[Archived] Royals At Ewood This Saturday 7Th May 12.30 Ko

[Leonard Venkhater]

The acoustics must be awful where you were sat. The Venkys Out chants - whilst hardly venomous - were regularly ringing out around the ground. Talk of 20 people is cobblers I'm afraid, and is akin to Kean saying it was only 1% of the fanbase who wanted him out.

Rest of your post talks a lot of sense.

Yes very audible, certainly in the Darwen and Blackburn End.

Yesterday I sat in the JW upper. Even there, people around me were certainly clapping along to the rhythm, although not singing.

[Stuart]

Yes very audible, certainly in the Darwen and Blackburn End.

Yesterday I sat in the JW upper. Even there, people around me were certainly clapping along to the rhythm, although not singing.

The tide has turned for the majority IMHO. The trouble is that Venkys won't listen to the fans or listen to realistic offers for the club. As a result it'll be fans leaving as the only place they can go next. Everybody has their breaking point.

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

Yes very audible, certainly in the Darwen and Blackburn End.

Yesterday I sat in the JW upper. Even there, people around me were certainly clapping along to the rhythm, although not singing.

Vive la resistance!

[punerover]

It is amazing how we always seem to win games when there is no pressure and nothing to play for. I remember Bowyer's season when we had a good run when we missed out on the automatic playoffs when there was no pressure. Either the team cannot take pressure or the manager, i am not sure.

[Leonard Venkhater]

Vive la resistance!

Haha...Back to that again! Tarring and feathering of collaborators has been discussed on this message board in the past!

Freedom soon will come.

Then we'll come from the shadows......

[Pedro]

This post made my eyes fill up.

Still got the Tugay mask, the mask that the Grandchildren always ask ' who is he?

I've got a signed Tugay picture in the downstairs toilet ☺

[onlyonejackwalker]

I've got a signed Tugay picture in the downstairs toilet ☺

That's a tad weird.

I've got Darren Peacock.

[Norbert Rassragr]

Should have a massive one of Phil Jones' cum face. That would be a natural laxative.

[tkturner]

How is it a difference of opinion? It's a fact. I'm afraid you are mistaken on this one.

The chants "We Want Venkys Out" were from all around the ground on many occasions - certainly not limited to 20 blokes in the BBE. The DE was particularly loud in fact. If you couldn't hear it, it doesn't change the fact that it happened.

Out of interest, what were you expecting?

It absolutely is a difference of opinion, I didn't think many joined in, you and a few others heard more.

I still stand by comments, had a great view of things from the back end of the BBE and aside from the few around me not many others showed frustration, we have given up...

If we are talking about facts, the majority of our fans sat there in silence on the final day of the season as Lambert walks, loan singings finish, other players likely to leave under the uncertainty, fanzone bar with the shutters up, no season ticket prices released and attendances plummeting.

In terms of what I was expecting, it was a bit more than people clapping along...

Suppose this "you're mistaken, I'm right" stuff does nothing either so will just leave this alone now...

[A cup of beans]

It absolutely is a difference of opinion, I didn't think many joined in, you and a few others heard more.

I still stand by comments, had a great view of things from the back end of the BBE and aside from the few around me not many others showed frustration, we have given up...

If we are talking about facts, the majority of our fans sat there in silence on the final day of the season as Lambert walks, loan singings finish, other players likely to leave under the uncertainty, fanzone bar with the shutters up, no season ticket prices released and attendances plummeting.

In terms of what I was expecting, it was a bit more than people clapping along...

Suppose this "you're mistaken, I'm right" stuff does nothing either so will just leave this alone now...

I think the true vitriol volume is somewhere between the two viewpoints.

It was loud in patches, but not long or sustained.

We tried. But I was a bit disappointed.

Rotherham was supposed to be rocking in fury, but that comes from everyone being in the same area of the ground.

I wanted a mass pitch invasion, or something to interupt the game.

Those types of themes are far more news worthy.

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

Haha...Back to that again! Tarring and feathering of collaborators has been discussed on this message board in the past!

Freedom soon will come.

Then we'll come from the shadows......

The clapping to the rhythm line made me chuckle.

Reminded me of row of Father Dougals shouting 'down with this sort of thing!'

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

You still haven't answered my question. How many times have you been right about Venkys?

I thought I replied at the time - but just a few of examples.

1, How many transfer windows did people say that Rhodes would be sold before he was eventually sold ?

2. How many times have they put us in administration - would be thousands if you believed all the rumours ?

3. When did they sell all our players on relegation - according to many they were going to immediately cash in and pocket all the parachute payments

4. Against all the odds, and for reasons I can't fathom - despite all the rumours they continue to fund the club

5. Prior to appointing Lambert - many said they would never appoint an experienced decent manager.

I am not attempting to defend them - just to point out that they various doomsayers on here have often been wrong. You will rightly point out that we are on a downward trend under Venky's - but I just point out that not everything is black and white.

Given previous experience they are just as likely to hire an experienced manager and give him a reasonable transfer kitty - as they are to appoint a relative novice with no budget - but of course pointing that out makes me a Rovers Fan or a Venky lover.

[booth]

You should be a politician, I doth my cap. But...

You defended Kean, you defended Venky's, you said we wouldn't get relegated, you said we'd bounce back, you said the sky wasn't falling on numerous occasions.

For everytime someone has exaggerated our plight, you've countered that by acting as if all was or will be rosy in the garden.

It's been over five years, we have no executive structure at the club, no figurehead and no manager. We've managed to accumulate over £79m of debt since they took over. We've had five managers and all have been failures. We've sold pretty much all our assets that could give us a profit, and probably over the summer we'll sell the rest. The home crowds are dwindling with a lot of hard core fans staying away leaving a mostly benign crowd.

Has the sky fallen yet? If not when does that happen. League 1, League 2, admin. When will you admit you were wrong?

The doomsayers as you call them have been a lot more right than you have, and if I were you I'd get my tin hat on because Venkys are doing everything they can to prove all your points wrong.

And it wasn't all blind faith. On occasion you were almost mocking those who foresaw what was happening to the club. You even at one time said that you felt you had to hold a contrary point of view to make the message board better off.

You may not realize it but your posts come across as if you really couldn't give a toss about the club. I'm sure you do as you support the club with your time and money, I suppose I just don't get how you can be so blase. Did yesterday not hurt you in any way? We won 3-1 but it felt so empty, most of those players won't be here, the stadium felt lifeless for most part. That's that then.

As for the manager they may appoint, they've appointed 4 novices and 1 experienced manager. Statistically we're more likely to appoint a novice.

[tomphil]

You should be a politician, I doth my cap. But...

You defended Kean, you defended Venky's, you said we wouldn't get relegated, you said we'd bounce back, you said the sky wasn't falling on numerous occasions.

For everytime someone has exaggerated our plight, you've countered that by acting as if all was or will be rosy in the garden.

It's been over five years, we have no executive structure at the club, no figurehead and no manager. We've managed to accumulate over £79m of debt since they took over. We've had five managers and all have been failures. We've sold pretty much all our assets that could give us a profit, and probably over the summer we'll sell the rest. The home crowds are dwindling with a lot of hard core fans staying away leaving a mostly benign crowd.

Has the sky fallen yet? If not when does that happen. League 1, League 2, admin. When will you admit you were wrong?

The doomsayers as you call them have been a lot more right than you have, and if I were you I'd get my tin hat on because Venkys are doing everything they can to prove all your points wrong.

And it wasn't all blind faith. On occasion you were almost mocking those who foresaw what was happening to the club. You even at one time said that you felt you had to hold a contrary point of view to make the message board better off.

You may not realize it but your posts come across as if you really couldn't give a toss about the club. I'm sure you do as you support the club with your time and money, I suppose I just don't get how you can be so blase. Did yesterday not hurt you in any way? We won 3-1 but it felt so empty, most of those players won't be here, the stadium felt lifeless for most part. That's that then.

As for the manager they may appoint, they've appointed 4 novices and 1 experienced manager. Statistically we're more likely to appoint a novice.

I bet he'd have gone over to pick the cat up as well. It's ok you know Venkys can make as many mistakes as they want on the way to finally finishing off the club because they are paying for it

[punerover]

Some end of season statistics for both the managers. Trying to provide my perspective on it.

Bowyer = 17 points in 16 games = 1.0625 points per game
Lambert = 38 points in 30 games = 1.266 points per game

[if we extrapolate the points per game under both the managers to the end of season wiz- 46 matches, we would get]

Bowyer = 48.875 points - Which means we would be blow Rotherham, missing relegation

Lambert = 58.236 points - which means we would be above wolves, just 1 position higher at 14th in the Table.

This extrapolation is valid on the ASSUMPTION that both the managers would have gone on as they have barring any dramatic circumstances like lots of player injuries, suspensions, etc. Everyone is free to derive their own inferences from the same.

[Athlete]

venkys out was loud and clear to me. Remember a lot of people don't sing but they did clap along, the message was there sadly it will be ignored.

TBH even people in the very sparse JW upper joined in right hand side

I thought I replied at the time - but just a few of examples.

1, How many transfer windows did people say that Rhodes would be sold before he was eventually sold ?

2. How many times have they put us in administration - would be thousands if you believed all the rumours ?

3. When did they sell all our players on relegation - according to many they were going to immediately cash in and pocket all the parachute payments

4. Against all the odds, and for reasons I can't fathom - despite all the rumours they continue to fund the club

5. Prior to appointing Lambert - many said they would never appoint an experienced decent manager.

I am not attempting to defend them - just to point out that they various doomsayers on here have often been wrong. You will rightly point out that we are on a downward trend under Venky's - but I just point out that not everything is black and white.

Given previous experience they are just as likely to hire an experienced manager and give him a reasonable transfer kitty - as they are to appoint a relative novice with no budget - but of course pointing that out makes me a Rovers Fan or a Venky lover.

They aren't funding the club with their own cash and never have done

The sooner these charlatans go the sooner we pick up the pieces

[J*B]

Has anyone seen the Sheff Utd lap of honour from yesterday? Boo'd all the way round the pitch for under achieving. Brilliant.

[DE.]

1, How many transfer windows did people say that Rhodes would be sold before he was eventually sold ?

2. How many times have they put us in administration - would be thousands if you believed all the rumours ?

3. When did they sell all our players on relegation - according to many they were going to immediately cash in and pocket all the parachute payments

4. Against all the odds, and for reasons I can't fathom - despite all the rumours they continue to fund the club

5. Prior to appointing Lambert - many said they would never appoint an experienced decent manager.

The problem is, all of these points are still loaded with negative circumstances.

1. Rhodes was eventually sold, for less than we had been offered previously. It also doesn't look like the money will be re-invested so even worse.

2. We may not be in administration but we're heavily loaded with debt and by all accounts barely have a pot to wee in.

3. No, we sold most of our best players BEFORE relegation! Then overpaid a bunch of mercenaries to further destroy the club financially.

4. BOI fund the club. Venky's continue to load us with debt.

5. They appointed Lambert, then sacked/forced him to resign after six months because as it turned out they don't like managers who aren't yes men. Who'd have thought it?

There are no positives to our situation. None. We are @#/? as long as they are in charge.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

You should be a politician, I doth my cap. But...

You defended Kean, you defended Venky's, you said we wouldn't get relegated, you said we'd bounce back, you said the sky wasn't falling on numerous occasions.

For everytime someone has exaggerated our plight, you've countered that by acting as if all was or will be rosy in the garden.

It's been over five years, we have no executive structure at the club, no figurehead and no manager. We've managed to accumulate over £79m of debt since they took over. We've had five managers and all have been failures. We've sold pretty much all our assets that could give us a profit, and probably over the summer we'll sell the rest. The home crowds are dwindling with a lot of hard core fans staying away leaving a mostly benign crowd.

Has the sky fallen yet? If not when does that happen. League 1, League 2, admin. When will you admit you were wrong?

The doomsayers as you call them have been a lot more right than you have, and if I were you I'd get my tin hat on because Venkys are doing everything they can to prove all your points wrong.

And it wasn't all blind faith. On occasion you were almost mocking those who foresaw what was happening to the club. You even at one time said that you felt you had to hold a contrary point of view to make the message board better off.

You may not realize it but your posts come across as if you really couldn't give a toss about the club. I'm sure you do as you support the club with your time and money, I suppose I just don't get how you can be so blase. Did yesterday not hurt you in any way? We won 3-1 but it felt so empty, most of those players won't be here, the stadium felt lifeless for most part. That's that then.

As for the manager they may appoint, they've appointed 4 novices and 1 experienced manager. Statistically we're more likely to appoint a novice.

Funny you say I should be a politician - as you have a style that for some reason reminds me of Jeremy Hunt.

I never said we wouldn't be relegated - I never said we would bounce straight back. I put forward different perspectives for both Kean and Venky's - but also called out when I thought they were wrong. I have absolutely no recollection of ever having said that holding a contrary view made the MB better off - though you may be paraphrasing something I said to meet your perspective.

If you had accused me of sitting on the fence - I would have possibly agreed with you. I think my previous post was a good example of my style - as requested I pointed out where some assumptions about the Venky's had been wrong - but then finished off by saying we were on a downward spiral under their ownership. Your response is a rant about how I don't care about the club - wow how dare I say that they haven't put us in admin yet, or that they didn't sell Rhodes as quickly as some claimed.

I think what is laughable is that you make out that I am some sort of a supporter of the Venky's - they are the worst thing to happen to our club in it's history - still doesn't mean that everything bad written about them is correct though. But of course if you dare to question such things you are automatically seen as supporting them.

"When will admit I am wrong" - about what specifically ? That they are taking us on a downward spiral - I think I actually said that in my post - your response just proves my point that anyone daring to question all the rumours around Venkys are automatically seen as supporting them rather than debating those specific points.

[47er]

You may have said they are taking us on a downward spiral but you don't seem unduly concerned about it, other than to slag off fans who are.

Complacent I'd say.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

TBH even people in the very sparse JW upper joined in right hand side

They aren't funding the club with their own cash and never have done

The sooner these charlatans go the sooner we pick up the pieces

I will bow to the far greater experience of the accountants on this MB - but as the debts are under written by Venky's - in the event we ended up in Administration would they be liable ? If we went into administration I presume they would lose the money they purchased the club with - and the money they used to pay of some of the debts at the time (as part of the purchase agreement).

Did our CEO not say that we owed £80m to the Venky's as an interest free loan ?

As I said - I don't know finance, so stand to be corrected - but if they are in anyway liable for our debts they may as well be funding with their own cash - and Chelston's comments infer it is their cash.

You may have said they are taking us on a downward spiral but you don't seem unduly concerned about it, other than to slag off fans who are.

Complacent I'd say.

MB's are all about perspective - but I seem to be the one being slagged off, rather that the other way around.

Don't seem unduly concerned - is this because I don't rant, rave and call Venky's names ?

[gumboots]

Don't seem unduly concerned - is this because I don't rant, rave and call Venky's names ?

I don't shout or swear or call venkys or anyone else names either but nobody accuses me of being a Venky's lover or of being in any way their apologist. They know I'm very definitely concerned because I don't go looking for the positive side of their actions all the time. I realise that there really is no positive to their ownership and I want them gone, whatever the cost.

[punerover]

The problem is, all of these points are still loaded with negative circumstances.

1. Rhodes was eventually sold, for less than we had been offered previously. It also doesn't look like the money will be re-invested so even worse.

2. We may not be in administration but we're heavily loaded with debt and by all accounts barely have a pot to wee in.

3. No, we sold most of our best players BEFORE relegation! Then overpaid a bunch of mercenaries to further destroy the club financially.

4. BOI fund the club. Venky's continue to load us with debt.

5. They appointed Lambert, then sacked/forced him to resign after six months because as it turned out they don't like managers who aren't yes men. Who'd have thought it?

There are no positives to our situation. None. We are @#/? as long as they are in charge.

Technically BOI is funding the club against mortgage of Venky's personal assets. So even if the Venky's default on the loan, the bank will simply recover the money by selling those assets. Personal being the keyword and that is why Venky's shareholders are not too concerned yet in my opinion. BRFC is nothing more than the RAO's pet project unfortunately. What would be interesting to know is what exactly are the "Personal assets" or security that is being provided for the bank loan and the valuation of the same. If we come to know that the value of those assets is nowhere close to the amount of the bank pouring in, now that would be some interesting news for the Shareholders.

[AllRoverAsia]

Technically BOI is funding the club against mortgage of Venky's personal assets. So even if the Venky's default on the loan, the bank will simply recover the money by selling those assets. Personal being the keyword and that is why Venky's shareholders are not too concerned yet in my opinion. BRFC is nothing more than the RAO's pet project unfortunately. What would be interesting to know is what exactly are the "Personal assets" or security that is being provided for the bank loan and the valuation of the same. If we come to know that the value of those assets is nowhere close to the amount of the bank pouring in, now that would be some interesting news for the Shareholders.

You're grasp on the situation has quantum leaped...........hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[punerover]

You're grasp on the situation had quantum leaped...........hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

As tomphil would say, i know a bit too much for a village guy