[Archived] Checkatrade Trophy

[JAL]

Thought the players put in 100% but they barely reached 50% of our expectations plus when you've only one outlet and a big blonde lump in the midfield and the fullbacks absolutely crap from a supporting point of view and one of the worst coaches in our dugout David Lowe what else should we come to expect.

Why wasn't the first team second choice goalie not playing though Fisher did reasonably well.

Nyambe can't head a ball so he resorted quite cleverly to pulling the forward down without putting him on the floor which is OK, but how long can he get away with this before he's found out.

Thought Bury's left back looked far better than our lads on last night's showing.

 

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Maybe the under 23s are realizing that regardless of what they do, they won't get a look in. Nutall was on fire earlier in the season, but was not given a chance. All while the likes of Graham and Gladwin were lumbering around the field for the first team. 

I am led to understand that at least one or two of the youngsters are dissatisfied with the lack of opportunity and given the fact they're not getting a chance would like to go out on loan to get some game time. 

However we are apparently not willing to let them go out on loan in case a few i njuries strike and they're needed to sit on the bench.

The whole thing, especially the presumption that they could only ever be good enough to warm the bench seems absolutely crazy to me.

[JBiz]

Just now, RevidgeBlue said:

I am led to understand that at least one or two of the youngsters are dissatisfied with the lack of opportunity and given the fact they're not getting a chance would like to go out on loan to get some game time. 

However we are apparently not willing to let them go out on loan in case a few i njuries strike and they're needed to sit on the bench.

The whole thing, especially the presumption that they could only ever be good enough to warm the bench seems absolutely crazy to me.

It's a bit catch 22 Rev - we can't really afford to stay at this level for more than a season, so I can understand the current managers reluctance to blood lots of younger players.

 

[JAL]

Just now, Biz said:

It's a bit catch 22 Rev - we can't really afford to stay at this level for more than a season, so I can understand the current managers reluctance to blood lots of younger players.

 

If they're not good enough that's more reason why, look at how Nyambe has shaped.

The clubs has had to bring in younger players on loan from outside.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, RevidgeBlue said:

I am led to understand that at least one or two of the youngsters are dissatisfied with the lack of opportunity and given the fact they're not getting a chance would like to go out on loan to get some game time. 

However we are apparently not willing to let them go out on loan in case a few i njuries strike and they're needed to sit on the bench.

The whole thing, especially the presumption that they could only ever be good enough to warm the bench seems absolutely crazy to me.

Not integrating more of the under 23s in is my number 1 gripe with Mowbray. Its like he includes Nyambe as he was already there when he arrived, but he won't include arguably better players such as ;Tomlinson, Travis, Doyle, Rankin-Costello, Hardcastle, Mols and Nutall.

Last night was a great opportunity, but being involved in games like that is just deflating for the younger players if Mowbray is treating it with such an indifferent attitude. Bury came to Ewood last night and bet us, terrible stuff. That will definitely help them for their next "real" visit. 

They are about to enter an international break, I would have expected the players to run themselves into the ground knowing a break is coming up. Very disappointed about last night to be honest. 

[RevidgeBlue]

Just now, Biz said:

It's a bit catch 22 Rev - we can't really afford to stay at this level for more than a season, so I can understand the current managers reluctance to blood lots of younger players.

 

I can't legislate for how the manager thinks but if it were me I'd be far more cautious about throwing them in the higher the level we wete competing at.

If they cant get a game in League 1, when are they ever going to get a game?

[JHRover]

7 minutes ago, Biz said:

It's a bit catch 22 Rev - we can't really afford to stay at this level for more than a season, so I can understand the current managers reluctance to blood lots of younger players.

 

Indeed, we're not really in a position where we can take gambles by throwing large numbers of young players in. Imagine the grief Mowbray would get if he did that and we missed out on promotion.

I can understand a preference to stick with experience and hesitation in dropping in several U23 players even though they are doing well. Very little room for error and so he has to go with the 'safest' option.

What I can't understand is signing people over the summer like Hart and Harper when there is a big question over whether these people are an improvement on our own kids, or even whether they are as good as our own kids, and what the point really was in signing them.

Further to that on recent displays I'm struggling to believe that Gladwin offers anything that couldn't have been sourced from the U23s instead of paying a fee for him this summer.

[JacknOry]

Just now, JHRover said:

Indeed, we're not really in a position where we can take gambles by throwing large numbers of young players in. Imagine the grief Mowbray would get if he did that and we missed out on promotion.

I can understand a preference to stick with experience and hesitation in dropping in several U23 players even though they are doing well. Very little room for error and so he has to go with the 'safest' option.

What I can't understand is signing people over the summer like Hart and Harper when there is a big question over whether these people are an improvement on our own kids, or even whether they are as good as our own kids, and what the point really was in signing them.

Further to that on recent displays I'm struggling to believe that Gladwin offers anything that couldn't have been sourced from the U23s instead of paying a fee for him this summer.

100% this.

 

[Parsonblue]

3 minutes ago, JAL said:

Thought the players put in 100% but they barely reached 50% of our expectations plus when you've only one outlet and a big blonde lump in the midfield and the fullbacks absolutely crap from a supporting point of view and one of the worst coaches in our dugout David Lowe what else should we come to expect.

Why wasn't the first team second choice goalie not playing though Fisher did reasonably well.

Nyambe can't head a ball so he resorted quite cleverly to pulling the forward down without putting him on the floor which is OK, but how long can he get away with this before he's found out.

Thought Bury's left back looked far better than our lads on last night's showing.

 

Leutwiler wasn't involved because he is away on international duty with Canada.  Nyambe is a right back and not a centre-back but with Wharton not fully fit and Ward clearly opting not to play there was nobody left.  I thought Travis, Nyambe and Platt didn't do too badly and, along with Fisher, were our best performers on the night.  I'm quite happy with Mowbray in general but I thought last night was poor from all concerned.  If that was the team he wanted to play it beggars belief that they had done no preparation.  With no match at the weekend he could easily have done what Bury did and put out the strongest eleven available.  A win last night would have put them through to the knock-out stages.  Now, if he wants to progress he will have to select a side strong enough to win at Rochdale - at a point in the season when we have a busy League programme.  The performances of Gladwin, Whittingham and Graham were particularly worrying as none looked to be remotely interested.  Gladwin was appalling from start to finish.  One really has to question the value of this competition in general.  In the last round Bury fielded a very young side and got hammered and I noticed that Stanley had a largely reserve team out last night when Blackpool beat them.  If the clubs don't want it and the fans don't want it and the players clearly aren't too bothered - what is the point?

[JHRover]

I wanted us to participate and take this competition seriously for the novelty factor and because I believed that if we did take it seriously we would have a very good chance of reaching Wembley and lifting a trophy.

I don't accept it is a threat to promotion as Bristol City showed a couple of years ago the two can work hand in hand.

However, last night was mind numbing to watch, clear the manager and players aren't really interested, and if, heaven forbid, we remain in this league in years to come I think I'd prefer it if this competition ceased to exist.

[darrenrover]

I think the comments from Mowbray are outrageous and perhaps typical of what's still going on at our 'rudderless ship'.

I can understand the lack of interest in the competition but without doubt his attitude will transmit to the squad.

It begs the question, what goes on at training? Are all players expected to do the graft to get them truly match fit? Based on these comments I can hardly imagine Danny Graham spewing up at the side of the pitch as he's pushed himself in pre-season training!

I think Rovers' wins in the league this season have in the main been fortunate in one respect or another and more down to poor opposition than us being a decent team.

All the signs thus far this season are that we're not good enough to gain automatic promotion and until someone stamps their authority on the club in general, we're only going oneway.

A car will roll down a hill of it's own accord but needs a driver to go uphill. Who's our driver?

[Parsonblue]

5 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I wanted us to participate and take this competition seriously for the novelty factor and because I believed that if we did take it seriously we would have a very good chance of reaching Wembley and lifting a trophy.

I don't accept it is a threat to promotion as Bristol City showed a couple of years ago the two can work hand in hand.

However, last night was mind numbing to watch, clear the manager and players aren't really interested, and if, heaven forbid, we remain in this league in years to come I think I'd prefer it if this competition ceased to exist.

That's what I don't understand JHR.  This competition is the equivalent of the old Full Members' Cup for lower league clubs.  Winning that in 1987 led to a rival in our fortunes and renewed interest in the club - not to mention a great day out at Wembley.

[JHRover]

5 minutes ago, darrenrover said:

I think the comments from Mowbray are outrageous and perhaps typical of what's still going on at our 'rudderless ship'.

I can understand the lack of interest in the competition but without doubt his attitude will transmit to the squad.

Really quite concerning some of the things he has come out with in the last few weeks. We can only hope some of it has been 'lost in translation' or 'taken out of context'.

I can't quite comprehend a manager asking senior players if they fancy playing in a cup game. Where I come from the manager decides on his team to play and then the players do as they are told. If a player doesn't 'fancy' a game when it is 11 days until our next league outing then perhaps they shouldn't be at the club. Utterly bizarre and to me it seems he is undermining his own authority by putting selection decisions into the hands of 'senior' players some of whom already seem to think they are too good for this league. What sort of ego trip would they have had when the manager offered them a night off if they wanted it?

For the manager to then admit after the game that they didn't prepare for the match stinks really. For starters if the fans are paying to get in then there should always be a determination to win and preparation to do that. Secondly, what were they doing on the training ground between Saturday and last night? Thirdly, what is Mowbray being paid for If he is deciding to not even bother with a cup game?

Bonkers really and he should have the sense by now to realise that silly comments like these will be picked up on and used against him down the line if our 'promotion campaign' is derailed and he'll have nowhere to hide.

[JHRover]

10 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

That's what I don't understand JHR.  This competition is the equivalent of the old Full Members' Cup for lower league clubs.  Winning that in 1987 led to a rival in our fortunes and renewed interest in the club - not to mention a great day out at Wembley.

Realistically we aren't going to win the League or FA Cups for a while. If we were to progress in the FA Cup then it would interfere with our league campaign and create a fixture backlog and some would argue that might harm our promotion chances.

So really other than winning this league the Checkatrade Trophy is our best chance and only chance of lifting silverware, putting some pride back in the club by going to Wembley and adding to the club's honours board, and I don't think it is a burden on our league campaign when these games are taking place during international breaks.

I might be in a minority but I quite fancied the potential to get to Wembley in a cup final and see us lift a trophy, irrespective of what competition it is.

Clearly not over with yet but continue to approach games as we have so far and Rochdale will sort us out at their place and we'll be out of it.

[Bigdoggsteel]

If ward the lazy sod is currently fighting for his first team place, why would he choose not to play last night? 

The whole thing is ridiculous if you ask me 

[darrenrover]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

If ward the lazy sod is currently fighting for his first team place, why would he choose not to play last night? 

The whole thing is ridiculous if you ask me 

Still gets his wage irrespective whilst he's under contract, does he not?

Doesn't matter whether they're crap, unfit, perform or don't perform, whilst they're under contract they can draw their wedge.

Why else are most of them here?

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, darrenrover said:

Still gets his wage irrespective whilst he's under contract, does he not?

Doesn't matter whether they're crap, unfit, perform or don't perform, whilst they're under contract they can draw their wedge.

Why else are most of them here?

Ya, same at every club, but the fact he isn't prepared to play in a game when he is fighting for his place is very, very worrying. 

[darrenrover]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ya, same at every club, but the fact he isn't prepared to play in a game when he is fighting for his place is very, very worrying. 

Agreed but perhaps we have more than a fair proportion of players with no ambition whatsoever who are more than happy just to collect a wage?

It seems to me that we have had a plethora of these over the past 7 years and whilst the values may have diminished, the general mantra remains the same. Why?

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, darrenrover said:

Agreed but perhaps we have more than a fair proportion of players with no ambition whatsoever who are more than happy just to collect a wage?

It seems to me that we have had a plethora of these over the past 7 years and whilst the values may have diminished, the general mantra remains the same. Why?

Maybe the fact the fans hate the owners so much seeps down to the players, although maybe I am giving them too much credit there. 

 

[RV Blue]

2 hours ago, Biz said:

I'd wager you fall much closer to the "thick" category.

You get personal, you go on the ignore list... I certainly won't miss having to read your drivel, see ya!

[darrenrover]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Maybe the fact the fans hate the owners so much seeps down to the players, although maybe I am giving them too much credit there. 

 

Quite the contrary, the fans love of the club above any disdain for the owners should transmit to the players.

I would guess that who signed them, who manages them and why they are here could perhaps answer the question.

I'd be really interested to know if any other club had signed as many players as us that seldom feature in the first team and had ultimately had their contracts paid up.

In fact, I'd be really interested to know our list over the past 7 years and the financial implications to the club

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

From a purely personal point of view I could not give a flying one about this ridiculous competition.There is one and only one main aim this season...PROMOTION FROM THIS P!SS POT LEAGUE.

But let me say this,for the Club to charge supporters money and then for the Manager to come out with a galling statement basically saying he couldn't be bothered is something else,really not what the punter wants to hear.

If you have nothing good to say Mowbray sometimes saying nothing is the better option.

Btw,was last night's attendance the club's lowest ever home attendance for a competitive game?

[JBiz]

2 minutes ago, RV Blue said:

You get personal, you go on the ignore list... I certainly won't miss having to read your drivel, see ya!

Drivel... from the man who said "sack Tony". 

My heart bleeds, it really does.

[JAL]

1 hour ago, Parsonblue said:

Leutwiler wasn't involved because he is away on international duty with Canada.  Nyambe is a right back and not a centre-back but with Wharton not fully fit and Ward clearly opting not to play there was nobody left.  I thought Travis, Nyambe and Platt didn't do too badly and, along with Fisher, were our best performers on the night.  I'm quite happy with Mowbray in general but I thought last night was poor from all concerned.  If that was the team he wanted to play it beggars belief that they had done no preparation.  With no match at the weekend he could easily have done what Bury did and put out the strongest eleven available.  A win last night would have put them through to the knock-out stages.  Now, if he wants to progress he will have to select a side strong enough to win at Rochdale - at a point in the season when we have a busy League programme.  The performances of Gladwin, Whittingham and Graham were particularly worrying as none looked to be remotely interested.  Gladwin was appalling from start to finish.  One really has to question the value of this competition in general.  In the last round Bury fielded a very young side and got hammered and I noticed that Stanley had a largely reserve team out last night when Blackpool beat them.  If the clubs don't want it and the fans don't want it and the players clearly aren't too bothered - what is the point?

Travis had a great chance to stake a claim on first team place but going off last nights showing he offered little. Only Matty Platt looked decent out of the back four last night and let's not forget to the reader that Bury ......had nothing to offer up front. Which raises concerns.

Seeing the team sheet last night before kick off thought I'm looking forward to this, looks good was my initial thoughts.

Then the game starts and I'm seeing Chapman, positive but with some very poor passing, Graham taking balls at neck height then expected to sprint thirty yards with his old legs and heavy body and generally the only forward outlet.  Add to this Peter Whittingham, Gladwin and Harper just drifting around hoping somebody else is going to do it for them.

Second half more much to do about nothing we go a goal down still no chances created by Rovers until the final few minutes.

From a future point of view it was very disappointing that the young lads just didn't stand out against Bury.

[mhead]

Apart from the sardine can conditions again  last night, which smacked of amateurishness after the Stoke match we got to see the unprofessionalism of 4/5 of our players who are BLOCKING the progress of keen and fit Under 23s.

My one question is: " At what point does our Academy quality fit in with our League status?"

If not League 1 when do they get the chance? Bury looked fitter,stronger and more together(sign up the No3 quick).

Bury looked a League above us last night and that contrast was not lost on the 2000 Rovers supporters there.