[Archived] Eu Referendum, In Or Out - Looks Like Blackburn Wants Out !

[philipl]

St George's flag

Absolutely,

Greek father, Syrian/Palestinian mother, grew up in Turkey, joined the Roman army and killed the dragon in Beirut. Never got closer to the UK than Athens....

He was a complete mongrel like most British passport holders are.

The flag of St George honours diversity and solidarity with Turkey, Syria and Palestine. Totally fitting that we should welcome refugees from these sad countries given we have adopted their flag.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

Absolutely,

Greek father, Syrian/Palestinian mother, grew up in Turkey, joined the Roman army and killed the dragon in Beirut. Never got closer to the UK than Athens....

He was a complete mongrel like most British passport holders are.

The flag of St George honours diversity and solidarity with Turkey, Syria and Palestine. Totally fitting that we should welcome refugees from these sad countries given we have adopted their flag.

First off, Turkish people aren't refugees. Second off, Turkey's President has told his citizens not to use birth control so they can "multiply our descendants". Make of that what you will. Personally I see it extremely, extremely alarming, basically a call by the leader of an Islamist party to convert the world to hardline Islam through sheer weight of numbers. If you disagree then I'd love to hear your take on it.

Either way, you're happy to welcome "refugees" (economic migrants) from a country that has been instructed to overpopulate itself by its religious nutjob of a president are you? Oh, wait a second, you live in Malta!

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

Biased postal voting forms going out in Bristol and elsewhere I see.

"The Electoral Commission has told Bristol Council not to use it again. But with reports of similar leaflets dropping on doormats around the country it may be too late to do anything about it."

What a complete joke. Its getting to the point where the Leave Campaign should consider a legal challenge against this sham of a vote. The traditional British inclination towards fairness has been completely trampled all over by the seedy tactics of the Remain Campaign and their morally gutter-level establishment backers.

[Norbert Rassragr]

Turkey shouldn't be part of the EU. It's the gateway to all sort of Islamist loons who want to inflict misery here or in Syria, and the President is a mad human rights abuser who fantasises about being a sultan of a new Ottoman empire. He may even profit from IS oil.

I'd consider voting to leave, but we have one of the most corrupt, vicious and hateful governments since Thatcher, and giving them an entirely free hand would inflict terrible wounds on society.

[jim mk2]

Biased postal voting forms going out in Bristol and elsewhere I see.

"The Electoral Commission has told Bristol Council not to use it again. But with reports of similar leaflets dropping on doormats around the country it may be too late to do anything about it."

What a complete joke. Its getting to the point where the Leave Campaign should consider a legal challenge against this sham of a vote. The traditional British inclination towards fairness has been completely trampled all over by the seedy tactics of the Remain Campaign and their morally gutter-level establishment backers.

Would this "British inclination towards fairness" include the antics of the right wing press that waged a war of fear against the Labour party in the last general election including character assassination of Ed Miliband and his family ? Nah, thought not.

Turkey shouldn't be part of the EU. It's the gateway to all sort of Islamist loons who want to inflict misery here or in Syria, and the President is a mad human rights abuser who fantasises about being a sultan of a new Ottoman empire. He may even profit from IS oil.

I'd consider voting to leave, but we have one of the most corrupt, vicious and hateful governments since Thatcher, and giving them an entirely free hand would inflict terrible wounds on society.

This government in its present form is finished anyway - In or Out.

[yoda]

Absolutely,

Greek father, Syrian/Palestinian mother, grew up in Turkey, joined the Roman army and killed the dragon in Beirut. Never got closer to the UK than Athens....

He was a complete mongrel like most British passport holders are.

The flag of St George honours diversity and solidarity with Turkey, Syria and Palestine. Totally fitting that we should welcome refugees from these sad countries given we have adopted their flag.

I don't think calling most British passports mongrels is called for Philip.

We should have cut Scotland loose years ago, they are a drain on the rest of the UK.

You are displaying hatred for anything British, or is it just the English ?

I think you want democracy but only on your terms.

[philipl]

In 1810 the population of Blackburn was well under 10,000.

How do you think it got to 126,000 by 1870?

Might the flight of 60,000 people to Lancashire from Belgium when France invaded have something to do with it? And the Irish potato famine which was exacerbated by British policies then added to the number of immigrants dramatically.

I have a Scandinavian derived surname and Irish and Scottish grandparents on my maternal side so I am pretty standard @#/? related as I am sure you are.

[philipl]

By the way democracy on my terms?

You say Scotland should have been cut loose years ago but they voted by a majority to remain part of the UK as it is now- a member of the EU.

I see a glaring hole in your argument.

[Paul]

I don't think calling most British passports mongrels is called for Philip..

Doesn't that depend on the intended use of the word? My kids are British passport holders and over two generations their direct blood heritage is Italian, Ukranian, Scottish, English, Irish.

No thoroughbreds in our family!!!

[Biddy]

Turkey shouldn't be part of the EU. It's the gateway to all sort of Islamist loons who want to inflict misery here or in Syria, and the President is a mad human rights abuser who fantasises about being a sultan of a new Ottoman empire. He may even profit from IS oil.

I'd consider voting to leave, but we have one of the most corrupt, vicious and hateful governments since Thatcher, and giving them an entirely free hand would inflict terrible wounds on society.

So vote labour at the next election. That's where we have a choice. Why people think they should limit themselves on the EU vote just because of the current government I'll never know. That's the beauty of democracy, we can kick them out and choose our leaders.

Or are people with this attitude basically admitting they think labour will never be in power again?

[Biddy]

By the way democracy on my terms?

You say Scotland should have been cut loose years ago but they voted by a majority to remain part of the UK as it is now- a member of the EU.

I see a glaring hole in your argument.

Scotland voted to remain as part of the UK, the EU question was never put to them. The SNP seem to always make a lot of noise speaking on behalf of Scotland that they will split and rejoin the EU in case of Brexit. It will be interesting to see which way the Scottish vote actually goes to see what the people themselves want. If 40-49% vote to leave the EU, I wonder if the SNP will go gung ho with a 2nd referendum and then to re-join the EU?

Has there been any polling to see which way Scotland are thinking? I might have just missed it.

[yoda]

By the way democracy on my terms?

You say Scotland should have been cut loose years ago but they voted by a majority to remain part of the UK as it is now- a member of the EU.

I see a glaring hole in your argument.

No one asked the rest of the UK if we wanted to keep the Jocks, another glaring hole in the debate (argument)

[RibbleValleyRover]

Scotland voted to remain as part of the UK, the EU question was never put to them. The SNP seem to always make a lot of noise speaking on behalf of Scotland that they will split and rejoin the EU in case of Brexit. It will be interesting to see which way the Scottish vote actually goes to see what the people themselves want. If 40-49% vote to leave the EU, I wonder if the SNP will go gung ho with a 2nd referendum and then to re-join the EU?

Has there been any polling to see which way Scotland are thinking? I might have just missed it.

Scotland from the polls I have seen are pro-eu. And yes I think it's an absolutely certainty that if leave win then Scotland will have another referendum on being in the UK and this time it will pass.

[yoda]

Will Scotland get the same level of hand outs from the EU as they get from the UK ?

Very much doubt it.

[yoda]

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon/12189037/scotland-runs-up-15bn-deficit-twice-size-of-UKs-html.

Cat out of the bag Philip ?

Maybe the North West should vote for independance, after all the NW economy is bigger than 15 other EU countries including Scotland's (120 billion plus currently)

[RibbleValleyRover]

Labour need to find a way to get its strong pro EU voter base out for the EU referendum otherwise Leave are going to win.

It certainly doesn't help when you have a leader that is either indifferent to the whole issue or deep down wouldn't actually mind seeing us out. Saw a recent poll that said that 43% of Lab voters don't even know the position of their party on the EU.

[K-Hod]

Labour need to find a way to get its strong pro EU voter base out for the EU referendum otherwise Leave are going to win.

It certainly doesn't help when you have a leader that is either indifferent to the whole issue or deep down wouldn't actually mind seeing us out. Saw a recent poll that said that 43% of Lab voters don't even know the position of their party on the EU.

It's probably a bit unfair to blame this on Labour. People probably don't know, as like the Conservatives, Labour is divided over the EU, but I would have thought that was obvious really.

Saw an article about Boris Johnson the other day where it said in the past he had been very pro-EU, but he's changed his stance for a shot at the leadership, which wouldn't shock me in all honesty. Still, it's dangerous to be playing political football with such a massive decision.....In any event, it's fairly likely Cameron's position would come under threat if we did leave.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

Labour need to find a way to get its strong pro EU voter base out for the EU referendum otherwise Leave are going to win.

It certainly doesn't help when you have a leader that is either indifferent to the whole issue or deep down wouldn't actually mind seeing us out. Saw a recent poll that said that 43% of Lab voters don't even know the position of their party on the EU.

Wouldn't necessarily say that. The polls seem to have the 2 camps at neck-and-neck, as they have been for most of the race. When something like this is neck-and-neck, I reckon the safe option has the best chance of winning, which in this case is the status quo. If we weren't in Europe already and this was a referendum to enter it, I'd say the no vote would have the advantage.

Plus what's got to be considered is the further tactics the government and local councils have up their sleeve. So far they've sent 2 propaganda leaflets out, biased voting forms, have run a campaign to encourage minorities and young people to vote (both heavily pro-EU demographics), and have threatened a leave vote will prompt world war 3, cost people thousands of pounds a year, prolong austerity, someone's probably even mentioned the 4-horsemen of the apocalypse but I might have missed it in amongst everything else. They've another 3 weeks to come up with scare tactics or psychological bullying to get their way.

As a Leave voter I'm pretty glum about my side's chances. The Scottish Independence vote and subsequent rise of the SNP showed that referendum's can be won against the odds when national and local government want to get their way.

Having said all that, immigration is the topic that I suspect is most on Leave voters minds. And with the recent migrant sea-crossing of the channel, and the inevitable hundreds more to come, maybe that will harden Leave voters opinions. I certainly can't see an IS bombing in the UK in the next 3 weeks, they want to be able to get to us as easily as possible.

[K-Hod]

There's been loads of propaganda from both sides, and too much scaremongering. The truth is obviously over-rated.......

[jim mk2]

It's probably a bit unfair to blame this on Labour. People probably don't know, as like the Conservatives, Labour is divided over the EU, but I would have thought that was obvious really.

Saw an article about Boris Johnson the other day where it said in the past he had been very pro-EU, but he's changed his stance for a shot at the leadership, which wouldn't shock me in all honesty. Still, it's dangerous to be playing political football with such a massive decision.....In any event, it's fairly likely Cameron's position would come under threat if we did leave.

Labour are divided, the Tories are at each other's throats, even the trade unions are undecided with the RMT and other unions in favour of a Brexit and at loggerheads with the pro-Remain TUC. Large FTSE businesses and the City want to stay In while SMEs largely want Out. The vote is a fantastically complex issue and both sides are guilty of trying to scare a public that largely does not understand the enormity of what is at stake.

Agree that whichever way it goes, Cameron is finished, and deserves to go for inflicting this unnecessary referendum on the country.

[joey_big_nose]

Labour are divided, the Tories are at each other's throats, even the trade unions are undecided with the RMT and other unions in favour of a Brexit and at loggerheads with the pro-Remain TUC. Large FTSE businesses and the City want to stay In while SMEs largely want Out. The vote is a fantastically complex issue and both sides are guilty of trying to scare a public that largely does not understand the enormity of what is at stake.

Agree that whichever way it goes, Cameron is finished, and deserves to go for inflicting this unnecessary referendum on the country.

Nah, I think remain will win quite comfortably and Cameron will soldier on. He is an average politician but there is virtually no one who can challenge him from within or outside his party. The lack of obvious talent across parliament is really striking.

Long term it looks like Sadiq Khan could be the next viable hope for Labour, but he won't get a shot unless they lose in 2020 (which with Corbyn at the helm they certainly will).

[RibbleValleyRover]

Nah, I think remain will win quite comfortably and Cameron will soldier on. He is an average politician but there is virtually no one who can challenge him from within or outside his party. The lack of obvious talent across parliament is really striking.

Long term it looks like Sadiq Khan could be the next viable hope for Labour, but he won't get a shot unless they lose in 2020 (which with Corbyn at the helm they certainly will).

For months I have thought that remain would win but I am not that confident now, just seems to me that there is a real danger people will instead vote with their hearts over their heads. In the past few days the immigration card has been played hard by Leave and it has managed to get some traction in some of the polls.

I really fear for this country specifically the economic repercussions of a Leave vote.

[Al]

No surprise that Jim thinks that Cameron should go. He's not a communist and that is unforgiveable in Jim's twisted eyes.

[Norbert Rassragr]

He should go because he's a crap useless tit, and so should Osbourne.Mind you, the thought of Boris, Gove and IDS running the show is no better.

[adopted scouser]

He should go because he's a crap useless tit, and so should Osbourne.Mind you, the thought of Boris, Gove and IDS running the show is no better.

Infinitely preferable would be Corbyn and Abbot and that pathetic opportunist Burnham ?

Nope.