...see ya!

Exactly.

[Mercer]

A termination fee/loyalty bonus is set in a players contract when they sign it. A transfer request forfeits that fee.

Players like Adebayor wouldn't agree a deal anywhere else as his contract at Spurs was more lucrative than any other offer on the table and his loyalty bonus mustn't have bridged the gap between the two.

A contract only usually gets paid up in full to a player when there is a mutual termination, unless said player accepts a fee lower than his contract is worth.

We bought Conway for about what, 100k? Say he had 6 months left on his contract at around 5k per week (not sure of the exact figure), you're saying Cardiff would have been obligated to pay him the full transfer fee, making nothing. They may as well just have kept him in the squad in case they needed him.

Hold my hand up if I'm wrong but I'd be 99% sure that's not how it works in football.

You are 99% correct.

[yoda]

Exactly.

Exactly !

are you sure,

do you have a buyer lined ?

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

The saddest thing in all of this is that Rhodes has become the bad guy. If it does fall through then we are still paying him £40k per week (or whatever the figure is) until the end of the season - and not getting the best out of him.

Let's hope Rhodes and his agent drop some of their demands. If he wants a promotion attempt this season then he will have to. The thing is, doing so could cost him millions.

I don't see it as sad in that respect. Between them, for whatever reasons - Rhodes, his agent and Middlesborough have cocked up a basic transaction. There's a simple way for for Rhodes to regain the respect of most people at our club. Try and be a bit less avaricious and tell the agent who's in charge.

Ok the Lamborghini may have to be traded in for a Ferrari or vice versa but I'm sure he'll never have to work again when he retires from the game

[JAL]

Could Rovers report Boro for their behaviour over this Rhodes bid???

Does the club have money ?

[yoda]

Does the club have money ?

Looks like Boro don't

[islander200]

How would that affect Jordan Rhodes' situation though?

Sorry, (and not aimed at you islander200) but I've just had to wade through pages of speculation about players' contracts and transfer pay offs and it has just about done my nut in!

Apologies oldjamfan,buy it is related to the Rhodes transfer as speedie dived is suggesting we would have to pay up Rhodes contract and his loyalty bonus on top of the sell on clause to huddersfield.We wouldn't be making any profit at all if that is the case

[mhead]

Hope Shelfie not reading all this. The poor little Chairman will be having nightmares.

Did I do anything wrong?

Will Madame be phoning?

What did I put in that last Contract of Rhodesy?

Am I taller than Steve Gibson?

Its tough being Rovers(very part-time) Chairman.

[Baz]

Can we have a different thread for the discussion of footballers contracts?

Its pretty tedious, and there must be 20 pages of it.

[koi]

Wrighty made a point on 606; this could be his best chance to get in the PL in the near future, if he gets in the PL and scores a few goals he'll be in a position to command what he's asking for now. In other words, suck it up and prove it in the prem.