[Archived] Southend v Rovers

[Crimpshrine]

10 minutes ago, renrag said:

Some of them seem to think the 1875 club is the number of members

I took that to be a joke by someone on their message board.

But it has made me wonder how many fans have actually joined the 1875 club? Anyone got any idea.

Presumably the main advantage of joining is for non season ticket holders who want to have a better chance of getting tickets for away matches. 

[GreenRover]

On 24/7/2017 at 11:40, RV Blue said:

Very tricky start, Brown will have them well up for this. If the game was tomorrow, I would pick:

                       Raya

           Lenihan Ward Mulgrew

Caddis Evans Whittingham Williams

           Bennett         Dack

                     Graham

Would have Ward no where near that team. Need a good solid centre half there. 

[neophox]

Rovers, Bradford and Wigan will go up.

[neophox]

Billy Sharp got 30 goals last season and I think Danny Graham who is a better striker can get the same amount of goals.

[RV Blue]

2 hours ago, GreenRover said:

Would have Ward no where near that team. Need a good solid centre half there. 

He was ok at the back end of last season.

[Fraserkirky]

I'd start:

---------------Raya----------------

---Nyambe Lenihan Mulgrew---

-Bennett-------------------Williams-

-----Whittingham---Evans------

----Dack-----------------Gladwin---

-------------- Graham--------------

[philipl]

Just picking up on the discussion about "natural level".

Worth pointing out that in the 26 seasons we spent outside the top level 1967-1992, in 13 of them we had serious promotion challenges at the top end of Division 2. We have not had one serious promotion challenge in the Championship since the Venky's relegation which might explain why so many are looking forward to this season with relish...

Plus 2005-2010 (under the Trust) we finished in the top half of the Premier League in four out of five seasons which could easily have become our natural level but for Jerome Anderson...

 

[Mattyblue]

Our 88-90 Play Offs traumas certainly prove that we weren't in any way lower league fodder in the era directly before Kenny et al (poor 90/91 season aside).

It was all part of the 'fairytale' promoted by the media (Hovis adverts style promos down Kidder Street) and jealous rival fans trying to justify their own crap existences in the 3rd/4th divisions, that our rise was out of absolutely nowhere like a Wimbledon and not one of a club that had consistently knocked on the door of the top fight.

Yes Jack made the heights we hit possible, but the THIRD division our natural level? Never.

 

[ChickenBolty]

6 hours ago, Fraserkirky said:

I'd start:

---------------Raya----------------

---Nyambe Lenihan Mulgrew---

-Bennett-------------------Williams-

-----Whittingham---Evans------

----Dack-----------------Gladwin---

-------------- Graham--------------

I like this a lot. I think a lot of people forget Nyambe has played a lot of his career CB before joining the first team. 

[Parsonblue]

4 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Our 88-90 Play Offs traumas certainly prove that we weren't in any way lower league fodder in the era directly before Kenny et al (poor 90/91 season aside).

It was all part of the 'fairytale' promoted by the media (Hovis adverts style promos down Kidder Street) and jealous rival fans trying to justify their own crap existences in the 3rd/4th divisions, that our rise was out of absolutely nowhere like a Wimbledon and not one of a club that had consistently knocked on the door of the top fight.

Yes Jack made the heights we hit possible, but the THIRD division our natural level? Never.

 

I don't think Meadows was arguing that the Third Division is our natural level - history proves that it isn't.  The period between 1966 and 1992 was largely spent in the Second Division with only five of those years spent in the Third.  I think Meadows was merely pointing out that for the majority of those seasons in the Second Division we were mainly a mid-table side.  Kendall came closest to getting us up in 80-81 and personally, I believe we should have gone up in 84-85 as we were top at Christmas but with no money for strengthening Saxton had to rely on players who were losing form and matches and that led to the subsequent, and all too familiar fade out.

Hopefully, Southend on Saturday will see the start of a successful promotion campaign.   In many ways it's a good game to start with as its against a team that will be looking to reach the play-offs so will give us an early indication of the standards required to get out of this League.  However, those who witnessed the Kendall promotion campaign know that a poor start doesn't prevent you from having a successful season.  It's an old cliché but true, nonetheless, that the League is a marathon and not a sprint.  

[Mattyblue]

My post wasn't aimed at meadows, just railing against the widespread myths around the Rovers that we've been hearing for 20 years plus.

[blueboy3333]

2 minutes ago, meadows said:

A mere five (six now) seasons in the Third Tier and none in the fourth, a fate which befell all our Lancashire rivals as well as clubs as well-supported & rich in history as Wolves & Sheff Utd speaks for itself and to be honest I can't ever recall anyone describing us as habitually "lower league"

You'd have to be mid-40s or above to even have any recollection of us being out of the top two divisions. 

One of the first games I can remember was the Sheff Wed match were they brought about 10 thousand to Ewood for a night match. Well, perhaps not that many but close, they had the Darwen End and the Nuttall Street paddock nearest it. Quite a following.  That was the old third division in the late 70's iirc.

[Bigdoggsteel]

25 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

One of the first games I can remember was the Sheff Wed match were they brought about 10 thousand to Ewood for a night match. Well, perhaps not that many but close, they had the Darwen End and the Nuttall Street paddock nearest it. Quite a following.  That was the old third division in the late 70's iirc.

Were they doing well at the time? 

[Dreams of 1995]

Wednesday have always travelled well. Sheffield is a big city (a great, young city too) and it's reflected in both of their clubs' support. I thoroughly enjoy going to the Sheffield grounds and I'm disappointed Sheffield Utd went up this year as it was a fixture I'd have definitely gone too.

[tomphil]

Wasn't there another side to the massive Sheff Weds following story, a demonstration of some sort in the area that boosted their numbers ?

[Bigdoggsteel]

26 minutes ago, tomphil said:

Wasn't there another side to the massive Sheff Weds following story, a demonstration of some sort in the area that boosted their numbers ?

A demonstration where more fans go to games? I like that 

[tomphil]

1 minute ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

A demonstration where more fans go to games? I like that 

That would be nice !

No i might have been something to do with Steel workers or miners or something i seem to remember reading about it somewhere.  They always rammed the away end back in the day though them and Leeds, not together of course 

[Bigdoggsteel]

31 minutes ago, tomphil said:

That would be nice !

No i might have been something to do with Steel workers or miners or something i seem to remember reading about it somewhere.  They always rammed the away end back in the day though them and Leeds, not together of course 

Something like a Galatasary game with Venkys out being the theme. That would be fantastic. Scare the sh1t out of other teams  

[philipl]

3 hours ago, meadows said:

Think that's a pretty generous definition of "serious promotion challenges"

1966-67 in contention till Easter but Coventry defeat at Ewood virtually ended hopes 

1977-78 very exciting season with genuine hopes but faded badly at a similar stage

1980-81 missed out on GD within a whisker 

1984-85 in contention till last day 

1987-88 play offs

1988-89 play offs

1989-90 play offs

1991-92 promoted

I make that eight seasons in any kind of serious contention

You could argue that Bowyer had us 8th and within touching distance of the play offs in his first full season not that I ever believed we would make it. 

1967/8 and 1969/70 both finished 8th but for long periods, promotion was possible and felt like it to the fans until tailing off.

1983/4 we finished 6th 

 

 

 

[philipl]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Were they doing well at the time? 

Wednesday had Jack Charlton as boss and went up with us that season.

[Bigdoggsteel]

6 minutes ago, philipl said:

Wednesday had Jack Charlton as boss and went up with us that season.

Big Jack, legend. Got Ireland to 6th in the FIFA world rankings. Unbelievable looking back. I can imagine how his Wednesday team played! Put 'em under pressure! No tippy tapping in midfield ,thats for sure  

[philipl]

8 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Big Jack, legend. Got Ireland to 6th in the FIFA world rankings. Unbelievable looking back. I can imagine how his Wednesday team played! Put 'em under pressure! No tippy tapping in midfield ,thats for sure  

Yes it was the only game that season I saw us completely out run and out muscled all over the park and that included three games against First Division opponents. I think I got to 30 games in total that season.

Back to Southend, we know Conway is out- any news about the other recent injuries/niggles? 

I am relaxed about not making any signings this week if we are only missing Conway.

 

 

 

 

[Admiral Nelsen]

28 minutes ago, philipl said:

Yes it was the only game that season I saw us completely out run and out muscled all over the park and that included three games against First Division opponents. I think I got to 30 games in total that season.

Back to Southend, we know Conway is out- any news about the other recent injuries/niggles? 

I am relaxed about not making any signings this week if we are only missing Conway.

 

 

 

 

Not sure where we're at with Evans, don't think his injury was meant to be that bad, but hasn't played much this pre-season.

Beyond that, we've got a team that you could argue is stronger than what we had out for most of last season.

[Dreams of 1995]

Having had a look back through previous league positions, and although this is slightly off topic, a stat stood out to me about Burnley: "Test matches were abolished in 1898 after Burnley and Stoke conspired to deliberately draw their test match 0–0, which resulted in Burnley being promoted and Stoke being saved from relegation".

Wonder if Barton's great great grandfather had a couple of quid on a no-score draw. Cheats.

[philipl]

1 hour ago, meadows said:

1983-84 we were 13 points off promotion and ended the season with our lowest ever league gate. Had its moments but never anywhere near the top 3 after Christmas (5 wins in last 17)

67-68 we had 5 wins in the last 20 matches. 69-70 not much better but I do remember going to Deepdale with my dad hoping Huddersfield would get beat. We thought we might have a chance if they did. But it was a Monday night in November & Huddersfield won!

My argument is there were genuine promotion pushes during those campaigns- enough to excite the pulses and dreams of Rovers fans at points during the season.

The two other promotion campaigns were in Div 3, not Div 2- my mistake.

But 50% of those long 26 seasons did see a promotion challenge at least at some point in the season.

Since we dropped in 2011/12, we have not had so much as a sniff of promotion excitement.