[Archived] Has Your Opinion Changed On Coyle?

[Blue blood]

Blue blood - no worries, I enjoy discussion here when it's like this- it's actually obvious that we have a similar view.

I think the key difference in that would be the mistakes thing, Venkys have never made a decision, it's the purchasing of advice that's been mainly ridiculous, the odd bit of advice they've taken has made sense; lambert was the correct decision, forcing Kean out was the correct decision (and the way it happened just proves what had gone on before with his "contract extension"), giving the job long term to GB was the correct decision, following up the other correct decision of giving him the chance after 5 managers in 8 months (or whatever it was)...

I also think that they've made some good decisions with the academy and other aspects involved in the community element...

Ofcourse, these are completely outweighed by the sheer negligence and criminal mistakes made!

As topman said, the evidence is there- no need to fill in blanks.

The fact they still rely on advice is probably the hardest pill to swallow but we are talking about a family who have zero idea of how to run things. Hence why they probably bought into "Jerome's big con"..

That's one of the things I really don't get with this theory - they know SEM and the like screwed them yet use their client as manager/take advice from them. No one is that stupid to know they've been hoodwinked and continue to trust that person.

It'd make sense if they didn't know the agents etc. were giving crap advice, but they do know, and they have seen the results. No matter how stupid someone is there is no way that they continue to trust someone in those circumstances.

Perhaps a better analogy for my POV is like a business man who gets a financial advisor who turns out to be dodgy and unethically makes a load of money from the client's business in a dodgy manner. When the owner finds out he realises he can't risk all being revealed and thinks the only way for him to make any money out of the venture himself is by continuing the unethical/dodgy business practices that the financial advisor instigated.

[chor808]

I can think of at least two people on here alone you'd probably be unpleasantly surprised at how many of the remaining fans appreciate such statements.

ABBEY and Iceman?

[JBiz]

I like that analogy but it only fits if they are taking the same advice. Coyle was SEM, I imagine many agents who'd never dealt with our club had ties to them - football is a pond full of sharks, and it'd wouldn't be difficult for a different face or agent to talk them into making more errors!

For example - wasn't pihi zahavi involved after relegation? Was he complicit in the scam?

Does Pasha still have contacts with past employees? Is he allowed to be involved now because of racial trust issues?

I've no doubt in my mind that someone's made a dodgy wage out of this, but it still doesn't tally up if we include the owners in the scenario IMO.

[Athlete]

Trimmed some down to try and reply to the important parts;

1. Acts designed to bury the club? By whom? If you are suggesting that, can you explain why someone would set fire to 100m+ of their own money, damage their global brand and become a figure of hate within one community, and a joke in another? These acts are easily explained by being hoodwinked by agents intent on pocketing!

2. The part about power plays I agree on - initial championship season cost us a fortune because if constant changing of the breeze, shebby, shaw, the managers, confused etc

3. Hired to look legit a past tactic? I don't quite understand that. If anything, it took 4 years to make an appointment of some legitimacy so that makes no sense.

4. Asset stripping. The definition should be pinned on this website because it's frustrating to read this term used. Asset stripping is what happens if another dodgy owner buys us for cheap and sells parts aka players, the training facility etc to pay for the transaction.

Venkys haven't asset stripped BRFC. Look at the numbers. They've bankrolled us into oblivion. Yes, we've had "assets" stripped from us, ie selling players but that's not the same thing.

5. The value of the club goes up with its position and down in a similar way. You can't just say "they are purposely taking us down" without looking at the ridiculous decisions, the investment, cost etc. They (the owners) have screwed us over by making the wrong decisions - it makes little sense in any format to say this was a purposeful act, they had no way of benefitting from.

6. Ofcourse there was ill intent- those giving advice had no conscience for stealing millions from our club. It makes no sense to suggest the owners would buy us to spite us, to ruin themselves financially and waste 100m+, damage their global brand and essentially (as said before) damage their reputation beyond fixing.

As jimmy I think said - it's easy to make us look silly by avoiding the actual story for a made up one about Indians teaching lowly peasants a lesson!

Why is it so hard to go with what stands out;

The heavily simplified; rich man gets conned, con artists tie up money for a long time, rich man gets more poor advice, rich man now poorer and a joke gives up and fades away.

The reason why they aren't investing is simple, when would it stop? 200m, 300m?

The sad part is - Coyle just shows that they still listen to poor advice. They picked him because he was cheap and probably had the right agent to get in.

They'll continue to make these mistakes though, but to buy into some conspiracy seems ridiculous in my eyes!

That write up is ridiculous fella and sounds like a venkys apologist just take a hard look at all the sales since these twohats and their charlatan co team rocked up

[ABBEY]

I like that analogy but it only fits if they are taking the same advice. Coyle was SEM, I imagine many agents who'd never dealt with our club had ties to them - football is a pond full of sharks, and it'd wouldn't be difficult for a different face or agent to talk them into making more errors!

For example - wasn't pihi zahavi involved after relegation? Was he complicit in the scam?

Does Pasha still have contacts with past employees? Is he allowed to be involved now because of racial trust issues?

I've no doubt in my mind that someone's made a dodgy wage out of this, but it still doesn't tally up if we include the owners in the scenario IMO.

?

[JBiz]

That write up is ridiculous fella and sounds like a venkys apologist just take a hard look at all the sales since these twohats and their charlatan co team rocked up

If I sound like a Venky apologist, am I allowed to say what this post sounds like without having a post removed?

?

That part meant will they only deal with Indians ie pasha since lots of other advice has cost them dearly?

[tomphil]

His latest Rovers.co.uk interview is just cringeworthy.

"It is great when we have those Blackburn Rovers fans singing and supporting the players, getting behind them and really driving them on"

Sounds desperate.

He genuinely talks like he is in front of several thousand school kids. No wonder Venkys assume fans are peasants.

[Hasta]

I've no doubt in my mind that someone's made a dodgy wage out of this, but it still doesn't tally up if we include the owners in the scenario IMO.

My point earlier was that the owners either couldnt or wouldnt sack the likes of Kean or Shaw despite knowing they were costing the club big time. They actually pointed this out in a solicitors letter.

The only reasons I can see is either they wanted us to be relegated or they did not fully own the club and could not remove key personnel.

You are correct in that I don't see how they could prefer relegation to the financial riches of the Premier League. However their actions (or lack of) make me think that they actually weren't fully responsible for decisions at the club which is against league rules. What happened seems more in keeping with this "conspiracy theory" than the official line we got of "we are confused".

[Stuart]

He genuinely talks like he is in front of several thousand school kids. No wonder Venkys assume fans are peasants.

He WAS last Friday...

[Waggy76]

Like everything it just doesn't make sense.

If they wanted promotion then they shouldn't have started the season with Bowyer. By the time they sacked him and brought Lambert in it was too late. No manager in the world would have got this squad to the play-offs from the position we were in without massive money to spend. If they wanted promotion they should have exited the embargo in the summer and appointed Lambert then, giving him a full season at it.

If they got rid of Bowyer because they were 'scared' of relegation taking place then what are they doing now? Are they no longer 'scared' of going down? Because at this rate it is going to happen sooner rather than later and we look poorer than we have been at any stage since they took over.

The reason people suspect dodgy goings on is because even misguided/poorly advised or clueless people would have some sort of strategy and relay that strategy to the club and supporters. The fact they allow the club to burn, supporters to revolt and managers to quit without ever speaking or engaging leads to only one conclusion. This isn't naivety or a continual succession of mistakes, but more likely a deliberate strategy to dismantle the club.

They have the Rhodes money, in the Venky bank a cheaper manager in situ and now they have lost all interest if they ever had any....

This will be our last season in the championship , the club is geared or near enough for Division 1 all be it with mostly League 2 permanant players ...

[Doaksie]

Does OC actually stands for "Oh Crap"?

Even now, it still appears to me that he shouldn't be wearing our crest on his top. Like he doesn't belong in it.

[47er]

They knew 3rd party ownership was against rules but did it anyway, allegedly and have been trying to hide it ever since.

[funny-old-game]

They knew 3rd party ownership was against rules but did it anyway, allegedly and have been trying to hide it ever since.

The worse thing is the FA know of the third party ownership, but have done nothing to help only obstruct by not getting involved and having injunctions on certain group trying to get to the bottom of things. All this in order to keep their so called squeaky clean but false image.

[Neal]

Saw Coyle on instagram today opening a hairdressers with a few of the players with a stupid smile on his mug.

Answer to the topic... Yes, he's bigger d*ckhead than I thought.

[Parsonblue]

Saw Coyle on instagram today opening a hairdressers with a few of the players with a stupid smile on his mug.

Answer to the topic... Yes, he's bigger d*ckhead than I thought.

You keep talking about community Neal, well a local business asked him to open their new premises and he was more than willing to do so with a few of the players. I know the owner was happy they were coming out. Coyle is doing what you want - getting involved with the community! I find the whole Burnley thing - which surfaced at Leeds on Tuesday amazing. I assume many of those giving him abuse for his Burnley connections forget that Rovers fans got behind the likes of Roy Stephenson, Wally Joyce, John Connelly, Adam Blacklaw, Johnny Price etc. - all ex-Clarets who became firm favourites at Ewood.

[philipl]

Trimmed some down to try and reply to the important parts;

1. Acts designed to bury the club? By whom? If you are suggesting that, can you explain why someone would set fire to 100m+ of their own money, damage their global brand and become a figure of hate within one community, and a joke in another? These acts are easily explained by being hoodwinked by agents intent on pocketing!

2. The part about power plays I agree on - initial championship season cost us a fortune because if constant changing of the breeze, shebby, shaw, the managers, confused etc

3. Hired to look legit a past tactic? I don't quite understand that. If anything, it took 4 years to make an appointment of some legitimacy so that makes no sense.

4. Asset stripping. The definition should be pinned on this website because it's frustrating to read this term used. Asset stripping is what happens if another dodgy owner buys us for cheap and sells parts aka players, the training facility etc to pay for the transaction.

Venkys haven't asset stripped BRFC. Look at the numbers. They've bankrolled us into oblivion. Yes, we've had "assets" stripped from us, ie selling players but that's not the same thing.

5. The value of the club goes up with its position and down in a similar way. You can't just say "they are purposely taking us down" without looking at the ridiculous decisions, the investment, cost etc. They (the owners) have screwed us over by making the wrong decisions - it makes little sense in any format to say this was a purposeful act, they had no way of benefitting from.

6. Ofcourse there was ill intent- those giving advice had no conscience for stealing millions from our club. It makes no sense to suggest the owners would buy us to spite us, to ruin themselves financially and waste 100m+, damage their global brand and essentially (as said before) damage their reputation beyond fixing.

As jimmy I think said - it's easy to make us look silly by avoiding the actual story for a made up one about Indians teaching lowly peasants a lesson!

Why is it so hard to go with what stands out;

The heavily simplified; rich man gets conned, con artists tie up money for a long time, rich man gets more poor advice, rich man now poorer and a joke gives up and fades away.

The reason why they aren't investing is simple, when would it stop? 200m, 300m?

The sad part is - Coyle just shows that they still listen to poor advice. They picked him because he was cheap and probably had the right agent to get in.

They'll continue to make these mistakes though, but to buy into some conspiracy seems ridiculous in my eyes!

The only problems with this set of assumptions are:

1) It is actually a conspiracy theory- full of guesswork from scant evidence coming up with a sanitised conspiracy that there is one almighty malign conman

2) I have swung between thinking this way and thinking it far far murkier. The balance of evidence now in the public domain is that it is far far murkier

3) The stuff which for now cannot go into the public domain....

[ABBEY]

You keep talking about community Neal, well a local business asked him to open their new premises and he was more than willing to do so with a few of the players. I know the owner was happy they were coming out. Coyle is doing what you want - getting involved with the community! I find the whole Burnley thing - which surfaced at Leeds on Tuesday amazing. I assume many of those giving him abuse for his Burnley connections forget that Rovers fans got behind the likes of Roy Stephenson, Wally Joyce, John Connelly, Adam Blacklaw, Johnny Price etc. - all ex-Clarets who became firm favourites at Ewood.

the big difference being ,correct me if im wrong,none of the above lied to fans from day one, went on sky and in the papers hammering rovers fans and none had a crap record like chimp head has.

The only problems with this set of assumptions are:

1) It is actually a conspiracy theory- full of guesswork from scant evidence coming up with a sanitised conspiracy that there is one almighty malign conman

2) I have swung between thinking this way and thinking it far far murkier. The balance of evidence now in the public domain is that it is far far murkier

3) The stuff which for now cannot go into the public domain....

why????? if its true get it out

[Parsonblue]

the big difference being ,correct me if im wrong,none of the above lied to fans from day one, went on sky and in the papers hammering rovers fans and none had a crap record like chimp head has.

why????? if its true get it out

I don't think Coyle has lied to the fans about the present situation or been on sky or hammered the fans. His record is more than poor and ultimately he will pay the price if it doesn't improve. However, the mentality of giving a guy stick because he has had connections with Burnley in the past is something I will never understand. The Burnley nonsense only started in the 1970s with the increased hooliganism at matches in general and all it has resulted in is more and more restrictions whenever we play them and the insanity of having to play an Under-21 game behind closed doors! Coyle should get stick for results but anything other than that is ridiculous.

[Stuart]

You keep talking about community Neal, well a local business asked him to open their new premises and he was more than willing to do so with a few of the players. I know the owner was happy they were coming out. Coyle is doing what you want - getting involved with the community! I find the whole Burnley thing - which surfaced at Leeds on Tuesday amazing. I assume many of those giving him abuse for his Burnley connections forget that Rovers fans got behind the likes of Roy Stephenson, Wally Joyce, John Connelly, Adam Blacklaw, Johnny Price etc. - all ex-Clarets who became firm favourites at Ewood.

The 'Burnley thing' is just an easy taunt. For those people still view the club as normal (e.g. 'we've been in the third tier before', 'owners come and go'), surely it's time to change the manager? He's taking us down and has 'lost' the majority of fans.

That said, some fans do hate Bumley. Much as plenty of Bumley fans are revelling in our demise, "love" Venkys, and can't wait for us to be relegated.

[martonrover]

I don't think Coyle has lied to the fans about the present situation or been on sky or hammered the fans. His record is more than poor and ultimately he will pay the price if it doesn't improve. However, the mentality of giving a guy stick because he has had connections with Burnley in the past is something I will never understand. The Burnley nonsense only started in the 1970s with the increased hooliganism at matches in general and all it has resulted in is more and more restrictions whenever we play them and the insanity of having to play an Under-21 game behind closed doors! Coyle should get stick for results but anything other than that is ridiculous.

Agreed, he shouldn't get stick for the Burnley connection.

" I've never heard of S.E.M. " sticks in the throat a bit though, as does the bullshit emanating from his trap.

[Stuart]

Are you in one of those moods today, Parson? Having a pop at fans who aren't supportive of Coyle. Poor form.

[AllRoverAsia]

The bogus (I think) Owen Coyle Twitter page is a source of a daily laugh which is a rare occurence with regards to Rovers these days so my thanks to the Dingle Fan, alledgedly, who runs it.

If its run by a Rovers Fan - well done Pal.

[ABBEY]

I don't think Coyle has lied to the fans about the present situation or been on sky or hammered the fans. His record is more than poor and ultimately he will pay the price if it doesn't improve. However, the mentality of giving a guy stick because he has had connections with Burnley in the past is something I will never understand. The Burnley nonsense only started in the 1970s with the increased hooliganism at matches in general and all it has resulted in is more and more restrictions whenever we play them and the insanity of having to play an Under-21 game behind closed doors! Coyle should get stick for results but anything other than that is ridiculous.

so saying he doesn't know about anderscums mob isn't lying? so when he defended kea' and give rovers fans pelters then he wasn't hammering us then ...?

your definitely on for a prize for troller of the week .

[CAPT KAYOS]

Agreed, he shouldn't get stick for the Burnley connection.

" I've never heard of S.E.M. " sticks in the throat a bit though, as does the bullshit emanating from his trap.

What a load of bull - this is football we are talking about and all part of the banter .

If he does well fair enough but if not there is not usually much more fans can use as there armoury.

For me it's not the Bumleh connection - more so what he said about us whilst he was there and at notlob and just his record is terrible

[AllRoverAsia]

This morning I watched/listened to Coyle on Player giving his interview pre Rotherham. Took one for 'The Team' so to speak.

He is difficult to follow as he speaks so quickly but it sounded like he thought we were unlucky in the last 4 games and could have won them all. All I have watched are the 15 minute highlights on Player so can't really comment but his view is not even shared by the recent LT match reports and certainly not by many on here who witnessed these games.

He is very positive and smiles a lot but is not a lip licker to the extent of some who shall remain nameless - if we were drawing/winning more games he would be much more acceptable despite his Dingle links and blatant lying re SEM.

Basically he's not that important. He's a symptom and not the cause - not like #VENKYSOUT