[Archived] Coyle Out

[G Somerset Rover]

The Reading game will be Coyles 1 in 5 turn up and win comfortably to keep the dogs off his back.

2 points off safety, 5 from 17th. He bloody well needs one.

[Steve Kean's Hypnotoad]

You seem to keep mentioning Bowyer recently. In my view, he also has to carry some responsibility for our position. Well out of his depth, wasted some major talent by making them play defensively when a competent manager rather than a trainee would have made the play-offs with that attack-minded squad. Gestede, King, Rhodes, Cairney, Marshall, Conway. What a Souness would have done with those. Makes you weep. A decent scout, yes. A Championship football manager? No. He cut his teeth at Rovers' expense and has put his experience into practise in League Two - when it should have been the other way around.

If I was a betting man I'd put my money on Blackpool finishing marginally outside the play-offs this season and then slowly sliding down League 2 in future seasons under Bowyer. Exactly what happened to us under him. Then he'll probably get sacked, and put into practice in the Conference or Conference North what he learnt cutting his teeth at Rovers and Blackpool.

I've nothing against the guy but the last season in which we were a proper club, 2009-10, Bowyer was a reserve team manager and Kean was a first team coach. Its no coincidence that they were the jobs they had at a functional club, they had them because that's how good they'd proven themselves to be throughout their coaching/management careers.

Only in the madness of Venkys do amateurs assume top positions and it was a voluntary mass delusion amongst a section of the Rovers fans in pretending Bowyer was a Championship-level first team manager, more palatable than accept the fact that we were blowing our last realistic shot at promotion on an amateur.

[DE.]

Have said it before, but as far as Bowyer is concerned it's pretty simple. He overachieved on a personal level, but underachieved for the club as a whole. His first season in particular was very impressive considering his absolute lack of first team experience. Second season was disappointing, but his third season was where things really went pear shaped and the team as a whole went backward at a rate of knots. Once Bowyer was no longer allowed to reinvest any money from player sales, he was done. The fairytale was finished.

Would I have him over Coyle? Yes, but there aren't very many managers I wouldn't have over that utter plank.

[Jimmy612]

If I was a betting man I'd put my money on Blackpool finishing marginally outside the play-offs this season and then slowly sliding down League 2 in future seasons under Bowyer. Exactly what happened to us under him. Then he'll probably get sacked, and put into practice in the Conference or Conference North what he learnt cutting his teeth at Rovers and Blackpool.

I've nothing against the guy but the last season in which we were a proper club, 2009-10, Bowyer was a reserve team manager and Kean was a first team coach. Its no coincidence that they were the jobs they had at a functional club, they had them because that's how good they'd proven themselves to be throughout their coaching/management careers.

Only in the madness of Venkys do amateurs assume top positions and it was a voluntary mass delusion amongst a section of the Rovers fans in pretending Bowyer was a Championship-level first team manager, more palatable than accept the fact that we were blowing our last realistic shot at promotion on an amateur.

After he kept us up in that first horrible season I said on here that I didn't want Bowyer to be manager. I thought that if the owners were serious (having sacked Kean, Appleton and Berg they must have been looking for something?) then we would be best served with a McCarthy or Warnock. The squad was absolutely poisonous - Characters such as Etuhu, Best, Murphy, Orr had created a divide between players and fans that many of us had never experienced.

But I guess for financial reasons (and perhaps fear of more bad advice) they stuck with Bowyer. I think the best thing he did was to attempt to unite the players and the fans. He actively sought to end the contracts of poisonous players and made a habit of buying youngsters who needed to kick-start their careers again - Gestede, Cairney, Judge (shame that didn't work out), Marshall, Duffy.

The season when we played Cardiff away and Cairney scored a peach - that was the best I'd felt about Rovers since Allardyce was sacked. The players were playing for the shirt, they were enjoying playing for BRFC and I genuinley thought we had a chance of achieving top 6.

He did somewhat lose his way in the transfer market towards the end, and he had lost the majority of the fan base when he was sacked. But I don't think we should look at Bowyer or his tenure with any great disdain. Genuinely I thought he tried to bring the club together and tried to sign players that would not only perform well for us whilst here, but would also attract a sell-on fee. In my opinion he gave BRFC an identity and a reason for hope, even if it was short lived.

[JHRover]

He was the only manager out of the 7 permanent ones under Venkys that has been able to do the job over a decent period of time to any level of success. To do it in the manner he did, whilst earning them millions in fees and bridging the huge chasm between players and fans that had developed in his first job as a manager I think deserves a lot of respect.

That first game of the season against newly-relegated Cardiff on a Friday night when we drew 1-1 and there was a decent crowd on Ewood despite it being a TV game was probably the best I have felt about Rovers since Allardyce left. We seemed to be united as a club again with the majority of fans buying into what Bowyer was doing and really rallying behind the team he had put together and optimism was high following the strong end to the previous season.

Yes, in the end we ultimately fell short of what was expected and arguably didn't achieve our potential. That happens in football every year where teams capable of more don't quite reach the levels expected of them. That's the game.

Again, if we only had 2 years to go up before the firesale started then that's Venkys fault for putting us in that position rather than developing a more sustainable financial structure without being wholly reliant on parachute money.

Allardyce and Lambert couldn't work for these people, Berg and Appleton didn't really get the chance to work for them, Kean I don't need to say anything about, Coyle is taking us down. Bowyer is the only one who can be judged to have overcome the difficulties and done a job to any level of success. But most importantly for me he repaired a lot of the damage between fans and club, which has sadly been completely destroyed again in less than a year by the people above.

[Amo]

Oh my. Getting nostalgic for the Bowyer years.

I take it back... we HAVE hit rock bottom!

[DE.]

Was it twice that Bowyer shhh'd the fans? Lost a lot of respect from me after that.

In the cold light of day, Bowyer papered over a lot of cracks. That's the best you can say for him. The fact he was able to work for Venky's and make them some money is not a positive, it would have just encouraged them and/or their partners to hang around even longer.

[AggyBlue]

I take it back... we HAVE hit rock bottom!

Not yet.

Relegation and TV money down from 6M to 1M will greatly accelerate our fall

[Glosrover]

Not yet.

Relegation and TV money down from 6M to 1M will greatly accelerate our fall

now that really is a scary thought......none of the current squad are worth anything like the £5 annual deficit, gate revenues will fall further, no doubt the 'dodgy' contracts handed out wont have relegation clauses on salaries, and the owners probably don't even know there is a league below the championship.

The debt is mounting, the assets are mortgaged, where's the cash coming from to keep going even in the short term??

[ABBEY]

my only hope is once the slumdogs leave that's its totally affecting there indian market and that jail time awaits ANYONE who has aided and abetted the going ons.

[Jimmy612]

Oh my. Getting nostalgic for the Bowyer years.

I take it back... we HAVE hit rock bottom!

Don't think it's nostalgia, Amo. I think the majority knew that Bowyer's time was up and that we had to make a move for a manager who could push us further. Whether that was Lambert I'm genuinely not sure - we'll see how he does at Wolves but I'm not convinced he's the saviour that you and others have deemed him to be.

I do think sometimes we forget that Bowyer did have a decent couple of years here. Only in the last 10 months did things really unravel - he lost Cairney and Gestede and replaced them with Delfouneso, Guthrie and Koita and we were floundering a bit. Before then I think he did a lot of good things with a little bit of tactival naivety being the main reason we couldn't convert that 7th place finish to a place in the play-offs or better.

Games against Yeovil (0-0) Sheff Wed away (3-3 or something) and I believe Brighton too where we conceded late were so bitterly disappointing and perhaps games that a more savvy manager would have got maximum points.

He's also started to turn things around at another stupid club in Blackpool, and I hope he succeeds there.

[Mattyblue]

That first game of the season against newly-relegated Cardiff on a Friday night when we drew 1-1 and there was a decent crowd on Ewood despite it being a TV game was probably the best I have felt about Rovers since Allardyce left. We seemed to be united as a club again with the majority of fans buying into what Bowyer was doing and really rallying behind the team he had put together and optimism was high following the strong end to the previous season.

Yep, remember it well.

Fresh from almost reaching the play offs, for this league we had a squad full of attacking talent and some decent defenders. Season ticket sales were up, there was a buzz around the ground- few new gimmicks like a permanent fan zone, murals etc, the crowd roared them on to the pitch....

What followed that surge of optimism was a season of mediocre performances... we ended up 10 points behind the previous season's total, marooned in mid-table.

I have a lot of time for Bowyer due to the job he did in the backend of the Season of 5 Managers, plus his first full season was a good effort. However, he just didn't improve, was overly cautious and wasted our final decent squad of players.

No misty eyed memories here.

[tomphil]

He shot himself in the foot almost straight away with that game when after we were doing fine he moved Lowe to right back instead of bringing the right back on from the bench and we were content to sit in our own half until the standard last 10 mins have a go. Set a pattern for the season and it was clear at times that first and foremost it was about getting as many players games in what was a fair sized squad then, There was no clear desire to have a real go for the top 6.

Understandable in a way as he was probably under instruction or pressure from agents to tinker and accommodate and at the end of the day his over cautious approach was down to inexperience. He was in way above his head and coped admirably but we needed something more. Whatever anyones thoughts though he was treated like dog turd by them at the end after he'd steered the club through the all to convenient FFP whilst the squad matured a bit and became of some value, what chance did he have once the cashing in had started but the purse strings remained shut ?

The mess me are in now picked up pace right there and then, there was no plan for promotion at all just grow a cheap squad whilst parachutes pay wages then sell it.

[Amo]

Don't think it's nostalgia, Amo. I think the majority knew that Bowyer's time was up and that we had to make a move for a manager who could push us further. Whether that was Lambert I'm genuinely not sure - we'll see how he does at Wolves but I'm not convinced he's the saviour that you and others have deemed him to be.

I do think sometimes we forget that Bowyer did have a decent couple of years here. Only in the last 10 months did things really unravel - he lost Cairney and Gestede and replaced them with Delfouneso, Guthrie and Koita and we were floundering a bit. Before then I think he did a lot of good things with a little bit of tactival naivety being the main reason we couldn't convert that 7th place finish to a place in the play-offs or better.

Games against Yeovil (0-0) Sheff Wed away (3-3 or something) and I believe Brighton too where we conceded late were so bitterly disappointing and perhaps games that a more savvy manager would have got maximum points.

He's also started to turn things around at another stupid club in Blackpool, and I hope he succeeds there.

Boywer did alright, recruited well, but just didn't have the tactical nous or ambition to break the glass ceiling of the playoffs.

I think he would've made a fine assistant if he was paired alongside a more dynamic and mercurial figure in the dugout. Someone like Sherwood, maybe? Their contrasting styles and personalities might have complemented each other nicely, or have been doomed to failure like everything under Venky's

[ABBEY]

get back under your stone he said.

[tomphil]

Boywer did alright, recruited well, but just didn't have the tactical nous or ambition to break the glass ceiling of the playoffs.

I think he would've made a fine assistant if he was paired alongside a more dynamic and mercurial figure in the dugout. Someone like Sherwood, maybe? Their contrasting styles and personalities might have complemented each other nicely, or have been doomed to failure like everything under Venky's

He'd have made a great no 2 good cop to someones bad cop probably.

[Blue blood]

Coyle's comments are so OTT it's infuriating.

For example after the Brighton game, he had to mention Newcastle were one of the other favourites for promotion to remind people we'd recently beaten them. Just a shame about the remaining fixtures we've played counting too, eh Owen?

Or today saying how unlucky we've been with injuries to have 4 centre backs injured. When 3 of them are permanent crocks and the 4th is 36 years old, luck doesn't come into it whatsoever, it was inevitable it would happen - in fact it's happened nearly every other season with that injury prone lot. But Mr Spin himself doesn't seem to be in the real world.

I feel like it's Kean all over again, although this time it seems even more deliberate than ever before. And I'm not sure I want anything to do with it.

[davulsukur]

I feel like it's Kean all over again, although this time it seems even more deliberate than ever before. And I'm not sure I want anything to do with it.

That's because it is.

Both Scottish "Managers"

Both bullet proof

Leak goals like a sieve

Need to score 4 to win a game

Capable of 1 or 2 shock results totally out of the blue and way against form.

In and around the relegation places from the word go.

Uber positive media tripe

Team won't go down (I think both have made that claim)

Squad disharmony-despite the manager saying otherwise (see K**n's shiner (cheers Nzonzi-Legend) and Hendrie's recent Twitter comment)

Both lack tactical nous

Suspicious/ridiculously awful substitutions

Bigging up of poor players (see the next wayne Rooney or Liam Feeney V2.0)

Hated by the fans/never wanted

Obvious links to a certain agency

Both liars

There will be more I'm sure.

[JHRover]

Can I add both continually try to pull the wool over people's eyes by lying repeatedly about an important player being in discussions over a new contract when it is obvious to everyone that no such discussions are taking place and that player will be leaving to join a direct rival in the near future?

[DE.]

Yeah, Coyle is basically Kean with hair and a horse's dental implants.

His success at the dingles is beyond baffling. Proof that ANYBODY can get a team promoted if luck and momentum is on their side.

[JHRover]

As many national newspapers take great delight in reminding us, Kean has us 3rd in this League when he scarpered with the loot, so I think that's all the evidence we need to suggest that flukes can happen. In some ways Coyle getting that lot promoted was less of a freak occurrence than us being near the top of this league under Kean.

They both hail from a similar part of the world, have similar backgrounds, are similar ages, appear to be able to sell sand to the Arabs with their endlessly positive spiel.

Would it really surprise anyone if Kean had put in a good word for his old mate Owen to help him get the job back in the summer?

We know Coyle was happy to jump to Kean's defence back in the Premier League days when those nasty Rovers fans were giving Steve stick, so maybe he's paid Owen back for the favour by having a word with the powers at Rovers.

I bet they're having a right old laugh with each other as Kean counts his ill-gotten gains in Brunei with his mate in place for the next round of fun at Ewood Park.

[RevidgeBlue]

Can I add both continually try to pull the wool over people's eyes by lying repeatedly about an important player being in discussions over a new contract when it is obvious to everyone that no such discussions are taking place and that player will be leaving to join a direct rival in the near future?

If you're talking about Marshall/Duffy a proper manager would have sent them packing with a size 10 up their jacksi anyhow.

[JHRover]

If you're talking about Marshall/Duffy a proper manager would have sent them packing with a size 10 up their jacksi anyhow.

A proper manager would play Marshall in the right position, ensure he had earned a new contract last season before getting him signed up in the summer.

If he hadn't earned a new contract then sell him in the summer and replace him. If he refused to sign a new contract then drop him rather than let him pass time starting for Rovers every week.

A proper manager certainly wouldn't have persisted with Duffy at the start of the season and allowed him to singlehandedly ensure we lost a relegation 6 pointer.

[Jimmy612]

We know Coyle was happy to jump to Kean's defence back in the Premier League days when those nasty Rovers fans were giving Steve stick, so maybe he's paid Owen back for the favour by having a word with the powers at Rovers.

I bet they're having a right old laugh with each other as Kean counts his ill-gotten gains in Brunei with his mate in place for the next round of fun at Ewood Park.

"I do not think they have given Steve Kean any chance from the outset," said Coyle.

"They have their own reasons for that and ultimately, those who want to be heard shout the loudest. Steve Kean is a terrific coach and manager. All you want is an opportunity. We have the best league in the world, but we don't have the 20 best managers in the world, someone has to fill the dreaded places where no-one wants to be."

"I hope he is given the time to do that because he is a genuinely nice person."

Owen Coyle | Wednesday 21st December 2011

[davulsukur]

I think I'm going to be sick.