[Archived] A Scab In The Park

[Al]

I think you will find he was referring to himself in the title ( a little humour ). Well that's the way I took it.

Maybe I misinterpreted the title but even so it appears to me to insinuate by association that anybody in the park was a scab. It may not have been meant that way but that's how it came across to me.

[chaddyrovers]

Stuart, can I said your starting post was a good read and full of passion. I respect the post and poster even tho we might not agree alot the time.

[Stuart]

Maybe I misinterpreted the title but even so it appears to me to insinuate by association that anybody in the park was a scab. It may not have been meant that way but that's how it came across to me.

Take your head out of your arse, Al. You're making a bigger issue of that than you should - particularly as I've already replied to your post and explained.

[Neal]

for me the only protest that worked well was the 1875

boycots are never going to happen

all the talk of more out than in and the amount of rovers fans on the march was pathetic

did anybody really expect thousands to turn up not to go to the match?

i honestly believe the thousands of missing supporters aren't boycotting at all they're just glory hunters,or most of them are

lets see the gate if we get man utd at home next round,they'll be back for one game just like the liverpool cup game

keep the protests inside the ground during the games its the only way more people will participate

all in my opinion of coarse

Mushroom.

[Stuart]

Mushroom.

We are all mushrooms as far as Venkys are concerned.

[Neal]

We are all mushrooms as far as Venkys are concerned.

Only if you pay the entrance fee Stuart!

[mustard]

Topic titles like that are just the thing to harden the resolve of the fans who want to enjoy watching the football. Who do you think you are to call fellow supporters scabs?

Can you suggest a way because boycotting is obviously having no effect?

How can it have an effect when a huge section of our fanbase would rather put their efforts into ensuring the boycotts have no effect?! These are people who have barely uttered a word against Venky's, never mind taken part in a protest.

It's incredibly difficult and frustrating when it is nigh on impossible to have a large and successful protest/boycott due to these people having no interest in doing ANYTHING to even show they disagree with the Rao's, let alone want them gone. A boycott from two sets of football fans to show the FA it isn't right what's happening at clubs like ours yet our attendance showed these fans either endorse, or don't give two hoots, what the Venky's and the FA have been complicit in, and in fact want to subsidise it.

It's now the case that anyone who shouts "Venky's Out" is met with arrogance and derision from such holier-than-thou individuals whose only interest is making sure they get to sit quietly watch their team play every Saturday. No wonder Ewood is a morgue nowadays. Lifeless individuals who will put down a protestor or say "get behind the lads ffs" yet won't muster a song to get the team going.

"This is my club, I've come Ewood for __ years, they can't take it away from me". Well, they might just! And if it ain't taken away in your lifetime, it could well be the future generations who suffer, in part due to this collective selfish attitude that plagues Ewood.

This isn't aimed at you Al, but with the 18-75 protests highlighted people aren't willing to miss half a game of football, or even ten mins, in a season to protest the powers that be. And it is selfish.

To reiterate, boycotting/protesting will obviously not have an effect whilst 8000 Rovers fans sit INSIDE Ewood saying "boycotting has no effect".

[Al]

Take your head out of your arse, Al. You're making a bigger issue of that than you should - particularly as I've already replied to your post and explained.

I'll take my head out of my arse when you remove the stick from yours. I admitted that I might have interpreted your title now leave it.

[mustard]

You are right on the 1st part. All views are not respected on here. We all have different views on here. If you are attend games certain posters just keep insulting you with their posts.

As I said before respect the boycotters and protestors.

I go games to watch the game and support my team. I discuss the game with friends and people around me during the game. Thats what ive done for years and will do for years in the future.

Don't count your chickens before they've hatched, chadster. Venky's keep running things as they are and you'll be getting your Saturday footy fix down Pleasy before long.

[Neal]

How can it have an effect when a huge section of our fanbase would rather put their efforts into ensuring the boycotts have no effect?! These are people who have barely uttered a word against Venky's, never mind taken part in a protest.

It's incredibly difficult and frustrating when it is nigh on impossible to have a large and successful protest/boycott due to these people having no interest in doing ANYTHING to even show they disagree with the Rao's, let alone want them gone. A boycott from two sets of football fans to show the FA it isn't right what's happening at clubs like ours yet our attendance showed these fans either endorse, or don't give two hoots, what the Venky's and the FA have been complicit in, and in fact want to subsidise it.

It's now the case that anyone who shouts "Venky's Out" is met with arrogance and derision from such holier-than-thou individuals whose only interest is making sure they get to sit quietly watch their team play every Saturday. No wonder Ewood is a morgue nowadays. Lifeless individuals who will put down a protestor or say "get behind the lads ffs" yet won't muster a song to get the team going.

"This is my club, I've come Ewood for __ years, they can't take it away from me". Well, they might just! And if it ain't taken away in your lifetime, it could well be the future generations who suffer, in part due to this collective selfish attitude that plagues Ewood.

This isn't aimed at you Al, but with the 18-75 protests highlighted people aren't willing to miss half a game of football, or even ten mins, in a season to protest the powers that be. And it is selfish.

To reiterate, boycotting/protesting will obviously not have an effect whilst 8000 Rovers fans sit INSIDE Ewood saying "boycotting has no effect".

Abso-bloody-lutely. Good post sir.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

for me the only protest that worked well was the 1875

boycots are never going to happen

all the talk of more out than in and the amount of rovers fans on the march was pathetic

did anybody really expect thousands to turn up not to go to the match?

i honestly believe the thousands of missing supporters aren't boycotting at all they're just glory hunters,or most of them are

lets see the gate if we get man utd at home next round,they'll be back for one game just like the liverpool cup game

keep the protests inside the ground during the games its the only way more people will participate

all in my opinion of coarse

Yeah, I've been glory hunting since 1962, not much glory over the years but plenty of hunting for it.

[Stuart]

How can it have an effect when a huge section of our fanbase would rather put their efforts into ensuring the boycotts have no effect?! These are people who have barely uttered a word against Venky's, never mind taken part in a protest.

It's incredibly difficult and frustrating when it is nigh on impossible to have a large and successful protest/boycott due to these people having no interest in doing ANYTHING to even show they disagree with the Rao's, let alone want them gone. A boycott from two sets of football fans to show the FA it isn't right what's happening at clubs like ours yet our attendance showed these fans either endorse, or don't give two hoots, what the Venky's and the FA have been complicit in, and in fact want to subsidise it.

It's now the case that anyone who shouts "Venky's Out" is met with arrogance and derision from such holier-than-thou individuals whose only interest is making sure they get to sit quietly watch their team play every Saturday. No wonder Ewood is a morgue nowadays. Lifeless individuals who will put down a protestor or say "get behind the lads ffs" yet won't muster a song to get the team going.

"This is my club, I've come Ewood for __ years, they can't take it away from me". Well, they might just! And if it ain't taken away in your lifetime, it could well be the future generations who suffer, in part due to this collective selfish attitude that plagues Ewood.

This isn't aimed at you Al, but with the 18-75 protests highlighted people aren't willing to miss half a game of football, or even ten mins, in a season to protest the powers that be. And it is selfish.

To reiterate, boycotting/protesting will obviously not have an effect whilst 8000 Rovers fans sit INSIDE Ewood saying "boycotting has no effect".

Nail. Head. Hit.

To be honest I was also disappointed by the Blackpool turn out. 1600 fans was about 10 times the number I'd have expected for a cup match where the Blackpool owners share the proceeds.

One thing the match yesterday showed me was that there are a heck of a lot of people who are in a bubble and are more than happy to be in that bubble. The club's standing in to town and importance to the community is second to their enjoyment of a game of football - or even just the game without the enjoyment.

I expect it's like people who see their local pub, cinema or even local church close down. Sure there will be campaigns to Save Our XYZ that a hardy fee will get going but the majority will just wait until it's gone and at that point they'll grumble a bit and find an alternative to meet their needs.

We could do to take a leaf out of this lot's book...

http://www.thenews.coop/97986/news/community/dog-inn-belthorn-saved-community/

[gumboots]

I respect that everyone has the right to do as they please but don't expect to come here and not be judged for it, I certainly don't by supporters like yourself. Step up to the hotpate or get out of the kitchen and stop whinging, you're a grown man... You should know better than to expect a church group mannered debate when it comes to football.

Have you ever been to a church meeting? Some of them get very heated. Admittedly the language isn't like at football but the passion rises quite high on certain topics

[RevidgeBlue]

But the truth is that you aren't 'doing' anything. You are simply doing what you have always done and carrying on as usual. You say you want Venkys to leave but you are happy to leave the effort to somebody else.

You have been asked several times what ideas you have to help to bring about Venkys leaving. You say boycotting won't work, and you won't ever boycott. You say marching won't work, and you won't march. You say keep protests away from the match but that's because you believe it affects the players. Everything offered so far you have pooh-poohed as ineffective.

So what ARE you able and willing to offer? You must have contacts, influence, the ear of sympathetic people. If anyone would be well placed to collect the facts and figures of Venkys' reign and to present this in an eloquent way then I would have thought it would be you. Can't you put your unique set of skills to help? Perhaps help to raise the profile of the www.venkysout.com site?

Something else?

Reactions like yours Al are just as much a part of the problem.

As somebody who is very much pro-protests, yet was in attendance, I was referring to myself as the 'scab'.

Hopefully you read the post and not just the title as I think it is more anti-protest that pro- and hopefully can be seen, at best, as reasonably balanced.

Absolute rubbish Stuart. Your reaction is typical of that of many protestors, like a kid who doesn't get his own way, therefore you're reduced to being disparaging and patronising about fellow supporters who don't have the same point of view as you.

The common insult thrown at non protesters is that you're lazy, apathetic or don't care or are doing nothing. I have thought it all through and AM doing something. I am of the view that if there is still to be a Club to rescue then the Venky's have gone then a certain number of supporters need to stick by the Club until the bitter end and we'll see what happens. Without an obvious alternative I am not going to actively lobby against the only thing currently preventing us from going under either. I realise the argument is that the support of those still going keeps the V's at the Club longer but I don't think that is the case. We are still losing money hand over fist and if money was the decisive factor in them staying or leaving they would have been gone long before now.

None of this makes me or any of the other attendees a "superfan" as is the other usual snotty insult thrown about. I merely hope there will still be a Club to salvage when V's go, and that we will still be attractive enough for someone else to take us over.

So fans that still attend are not doing "nothing" they have taken a positive course of action and made a certain decision to still attend games even though strictly speaking the quality of the product on offer doesn't warrant it.

[Stuart]

Absolute rubbish Stuart. Your reaction is typical of that of many protestors, like a kid who doesn't get his own way, therefore you're reduced to being disparaging and patronising about fellow supporters who don't have the same point of view as you.

The common insult thrown at non protesters is that you're lazy, apathetic or don't care or are doing nothing. I have thought it all through and AM doing something. I am of the view that if there is still to be a Club to rescue then the Venky's have gone then a certain number of supporters need to stick by the Club until the bitter end and we'll see what happens. Without an obvious alternative I am not going to actively lobby against the only thing currently preventing us from going under either. I realise the argument is that the support of those still going keeps the V's at the Club longer but I don't think that is the case. We are still losing money hand over fist and if money was the decisive factor in them staying or leaving they would have been gone long before now.

None of this makes me or any of the other attendees a "superfan" as is the other usual snotty insult thrown about. I merely hope there will still be a Club to salvage when V's go, and that we will still be attractive enough for someone else to take us over.

So fans that still attend are not doing "nothing" they have taken a positive course of action and made a certain decision to still attend games even though strictly speaking the quality of the product on offer doesn't warrant it.

You are proving my point completely.

Do nothing.

Get called out for doing nothing.

Blame those calling you out as the reason you are doing nothing.

My point of view is that we need Venkys, who are refusing to sell without getting their money back, to leave as soon as possible for the long term good of Blackburn Rovers.

Those who do not share "my" view, please explain your reasoning.

[Neal]

I have thought it all through and AM doing something.

Hahahaha! Bloody hell, I almost spat out my toast! This was funny many levels pal, thanks for that!

[RevidgeBlue]

for me the only protest that worked well was the 1875

boycots are never going to happen

all the talk of more out than in and the amount of rovers fans on the march was pathetic

did anybody really expect thousands to turn up not to go to the match?

i honestly believe the thousands of missing supporters aren't boycotting at all they're just glory hunters,or most of them are

lets see the gate if we get man utd at home next round,they'll be back for one game just like the liverpool cup game

keep the protests inside the ground during the games its the only way more people will participate

all in my opinion of coarse

Absolutely spot on particularly the bit about the majority of missing fans being glory hunters. They've given up because it's chap and will likely never return on a full time basis.

Also correct that if it is felt there's a need to protest that should carry on and happen in some form every week to remind the powers that be that things aren't acceptable and that a full stadium of people protesting would be way more effective than 10k missing (whether boycotting or simply fed up) and a relatively small proportion of those inside the ground protesting.

[mustard]

Absolute rubbish Stuart. Your reaction is typical of that of many protestors, like a kid who doesn't get his own way, therefore you're reduced to being disparaging and patronising about fellow supporters who don't have the same point of view as you.

The common insult thrown at non protesters is that you're lazy, apathetic or don't care or are doing nothing. I have thought it all through and AM doing something. I am of the view that if there is still to be a Club to rescue then the Venky's have gone then a certain number of supporters need to stick by the Club until the bitter end and we'll see what happens. Without an obvious alternative I am not going to actively lobby against the only thing currently preventing us from going under either. I realise the argument is that the support of those still going keeps the V's at the Club longer but I don't think that is the case. We are still losing money hand over fist and if money was the decisive factor in them staying or leaving they would have been gone long before now.

None of this makes me or any of the other attendees a "superfan" as is the other usual snotty insult thrown about. I merely hope there will still be a Club to salvage when V's go, and that we will still be attractive enough for someone else to take us over.

So fans that still attend are not doing "nothing" they have taken a positive course of action and made a certain decision to still attend games even though strictly speaking the quality of the product on offer doesn't warrant it.

I don't get it. I'll be there when the Venky's have gone. A lot will. Doesn't mean I'm going to subsidise them now. We could pack out Ewood every week and it wouldn't make diddly squat of a difference to our debt or losses.

My opinion is that every person who enters that turnstile and doesn't protest in some way is as good as saying "I endorse what Venky's are doing to BRFC". You are merely a statistic to them. The money goes out of your back pocket and into theirs. I don't think it's saving the club but providing them with a reason to stick around as keeping you around will give them a chance of breaking even when we're in League One.

I also don't buy this about needing to keep attendances up to look an attractive proposition for a takeover. Any potential investor will do their due diligence and look at attendances pre-Venky's, incl our previous spell in the Champ and think "hmm maybe the attendances are so low in protest of the owners". The information is there and I don't think a potential investor would be daft enough not to look into this.

I don't know if most ST holders have convinced themselves they are somehow saving the club but I'd say turning up at Ewood as if everything is normal is as good as doing nothing.

Absolutely spot on particularly the bit about the majority of missing fans being glory hunters. They've given up because it's chap and will likely never return on a full time basis.

Also correct that if it is felt there's a need to protest that should carry on and happen in some form every week to remind the powers that be that things aren't acceptable and that a full stadium of people protesting would be way more effective than 10k missing (whether boycotting or simply fed up) and a relatively small proportion of those inside the ground protesting.

How do you know?

A mass boycott would ring alarm bells. A packed out Ewood would make everyone in Pune happy.

[RevidgeBlue]

Hahahaha! Bloody hell, I almost spat out my toast! This was funny many levels pal, thanks for that!

It's obvious from all your recent postings that your hatred for Venky's has caused you completely to lose the plot and the ability to participate in rational debate to the point where you actively despise the Club and want them to do badly.

But try not to make yourself sound any more unreasonable than you already do with idiotic posts like that. I explained my reasoning, if you don't agree with it that's up to you.

[den]

Absolute rubbish Stuart. Your reaction is typical of that of many protestors, like a kid who doesn't get his own way, therefore you're reduced to being disparaging and patronising about fellow supporters who don't have the same point of view as you.

The common insult thrown at non protesters is that you're lazy, apathetic or don't care or are doing nothing. I have thought it all through and AM doing something. I am of the view that if there is still to be a Club to rescue then the Venky's have gone then a certain number of supporters need to stick by the Club until the bitter end and we'll see what happens. Without an obvious alternative I am not going to actively lobby against the only thing currently preventing us from going under either. I realise the argument is that the support of those still going keeps the V's at the Club longer but I don't think that is the case. We are still losing money hand over fist and if money was the decisive factor in them staying or leaving they would have been gone long before now.

None of this makes me or any of the other attendees a "superfan" as is the other usual snotty insult thrown about. I merely hope there will still be a Club to salvage when V's go, and that we will still be attractive enough for someone else to take us over.

So fans that still attend are not doing "nothing" they have taken a positive course of action and made a certain decision to still attend games even though strictly speaking the quality of the product on offer doesn't warrant it.

"Without an obvious alternative"

Says everything Rev.

[DE.]

Not going to get involved in the pro/anti-protesting argument as both camps' minds are not for changing and any debate is wasted effort at this juncture.

What I will say is that I don't agree with the "all views must be respected" mantra. Are we saying if a person comes on here and starts praising Venky's (eg. Ewood Spark) that we have to respect that opinion? Absolute nonsense. An opinion only need be shown respect if it is backed up by solid reasoning. Otherwise it's perfectly valid to oppose it.

If you can defend your position, then defend it well and ignore personal jibes as if a person needs to get personal it shows they have already lost the argument. If you struggle to defend your opinion then perhaps it's time to consider changing it.

[arbitro]

It's obvious from all your recent postings that your hatred for Venky's has caused you completely to lose the plot and the ability to participate in rational debate to the point where you actively despise the Club and want them to do badly.

But try not to make yourself sound any more unreasonable than you already do with idiotic posts like that. I explained my reasoning, if you don't agree with it that's up to you.

What is obvious to me is quite the opposite. He loves the club but hates the people who own and run it. I know exactly where he is coming from and in many ways it is harder for anybody who is boycotting than for those still going. From your recent posts you are happy for them to remain to pay the bills. Some would argue that whilst they are doing this we are getting into more debt from which we may never recover.

[RevidgeBlue]

I don't get it. I'll be there when the Venky's have gone. A lot will. Doesn't mean I'm going to subsidise them now. We could pack out Ewood every week and it wouldn't make diddly squat of a difference to our debt or losses.

My opinion is that every person who enters that turnstile and doesn't protest in some way is as good as saying "I endorse what Venky's are doing to BRFC". You are merely a statistic to them. The money goes out of your back pocket and into theirs. I don't think it's saving the club but providing them with a reason to stick around as keeping you around will give them a chance of breaking even when we're in League One.

I also don't buy this about needing to keep attendances up to look an attractive proposition for a takeover. Any potential investor will do their due diligence and look at attendances pre-Venky's, incl our previous spell in the Champ and think "hmm maybe the attendances are so low in protest of the owners". The information is there and I don't think a potential investor would be daft enough not to look into this.

I don't know if most ST holders have convinced themselves they are somehow saving the club but I'd say turning up at Ewood as if everything is normal is as good as doing nothing.

How do you know?

A mass boycott would ring alarm bells. A packed out Ewood would make everyone in Pune happy.

We can't be there then Venky's have gone if we've already gone bust. Secondly I feel the further we drop and the more the fans drop off the less attractive we become to alternative investors.

Finally, if protests by a relatively small number of fans are deemed to be a good thing and meant to grab the attention, why wouldn't protests by a much larger number be even more effective?

[Neal]

It's obvious from all your recent postings that your hatred for Venky's has caused you completely to lose the plot

Mate, you said "I have thought about it and I am doing something"... Comedy gold... And now you're telling me I've lost the plot! You've been good value today fella.

The rest was unreasonable drivel as expected, astounding how YOU can call anyone else unreasonable looking at your posts, at least I'm honest enough to say that on the subject of Rovers I'm pretty unreasonable these days but it's pretty simple in my view, I know right from wrong. Yes, I despise the owners, I despise many of it's employees but you unreasonably oversee that folk protest because they want the best for their club. I understand why you attend but that doesn't mean I won't judge you for it just like you've judged me.

You can continue to call me whatever you like, nothing bothers me anymore, call me unreasonable but you've drawn your line in the sand and at least I and many others know what you are now.

[RevidgeBlue]

What is obvious to me is quite the opposite. He loves the club but hates the people who own and run it. I know exactly where he is coming from and in many ways it is harder for anybody who is boycotting than for those still going. From your recent posts you are happy for them to remain to pay the bills. Some would argue that whilst they are doing this we are getting into more debt from which we may never recover.

That's a very fair point but the counter argument is that while there's still life there's hope. What if Venky's walked away tomorrow and refused to write off their proportion of the debt and no-one would take us on? That's the end of that let alone "may" never recover.

It's not an easy conundrum, we're stuck between a rock and a hard place. We all would like them out in an ideal world but unfortunately we need them in the immediate term due to the God awful mess they've created.