[Archived] Protest Ideas...

[Gav]

You don't have to be "pro Venkys" to believe that "Venkys out" is the wrong message.

I know plenty of articulate, experienced and intelligent fans who couldn't possibly get behind that message, as it completely ignores the solution.

Finding a good new owner or way of ownership is the way to uniting those fans, aka a solution to our demise. Venkys out could mean more "venkystyle owners" in or even worse, a similar scenario to Bolton where we sell our academy, training facilities and ground to lease it back! Those who say that would be worth it to get rid are cutting off their own nose to spite the face! The academy in particular is our advantage and gift from Jack.

I would count myself as a fan who finds it hard to rally behind this message, and I can safely say that calling me or them all deluded is the way to separation, division and just basic argument.

Time to put up or shut up jbizzle, the talking needs to stop, are you prepared? ready for action? or just going to write another 25 lines of bunkum and hope that somehow gets rid of the owners?

[Rover_Shaun]

If 'things' are to be 'done' then it cannot be discussed openly

[broadsword]

I agree, something more visible is needed next time. There is already a rubber chicken thread though...

It shouldn't be too hard to organise. A pot needs to be set up to fund it (99p each on eBay) and they could be given out at a set location e.g fox and hounds before the match. Unleash chicken hell from the bburn/Darwen end!

How about staging a half-time walk-out, and just before you leave, supergluing a rubber chicken to your seat?

[tomphil]

You don't have to be "pro Venkys" to believe that "Venkys out" is the wrong message.

I know plenty of articulate, experienced and intelligent fans who couldn't possibly get behind that message, as it completely ignores the solution.

Finding a good new owner or way of ownership is the way to uniting those fans, aka a solution to our demise. Venkys out could mean more "venkystyle owners" in or even worse, a similar scenario to Bolton where we sell our academy, training facilities and ground to lease it back! Those who say that would be worth it to get rid are cutting off their own nose to spite the face! The academy in particular is our advantage and gift from Jack.

I would count myself as a fan who finds it hard to rally behind this message, and I can safely say that calling me or them all deluded is the way to separation, division and just basic argument.

There are pro Venkys out there though and that's directed at them but then as one of these self styled articulate and experienced intelligent fans you already know that seeing as i'd already said those who don't like the protests then fair enough.

So in reality it's you as usual looking for an argument and twisting it to suit your agenda.

Understand your concerns fully about the prospect of the Bolton style stuff but if you'd open your eyes a bit wider for once you'd see we are heading that way albeit a bit slower than them. Training ground etc already been sounded out or did you miss that ?

What we are looking at is at best another few years being hamstrung near the foot of this division whilst they continue to faff around or ignore it. If we are going to do that or worse drop and continue to sell off/remortgage what they can to survive then why do it with them ?

[JBiz]

My view is that forcing the club into administration may be the only way to get Seneca (the only ones to put forward a legitimate plan for us with fan involvement) or anyone else on board.

Though even if the next owners (if we're lucky to not get wound up) are almost as bad as Venkys, it's better than as bad as.

They literally started something better by appointing Lambert with Irvine and Kelly. Just give that set-up £5m (instead of paying them off) and the recovery would start. Hell, they could've given it to Warnock!

It isn't 'just poor advice', it is consistently getting EVERY decision wrong, bar 2 (Bowyer's appt and Lambert's appt), and rewarding only those who to their line while punishing those who want better.

Don't need to discuss what they've done wrong mike, it's been done to death. Protest directions and ideas are the priority.

Just like I said, the focus of "let's oust the owners" will not fly for everyone. Switch it to a protest for more ambition, transparency and experts employed in their roles - we'd get more involved.

I think the idea that Venkys are irrelevant is wasted on many but that's the way I see it. I just want a club I can support - the thought of that going just to win a battle against ignorant millionaires? Can't support and many won't.

I thought we'd got past the arguments Tomphil but I see we'd rather ignore content for petty squabbles - I never twisted your words, I replied to your content.

[Gav]

Are you protesting Jbizzle?

[den]

Just like I said, the focus of "let's oust the owners" will not fly for everyone. Switch it to a protest for more ambition, transparency and experts employed in their roles - we'd get more involved.

Tell me that's a joke JB.

We fans have been arguing that for 6 years and they're well aware of that. How's that campaign going?

Give me strength.

[tomphil]

Don't need to discuss what they've done wrong mike, it's been done to death. Protest directions and ideas are the priority.

Just like I said, the focus of "let's oust the owners" will not fly for everyone. Switch it to a protest for more ambition, transparency and experts employed in their roles - we'd get more involved.

I think the idea that Venkys are irrelevant is wasted on many but that's the way I see it. I just want a club I can support - the thought of that going just to win a battle against ignorant millionaires? Can't support and many won't.

I thought we'd got past the arguments Tomphil but I see we'd rather ignore content for petty squabbles - I never twisted your words, I replied to your content.

What we are past is hoping or asking for them to do things the right way. It's alright saying protests should be aimed at that but haven't we been there before ? That's what gave us Shebby Singh, Derek Shaw and Paul Agnew before they got briefly lucky with Bowyer. Look at the damage most of that lot added to the mess.

Any asking for that will just result in more window dressing along the lines of powerless Pasha being paraded as MD or something before he disappears again.

Enough is enough that's whole point of it.

[JBiz]

Tell me that's a joke JB.

We fans have been arguing that for 6 years and they're well aware of that. How's that campaign going?

Give me strength.

As far as I'm aware, two key protests have been; Kean out and Venkys out.

Gav - no I'm not going on Saturday.

[JBiz]

What we are past is hoping or asking for them to do things the right way. It's alright saying protests should be aimed at that but haven't we been there before ? That's what gave us Shebby Singh, Derek Shaw and Paul Agnew before they got briefly lucky with Bowyer. Look at the damage most of that lot added to the mess.

Any asking for that will just result in more window dressing along the lines of powerless Pasha being paraded as MD or something before he disappears again.

Enough is enough that's whole point of it.

You're probably correct and I agree that "enough is enough" months/years ago but STILL.. What is there to come after?

It's human nature of some, they can't make a decision without knowing its outcome.

If I had the money and the power, I'd take the club off their hands. I'd also make a fool of them in the process for doing that to us but in reality I can't do that.

Protests won't get them out. It might draw media attention to a cause but is that what we need? Or just better decisions, more investment and more expertise?

[bob fleming]

We need them to put the club up for sale Jbizzle. It's as simple as that.

Good decision making, investment and expertise evidently isn't in their vocabulary.

[JBiz]

We need them to put the club up for sale Jbizzle. It's as simple as that.

Good decision making, investment and expertise evidently isn't in their vocabulary.

If and when that happens, how do we prevent this happening again? Another Rao, Fawaz, Ashley or Gaydamak?

[Stuart]

If and when that happens, how do we prevent this happening again? Another Rao, Fawaz, Ashley or Gaydamak?

One thing at a time.

Worry about whether you can sink or swim when you've managed to remove the concrete post chained to your leg.

[broadsword]

I can't imagine we could actually exchange Venky's for worse owners.

It's just not logical, Jim.

[Dreams of 1995]

Venkys have actively said they won't sell of their own accord. What would the point be in actively seeking new owners (despite being told that there is a new owner out there....the 2 Ian's, or do you not "trust them enough" Jbizzle?) when they won't sell.

The campaign is to MAKE them sell knowing full well Seneca are interested. If Venkys can float this club they certainly can. Get your head in gear man.

[JBiz]

One thing at a time.

Worry about whether you can sink or swim when you've managed to remove the concrete post chained to your leg.

I can't do that! I just cannot see the point until some element of fall back is in place. Nice analogy but it would be just as easy to flip it to rock and hard place, fire and frying pan etc.

Maybe some sort of change within the FA, proper ownership tests, parliament etc is a better fallback than the trust or a new owner? I've said previously any protesting I do will be towards the FA for their complete shirking of responsibility.

Original message or reply to Tomphil was my opinion on how to get people on side;

I'm sure there are plenty of others like me who would rather not see us lose everything for the sake of seeing the backs of the Rao family. I know some would see it that way, and there is no sound argument to suggest the trend can be bucked, but surely ALL fans would protest if they agreed with the key focus.

A simple improvised idea without pre thought to that theme- get someone at Seneca or another company to say publicly they want to buy the club and run it properly. Have plans in place for board members/fan membership etc. Organise public protest based on what they'd do for the club.

Venkys have actively said they won't sell of their own accord. What would the point be in actively seeking new owners (despite being told that there is a new owner out there....the 2 Ian's, or do you not "trust them enough" Jbizzle?) when they won't sell.

The campaign is to MAKE them sell knowing full well Seneca are interested. If Venkys can float this club they certainly can. Get your head in gear man.

Firstly - who are you quoting? Trust who enough?

Secondly - I can understand the tone but you've made the point I was talking about. Where is the connection to Seneca? It's months old.

Until someone from them is publicly backing this protest, I can't see how it's possible to "get my head in gear, man"..

I can't imagine we could actually exchange Venky's for worse owners.

It's just not logical, Jim.

The club is essentially a husk of a well run club and would cost 100m+?

Who in their sound mind would take that on?

[Claytons Left Boot]

You don't have to be "pro Venkys" to believe that "Venkys out" is the wrong message..... Venkys out could mean more "venkystyle owners" in or even worse, a similar scenario to Bolton where we sell our academy, training facilities and ground to lease it back! Those who say that would be worth it to get rid are cutting off their own nose to spite the face! The academy in particular is our advantage and gift from Jack.

Crikey Jb, when will people like you wake up and smell the coffee? At what point will you draw the line?

Six years on and you're coming out with this sort of stuff.

A few years from now, we could well be in the Conference and £200m+ in debt. Will you still be sprouting the same then?

At some point, people have to take a stand. That time is now.

[JBiz]

I'm prepared to make a stand if I can agree with the key concept.

Venkys out. Then what?

[den]

I'm prepared to make a stand if I can agree with the key concept.

Venkys out. Then what?

No mate, it isn't Venkys out then what? What a lot of fans want is for Venkys to appoint a company to find potential buyer(s). That would be a great first move and that's as far as it goes for the time being. Nothing else to be said at this point.

[Stuart]

I can't do that! I just cannot see the point until some element of fall back is in place. Nice analogy but it would be just as easy to flip it to rock and hard place, fire and frying pan etc.

Just to roll the analogy a step further. Unless you do remove that concrete post that is dragging you to the bottom then you will eventually sink to the point beyond where you can ever return to the surface.

The argument that we might end up with a heavier post is moot at that point.

We are about 4 years beyond it mattering about worrying about better owners. Yes, we all want and need owners who actually want to own a football club but right now we don't have that so how can it be worse?

Venkys will not negotiate, that's for sure. The next owners - even if they are bad ones - will eventually. The only similar owners to Venkys who spring to mind are at Blackpool and Coventry. They didn't / won't leave and look where they are. Hardly better the devil you know!

[Claytons Left Boot]

I'm prepared to make a stand if I can agree with the key concept.

It doesn't work like that. You make a stand now and worry about the 'then what' later.

Middlesbrough, Portsmouth, Bolton, Rangers et al were all thought to be going under and folding. Guess what? They didn't.

Even Venky's, as naive as they are, will know that they'll never get their £100m back. They'll have to write off £80-90m of that realistically and cut their losses. The longer they leave it, the more money it will cost them.

That's why it's imperative that fans make a stand now and all the various actions planned by WAR effectively chip away at them, constantly, constantly and constantly in an effort to get them to throw in the towel.

Then you plan for the 'then what.'

[Baz]

I'm prepared to make a stand if I can agree with the key concept.

Venkys out. Then what?

Venkys stay. Then what?

[Norbert Rassragr]

It has got to the point that we have to jump and get rid of them. Chemotherapy is needed, you may feel awful but it is the only way you can get rid of the cancer. Otherwise it will destroy you. Venky's are going to end this club unless they're removed ASAP.

[Rover_Shaun]

I'm prepared to make a stand if I can agree with the key concept.

Venkys out. Then what?

So you like to have a girlfriend lined up before you dump the current one? Or 'have' to have the name of the next bar spelled out to you before leaving the current one?

Sometimes you just make me put my head in my hands

[onlyonejackwalker]

I can think of no better protest with bigger impact than a totally empty stadium. Other than away fans. Try explaining that away to the national media.