[Archived] Election called for 8th June

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I'll be voting enthusiastically for Labour and Corbyn on Thursday. Wether we win or not I don't know. The usual shameful bias against the Labour Party and anything remotely socialist by the gutter press must be worth 30- 40 seats to the Tories and that could be the difference. How anybody can vote for May and the Tories after this campaign I just don't know.  It's revealed just how inept they really are.

Having said that I won't be bent out of shape on a personal level if the news is bad on Friday morning. I'll be gutted for the " just managing " families out there that won't even be just managing in the future.

Whoever wins it's a poison chalice with the Brexit disaster just waiting around the corner. It'll be a pretty unpopular government that goes into the next election with the economy in an even more shambolic state than it is now.

Put your house on Labour winning the next election if the Tories get back this time.

[broadsword]

4 hours ago, dave birch said:

Baz, perhaps this might explain why:

Every time I pass the local school, there's a rather large sign that basically says the violence against women and girls is not on.

That, and the fact that a mate of mine is an advocate to eliminate violence against women and girls.

Additionally, my wife, through her profession, was was threatened by a well known sporting identity for assisting his (then) wife to leave him (because of domestic violence). It was only through the intervention of the court that he stopped.

You, and others might think it's "only a joke", but it's real life to others.

How are the two things in any way equatable?

Theresa May is a politician who's doing an exceptionally bad job and is full of waffle and soundbites. Den wasn't actually advocating smacking her with a shovel, it was a throwaway remark made out of frustration. It wouldn't have mattered what her gender was, she is being judged on what she does and says, nothing more than that.

I'm sorry that you wife has been threatened, that is indefensible. I can't help but feel that that is clouding your judgement.

[Dreyski]

1 hour ago, Paul said:

A group of posters who no longer post here must have made, between them, thousands of derogatory comments towards women, politicians, other BRFCS members, muslims, gays and ethnic minorities. Many of those one liners could be said to advance Islamophobia, racism and other views many people find unacceptable. If we limit the discussion to leading female politicians Nicola Sturgeon was regularly referred to by those posters as the "Scottish bitch." In the other areas I mention there are hundreds, thousands of examples of one liners which could be said to help propagate different and, to many, unacceptable views.

I was one button press away from posting something similar yesterday - I'm glad I didn't because you were far more gracious than I would have been.

[den]

Some good points from Paul.

However, - the election. I'm still expecting a sizeable Tory majority and for one reason. Corby needs to convert Tory voters into Labour voters, just as Blair did in 1997. That's where the Labour Party are still handicapped with Corbyn. Although he's offering a genuine alternative as people wanted, the negative, personal campaigning of the Tories will affect Labours chances. With a different leader, Labour would have stood a better chance. Unfortunately, as in the USA, personalities mean just as much as policies.

Tim Farron will be feeling pretty disconsolate as well. He must have expected to have seen far better polling results considering that he was giving the 48% that voted remain a voice in the EU negotiations. Sadly, I expect him to be replaced by his party.

Talking of the EU, May called this election to gain more support for her upcoming negotiations. What happened, did she actually give us any more information of how she'll go about those negotiations or what she's aiming for? No, it was an unprepared, instinctive grab for more power. Heck, they didn't go in with anything like a comprehensive, costed manifesto. As with Tim, she'll be gone as soon as her party see fit - which will likely be after negotiations are concluded.

[joey_big_nose]

Just now, den said:

Talking of the EU, May called this election to gain more support for her upcoming negotiations. What happened, did she actually give us any more information of how she'll go about those negotiations or what she's aiming for? No, it was an unprepared, instinctive grab for more power. Heck, they didn't go in with anything like a comprehensive, costed manifesto. As with Tim, she'll be gone as soon as her party see fit - which will likely be after negotiations are concluded.

I think she should extend her majority slightly, but you are right her personal leadership, credibility and support has been absolutely shot to pieces. Ive not seen a fall from grace like it. Totally destroyed in six short weeks..!

As much as Corbyn has been a handicap for Labour, May even more so for the Conservatives.

As for the next election after this one it will surely go to whoever builds a "one nation" centerist platform like Macron in France. It's a question of who gets there first, or whether we will have this daft situation of both major parties being in the thrall of their more extreme elements.

[Husky]

I've already stated that I won't be voting due to the undemocratic and rigged system that persists in the UK (long live the Brexit vote!!).

However having said that - Dianne Abbot! Holy @#/?! Can they not gag her?  I'm not rich enough to ever vote for the Saudi Conservative Arabia party, but if I was thinking about voting Labour, that Abbot woman would be a sure-fire vote loser. An absolute car crash for the Labour party and from reading many comments on social media I'm not the only one that thinks that way. Surely the Labour party must know she's an absolute liability? As I said, they should have gagged her (even literally).

[DE.]

2 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Whoever wins it's a poison chalice with the Brexit disaster just waiting around the corner. It'll be a pretty unpopular government that goes into the next election with the economy in an even more shambolic state than it is now.

Makes you wonder if the Tories are trying to lose on purpose! 

[joey_big_nose]

29 minutes ago, Husky said:

I've already stated that I won't be voting due to the undemocratic and rigged system that persists in the UK (long live the Brexit vote!!).

However having said that - Dianne Abbot! Holy @#/?! Can they not gag her?  I'm not rich enough to ever vote for the Saudi Conservative Arabia party, but if I was thinking about voting Labour, that Abbot woman would be a sure-fire vote loser. An absolute car crash for the Labour party and from reading many comments on social media I'm not the only one that thinks that way. Surely the Labour party must know she's an absolute liability? As I said, they should have gagged her (even literally).

I agree having Diane Abbot, McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn in three of the top four jobs is a bizarre position to be in. Who would have imagined that two years ago? But then they are up against a very weak Tory front bench too.

Politics at the moment is really at a very very low ebb. We need to figure out how to get more talent into Parliament. The whole system needs looking at, right through from a full review of FPTP to how the House of Lords works. There just isn't much quality coming through, and we are all suffering for it.

To be honest, I think a lot of this is due to the general cynicism with which politics is viewed, which leads to capable people not wanting to get involved. Really you want some of your best people to be in parliament, but that - with a fair few exceptions - is not what generally happens today.

[Mike E]

Thinking about it, if someone like Hilary Benn was in Diane Abbott's place, I reckon we'd be looking at a Labour majority. The only serious weakness in the party in Abbott, but Corbyn and Starmer are real strengths. McDonnell isn't my favourite bloke, but Corbyn seems to keep him reasonably reigned in, particularly aided by Corbyn's democratic principles and willingness to listen to the 'right' within the party.

[JBiz]

Moaning about Dianne Abbott and the damage she could do, whilst ignoring the damage that Boris the buffoon has done already really doesn't work.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

58 minutes ago, den said:

Some good points from Paul.

However, - the election. I'm still expecting a sizeable Tory majority and for one reason. Corby needs to convert Tory voters into Labour voters, just as Blair did in 1997. That's where the Labour Party are still handicapped with Corbyn. Although he's offering a genuine alternative as people wanted, the negative, personal campaigning of the Tories will affect Labours chances. With a different leader, Labour would have stood a better chance. Unfortunately, as in the USA, personalities mean just as much as policies.

Tim Farron will be feeling pretty disconsolate as well. He must have expected to have seen far better polling results considering that he was giving the 48% that voted remain a voice in the EU negotiations. Sadly, I expect him to be replaced by his party.

Talking of the EU, May called this election to gain more support for her upcoming negotiations. What happened, did she actually give us any more information of how she'll go about those negotiations or what she's aiming for? No, it was an unprepared, instinctive grab for more power. Heck, they didn't go in with anything like a comprehensive, costed manifesto. As with Tim, she'll be gone as soon as her party see fit - which will likely be after negotiations are concluded.

I can't agree Den. With a different Labour leader we'd still be flogging the old, tired Tory lite policies that the electorate have turned their back on.

The Tories will always vote Tory and potential Labour voters aren't inspired by the old policies.

Corbyn has had a good campaign inspite of all the doubters and back stabbers on the benches behind him.

Win, lose or draw the national political agenda has been moved more to the centre left. If the Tories ignore that fact they do so at their peril.

[broadsword]

Johnson is loyal only to himself. I wouldn't leave him in charge of a burger bar. 

You can't say he's both a buffoon and capable. Let's be honest. He's only where he is now because he was born into money and went to the right school

[den]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I can't agree Den. With a different Labour leader we'd still be flogging the old, tired Tory lite policies that the electorate have turned their back on.

The Tories will always vote Tory and potential Labour voters aren't inspired by the old policies.

Corbyn has had a good campaign inspite of all the doubters and back stabbers on the benches behind him.

Win, lose or draw the national political agenda has been moved more to the centre left. If the Tories ignore that fact they do so at their peril.

Three landslide Labour victories didn't come with left wing policies Tyrone. 

[DE.]

Just now, broadsword said:

born into money and went to the right school

Should be the Tory party slogan.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, den said:

Three landslide Labour victories didn't come with left wing policies Tyrone. 

That's true in the medium term Den but look where we are now. Blair did more damage to the Labour Party than anything the Tories have ever managed.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, broadsword said:

Johnson is loyal only to himself. I wouldn't leave him in charge of a burger bar. 

You can't say he's both a buffoon and capable. Let's be honest. He's only where he is now because he was born into money and went to the right school

Not only that but under all the buffoonery there is a very, very nasty, ruthless man. 

[den]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

That's true in the medium term Den but look where we are now. Blair did more damage to the Labour Party than anything the Tories have ever managed.

Have to disagree with that Tyrone. We have different views about Blair.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, den said:

Have to disagree with that Tyrone. We have different views about Blair.

Ok.

[joey_big_nose]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I can't agree Den. With a different Labour leader we'd still be flogging the old, tired Tory lite policies that the electorate have turned their back on.

The Tories will always vote Tory and potential Labour voters aren't inspired by the old policies.

Corbyn has had a good campaign inspite of all the doubters and back stabbers on the benches behind him.

Win, lose or draw the national political agenda has been moved more to the centre left. If the Tories ignore that fact they do so at their peril.

As much as I wish it was true I think your basic point - that a majority  of people want policies to the left of Blairist third way stuff - just does not stand up to analysis.

There are certain areas where there is a willingness to go left - tuition fees and renationalising the railways for example - but there is no appetite for wholesale socialism. Labour have played a solid game of moderating their message in the manifesto. However if they come out with some more radical stuff theyll get absolutely minced.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

In that case the Tories have us exactly where they want us.

Genuine Tory policies when they are in power and when the electorate has had enough of that, Tory lite policies when Labour are in power. Repeat as necessary.

[Speedie Dived]

7 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I'll be voting enthusiastically for Labour and Corbyn on Thursday. Wether we win or not I don't know. The usual shameful bias against the Labour Party and anything remotely socialist by the gutter press must be worth 30- 40 seats to the Tories and that could be the difference. How anybody can vote for May and the Tories after this campaign I just don't know.  It's revealed just how inept they really are.

Having said that I won't be bent out of shape on a personal level if the news is bad on Friday morning. I'll be gutted for the " just managing " families out there that won't even be just managing in the future.

Whoever wins it's a poison chalice with the Brexit disaster just waiting around the corner. It'll be a pretty unpopular government that goes into the next election with the economy in an even more shambolic state than it is now.

Put your house on Labour winning the next election if the Tories get back this time.

I agree entirely. They called a referendum they didn't want, destroyed Cameron. They have called a general election that has shown everyone what the PM is really like and it's now dawned on them we are heading for a bloodbath with Brexit, with said PM probably leading the negotiations.

I do not think May will survive Brexit, she will be ousted as the outrage will be fierce when it dawns on people what the Tories have done.

[Baz]

6 hours ago, Husky said:

I've already stated that I won't be voting due to the undemocratic and rigged system that persists in the UK (long live the Brexit vote!!).

However having said that - Dianne Abbot! Holy @#/?! Can they not gag her?  I'm not rich enough to ever vote for the Saudi Conservative Arabia party, but if I was thinking about voting Labour, that Abbot woman would be a sure-fire vote loser. An absolute car crash for the Labour party and from reading many comments on social media I'm not the only one that thinks that way. Surely the Labour party must know she's an absolute liability? As I said, they should have gagged her (even literally).

I don't know where you live Husky, but if it's Blackburn, a vote for the Venkys out party? If not, then at least go and spoil your ballot, or vote for a party that wants proportional representation. You can't change a system if you don't get involved.

[Steve Moss]

Conservatives expected to gain 31 seats and have a clear majority.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/06/06/can-people-rather-than-pollsters-accurately-predict-thursdays-u-k-election/?utm_term=.076aa2e79c5b 

[JBiz]

Mo money, mo problems.

 

[Mike E]

7 hours ago, Suhail Slayer said:

Surely you are joking Mike.

Labour are unelectable under Corbyn. Abbott is embarrassing. You wouldn't trust the running of the country in the hands of these people.

 

Nope, I posted precisely what I believe.

I only know that I cannot trust Theresa May to run the country, I can't take her at her word as she u-turns every month, I can't trust Hammond any more than Abbott, I can't trust Boris Johnson to do anything other than embarrass the UK.

Jeremy Corbyn and Keir Starmer are the most formidable pair of negotiators on offer for Brexit and I believe that is the priority (and that's before I think about the Conservatives' AWFUL record in government).

For years people have said 'politicians are all the same', and now someone different has come along. I believe that if Labour don't get in this time, they're pretty much guaranteed a majority in 2022.