[Archived] Blackburn End

[old darwen blue]

pretty much confirms to me my earlier thoughts regarding brag,

all that bunch have ever done is divide the fan base(even though they may do it inadvertently they still do it)

I enjoy going in the Darwen End and I have nothing to do with the action group.

[barry_]

all you seem to be doing is trying to divide the fan base even more. You have been whining about the DE for weeks even though you know it's not closing down. What is your agenda. (for Stuart)

If the club wants change then put away fans in the upper tier. Why give the DE to teams which then cancels out home advantage.

Stop moving games to 12.30 because it's the easy thing to do (if the people in charge of security can't handle the job that was done season after season without hitch, then mayve they should stand down).

Stop playing awful, awful music as soon as the half/full time finishes... most times we really do want to support the team, only for it to be drowned out.

I don't know how you would make the BBE (and the whole fanbase) more vocal/passionate. What are those rattle like things Leicester fans use? Seems to make some noise.

Anyways...

[Stuart]

No it doesn't start with us Stuart far from it.

What does it start with then, JAL?

Billionaires bankrolling a club, half of whose fans are caught between apathy and hatred, and the majority of the rest are just mute?

The manager we have knows what he is doing. We should listen to him.

Barry, why do I have to have an agenda? But if there is one then it is uniting behind a proven manager for the good of the team - before we scare him off and end up with worse (again).

It's a shame that the DE fans seem to hate the BBE so much. That in itself is part of the problem.

[Paul]

Time this debate came to a head.

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/14339703.Blackburn_Rovers_boss_Paul_Lambert_wants_to_create_a____Fortress_Ewood________by_housing_all_home_fans_in_one_end/

I agree with him. Is it time for fans to do their bit?

I agree with the sentiment Stuart but think there is much more to it than moving some fans - which I think could be counterproductive. As I recall it the DE section came about through fans calling for an unreserved seating area so singers could group together and help build the atmosphere. Like the days of terracing, everyone had their patch and knew what to expect in that particular area. Now I'm sure everyone knew this would mean those who wanted to stand could, the club would turn a blind eye as it clearly can't endorse standing. The DE was the only area available as unreserved seating in other parts of the ground would upset fans there. Moving the DE fans back to the BBE is going to create a problem and not solve a problem.

Myself I don't mind standing, I don't want to but will put up with it, but I've lost count of the number of discussions I've had at away grounds with fellow fans who stand and prevent my son from the seeing the game. I and the club now have to go to the trouble of ensuring we get seats at the front to avoid this. That though is only a small part of the point.

Recently there's been some very vocal discussion about bubble matches, switching KO times and other things which force fans to watch/attend football in a way they don't wish to. This always boils down to how important the fans are and how the club (and other clubs) are taking the easy option and ignoring the fans' wishes.

Now I'm not having a poke at you Stuart, or others who agree with moving the DEers, but I can't see how one can complain about the bubble or changed KO times and then endorse forcing our own fans, in our own ground to sit somewhere other than where they want to. If the club forced me to leave my seats I'd be outraged. Of course the club is within its' rights to do this but in every other way it should not. We have four stands open to home support and while we do supporters should be free to choose where they sit. If the club decides to close the DE for financial reasons I imagine there would be a backlash but also understanding, however to do so to generate atmosphere is wrong especially when the original move was designed to create atmosphere.

John Williams always said the only way to generate support, atmosphere and increase crowds is on the pitch. He was and remains correct. Goal music (!) and every other trick in the book won't make any serious difference. How many go because of the halftime "entertainment" - yesterday three blokes trying to hit the crossbar - or say to their son/daugher come on lets go to Ewood, if Rovers score we can hear Coldplay!!!! Success is the answer.

Yesterday the support was louder than I've heard at home for a very long time. The fans recognise the team and the management are performing well, yesterday we gave it everything, again, and the fans responded all around the ground. I know the JW gets mocked but people were singing and clapping yesterday. Responsibility for the atmosphere is ultimately that of the team and manager.

Yes we all have our bit to do and during games fans often recognise this and respond accordingly. Yes we need to hit the ground running with plenty of vocal support but we need the team to play from the first whistle - that's why the opposition are often said to have quietened the crowd in the first 20 minutes.

Forcing supporters to move out of the DE can only be counterproductive and I'd view it in much the same way as forcing me on to a bus to watch an away game.

[chaddyrovers]

I think Darwen end should just be for away fans only.

I would move the family stand to the Jack Walker upper tier or the Riverside stand.

[Stuart]

Paul, they really are nothing alike. I do not have freedoms to do what I like in a private building but I do have freedoms to be able to walk from Blackburn to Burnley if I so choose and to not be forced to be paraded in front of away fans. It's a complete nonstarter comparing the two and we are only going to end up in an argument if you persist.

Back to the matter at hand, closing the DE in order to encourage those fans to move back behind the home end goals, to create a groundswell of home support, is the aim.

However, because of what appears to be a deep-seated dislike between the two ends it is more likely to fill the Riverside or lower corner of the JW. The debate is maybe not about the seating plan but about a split in the fanbase, probably over-spilling from the old protest days. This needs to be sorted out and the fanbase reunited. I'm not sure Lambert is fully aware of what Kean and co did to this club, long term.

[Mike Graham]

I think the DEnders are great. Without them there would be no atmosphere.

As for the BBE it is virtually dead apart from 20 or so in the top left corner. Most home games this season it has been 25% full at the best.

I would focus on building up the DE rather than the BBE.

[Stuart]

I think the DEnders are great. Without them there would be no atmosphere.

As for the BBE it is virtually dead apart from 20 or so in the top left corner. Most home games this season it has been 25% full at the best.

I would focus on building up the DE rather than the BBE.

Can you not see the backwards logic in this?

[Paul]

Paul, they really are nothing alike. I do not have freedoms to do what I like in a private building but I do have freedoms to be able to walk from Blackburn to Burnley if I so choose and to not be forced to be paraded in front of away fans. It's a complete nonstarter comparing the two and we are only going to end up in an argument if you persist.

Back to the matter at hand, closing the DE in order to encourage those fans to move back behind the home end goals, to create a groundswell of home support, is the aim.

However, because of what appears to be a deep-seated dislike between the two ends it is more likely to fill the Riverside or lower corner of the JW. The debate is maybe not about the seating plan but about a split in the fanbase, probably over-spilling from the old protest days. This needs to be sorted out and the fanbase reunited. I'm not sure Lambert is fully aware of what Kean and co did to this club, long term.

Well I'm not arguing, I'm expressing my view which says I understand what you feel and want to achieve but I don't believe forcing people to do something they don't want to is the way forward. You seem to feel in the interests of the club we should ride roughshod over the feelings of a section of fans. I don't agree with the approach. It's not about freedoms of the sort you describe and if we apply that logic the same can be said about the bubble - if you want to buy a ticket to enter Turf Moor you must get on a bus. That is fundamentaly wrong. Taking away fans choice in Ewood is also wrong in my eyes.

As for the two sections having a deep seated dislike of each other? Well I'm in no position to judge but I find it hard to believe. Rovers fans dislike each other because of where they chose to sit, I don't think so. You seem to be implying, because of the Kean era, fans in one section take an opposite view to fans in another. I doubt fans move to the BBE or DE for that reason. There is divided opinion in the fan base on the protests, ownership etc. but I don't feel moving people to create atmosphere will address those issues.

[chaddyrovers]

Think Lambert is after the Blackburn End to be very similar to the Dortmund home end.

[Mike Graham]

Can you not see the backwards logic in this?

The DE fans will only move to the BBE if they have an unallocated standing area set aside. That could happen quite easily but it may upset a few of the old fa*ts who will have to move seats.

[Stuart]

As for the two sections having a deep seated dislike of each other? Well I'm in no position to judge but I find it hard to believe. Rovers fans dislike each other because of where they chose to sit, I don't think so. You seem to be implying, because of the Kean era, fans in one section take an opposite view to fans in another. I doubt fans move to the BBE or DE for that reason. There is divided opinion in the fan base on the protests, ownership etc. but I don't feel moving people to create atmosphere will address those issues.

I seem to recall the '100% Rovers 0% Venkys' protesters upping sticks at one point. Maybe I'm misremembering.

You are right in that physically moving people may not heal any rifts and, as I've mentioned, given the multitude of choices that former DE'ers would still have, they may still choose to sit apart. The healing may need to happen first. However, there does seem to be a stigma being attributed to the BBE these days - mainly by the DE guys funnily enough. In my view, the BBE may be going through a quieter period but it is still the 'main stand' at Ewood as far as I'm concerned. Some may say that our heart is in the DE but our soul is in the BBE.

But even thinking about this objectively, which is loudest? 500 BBE fans singing their best at one end and 500 DE fans singing their best at the other, or 1000 Rovers fans singing their best together?

[ABBEY]

pretty much confirms to me my earlier thoughts regarding brag,

all that bunch have ever done is divide the fan base(even though they may do it inadvertently they still do it)

At least they attend matches which is more than you . Why butt in with digs when it doesn't even concern you .

[tomphil]

A few hundred fans sing in opposite corners of the ground but NO one in between hardly ever joins in that's the problem. People sat in the side stands complaining I'd ask what do you do ? How about making a concerted effort to get those stands to join in or even have an atmosphere of their own ?

But we just go to watch the watch they might say, if we wanted to sing we'd go behind the goal. Yet the people already in the goal ends don't have a right pick which end they want or choose to sing or not ?

Maybe a good way forwards is make the BBE £100 season tickets next season first come first served, not unreserved just fill in the spaces. Lambert wants a full end so it's a good way of going about it and I'm sure the DE enders would be tempted across with minimal fuss at a reduced price.

I think Darwen end should just be for away fans only.

I would move the family stand to the Jack Walker upper tier or the Riverside stand.

Family stand move to the Riverside ??? A sure fire way to reduce the numbers even further.

[Al]

That is the aim.

When will you start to do your bit and go to Ewood, JAL?

Because it starts with us.

In the meantime the Ewood Swiss Cheese fanbase cannot continue and hope to generate any real support. Lambert wants a throbbing BBE by selling it out. I say we should back him. Maybe that even means moving other people from the JW or Riverside but as far as I'm concerned we have a split/diluted set of fans behind each goal and this needs to be addressed.

And sambo, you are not able to stand freely in any part of the ground...

All well and good but from a pure viewing point of view it's impossible to see properly what's going on at the other end of the pitch from behind a goal. You need to view from side on to watch a match. That's why the technical areas are where they are.

[Stuart]

All well and good but from a pure viewing point of view it's impossible to see properly what's going on at the other end of the pitch from behind a goal. You need to view from side on to watch a match. That's why the technical areas are where they are.

Why do you think I sit where I do?

Also the TV cameras have the same idea funnily enough. But that just adds to the argument that the home 'end' is all about generating an atmosphere during the game.

Although for helping kids understand how the game works the BBE upper is actually a very good view from an educational aspect.

Maybe moving Riversiders and the JW lot to the BBE isn't such a great idea after all. DE closure it is then.

I'm not sure why the DE guys get so attached though. The unreserved seating means they have no guarantee of their spot each week - although I bet many of them do have their "usual spot".

[sambo]

Why do you think I sit where I do?

Also the TV cameras have the same idea funnily enough. But that just adds to the argument that the home 'end' is all about generating an atmosphere during the game.

Although for helping kids understand how the game works the BBE upper is actually a very good view from an educational aspect.

Maybe moving Riversiders and the JW lot to the BBE isn't such a great idea after all. DE closure it is then.

I'm not sure why the DE guys get so attached though. The unreserved seating means they have no guarantee of their spot each week - although I bet many of them do have their "usual spot".

Most people go to the same area every week.

People in the DE are attached as they get to stand for 90 mins with the guarantee the person next to them will be singing. In the BBE you sometimes get looked at like you're out of space for singing.

[Stuart]

Most people go to the same area every week.

People in the DE are attached as they get to stand for 90 mins with the guarantee the person next to them will be singing. In the BBE you sometimes get looked at like you're out of space for singing.

And that needs changing. A singing (unofficial safe standing) zone with unreserved seating at the top three rows of the BBE?

[Ben-2000]

I goto the same area in the Darwen End every game, not always the exact same spot but that's how it works.

Long may it continue, I have no interest in sitting in the Blackburn End.

[Stuart]

I goto the same area in the Darwen End every game, not always the exact same spot but that's how it works.

Long may it continue, I have no interest in sitting in the Blackburn End.

Why not Ben?

[chaddyrovers]

Family stand move to the Riverside ??? A sure fire way to reduce the numbers even further.

why is it?

Young fans will be closer to the players and give them a great chance of getting players signatures

[K-Hod]

I think people are over thinking this. Lambert said he wants the club to sit down with fans and discuss the best way to improve the atmosphere. As much as winning football would bring the fans back eventually, why wouldn't we do the most we can to improve the atmosphere for existing fans?

[tomphil]

why is it?

Young fans will be closer to the players and give them a great chance of getting players signatures

Facilities, think about it.

Our family stand is pretty unique and there can't be many clubs whose family area has a whole tier to themselves. The JW would be the only other sensible option, probably the upper as the walkway connects to the BBE end so they could still use the same lounge.

[VinjayV4]

why is it?

Young fans will be closer to the players and give them a great chance of getting players signatures

Why even have a designated "family stand" its just the same as anywhere else and adults can buy single tickets up there.

Kids probably would be less impressed by the Riverside though so certainly wouldn't move it there.

Can't say I ever cared about asking someone to scribble their name on a bit of paper.

[Stuart]

why is it?

Young fans will be closer to the players and give them a great chance of getting players signatures

There is zero chance of players' signatures in the Riverside.