[Archived] Unsustainable Rovers

[Stuart]

This really deserves its own topic given the revelation last night.

This has to be of grave concern. We are already over £100m in debt and are now apparently using short term high interest loans rather than Venkys putting any cash in.

This is the territory we would be looking at post-Venkys in desperation survive in the short term (without a Seneca) - yet here we are with Venkys still here but not putting any money in. How can there be any faith that we will spend any transfer fee ever again under Venkys? We can't even match other offers for Mahoney by all accounts.

If fans now wait to see what division we are in before renewing, and take their chances on season ticket pricing, then the club's cash flow plans will be in ruins. If the club then put the price up there will be a lot of folk who will walk away again. The club are taking a big gamble here by threatening fans in this way. It will not garner any loyalty, instead they are relying on the most blindly loyal fans, and those who continue to go in spite of Venkys.

But if that is the stick, the threat of a ST price increase and the implied threat of further financial consequences for the club, then what is the carrot? There isn't one. They can't even offer our young rising star, home grown, Rovers fan a contract worth staying for - not without increasing our debt on an exponential basis.

Despite Senior's polished patter, and Mowbray's fatherly demeanour, the biggest threat today is Venkys lack of interest or pride. Their 'continued commitment' is completely at odds with the club having to go out and find cash on payday loan-style terms - presumably to pay wages. If this is the way forward ("you're on your own but we support you") then Venkys must sell and allow the fans to rally to the cause of saving the club.

Edit: it is noted the absence of any kind of commitment in their latest statement. More 'Good luck and thanks for all the fish'.

[Waggy76]

Venkys leaving asap !  is the only hope for the future of the club..

The longer their tenure lasts the deeper into the mire , we go ....

Venkys Out !

[duggy9197]

like i have said on 2 other threads,BOYCOTT the season ticket sales,its easy will bring this venkys regime to its knees.

[Mike Graham]

If you were an individual trying to make ends meet by regular short term loans would you be regarded as financially viable or a risk?  Add to that you have taken a mortgage (loan) out against future income.......what does that tell you?

No wonder Rovers are putting ST's on sale, they are desperate for the income.  I hope they have factored in that ST sales will probably drop again.  As for relegation we will really be in the mire.

Bad times is putting it mildly.

[Parsonblue]

The last few away games have seen adverts from the home team selling season tickets.  Many clubs have been selling them for weeks already.  It seems fairly standard to be selling tickets early and at last we seem to be catching on to what most teams in this division are doing.  Will happily renew next week as will the folk I went to last night's meeting with.  I thought Greg Coar made a valid point when he stated that many Championship clubs are taking in far more from ticket sales than the Rovers and that under FFP this revenue becomes increasingly important - particularly if we were to be relegated.  I think many of those who are still attending regularly - probably 7,000 or so - will happily renew within the next two months to make the most of the early bird offer.  If we retain Championship status I suspect that number will grow.  Listening to what was said last night, it seems clear that the owners have no intention of leaving so we can only hope that Senior and Mowbray can work together to improve our present standing.

[duggy9197]

So your quite happy with the goings on at ewood?

[chaddyrovers]

Duggy, I happy that the season tickets are going to be available so early. Gets it all sorted early for fans before the summer starts.

Also I very happy with the impact that Mowbray has had.

we all know the issues with the owners

[duggy9197]

Well hold onto your money and the issue may change.

[JBiz]

Apparently, and by all accounts....

Is it really worth creating another thread on another chubby red top rumour?

[duggy9197]

Just now, Jbizzle said:

Apparently, and by all accounts....

Is it really worth creating another thread on another chubby red top rumour?

Did you follow last nights events?

[Parsonblue]

Just now, duggy9197 said:

So your quite happy with the goings on at ewood?

I came away from last night's meeting feeling quite optimistic.  I was impressed by Senior and I believe Mowbray to be the best we have had since 'Big Sam', Souness and Hughes.  More than happy to renew, particularly with the price frozen until the end of May. 

[duggy9197]

But this is a chance to make the owners sit up and take notice the fans are not happy,jeez they can,t even video link to the supporters meeting,leaving the lackies to take the heat.

[JBiz]

Just now, duggy9197 said:

Did you follow last nights events?

Yea, the mortgage thing is from Nickos twitter and the part about Mahoney - listen to Mowbrays quotes on him. If he wants to leave for money to sit on a development squads bench, let him go.

Like PB, I feel a lot bettter about the direction of the club at current, releasing the STs late last season was criticised, this year they come early and that's criticised, or given alterior motive.

The idea that there should be a "carrot" completely undermines the argument that supporting a football club is like no other product.

[MCMC1875]

2 minutes ago, Jbizzle said:

Apparently, and by all accounts....

Is it really worth creating another thread on another chubby red top rumour?

It's in the accounts in black and white as Dunnfc has pointed out several times. Short term loans with interest rates of 8% and 14%. One of which is borrowed against next year's season ticket sales. Who is arranging these loans? I can't get 0.5% on a savings account.

[duggy9197]

Does anyone follow what nicko says these days,your took in by a slimey cockney spiv,mahoney leaving or staying is being blown up to make him look bad,after 6 yrs of lies fans still fall for it.

[Parsonblue]

Just now, duggy9197 said:

Does anyone follow what nicko says these days,your took in by a slimey cockney spiv,mahoney leaving or staying is being blown up to make him look bad,after 6 yrs of lies fans still fall for it.

No duggy, it's just that people have different opinions which is what some find difficult to accept.  I thought Mowbray dealt with the Mahoney situation exceptionally well last night.

[duggy9197]

for someone who gets limited game time they are making a big issue of Mahoney,

[RV Blue]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

This really deserves its own topic given the revelation last night.

This has to be of grave concern. We are already over £100m in debt and are now apparently using short term high interest loans rather than Venkys putting any cash in.

This is the territory we would be looking at post-Venkys in desperation survive in the short term (without a Seneca) - yet here we are with Venkys still here but not putting any money in. How can there be any faith that we will spend any transfer fee ever again under Venkys? We can't even match other offers for Mahoney by all accounts.

If fans now wait to see what division we are in before renewing, and take their chances on season ticket pricing, then the club's cash flow plans will be in ruins. If the club then put the price up there will be a lot of folk who will walk away again. The club are taking a big gamble here by threatening fans in this way. It will not garner any loyalty, instead they are relying on the most blindly loyal fans, and those who continue to go in spite of Venkys.

But if that is the stick, the threat of a ST price increase and the implied threat of further financial consequences for the club, then what is the carrot? There isn't one. They can't even offer our young rising star, home grown, Rovers fan a contract worth staying for - not without increasing our debt on an exponential basis.

Despite Senior's polished patter, and Mowbray's fatherly demeanour, the biggest threat today is Venkys lack of interest or pride. Their 'continued commitment' is completely at odds with the club having to go out and find cash on payday loan-style terms - presumably to pay wages. If this is the way forward ("you're on your own but we support you") then Venkys must sell and allow the fans to rally to the cause of saving the club.

Edit: it is noted the absence of any kind of commitment in their latest statement. More 'Good luck and thanks for all the fish'.

I think it's clear that they are trying to get the club into a position where it runs itself and they don't need to put any more money in. We have League 1 gates receipts and will no doubt end up in League 1 sooner rather than later. If this is the case, what are they going to do with the money we owe them? The only was they'd get it back would be if we spent a few seasons in the premier league, which clearly isn't going to happen if there's no money to spend. Surely the debts will have to be written off.

[47er]

1 hour ago, preston blue said:

If you were an individual trying to make ends meet by regular short term loans would you be regarded as financially viable or a risk?  Add to that you have taken a mortgage (loan) out against future income.......what does that tell you?

No wonder Rovers are putting ST's on sale, they are desperate for the income.  I hope they have factored in that ST sales will probably drop again.  As for relegation we will really be in the mire.

Bad times is putting it mildly.

They want fans to buy the tickets without knowing whether we will be relegated again. Fans will hold off till they know.

The club then expects them to pay a hefty premium to watch Div 1 football1 Lunatics!

[47er]

25 minutes ago, MCMC1875 said:

It's in the accounts in black and white as Dunnfc has pointed out several times. Short term loans with interest rates of 8% and 14%. One of which is borrowed against next year's season ticket sales. Who is arranging these loans? I can't get 0.5% on a savings account.

If J Biz doesn't like it, its a far-fetched rumour!

[47er]

22 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

No duggy, it's just that people have different opinions which is what some find difficult to accept.  I thought Mowbray dealt with the Mahoney situation exceptionally well last night.

Mowbray is not the club. He will do his best with what he's got to hand but can only affect events on the pitch.

Sadly that is all you are interested in. 

[DE.]

Just now, 47er said:

Mowbray is not the club. He will do his best with what he's got to hand but can only affect events on the pitch.

Sadly that is all you are interested in. 

Mowbray will most likely be gone within a year. If he does well at this cesspit a better resourced club will come in for him, and Rovers will jump at the chance of a little extra compensation cash. If he doesn't do well the brain trust will probably sack him and re-appoint Steve Kean.

Some of our fans will never see the bigger picture though, and it's pointless at this juncture to debate anything with them beyond what happens on the pitch. They just aren't interested in anything else.

[blueboy3333]

Just now, 47er said:

Mowbray is not the club. He will do his best with what he's got to hand but can only affect events on the pitch.

Sadly that is all you are interested in. 

And, sadly, you have no interest in that.

Anyway, if ToMo gets it right on the pitch we'll all be able to enjoy a right good promotion all our financial worries will float away into the ether. There will be 20k+ on Ewood again and the vast majority who attend will not give a toss who owns us. That is a guarantee.

[blueboy3333]

13 minutes ago, 47er said:

If J Biz doesn't like it, its a far-fetched rumour!

There have been a lot of far-fetched rumours on here over the last 7 years. We've been going into administration every year for the last 5 years just for starters. Maybe we should do a thread on rumours that didn't come to pass? What say you?

[47er]

God Almighty! If its in the balance sheets produced by the club its not a rumour is it?

Deliberately missing the point as usual.

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

And, sadly, you have no interest in that.

Anyway, if ToMo gets it right on the pitch we'll all be able to enjoy a right good promotion all our financial worries will float away into the ether. There will be 20k+ on Ewood again and the vast majority who attend will not give a toss who owns us. That is a guarantee.

I've no interest in what happens on the pitch? What an idiot.The two are connected.

BIGGER PICTURE!!