[Archived] Transfers Part 2

[Tom]

Fair play to Lowe finding his way to a premier league team 

[davulsukur]

2 minutes ago, Tom said:

Fair play to Lowe finding his way to a premier league team 

They've not seen him play yet..

[Dunnfc]

Jason Lowe for England

livermore to Lowe. 

[K-Hod]

https://www.expressandstar.com/sport/football/west-bromwich-albion/2017/07/12/west-brom-hand-trial-to-free-agent-jason-lowe/:

Jason Lowe looks an awful lot like Elliott Ward.....

[Parsonblue]

12 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

How do you know he's been disruptive? 

Additionally in our situation you can't afford to be that fussy, you've got to find a way to deal with it if it even exists

There is a reason he wasn't at Barrow or in Austria.  Sometimes you just need to get rid of those who don't fit in with what you are trying to achieve.

[Dunnfc]

Just now, Parsonblue said:

There is a reason he wasn't at Barrow or in Austria.  Sometimes you just need to get rid of those who don't fit in with what you are trying to achieve.

Not if its at a further expense when you can ill afford it you don't. It's poor man management, tbh.

[islander200]

Just now, Dunnfc said:

Not if its at a further expense when you can ill afford it you don't. It's poor man management, tbh.

Dunnfc apart from hibs which other club has stokes not been thrown out of. The guy is a disruptive influence and has done nothing at the club.Mowbray might deserve some criticism if he had brought him to the club.

I do agree with some of the points you have made regarding Mowbray though,I agree thathat he isn't beyond criticism.I don't blame him for our relegation but his recent cv is not all that and I don't think he should have been handed a two year deal after we got relegated. A years contract would have been enough.

It also troubles me that the manager once again seems to be running the whole football club and getting involved with downgrading the academy if that rumour is true.At the end of the day we could start the season terribly and he could be sacked after 10 games and then another manager comes in and he has his own ideas about the academy and the running of the football club.

In saying all that I really like Mowbray,proper footballing man and I hope he is a success at Rovers

[chaddyrovers]

55 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

I find it concerning Mowbray appears not to be able to handle him or make use of him

Dont think most managers throughout his career can handle him and his behaviour

34 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

When you go into a business do you look at the colleagues you have working below you and pack them off? No you make them fit in and learn to get what you need/require out of them.

He may well be a complete @#/? but that's the difference between a Warnock and TM, Warnock gets everything out a player.

in some campanies maybe but I have worked for some companies were they force you out by any means possible

30 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

No manager worth their salt would want a disruptive influence in the dressing room.

Coyle and Mowbray have both found him a disruptive influence and one they dont want

19 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

How do you know he's been disruptive? 

Additionally in our situation you can't afford to be that fussy, you've got to find a way to deal with it if it even exists

he was a disruptive influence last season and rumours are during pre season he and Mowbray had a disagreement about him doing some extra training. Think I seen Savio posted some thing on Facebook about it.

he not in Austria with the first team and wonder why that is?

[Dunnfc]

Just now, islander200 said:

Dunnfc apart from hibs which other club has stokes not been thrown out of. The guy is a disruptive influence and has done nothing at the club.Mowbray might deserve some criticism if he had brought him to the club.

I do agree with some of the points you have made regarding Mowbray though,I agree thathat he isn't beyond criticism.I don't blame him for our relegation but his recent cv is not all that and I don't think he should have been handed a two year deal after we got relegated. A years contract would have been enough.

It also troubles me that the manager once again seems to be running the whole football club and getting involved with downgrading the academy if that rumour is true.At the end of the day we could start the season terribly and he could be sacked after 10 games and then another manager comes in and he has his own ideas about the academy and the running of the football club.

In saying all that I really like Mowbray,proper footballing man and I hope he is a success at Rovers

The fact Mowbray seems to be running the club is a serious cause of concern. An average manager at best running every division and making every decision within the club is Madness. Each department I.e ladies, academy, first team etc need there own manager and lead to report into a central board (Cheston) for the key decisions to then be made at that level. Why would a business with a turnover of 10 million plus trust a bloody football manager with anything more than coaching a team!

Got to disagree and agree on Stokes, I appreciate he didn't sign him and alleged past issues but for me he could have had a clean slate this summer, it's obvious either neither party wants that or TM can't man manage the lad. 

[JHRover]

Who authorised a 3 year deal for Stokes?

Coyle?

Cheston?

Shadow Director?

Venkys?

How on earth did that one ever get off the ground? Any other club with a manager wanting to offer him that money for 3 years would have been laughed out of the boardroom, and probably fired soon after.

How many of the above are qualified to be running a club of this stature and sanctioning multi-million pound contracts to football players?

If it was Cheston or Pasha they should be sacked, as they should have been for the appointment of Coyle. If it was Venkys then we're no further on than 2012 when they were dishing out deals for Etuhu and Best.

 

[Dunnfc]

2 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Who authorised a 3 year deal for Stokes?

Coyle?

Cheston?

Shadow Director?

Venkys?

How on earth did that one ever get off the ground? Any other club with a manager wanting to offer him that money for 3 years would have been laughed out of the boardroom, and probably fired soon after.

How many of the above are qualified to be running a club of this stature and sanctioning multi-million pound contracts to football players?

If it was Cheston or Pasha they should be sacked, as they should have been for the appointment of Coyle. If it was Venkys then we're no further on than 2012 when they were dishing out deals for Etuhu and Best.

Two people usually sign the docs for a player, used to be Cheston and Silvestre to co-sign. 

[tomphil]

Stokes was a well known twohat at Celtic and they wanted rid, enter agents, enter Coyle, enter 3 year deal at Blackburn where he very quickly can't be arsed and oddly gets sidelined by the gaffer who went to great lengths to bring him here despite scoring a few. Which makes him even less arsed then immediately Hibs are wanting him again.

Suspicious ?   You bet.

[chaddyrovers]

11 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

The fact Mowbray seems to be running the club is a serious cause of concern. An average manager at best running every division and making every decision within the club is Madness. Each department I.e ladies, academy, first team etc need there own manager and lead to report into a central board (Cheston) for the key decisions to then be made at that level. Why would a business with a turnover of 10 million plus trust a bloody football manager with anything more than coaching a team!

Got to disagree and agree on Stokes, I appreciate he didn't sign him and alleged past issues but for me he could have had a clean slate this summer, it's obvious either neither party wants that or TM can't man manage the lad. 

isnt Mowbray running the 1st team and recruiment side of the club? shouldnt he have a say into how the academy is run?

Stokes is reported to be disruptive already in pre season aswell

[JHRover]

7 minutes ago, tomphil said:

Stokes was a well known twohat at Celtic and they wanted rid, enter agents, enter Coyle, enter 3 year deal at Blackburn where he very quickly can't be arsed and oddly gets sidelined by the gaffer who went to great lengths to bring him here despite scoring a few. Which makes him even less arsed then immediately Hibs are wanting him again.

Suspicious ?   You bet.

But there should be barriers up preventing such outrageous signings taking place. And herein lies the problem. We've got owners who at best hand down a budget in June and then go silent for 12 months leaving the manager/shadow director to get on with it. Cheston and the shadow director are incompetent as proven by the shambles they have presided over with Lambert-Coyle-Senior.

In that vacuum emerges the potential for clowns like Stokes to secure himself a 3 year deal before the club either has to pay him off or loan him out whilst covering all/most his wages.

Its disgusting, especially for a club supposedly struggling for money, yet on and on it keeps repeating itself. Everyone knew before Stokes signed he had major issues, yet whoever had the power at Rovers either didn't or wouldn't stop the 3 year deal being heaped onto the club's accounts.

Unfortunately for us whilst the manager has changed and this one talks a lot more sense than the last, the same individuals are running the club next to him.

[JHRover]

5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

isnt Mowbray running the 1st team and recruiment side of the club? shouldnt he have a say into how the academy is run?

Stokes is reported to be disruptive already in pre season aswell

We've had 8 managers in less than 7 years, so no, the current manager at this stage should not be dictating the future direction of the academy, because if recent history is anything to go by he won't be here very long before the next one comes in. By all means offer his advice/opinion on the academy and direct how the players are coached/what tactics are used and co-operate in terms of players moving between them, but other than that it should be a different department run independently of the first team. The academy should be under the control of the board of directors, like at every other club. But then we don't have one of those, do we?

[Dunnfc]

5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

isnt Mowbray running the 1st team and recruiment side of the club? shouldnt he have a say into how the academy is run?

Stokes is reported to be disruptive already in pre season aswell

First team and recruitment for FT yes. Everything else no. He's simply not qualified to do so.

[bluebruce]

47 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Not if its at a further expense when you can ill afford it you don't. It's poor man management, tbh.

It's not further expense. The remainder of Stokes' contract is something we are already committed to. All this would mean is less expense, as Hibs take some of the burden. Probably nowhere near enough of it for my liking, and I'd rather tell them and Stokes to swivel on principle if the contribution is less than half, but to call it further expense is disingenuous.

[AllRoverAsia]

28 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Dont think most managers throughout his career can handle him and his behaviour

in some campanies maybe but I have worked for some companies were they force you out by any means possible

Coyle and Mowbray have both found him a disruptive influence and one they dont want

he was a disruptive influence last season and rumours are during pre season he and Mowbray had a disagreement about him doing some extra training. Think I seen Savio posted some thing on Facebook about it.

he not in Austria with the first team and wonder why that is?

Coyle knew what he was getting. He was part of the arrangement to get Stokes a job on big money, knowing that large financial claims were likely to arise against Stokes.

Whether Stokes played or not was irrelevant.

Imo.

[Dunnfc]

Just now, bluebruce said:

It's not further expense. The remainder of Stokes' contract is something we are already committed to. All this would mean is less expense, as Hibs take some of the burden. Probably nowhere near enough of it for my liking, and I'd rather tell them and Stokes to swivel if the contribution is pitiful, but to call it further expense is disingenuous.

True but by expense I mean simply writing him off we pay for that luxury without getting any benefit in return, or a loan fee or even appearances. Hibs were offering 3k towards his 14k. Unless they get to near 10k then I'd be telling Mowbray to start making use of him, simply can't afford to stand that sum of monies.

[tomphil]

14 minutes ago, JHRover said:

But there should be barriers up preventing such outrageous signings taking place. And herein lies the problem. We've got owners who at best hand down a budget in June and then go silent for 12 months leaving the manager/shadow director to get on with it. Cheston and the shadow director are incompetent as proven by the shambles they have presided over with Lambert-Coyle-Senior.

In that vacuum emerges the potential for clowns like Stokes to secure himself a 3 year deal before the club either has to pay him off or loan him out whilst covering all/most his wages.

Its disgusting, especially for a club supposedly struggling for money, yet on and on it keeps repeating itself. Everyone knew before Stokes signed he had major issues, yet whoever had the power at Rovers either didn't or wouldn't stop the 3 year deal being heaped onto the club's accounts.

Unfortunately for us whilst the manager has changed and this one talks a lot more sense than the last, the same individuals are running the club next to him.

Yep that's mainly how I see it the budget is set then some of those over here then go about ways to work it best to their advantage rather than the clubs. Repeat process and whenever they get through to one of the Indians for a final say they just get a yes or no or we'll get back to you but what they are saying yes/no/maybe to rarely gets checked out so the answer depends on the moment and mood.

Club will still never prosper whilst no one correctly runs it over here.

I thought Stokes would be a decent signing based on his ability and still think he could be a big player now in league 1 but I raised eyes straight away at the contract and it soon became clear it was a stitch up of some kind.

[chaddyrovers]

4 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

First team and recruitment for FT yes. Everything else no. He's simply not qualified to do so.

Surely he should have an input in the academy and creating a pathway for those players? Not running it but an opinion or part of committee

5 minutes ago, JHRover said:

We've had 8 managers in less than 7 years, so no, the current manager at this stage should not be dictating the future direction of the academy, because if recent history is anything to go by he won't be here very long before the next one comes in. By all means offer his advice/opinion on the academy and direct how the players are coached/what tactics are used and co-operate in terms of players moving between them, but other than that it should be a different department run independently of the first team. The academy should be under the control of the board of directors, like at every other club. But then we don't have one of those, do we?

Thats what I said about having a opinion.

Thats why I always like director of football in place so he can make these decisions on things like this.

should Mowbray be part of decision maker process who is the next academy director is?

[Dunnfc]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Surely he should have an input in the academy and creating a pathway for those players? Not running it but an opinion or part of committee

Thats what I said about having a opinion.

Thats why I always like director of football in place so he can make these decisions on things like this.

should Mowbray be part of decision maker process who is the next academy director is?

No and no he needs to look at the FT and prove himself there. Who's to say he will be even here after xmas? Managerial appointments usual last at our level 14 months average tenure. He can coach first teams but he's not a director of football or youth director and never has been so I don't think TM is qualified in anyway especially after 5months only at this club to meddle elsewhere.

Each department ladies team (cut next) academy, FT, commercial department should all have a senior head to report into a board whether that's Suhail Shaikh or Mike Cheston and decisions made there by those two

[Tom]

Tre Pemberton who was released by us has signed for Stoke - he could play us in the Checkatrade!

[SkipDonoghue]

Stokes is as good as gone...he wants Hibs but his wages at Rovers are preventing him joining them...he is apparently earning £8k per week at Rovers 

Hibs can only offer him £4k per week he wants Rovers to pay him up to cover the short fall 

so it will happen but first the pay off will need to be agreed 

[davulsukur]

Venky's/Useless managers never learn.

Still needing to pay off complete waste of spaces like Stokes.