[Archived] New Sporting Director Rumour

[gumboots]

But no one ever could with AC Rev. Kenny messed up. Overpaid somewhat shall we say. It could easily have happened here if Shearer hadn't have recovered from the acl. We were lucky in that he had a worse one pre season for Newcastle v Everton and he did his Achilles, never the same player, bloody awful in fact. Only bagged 20 a season from then on in ish. :-)

Anyway, back to this stats bollokcs. Stats get you Jason Lowe, runs around all day, plays the percentages. Give me a Dunn or a Tugay every day of the week.

89.56% passing completion, 29 miles run, no goals, no assists, no tackles Vs 69%, 200 yards, no tackles, no goals and 2 assists. Oh and a bit of fun and excitement.

Remember that anyone? Fun and excitement?

#venkysout

I do indeed remember it. It's why I don't watch them any more. It's like the gambling ad says, " When the fun stops, STOP!" Football is an addiction but you have to know when the habit is harming you, and cut it out.

[bob fleming]

I do indeed remember it. It's why I don't watch them any more. It's like the gambling ad says, " When the fun stops, STOP!" Football is an addiction but you have to know when the habit is harming you, and cut it out.

I didn't know you used to play central midfield gumboots?!?

Point taken btw!

[gumboots]

To be honest I don't think I'd be much worse than some of those who'd played there recently

[tomphil]

So they've appointed another set of agents. Now just why would they do that ? Yet again refusing to just employ a proper football club chief exec to run the show.

I bet Lara has got a whole new set of follower requests this morning

[koi]

It was never going to be an appointment to benefit on-field performance. Every appointment since they've taken over has been to make money out of the club.

[RoverCanada]

The baseball model was based on having batters who don't necessarily score home runs, but get to first Base regularly. Get 2 or 3 of them and you score points. The league was spending all its money on big hitters, one club took the risk, had one successful season, then everyone else cottoned on, and they fell down the league again.

I'm not having it that Kenny bought Andy Carroll on the basis of money ball- he bought him because he thought he'd score loads of goals for Liverpool. Same reason he bought Jordan Henderson and tried to buy Phil Jones - he thought they where the best young talent. Liverpool don't buy players for them to be worth more in the future.

You don't need a data analyst to tell you that a fit Andy Carroll and an accurate crosser, would score goals in any league in the world.

I don't know where you're getting your history on the 'baseball model', but you're quite off. Yes, at the time, the Oakland Athletics did identify that getting on base was undervalued relative to a player's perceived athleticism. For position players, they found batting ability to be way more valuable than fielding ability (in retrospect, they simply didn't have the tools to measure fielding properly. They now have tracking cameras in every stadium that have revolutionized that part of analytics). So they loaded up on 'bad body' guys who could still hit (including HRs! Not sure where you got that tidbit from...), for a fraction of what their actual value on the field was.

While the Athletics story isn't quite wrapped up in a bow due to not winning a World Series, Moneyball follows the narrative when they managed to be perennial contenders between 1999-2006 despite only spending a fraction of what the Yankees, Red Sox, etc. were spending. THAT'S 'Moneyball' - identifying what other teams are not properly valuing and spending what limited resources you have on that while the market inefficiency exists. It's not simply about using data.

And as you allude to, what is undervalued will be a constantly moving target. The Moneyball book narrates the A's 2003 draft and part of the story there was drafting college players rather than high schoolers, the argument being the former were more developed and more of a sure thing. However, if you returned to the A's draft room a couple years later, they were suddenly drafting a bunch of high schoolers because other teams had picked up on it and college players were now overvalued. The A's first came to prominence with guys who could get on base and not necessarily field well, but they later found athletic fielders were being undervalued.

The A's did have a lull in the late 2000s. but that's part of their new strategy to build their team in cycles. They sucked 2007-2011, then made the playoffs three straight years, and have sucked the past two years. Given how many other teams have started doing hardcore data analysis, they can no longer manage to be a perennial contender on the cheap. The market for players has become too efficient. So they now have to time their breakout seasons with young players on cheap contracts (who they then have to trade away once they start asking for lots of money).

Part of the Moneyball story is how analytics took over the game. Last year the final holdout (the Phillies, who had a good team that they gradually let fall apart in a slow motion car wreck, partially due to a stats-adverse GM who they finally fired) hired a data analyst and now the whole league has them. Hell, the Astros literally have former NASA scientists working for them. I suspect this is slowly coming to be in the PL as well, though that's dependent on the advent of tracking cameras, and hence my skepticism of how much advanced data work you can do in the Championship where I highly doubt teams have the same data available to them.

The 'moneyball' concept obviously makes sense to Rovers given our revenue has plummeted, but I'm not so confidant the 'geniuses' in our front office will be able to regularly identify market inefficiencies... I'd guess this Paul Senior fella has simply put it in his CV as a buzzword more than anything.

My Andy Carroll example was NOT 'moneyball' (an overused phrase anyway) at all. He was the result of Damien Comolli and his analysts identifying Carroll's talents as the key to success in football (yes, if fit, Carroll can certainly contribute), that's the data side of it, and deeming that money was no object in acquiring him. I'm sure they had some model results suggesting Carroll was worth more than £50M, but analytics can often be blind to injury proneness, player temperament, etc.

[MGAndy]

Senior Sideshow

Pasha Out

[JAL]

How did the lad Travis make the bench today questions need to be asked.

[chaddyrovers]

How did the lad Travis make the bench today questions need to be asked.

why does questions need to be asked? have you seen him play? Nope. so how can you judge?

we have players injured, Emnes not available to play and Byrne gone back to the club.

[ABBEY]

you moan i follow you ..but your obsession with jal is worse tha knows

[yoda]

Scousers out

[MGAndy]

Scousers out

Pasha is a scouser???

Pasha Out

[yoda]

Pasha is a scouser???

Pasha Out

Did you not know

[MGAndy]

Paul Senior

sacked by Sheff Wed

now hired to take venky coin

questionable character

[Parsonblue]

How did the lad Travis make the bench today questions need to be asked.

Perhaps because he has played exceptionally well for the Under-23's this season and thoroughly deserved a place on the bench in recent weeks.

[ABBEY]

parson ...what about what anderson and co have/doing to our club, why do you ignore this question?

[chaddyrovers]

parson ...what about what anderson and co have/doing to our club, why do you ignore this question?

We all know what went on then. Cant change it the past now. But he retired now as an agent hasnt he?

What are agents doing to the club now. Spill the beans then if you know?

[ABBEY]

yet again you cant ignore me ha....

retired ? is that fact chaddy?

[perthblue02]

We all know what went on then. Cant change it the past now. But he retired now as an agent hasnt he?

New nest, new title, and previously been linked to on this board

[ABBEY]

new place to bury head lol

[Stuart]

New nest, new title, and previously been linked to on this board

Not the lot that get louder at the end?

[chaddyrovers]

yet again you cant ignore me ha....

retired ? is that fact chaddy?

Surely you should be finding out and doing some research about him since you keep mention him. Not mu job to do research for you.

What are agents doing to the club now? if you know then spill the beans.

[ABBEY]

what in hells name as it got to with you what i do...show me where i have EVER asked you to do anything for me ?

Surely you should be finding out and doing some research about him since you keep mention him. Not mu job to do research for you.

What are agents doing to the club now? if you know then spill the beans.

[chaddyrovers]

what in hells name as it got to with you what i do...show me where i have EVER asked you to do anything for me ?

Getting all defensively as you always do when asked anything. You keep mention Agents(complaining about them) but when asked simple question cant even answer it.

Time to back on the ignore list again. But Probably the best thing for Messageboard and myself.

[walk down bolton road]

If anybody believes that this football club is being run openly and all above board like a proper football club,then either them or me need urgent medical help.