[Archived] Rovers V Wolves - The Game Itself Thread.

[JHRover]

Graham, Stokes, Greer, Mulgrew and Brown between them signed contracts totaling 9 years of commitment from the football club this summer.

By the time May comes round the average age of those 5 players will be 32 years and 7 months.

Mulgew made a total of 19 appearances in the last 2 seasons for Celtic before coming here on a 3 year deal. Whilst I thought he played well yesterday he's clearly got fitness issues which are unlikely to be resolved at his age.

Wes Brown made 6 appearances for Sunderland last season and has yet to kick a ball in anger for Rovers (not counting the Trophy at Carlisle). Now we're faced with major defensive issues with injuries to Ward and Hoban and he's not ready to step in for a few games.

It seems they've come full circle with their recruitment policy. Bowyer's days saw the arrival of sensible signings of players of a good age with very few veterans joining. The vast majority of the recruitment was carried out with one eye on future values and player development as assets for the club which would retain value and help the club financially in years to come. They've cashed in on all that good work with scant regard for the damage it is doing for the team and league status and are now authorising multi-year contracts for players who either have major fitness issues, are the wrong side of 30 or who will have little/no sell on value.

For people who have shown an insatiable appetite for cashing in on players and taking the money out to then sanction such contracts seems odd to say the least.

Add in Liam Feeney who also got a 2 year deal who will be 30 in January and has barely featured for the team in recent weeks and the picutre just gets worse.

[47er]

This information was highlighted by many on here when the signings were rumoured but they went ahead anyway.

Crocks+loanees is a temporary fix which will prove disasterous at some point this season.

That's one reason why I feel certain we will be relegated.

Why 3 years for Mulgrew? At the very least it should have been one season at a time. He would still have signed. Madness.

[tomphil]

It stinks it really does but the writing was on the wall from Bolton and Wigan fans. He'll sign a few good young loan players but a load of crap as well on big contracts said notloB fans on twitter, how right they are.

Many managers these days don't work for football clubs they actually work for agents/agencies and third party investors. The agents get them into a club then they set about doing what they can for their direct partners not the mob they are sub contracted to .. the club. Only aim is to get enough points to keep them in a job whilst they get as many guys in and out as they can on behalf of their contacts no doubt on a % system paid directly from the agents.

One or two people within the game have said as much recently and nowhere has this been more put into practise than Blackburn Rovers in the last 6 years. Bowyer didn't fit that mould so someone somewhere wanted him out as their % was looking like drying up if GB had been given leeway once the embargo was lifted and sales began imo.

[Jimmy612]

Thought our goal came a little bit out of the blue. Wolves had 2 or 3 really decent crosses in to the box that we never really dealt with comfortably in the first 15mins.

Once we scored we immediately had 10 minutes where we dropped 10 yards and that allowed their CM with the shaved head to find pockets of space and have a few decent efforts at goal.

And then for the rest of the half I though we were the better team. The four of Emnes, Gally, Conway and Marshall is a very decent attacking threat - those 4 could easily make up the attacking line for a top 10 club - Marshall particularly was playing across the No. 10 line to good effect in the first half. A flexible role suits him well and he could have made it 2-0 but for a very good save.

Then the second half just seemed to be 'what we have, we hold' and it immediately went wrong. Wolves brought a bit of flair and creativity on and we couldn't handle it in the midfield. We have a really poor CM pair and that showed as they started to turn the screw. They brought on two players who swung the game for them - Teixera (in particular) and Cavaleiro

After that there was only one team likely to win it.

Frustrating because we needed 3 points, especially after Wigan won and all the other teams around us have new managers. November looks to be a write off and we go into December with 3 or 4 HUGE games - Huddersfield and Reading at Home and Barnsley, PNE Away. If we fail to get 9 points from those 4 then we are down and out IMO. Oh, and I can't see us getting anything from Deepdale this time around.

I predict a straight out scrap between;

Wigan

Rovers

Forest

Burton

Cardiff

Wolves (how big is their next appointment?!)

Rotherham have left themselves to much to do already and Cardiff have a really safe pair of hands in Warnock so I think they'll have enough to pull away - so too should Derby (even though they have a crap manager) and Ipswich.

[DE.]

Ipswich will be fine, but it wouldn't surprise me if this is Mick's last season there. The fans are starting to turn and Mick seems to have taken them as far as he can. We might both be meeting in League 1 in the next 2-3 years.

[broadsword]

I predict a straight out scrap between;

Wigan

Rovers

Forest

Burton

Cardiff

Wolves (how big is their next appointment?!)

Rotherham have left themselves to much to do already and Cardiff have a really safe pair of hands in Warnock so I think they'll have enough to pull away - so too should Derby (even though they have a crap manager) and Ipswich.

Bookies appear to think Rovers and Rotherham are already down, and then a straight-out scrap between Forest, Wigan and Burton, with Cardiff and Barnsley on the fringes.

I would agree with that.

[Lancaster Rover]

I watched the game back yesterday as large parts of it passed me by as in all honesty I concentrated more on the protest than the game. I thought we moved the ball about reasonably well, some of the interplay between the front 4 was quite slick and enjoyable to watch. I thought Guthrie moved the ball well but a midfield two of him and Evans is very lightweight. I thought Mulgrew played very well and his departure was the turning point. Regardless of whether the goal was offside or not Hendrie was fast asleep, he was caught in no mans land and took an age to get out and close the ball down. He really is appalling and have absolutely no idea why he is here, he got turned on around the 85th minute and it looked like he was running through custard. Also, credit where its due I thought Lowe had his best game in a Rovers shirt for a very long time.

[Waggy76]

Bookies appear to think Rovers and Rotherham are already down, and then a straight-out scrap between Forest, Wigan and Burton, with Cardiff and Barnsley on the fringes.

I would agree with that.

It is not as cut and dried as that , yet !

An appointment of a new manager and a proper one , would give us a fighting chance , its a long shot !

Remember the sacking of Saxton in the bottom 3 at New year appointed Mackay and the rest is history ...

[JHRover]

It is not as cut and dried as that , yet !

An appointment of a new manager and a proper one , would give us a fighting chance , its a long shot !

Remember the sacking of Saxton in the bottom 3 at New year appointed Mackay and the rest is history ...

Rotherham looked down and out all last season and didn't make a managerial change until February when they brought Warnock in but he managed to keep them up, so I agree that there is time if the right decisions are made. Rotherham are an extreme example because Warnock delivered promotion form from February-April to keep them up but nevertheless he showed it can be done.

The problem is that we all know deep down that they aren't going to change manager, and if they do it will be too late or they will bring in the wrong man again, so we've no chance unless Coyle somehow manages to find a way to collect a decent return of points against the better sides in the league.

Unfortunately in my opinion we're lacking two critical things that any side fighting to survive needs to have. One is organisation, the other is fitness. Someone like Warnock will deliver both. Kenny Jackett will deliver both at Rotherham. Sides like Burton have them both. The majority of goals we've conceded in recent weeks haven't been because the opposition have cut through us and been better than us, they've been because in the last 20 minutes there are 3 or 4 important players completely out of steam and running on empty or because basic defensive duties are neglected or missed at a time when we should be keeping it tight at the back. Coyle and one or two others paint these as bad fortune but I don't accept that. Birmingham and Bristol away - on course for decent points at both and then lapses in the last 20 minutes cost us. Same with Fulham, Burton and Wolves at home. A staggering number of points dropped late on in games which in my opinion is down to a lack of fitness and discipline more than anything else.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

We've been in worse positions regarding our league situation than this in the past and managed to pull clear. We all know why it's different this time. If they do make a change they'll make the change when it's too late and they'll appoint somebody who has absolutely no chance of doing the job.

Sorry to be so pessimistic but recent experience has taught me not to expect anything else. I'm afraid I see us going down without a whimper.

[tomphil]

Echo the comment about the Lowe I thought he played quite well but we'd expect a reaction from the last game. He needs to keep it up.

[47er]

Rotherham looked down and out all last season and didn't make a managerial change until February when they brought Warnock in but he managed to keep them up, so I agree that there is time if the right decisions are made. Rotherham are an extreme example because Warnock delivered promotion form from February-April to keep them up but nevertheless he showed it can be done.

The problem is that we all know deep down that they aren't going to change manager, and if they do it will be too late or they will bring in the wrong man again, so we've no chance unless Coyle somehow manages to find a way to collect a decent return of points against the better sides in the league.

Unfortunately in my opinion we're lacking two critical things that any side fighting to survive needs to have. One is organisation, the other is fitness. Someone like Warnock will deliver both. Kenny Jackett will deliver both at Rotherham. Sides like Burton have them both. The majority of goals we've conceded in recent weeks haven't been because the opposition have cut through us and been better than us, they've been because in the last 20 minutes there are 3 or 4 important players completely out of steam and running on empty or because basic defensive duties are neglected or missed at a time when we should be keeping it tight at the back. Coyle and one or two others paint these as bad fortune but I don't accept that. Birmingham and Bristol away - on course for decent points at both and then lapses in the last 20 minutes cost us. Same with Fulham, Burton and Wolves at home. A staggering number of points dropped late on in games which in my opinion is down to a lack of fitness and discipline more than anything else.

and old age!

[Al]

I watched the game back yesterday as large parts of it passed me by as in all honesty I concentrated more on the protest than the game..

Trouble is, so did the players. The concentration completely went when the crowd started leaving after 75 minutes and Wolves scored shortly afterwards. They should be professional enough to ignore such goings on.

[only2garners]

Echo the comment about the Lowe I thought he played quite well but we'd expect a reaction from the last game. He needs to keep it up.

He actually played very well at Bristol as well.

[tomphil]

He actually played very well at Bristol as well.

Well they are never going to replace him until he's worth something to sell so hopefully with no injury interruptions he'll grow into the role. Maybe he's finally starting to accept that's his position now.

[G Somerset Rover]

I thought Guthrie moved the ball well but a midfield two of him and Evans is very lightweight.

Not only are the pair a little lightweight but they offer nigh on nothing going forward besides some 'pretty' sideways passing. Aside from the Forest match when did last either assist or score? Seeing somebody like Edwards charge time and time again into our area shows the difference for me. The two of them just don't have the attacking hunger (or stamina) to contribute with goals and assists.

[Lancaster Rover]

I thought Guthrie spread the play quite well, I'd prefer him in there with a tackler over Evans. I'm not quite sure what Evans is, he probably has very good ball retention stats, etc as he makes a lot of 5-10 yard passes but he very rarely makes an incisive pass or run, he's not a great tackler either, he buzzes around without offering a great deal IMO, he's a player who looks good on OPTA stats.

[Jimmy612]

Bookies appear to think Rovers and Rotherham are already down, and then a straight-out scrap between Forest, Wigan and Burton, with Cardiff and Barnsley on the fringes.

I would agree with that.

Nearly mentioned Barnsley but they've had a couple of decent results at Brentford and Bristol which has stopped the rot.

[DE.]

I thought Guthrie spread the play quite well, I'd prefer him in there with a tackler over Evans. I'm not quite sure what Evans is, he probably has very good ball retention stats, etc as he makes a lot of 5-10 yard passes but he very rarely makes an incisive pass or run, he's not a great tackler either, he buzzes around without offering a great deal IMO, he's a player who looks good on OPTA stats.

Evans is acceptable when flanked by a destroyer type and a creative type, but how often do we play three in midfield nowadays? Coyle is obsessed with 4-4-2, despite not having the right players for it. It results in some decent attacking play at times, but also makes us easy to score against, especially as the game gets to the closing stages and the players get tired.

[Blue blood]

The reason we concede so many late goals is because even before taking into account Coyle's "preparation" we're a step behind in the fitness stakes.

Our central midfielders - one of the positions that do (or should do unless you're a Tugay like player) the most running - are both occupied by crocks. Evans and Guthrie have a long history of injury problems, and continue to do so. It's no wonder they're gassed after 70 minutes - they're fragile players.

Then you've got other crocks, Mulgrew - playing another running heavy role of full back, and Brown - although he'll never actually play, so perhaps unfair to count him. Add in the fact that Greer is 36 and Hoban missed all of last season, which is bound to have an effect on his fitness levels, and you're looking at about half the team being a step behind fitness wise, before a training session has just begun.

The other reason we concede late is because, strikers excluded, all our substitutes have no positive impact on the game. I can understand why Coyle is reluctant to make substitutions because they are all significantly weaker then the players they are replacing. Feeney, Byrne, Hendrie, Henley et al aren't going to help a team hold onto a lead because they are guff. Others are young and inexperienced and bound to make the odd mistake. Some are both. So imo the other reason we concede so late is we don't have the subs to 'manage' the game.

Oh and on that last point how is Coyle good at developing youth. Wasting half a dozen loan spots by bringing in poor quality young players from premiership clubs and then not playing them does not count as developing youth.

[Mercer]

I predict a straight out scrap between;

Wigan

Rovers

Forest

Burton

Cardiff

Wolves (how big is their next appointment?!)

Rotherham have left themselves to much to do already and Cardiff have a really safe pair of hands in Warnock so I think they'll have enough to pull away - so too should Derby (even though they have a crap manager) and Ipswich.

Wigan - caretaker Barrow is Wigan's Tony Parkes, solid and knows his stuff. Looks like Warren Joyce could be heading there. Good win at Cardiff. I think it's us or them for the drop.

Rovers - IF and it's a big if, we can keep Marshall and Emnes when January's window opens (heard some gossip last night that we will be lucky to have either for 2nd half of season) and we have a fair injury free run with likes of Mulgrew, Greer, Brown and Evans then I think we might just be okay.

Forest - think they are shot at. Unless they make a really good managerial appointment, think they've gone.

Burton - great spirit there and Clough is solid if unspectacular. Think they'll be okay.

Cardiff - it's Warnock, enough said.

Wolves - no problems there unless they appoint another foreigner which they have said they wont.

Rotherham - Have got longer to catch up this season. Stubbs was never going to work, just listen to the bloke speak. Jackett will forge them into a decent unit though may have a tad too much to do.

For me, Forest and Rotherham to drop with one from Wigan and Rovers (Marshall and Emnes gossip makes me less optimistic).

[booth]

Trouble is, so did the players. The concentration completely went when the crowd started leaving after 75 minutes and Wolves scored shortly afterwards. They should be professional enough to ignore such goings on.

We were on the wane a long time before the 75th minute.

[roversfan99]

Wigan - caretaker Barrow is Wigan's Tony Parkes, solid and knows his stuff. Looks like Warren Joyce could be heading there. Good win at Cardiff. I think it's us or them for the drop.

Rovers - IF and it's a big if, we can keep Marshall and Emnes when January's window opens (heard some gossip last night that we will be lucky to have either for 2nd half of season) and we have a fair injury free run with likes of Mulgrew, Greer, Brown and Evans then I think we might just be okay.

Forest - think they are shot at. Unless they make a really good managerial appointment, think they've gone.

Burton - great spirit there and Clough is solid if unspectacular. Think they'll be okay.

Cardiff - it's Warnock, enough said.

Wolves - no problems there unless they appoint another foreigner which they have said they wont.

Rotherham - Have got longer to catch up this season. Stubbs was never going to work, just listen to the bloke speak. Jackett will forge them into a decent unit though may have a tad too much to do.

For me, Forest and Rotherham to drop with one from Wigan and Rovers (Marshall and Emnes gossip makes me less optimistic).

More miscellaneous gossip that you cant go into?

[Blue blood]

Wigan - caretaker Barrow is Wigan's Tony Parkes, solid and knows his stuff. Looks like Warren Joyce could be heading there. Good win at Cardiff. I think it's us or them for the drop. Agree they are a candidate. Their next appointment is crucial. IF it is someone like Joyce then I think they'll be in real trouble.

Rovers - IF and it's a big if, we can keep Marshall and Emnes when January's window opens (heard some gossip last night that we will be lucky to have either for 2nd half of season) and we have a fair injury free run with likes of Mulgrew, Greer, Brown and Evans then I think we might just be okay. Even without inside knowledge why would they want to stay at the circus that is Rovers? (Although Graham signed so maybe not so cut and dried...) But hoping that Evans et al stay injury free is clutching at straws, they all have consistently proved they can't, with the exception of Greer who's 36! However we may have enough goals in our strike force to scrape some points together.

Forest - think they are shot at. Unless they make a really good managerial appointment, think they've gone. They've got some quality players still which means that there's always a chance they can get a few points. On a terrible run though and seem similar to us. With a good manager they should have enough to stay up. A bad one and it'll be a struggle.

Burton - great spirit there and Clough is solid if unspectacular. Think they'll be okay. Agree

Cardiff - it's Warnock, enough said. Agree - gutting as prior to him they were certs to go down imo.

Wolves - no problems there unless they appoint another foreigner which they have said they wont. Agree. Added to which again they have a decent team that will scrape together points irrespective of the manager.

Rotherham - Have got longer to catch up this season. Stubbs was never going to work, just listen to the bloke speak. Jackett will forge them into a decent unit though may have a tad too much to do.Think they have too much to do. Really rate Jackett as a manager (for his work at Swansea as well as Millwall.) However I think there's already too much of a gap for them to catch up.

I'd add in Ipswich. They've a terrible team but excellent manager. IF they sack McCarthy though they could really struggle.

For me, Forest and Rotherham to drop with one from Wigan and Rovers (Marshall and Emnes gossip makes me less optimistic).Less certainty with Forest but I think other than that it's pretty accurate. I'd say Rotherham for definite then 2 from us 3. Sadly our season may well depend on who our opponents appoint as managers. It is very frustrating that a lot of our survival rests on other teams.