[Archived] Transfers Part 3

[Dunnfc]

4 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Base! How low can you go?

Touché 

[Dunnfc]

4 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Just realized that Caddis is only 29, I thought he was around 33! So thats why he signed a 2 year deal. Makes sense if he gets fit and maintains it. Him and Nyambe add nice balance and options in that position  

Eh? The point of the two year deal I was making is he's sufficient at our current league one level but I don't believe him to be good enough for the championship. The championship continues to kick on and Caddis struggled at Bury as we know from Mowbray due to fitness. Not exactly a que of suitors at his door neither. It should have been a years deal with an option to extend based on performance. Dangle the carrott but we've seen this summer and generally how reckless Mike Cheston is in signing off contracts.

 

[RV Blue]

10 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Just realized that Caddis is only 29, I thought he was around 33! So thats why he signed a 2 year deal. Makes sense if he gets fit and maintains it. Him and Nyambe add nice balance and options in that position  

Brum fans love him from having a quick look at their forums, good signing.

[K-Hod]

10 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Eh? The point of the two year deal I was making is he's sufficient at our current league one level but I don't believe him to be good enough for the championship. The championship continues to kick on and Caddis struggled at Bury as we know from Mowbray due to fitness. Not exactly a que of suitors at his door neither. It should have been a years deal with an option to extend based on performance. Dangle the carrott but we've seen this summer and generally how reckless Mike Cheston is in signing off contracts.

 

I'll be honest, I think you're being a bit harsh there.

If he has a good season and we get promoted, but isn't deemed good enough for the Championship, then I'm sure a League 1 club would buy him, then we (would most likely) get a fee as he's still under contract.

He got to where Mowbray wanted him to be re fitness, so if he maintains that, then we can't really argue. It seems like he lost his way a bit after leaving Brum, where he did well, but it happens.

 

[Dunnfc]

Forget Mavidi I wonder if we can get a loan move in place for Chris Long of Burnley.

Lads a finisher, who will get better, had a bad injury pre Brentford and been hit and missing loan recently but definitely a good 3rd option for up top and with Sammy and Graham we'd be good to go in that department 

[Dunnfc]

2 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

I'll be honest, I think you're being a bit harsh there.

If he has a good season and we get promoted, but isn't deemed good enough for the Championship, then I'm sure a League 1 club would buy him, then we (would most likely) get a fee as he's still under contract.

He got to where Mowbray wanted him to be re fitness, so if he maintains that, then we can't really argue. It seems like he lost his way a bit after leaving Brum, where he did well, but it happens.

 

Possibly but no room for sentiment, our club decisions have to get better. Like the sound of the lad and we did really need a good full back.

i see what your saying on selling on but the lad has never made a monetary move in his career and as you've seen in this division it's mostly free transfers, we'd have to release him or mutually terminate to shift him on and incur that expenditure.

As it stands I think he will be great this year but I wouldn't want or think he's good enough for a championship side, hence my comment of a years deal and dangle the carrot of he performs and keeps fitness levels up etc.

Knowing Cheston and Venkys he will still be lining up next few years to avoid being ambitious and improving quality wise next year regardless

[JHRover]

7 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Forget Mavidi I wonder if we can get a loan move in place for Chris Long of Burnley.

Lads a finisher, who will get better, had a bad injury pre Brentford and been hit and missing loan recently but definitely a good 3rd option for up top and with Sammy and Graham we'd be good to go in that department 

We can't take their players on loan.

[Parsonblue]

25 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Eh? The point of the two year deal I was making is he's sufficient at our current league one level but I don't believe him to be good enough for the championship. The championship continues to kick on and Caddis struggled at Bury as we know from Mowbray due to fitness. Not exactly a que of suitors at his door neither. It should have been a years deal with an option to extend based on performance. Dangle the carrott but we've seen this summer and generally how reckless Mike Cheston is in signing off contracts.

 

The fact that the manager thinks he is worth a two year deal is really all that matters.  The opinions of you or I are really irrelevant.  Mike Cheston is an employee of the club and does what he is instructed to do by the owners - just as anyone who is not self employed does exactly as instructed by their employers or is soon down the road.  Personally, have no problem with the summer transfer activity.  We seem to have assembled a more than decent squad, particularly with such excellent youngsters as Raya, Nyambe, Tomlinson, Wharton, Rankin-Costello, Travis, Doyle and Hardcastle all part of the senior squad.

[Dunnfc]

5 minutes ago, JHRover said:

We can't take their players on loan.

Lol can't be successful if you allow sentiment in decision making. 

Whittingham is ex Burnley isn't he?

Toddy McEveley Stewart all played for us after loan spells with them.

[Mike E]

Even Dunn was signed from Burnley!

[Dunnfc]

5 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

The fact that the manager thinks he is worth a two year deal is really all that matters.  The opinions of you or I are really irrelevant.  Mike Cheston is an employee of the club and does what he is instructed to do by the owners - just as anyone who is not self employed does exactly as instructed by their employers or is soon down the road.  Personally, have no problem with the summer transfer activity.  We seem to have assembled a more than decent squad, particularly with such excellent youngsters as Raya, Nyambe, Tomlinson, Wharton, Rankin-Costello, Travis, Doyle and Hardcastle all part of the senior squad.

Respectfully PB i have to disagree the owners run 30 businesses and above else only seemingly make key decisions such as Deloitte and KPMG. I'd imagine pretty much everything is delegated in all 30 companies, I don't consider player contracts and lengths to be a remit of the owners, I'd imagine they've bigger fish to fry. 

Additionally we were told in March at the supporters meeting in which I think yourself attended that the owners have passed or delegated the running of the club to Mike Cheston, Paul Senior and Rob Coar.

Cheston is the managing director of this football club it's his remit to sign the contracts and advise the owners of what is going on. The book stops with this man on the ground.

Whether Mowbray thinks a two year deal or three year deal is best is actually irrelevant as a manager he could be easily gone on six months. The Book stops with Cheston the MD, the director and bar coaching and managing the players TM shouldn't have any authority as a manager not director to make decisions of that level, of course he'd have a say but it'd set a dangerous precedent if a manager calls the shots of a club.

[JHRover]

12 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Lol can't be successful if you allow sentiment in decision making. 

Whittingham is ex Burnley isn't he?

Toddy McEveley Stewart all played for us after loan spells with them.

Think both McEveley and Todd joined them on loan whilst at Rovers. Played for Rovers first and then not deemed good enough for the first team so allowed to go there for match time. I've no issue with them taking our fringe players, just not the other way around.

Whittingham is ex Burnley but that was very briefly a long time ago - he was only on loan there and didn't come here directly.

[RV Blue]

25 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Lol can't be successful if you allow sentiment in decision making. 

Whittingham is ex Burnley isn't he?

Toddy McEveley Stewart all played for us after loan spells with them.

Yes, we can't be successful if we don't loan players from Burnley! ?

[Irishrover213]

41 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Forget Mavidi I wonder if we can get a loan move in place for Chris Long of Burnley.

Lads a finisher, who will get better, had a bad injury pre Brentford and been hit and missing loan recently but definitely a good 3rd option for up top and with Sammy and Graham we'd be good to go in that department 

Long wouldn't be a bad signing for league one he's quick.

He's was loaned out to Bolton last season I think not sure how he done for them. 

[tomphil]

10 hours ago, Mike E said:

I find it odd that Samba was so desperate to leave Russia due to the racist abuse aimed his way, yet is happy to sign up to play alongside John Terry. 

Probably more to do with his 100k pwk contract running down and no chance of renewing. I wouldn't hang around in Russia with that kind of brass if i'd nowt to do

[Dunnfc]

5 minutes ago, RV Blue said:

Yes, we can't be successful if we don't loan players from Burnley! ?

Nothing like taking onescomments away from the actual context.

 

[Pedro]

40 minutes ago, JHRover said:

We can't take their players on loan.

We lent them a useless Andy Todd and they sent back a future two-time player of the season.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 hour ago, Dunnfc said:

Eh? The point of the two year deal I was making is he's sufficient at our current league one level but I don't believe him to be good enough for the championship. The championship continues to kick on and Caddis struggled at Bury as we know from Mowbray due to fitness. Not exactly a que of suitors at his door neither. It should have been a years deal with an option to extend based on performance. Dangle the carrott but we've seen this summer and generally how reckless Mike Cheston is in signing off contracts.

 

Mowbray said he let his fitness slip. If he knuckles down there is no reason why he wont excel this year and be a solid squad member going forward. If he done well this season and then left for something better because we only offered him a 1 year deal, you would be the first one complaining about it saying why didn't we offer him a longer deal. 

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, Dunnfc said:

Forget Mavidi I wonder if we can get a loan move in place for Chris Long of Burnley.

Lads a finisher, who will get better, had a bad injury pre Brentford and been hit and missing loan recently but definitely a good 3rd option for up top and with Sammy and Graham we'd be good to go in that department 

5 goals in 28 games out on loan in League 1 last season. And he's a dirty dingle.

It's a no from ToMo

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, renrag said:

Not many would have thought the nucleus of Bournemouth's League 2 journeyman squad would have been good enough for the Premier League.

...or Southamptons a few years back.

[Parsonblue]

59 minutes ago, Dunnfc said:

Respectfully PB i have to disagree the owners run 30 businesses and above else only seemingly make key decisions such as Deloitte and KPMG. I'd imagine pretty much everything is delegated in all 30 companies, I don't consider player contracts and lengths to be a remit of the owners, I'd imagine they've bigger fish to fry. 

Additionally we were told in March at the supporters meeting in which I think yourself attended that the owners have passed or delegated the running of the club to Mike Cheston, Paul Senior and Rob Coar.

Cheston is the managing director of this football club it's his remit to sign the contracts and advise the owners of what is going on. The book stops with this man on the ground.

Whether Mowbray thinks a two year deal or three year deal is best is actually irrelevant as a manager he could be easily gone on six months. The Book stops with Cheston the MD, the director and bar coaching and managing the players TM shouldn't have any authority as a manager not director to make decisions of that level, of course he'd have a say but it'd set a dangerous precedent if a manager calls the shots of a club.

I believe that Cheston has returned to being Finance director and that all contracts are done by the Club Secretary.  When Venkys took over I remember reading that at none of the companies they own do they have a Board of Directors as such.  Apparently, Mrs. Desai preferred to deal with whoever was in charge of the shop floor.  In the case of the Rovers it would appear that they have dealt with the manager whenever they could - hence Kean, Bowyer and Mowbray, in particular, have dealt with the owners.  It may not be the way in which business is run here but it as it has worked successfully for them in their other businesses I assume they see no reason to change the model.  We look at Blackburn Rovers as a sporting institution - and rightly so - because it is the club we have followed all our lives.  They see Blackburn Rovers as just another element of their business empire.  The fact that they are still here suggests that they have found a way of making the Rovers work for them in the greater scheme of things.  Either by accident or design it would appear that they have finally found a manager who might, just might make the whole thing work.  Only time will tell but, personally, I'm more optimistic than I have been for some time that we might actually make some progress in the right direction this season.     

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

I believe that Cheston has returned to being Finance director and that all contracts are done by the Club Secretary.  When Venkys took over I remember reading that at none of the companies they own do they have a Board of Directors as such.  Apparently, Mrs. Desai preferred to deal with whoever was in charge of the shop floor.  In the case of the Rovers it would appear that they have dealt with the manager whenever they could - hence Kean, Bowyer and Mowbray, in particular, have dealt with the owners.  It may not be the way in which business is run here but it as it has worked successfully for them in their other businesses I assume they see no reason to change the model.  We look at Blackburn Rovers as a sporting institution - and rightly so - because it is the club we have followed all our lives.  They see Blackburn Rovers as just another element of their business empire.  The fact that they are still here suggests that they have found a way of making the Rovers work for them in the greater scheme of things.  Either by accident or design it would appear that they have finally found a manager who might, just might make the whole thing work.  Only time will tell but, personally, I'm more optimistic than I have been for some time that we might actually make some progress in the right direction this season.     

 

Paul Seniors legacy 

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, Dunnfc said:

Whether Mowbray thinks a two year deal or three year deal is best is actually irrelevant as a manager he could be easily gone on six months.

So could Cheston. Or any other club official. The only constants at the club in the last 7 years have been the owners. By your logic only the Rao's should choose which players get which contracts.

Gawd help us.

[lraC]

1 minute ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Paul Seniors legacy 

A serious question, as I am curious and I hopefully don't offend asking it. Do you know Paul Senior personally?

[lraC]

25 minutes ago, meadows said:

What manager of any football club couldn't be gone in six months? 

Should no player at any club therefore be offered any longer on the basis that the manager might change?

I'm happy with the decisions Mowbray is making and the fact that he is quite obviously and stridently broadcasting the fact that he is empowered to make them

Folks moan if the manager doesn't have authority, then turn around the argument and complain when he patently does 

I'm quite happy to trust Mowbray's instincts and inclinations at this stage and have more confidence than if the strings were being pulled by an accountant or some unknown DOF who has never set foot on a football field.  

Caddis may have had a 2-year deal elsewhere on the table. Though it's difficult to believe, the information might not have been made available to posters on a fans' forum. 

 

It is a real balancing act now the length of the contract to offer. Go for a two and a huge success in year one, means you are literally looking at a more valuable player, escaping for peanuts. Go for a 3 and if that players rests on his laurels, you are stuck with a liability. It's hard to know which way to go I guess.