[Archived] Last Game: Aston Villa (H) Saturday 29th April, Kick off 15.00

[den]

Just now, Gav said:

 

  Posters on here backed themselves into a corner on Rhodes, on a match day everyone loved the lad because he scored goals, its not even worth debating.

I brought up the 'lacking footballing knowledge' theme and have argued against it vehemently in the past, but I do think it holds some truth the more I think about it.

I've been all over the world watching football and can count on one hand the amount of times I've heard home teams players being booed when the teams read out, or cheered when being substituted, it happens but very rarely. Most recent example would be Fellaini at United and we all know the United home crowd is made up of uneducated, in footballing terms, day trippers.

Off the top of my head we've had Jimmy Quinn, Jason Wilcox, Mark Atkins, Tim Sherwood, Richard Brown, Keith Andrews, Chris Brown and Lowe that have all been booed by their own fans, how can that be acceptable? how can that be anything other than a crowd, or section of, lacking footballing knowledge? 

I'm open to being convinced either way, but as someone who has never booed his own players ever I can't get my head around it. 

Yeah, you did. 

on Jason Lowe, you argue he's better than some fans think because all our managers picked him - and you trust their judgement over the fans. Yet when managers don't want Rhodes and don't play him, those managers are wrong.

posters "lacking knowledge" eh?  

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, den said:

Yeah, you did. 

on Jason Lowe, you argue he's better than some fans think because all our managers picked him - and you trust their judgement over the fans. Yet when managers don't want Rhodes and don't play him, those managers are wrong.

posters "lacking knowledge" eh?  

Fair point.

However, the two managers who left Rhodes out, (Strachan and Karanka) saw their sides tank. Whilst the various managers who have played Lowe in midfield for Rovers over the last few seasons have seen the fortunes of their sides steadily decline.

[Stuart]

Just now, Gav said:

Posters on here backed themselves into a corner on Rhodes, on a match day everyone loved the lad because he scored goals, its not even worth debating.

I brought up the 'lacking footballing knowledge' theme and have argued against it vehemently in the past, but I do think it holds some truth the more I think about it.

I've been all over the world watching football and can count on one hand the amount of times I've heard home teams players being booed when the teams read out, or cheered when being substituted, it happens but very rarely. Most recent example would be Fellaini at United and we all know the United home crowd is made up of uneducated, in footballing terms, day trippers.

Off the top of my head we've had Jimmy Quinn, Jason Wilcox, Mark Atkins, Tim Sherwood, Richard Brown, Keith Andrews, Chris Brown and Lowe that have all been booed by their own fans, how can that be acceptable? how can that be anything other than a crowd, or section of, lacking footballing knowledge? 

I'm open to being convinced either way, but as someone who has never booed his own players ever I can't get my head around it. 

Gav, of all people you should know full well about being backed into a corner over the Allardyce-hate.

Rhodes' record at Rovers will stand up to scrutiny (as will Allardyce) what will the record books say about Lowe? Appearances 195; Goals 1; Captain 2016/17 (Relegated to L1). What's the best superlative that could be used to describe him? "Good engine".

I'm not even sure why this is still a debate. Check back, I have stopped bringing either player up and only respond when others start trying to reinvent history.

But ignoring all that, what do you even mean by "Lack of footballing knowledge"? Do you mean people shouldn't express their displeasure on a match day? People should clap a poor player that they hold partly responsible for the team being so negative? Genuinely don't know what your getting at with that line.

How about Arsenal fans booing Wenger? Or better still Rovers fans booing Kean? Or Yakubu or Bradley Orr for publically supporting him? Because I guess, by extension, nobody should boo their own manager either? Or owners for that matter? Or is it only the things that you decide which make it into the "football knowledge" slur?

[Stuart]

Just now, den said:

Yeah, you did. 

on Jason Lowe, you argue he's better than some fans think because all our managers picked him - and you trust their judgement over the fans. Yet when managers don't want Rhodes and don't play him, those managers are wrong.

posters "lacking knowledge" eh?  

Half right, den.

The double standards is that Rhodes got picked and contributed and was derided as not good enough. Lowe gets picked and runs around a lot. Yet Rhodes was a "forced pick" and Lowe is "selected on merit"?

As a Championship side I know who I'd rather our midfielders were passing the ball to.

[den]

Just now, RevidgeBlue said:

Fair point.

However, the two managers who left Rhodes out, (Strachan and Karanka) saw their sides tank. Whilst the various managers who have played Lowe in midfield for Rovers over the last few seasons have seen the fortunes of their sides steadily decline.

Lambert didn't want him, while he's not first choice at Sheffield wed either. That's four so far. 

[roverstdt]

Surprised that Williams won player of the season. I would have thought Mulgrew, Gallagher, or someone else would have. I guess he was the most consistent...

[jim mk2]

 

Says it all about our season really. The games I've seen Williams has been one of our worst players, certainly one of the poorest left backs in the club's history.  

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, roverstdt said:

Surprised that Williams won player of the season. I would have thought Mulgrew, Gallagher, or someone else would have. I guess he was the most consistent...

Even worse was Graham winning the disabled supporters award. 

At least Williams is a trier. Graham played his socks off last season whilst on loan to earn himself a permanent deal then having got that in the bag couldn't be bothered to get himself properly fit at any point this season.

Perhaps he will when he moves on to a new Club at the end of the season.

[Stuart]

Just now, jim mk2 said:

Says it all about our season really. The games I've seen Williams has been one of our worst players, certainly one of the poorest left backs in the club's history.  

I honestly think the voting was a sham.

Only about 9 players were on view for the voting. At one stage Williams had 500+ votes and second place had 60+.

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, Stuart said:

I honestly think the voting was a sham.

Only about 9 players were on view for the voting. At one stage Williams had 500+ votes and second place had 60+.

Seems that way whether by accident or design.

Only two viable candidates surely. Mulgrew or Lenihan.

[Mike E]

Maybe the voting was 'forced' in such a way to up his value to be sold? POTY tends to be on their way out...

[Stuart]

Just now, Mike E said:

Maybe the voting was 'forced' in such a way to up his value to be sold? POTY tends to be on their way out...

Entirely possible. Lowe is captain due to being longest serving. Williams could well be POTY because of the length of his contract.

Did you know that we have nobody on contract with more than two years left?

All of the players at the two more years point look like they are the most likely to go (except - probably Raya) because they have some value:

Mulgrew, Evans, Stokes, Lenihan, Williams.

(Although I doubt anybody wants Stokes).

Plus, those with one year left:

Graham, Conway, Steele, Bennett, Feeney, Ward, Nyambe.

Frankly I could see each of them leaving for different reasons.

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, Stuart said:

Entirely possible. Lowe is captain due to being longest serving. Williams could well be POTY because of the length of his contract.

Did you know that we have nobody on contract with more than two years left?

All of the players at the two more years point look like they are the most likely to go (except - probably Raya) because they have some value:

Mulgrew, Evans, Stokes, Lenihan, Williams.

(Although I doubt anybody wants Stokes).

Plus, those with one year left:

Graham, Conway, Steele, Bennett, Feeney, Ward, Nyambe.

Frankly I could see each of them leaving for different reasons.

The only ones of those I'd definitely like to see stay are Raya Mulgrew Lenihan. 

I'd probably prefer to keep Nyambe as well. Rest of them - See ya later.

[Stuart]

Just now, RevidgeBlue said:

The only ones of those I'd definitely like to see stay are Raya Mulgrew Lenihan. 

I'd probably prefer to keep Nyambe as well. Rest of them - See ya later.

I'd add Conway and Bennett.

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, Stuart said:

I'd add Conway and Bennett.

Maybe Bennett but I'm not at all convinced by him based on his time at Ewood as a whole.

Conway would be one of the first ones out for me, completely past it imo. 

That said I remember thinking like this a couple of seasons ago. "Rhodes and Gestede in, everyone else out" They're in fact the ones that go, you're left with the others who have massively underperformed for you and here we are 2 years down the line.

[broadsword]

I doubt players will be going our of the door on any other basis than how much money they can raise. 

Mogga man has been given a man's promise that he'll have cash to spend but my guess is that that promise is worth nothing at all. 

I'll have a stab in the dark as some sort of anti-Mercer cackling villain. 

Rovers to go down. Mog man to walk when it becomes apparent the promises are worthless. No incoming players at all. We'll get to the week before the season starts and have eight first teamers left. We'll  hastily get some loans and frees in. We won't win a single game in August and September and go bust in October. Twelve points deducted, new owners by Christmas, starting down the barrel of league two this time next year. 

Relax, put your feet up, put a bottle of carpet glue on ice, stay doing stone yogic flying, no need to be negative, champions' league in two years etc

[Neil Weaver]

6 hours ago, broadsword said:

I'll have a stab in the dark as some sort of anti-Mercer cackling villain. 

Rovers to go down. Mog man to walk when it becomes apparent the promises are worthless. No incoming players at all. We'll get to the week before the season starts and have eight first teamers left. We'll  hastily get some loans and frees in. We won't win a single game in August and September and go bust in October. Twelve points deducted, new owners by Christmas, starting down the barrel of league two this time next year. 

 

Thought you were getting all suicidal there Bry, till you mentioned that bit in bold and the true Mercerman-like colours shone through.  Hope you're right about that bit, might make the other things you mention almost acceptable.