[Archived] Rovers v Doncaster Rovers

[blackburnforever]

think fraserkirky has got the best line up we could have this line +++ a whole lot of guts could get us out of the division. good one fraser kirky

[Stuart]

6 hours ago, blackburnforever said:

hi guys new to the forum. But had to join to voice my opinions. Ihave watched live football for 34 years and have seen it all apart from george best at his peak!

Never has not getting behind your own team been a good idea, we are in this together. Manager, players and supporters. We must all try to fulfill our roles the best we canie managing the team playing in the team and supporting the team. These are basic requirements Sun TSU (a ancient chinese philospher) said he whose ranks are united in purpose will be victorious ! So lets get united. 

Always the fans that are to blame.

You've missed out a very important stakeholder who needs to be 'united' with us and play their part though. The fact that the don't and never have is the reason we are in this mess.

Can you guess who it is?

[blueboy3333]

7 hours ago, Fraserkirky said:

Nyambe was twice as good yesterday as he was at Southend

Nyambe was one of our better players.

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Always the fans that are to blame.

 The irony.

[lraC]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Always the fans that are to blame.

You've missed out a very important stakeholder who needs to be 'united' with us and play their part though. The fact that the don't and never have is the reason we are in this mess.

Can you guess who it is?

I can and until they engage properly and show some interest, this slide will continue. Given that the next time, we hear from them, they are likely to reiterate how, they are still fully committed, then the show goes on, badly.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

8 hours ago, blackburnforever said:

Never has not getting behind your own team been a good idea, we are in this together. Manager, players and supporters. We must all try to fulfill our roles the best we canie managing the team playing in the team and supporting the team. These are basic requirements Sun TSU (a ancient chinese philospher) said he whose ranks are united in purpose will be victorious ! So lets get united.

 

 

Yeah,fair enough mate,moving motivational speech and all that to the suffering fans.

Just make sure that you get the players to equally understand that the minimum requirements we demand as paying fans is for our team to give 100% on the field of play and act like professional footballers (half time debacle)

In more terse,straightforward language....PULL YOUR BLOODY FINGERS OUT!! 

[RevidgeBlue]

7 hours ago, blackburnforever said:

hi guys new to the forum. But had to join to voice my opinions. Ihave watched live football for 34 years and have seen it all apart from george best at his peak!

Never has not getting behind your own team been a good idea, we are in this together. Manager, players and supporters. We must all try to fulfill our roles the best we canie managing the team playing in the team and supporting the team. These are basic requirements Sun TSU (a ancient chinese philospher) said he whose ranks are united in purpose will be victorious ! So lets get united.

Well onto team selection. we dont have enough pace in the team to play 3 at the back, not in this league anyway as the ball gets pinged about far to much and can easily leave us exposed at the back. Secondly we need to control the midfield to win games evans and smallwood as the two sitting with evans being the tempo setter like thorne and hughes were at derby and even further back faurlin and barton at qpr worked magic there and was brilliant to watch.

In front we need dack in the middle conway one side gladwin or bennett the other then the striker is the point but with three attack minded midfielders supporting. BUT we dont really have a striker whos natural game is holdup play, so a massive amount of movement and interchange would be required. This is definately possible because of the ability within the team.  A natural tendency would then be to sometimes revert to a 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1 the latter if carried out correctly will give you higher possession stats its upto us the to make the most of it. But 3 at the back when the ball is pinged about is dangerous but possible if the 3 and 2 wing backs have the pace and energy to carry it out  - right now we havent so i would go with 4-2-3-1 as our personel siut this system best.We would therefore require in the transfer window somebody who could cover richie and cory for injury and suspension. We have to put the work in to get out of this dreadful division.

thoughts please

Tony, is that you? Lol.

In all seriousness welcome to the forum.

I'm not sure I agree with you on formation though as your preferred method seems to rely heavily on Conway/Bennett/Graham and anyone relying on those 3 is going to be sorely disappointed imo. Only here to pick up their wages.

Liked what I saw from Dack on Saturday and having spent 750 k on him he surely has to be central to any attacking plans. If he could be accommodated into a system linking up with two front men who can make a nuisance of themselves maybe Samuel and the lad from Leeds I think we'd look a lot more potent.

[lraC]

8 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Tony, is that you? Lol.

In all seriousness welcome to the forum.

I'm not sure I agree with you on formation though as your preferred method seems to rely heavily on Conway/Bennett/Graham and anyone relying on those 3 is going to be sorely disappointed imo. Only here to pick up their wages.

Liked what I saw from Dack on Saturday and having spent 750 k on him he surely has to be central to any attacking plans. If he could be accommodated into a system linking up with two front men who can make a nuisance of themselves maybe Samuel and the lad from Leeds I think we'd look a lot more potent.

It seems a common theme, Graham not looking either up to it, or up for it. Will he be dropped for the next  game and will we go two up top? I hope so, as something has to change surely?

[JacknOry]

Not soley his fault as he has been isolated and asked to do a job up top on his own that i dont think suits his play. Saying that though, he looks like he doesnt give a toss at the moment. Needs a kick up the ass as he will be on more wages than some clubs in this division are paying a good portion of their overall playing staff.

[lraC]

59 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

Not soley his fault as he has been isolated and asked to do a job up top on his own that i dont think suits his play. Saying that though, he looks like he doesnt give a toss at the moment. Needs a kick up the ass as he will be on more wages than some clubs in this division are paying a good portion of their overall playing staff.

Its the not giving a toss and not looking up for it, that is unforgivable. No excuse for that and he needs to be sorted. Unless we have 11 players on the pitch, who are prepared to put a shift in, we will get nowhere.

[Waggy76]

Never been a gteat fan of Graham , I think I would be trying to get rid if some mug will have him !

[Skiptonrover]

Someone had a couple of simple tap ins when the low crosses got fizzed in, playing the high balls was never going to work not with 1 lone striker. I guess Tony will have a lot to mull over & get prepared for Bradford what should be a even harder game some might argue on paper & away.

[Athlete]

1 hour ago, lraC said:

I can and until they engage properly and show some interest, this slide will continue. Given that the next time, we hear from them, they are likely to reiterate how, they are still fully committed, then the show goes on, badly.

They're committed to letting bazza play around with their corporation's accounting tool for awhile.. 

But getting back on track what happened on the pitch on Saturday TM is responsible for and unless we see a drastic improvement we'll be in another relegation battle 

 

[Athlete]

2 hours ago, Stuart said:

Always the fans that are to blame.

You've missed out a very important stakeholder who needs to be 'united' with us and play their part though. The fact that the don't and never have is the reason we are in this mess.

Can you guess who it is?

We all know who that is 

This get behind the lads rubbish has worn very thin. The support from the stands for the last seven years has been brilliant and where has it taken us.... League one and struggling.. 

My blame lies firmly with the FA for allowing it to happen fit and proper... The FA should somehow be held accountable 

[Tom]

If Graham played Whittingham in instead of waiting and waiting and then shooting in the first half we probably would have won that game comfortably.

Nyambe isn't a centre half but has the attributes for it, between him and Ward id take him there! 

[tomphil]

Ironic how LT focuses on the so called pressure and expectation from fans on it's back pages you'd almost think it was fans fault on Saturday. This rag did more than anything to whip up expectation levels beyond the norm to totally deflect from relegation and the real problems by continually running stories of various promotion seasons.

I said at the time you could be forgiven for thinking we'd just been promoted not relegated !!!

[perthblue02]

59 minutes ago, tomphil said:

Ironic how LT focuses on the so called pressure and expectation from fans on it's back pages you'd almost think it was fans fault on Saturday. This rag did more than anything to whip up expectation levels beyond the norm to totally deflect from relegation and the real problems by continually running stories of various promotion seasons.

I said at the time you could be forgiven for thinking we'd just been promoted not relegated !!!

The venkygraph showed what a piece of s*** it was when they slipped up with the "please take out"

[sharpysharps]

For me this is how we should be lining up. I saw enough of Samuel in his appearance at the weekend to say that he should be our first choice striker. Graham is 32 and in decline. Samuel is our future main striker as long as we treat him correctly.

 

Home games:

Raya

Caddis Mulgrew Wharton (or Williams at CB until Lenihan returns) Doyle (give the kid a chance)

Bennett Smallwood Dack Conway

Samuel Graham / Antonsson

Back in Division 1 with Souey we played Flitcroft and Dunny in the middle, I see no reason we can't do the same with Dack and Smallwood, or Smallwood and Gladwin. I saw enough of Smallwood on Saturday to see that he can deal with the majority of the dirty work, he was the only player to start on Saturday that came out with any kind of credit in my eyes.

 

Altyernatively for away games or generally tougher opposition:

Raya

Caddis Mulgrew Wharton (or Williams at CB Lenihan returns) Doyle

Smallwood Evans

Bennett Dack Conway

Samuel

 

Ward, Graham and Whittingham are 3 players clearly in decline in their careers. We need young and hungry players to get us out of this mess and not a repeat of the Murphy / Etuhu season.

I look at the likes of Josh Morris at Scunthorpe. A young player who was deemed not good enough for Rovers in the championship (probably correctly so btw) but has excelled in League One. We need those types, not ageing has beens.

We have on paper the best group of players in this division by some distance IMO. But when you are playing a system that means we have 3 fullbacks on the pitch in a home game then its not going to end well.

[onlyonejackwalker]

On Saturday the 28th July we lost 3-1 at Carlisle.

On Saturday the 5th August we lost 2-1 at Southend.

On Tuesday the 8th August we won 3-1 at Coventry.

On Saturday the 12th August we lost 3-1 at home to Doncaster.

Nine goals conceded in those four matches. Six goals scored.

Five goals conceded in two league matches. Two goals scored.

In my opinion, we remain very lob sided in our squad and the deficiencies highlighted for a long time still need to be addressed. Our sourcing policy has confused for years, unless third party payments are considered. I am a tad older and believe that any team should be built from the back, not the other way round. I also dislike intensely our approach to pre-season and the fact we are never organised when the season starts. 

I cannot remember when we last had a big commanding goal-keeper, nailed down as number one, who actually had the ability to not only save the odd game, but was actually good enough to win us games. The last three in Kean, Steele and Raya all have a major weekly mistake in them and it is hugely costly with such small margins involved. I remain  of the opinion that this is a key position and cannot for the life of me understand the attitude of recent managers to recruitment in this area. I would like us to buy a quality keeper, preferably very tall who can command the box.

I also keep reading we have enough centre halves, plus cover, plus players who can fill in, but we are currently shoe-horning players into this position and it is foolhardy. I would like us to buy a commanding centre half and play midfielders in midfield.

Our full back positions have supposedly been professionally addressed, but this is currently open to debate as teams find it easy to get down our wings and create chances. I appreciate it is early days but I would also like a quality full back please, preferably one who can cope on both sides.

Getting greedy now and moving away from defence but where are the speedy wingers of yester-year who beat a man and cross the ball?

However scoring goals is largely irrelevant if you let three in each week. Bowyer was unable to understand there are two goals on a football pitch and we needed a decent keeper and qualified right back, hence conceeding almost as many as we scored each season with him in charge. Coyle loved being a goal down and the players happily obliged. Lambert tightened things initially but at the expense of flair going forward and Mowbray seemed to have sorted some of the defensive weaknesses in a higher division last time round and I therefore fully expected us to be hard to beat and score against in a lower division. Not still conceding against all and sundry and now being wide open at the back.

Those suggesting the immediate removal of Mowbray need to calm down a tad. No prizes have been given out as yet. I know it is not easy however as I was gutted at weekend following this latest reverse. Equally waiting way too long like we did with Bowyer and Coyle does not make any sense either. I fully expect Mowbray to continue with his preferred mode of playing and believe in his signings and would think less of him changing after only two games. Bowyer had 17 points from 16 games, Coyle even less if my memory serves me correctly. I would give Mowbray at least 8 - 12 games before making any decision with lasting consequences.

A tad ironic the calls to focus on defence and clean sheets, hump it forward, 4-4-2, get a target man in, play free-kicks long into the box and fight for second balls. Pity our fans didn't get it with Allardyce in charge. 

[tomphil]

3 hours ago, JacknOry said:

Not soley his fault as he has been isolated and asked to do a job up top on his own that i dont think suits his play. Saying that though, he looks like he doesnt give a toss at the moment. Needs a kick up the ass as he will be on more wages than some clubs in this division are paying a good portion of their overall playing staff.

He's taken up the Rhodes mantle of just lurking between the back 2 but every low ball is cut out and every cross flew high over everyone's heads so harsh for him to be shouldering most of the blame.  What he needs to do in that system is take a stab at what Jordan was a master of in those situations and make more little runs and bits of movement instead of standing looking pished off. 

Ball isn't coming to him so go looking front post across his man or drop off to the back.

[bigbrandjohn]

Ok spent too much of the weekend stewing about our season so far. Truth is the squad is strong for this division. Need time to gel. Not too long. I am feeling more upbeat today listening to Johnnie Walker on Pirate BBC Essex. Big L silenced 50 years ago today but Johnnie and Radio Caroline sailed on. So will we. Eventually. 

[RV Blue]

15 hours ago, AAK said:

Don't know about others but I think the defence is such a shambles and poor that some risk are going to have to be taken. Wharton needs to be brought in, seems very capable and got rave reviews from Cambridge, umpteen man of the match awards and was a regular on loan. Williams best football was as a CB so we put him there, he's played there in cup comps and looked a far better player, or we get a new CB to partner Wharton. Mulgrew is a midfielder. Replace Williams with Doyle at LB, another risk but his proper position and changes needed, Bennett hard working and can tackle and has energy and performed well at rb before and from what I've seen from this two, at full back they have the energy and ability to get forward and create as well as defend 

               Keeper

Bennett/Wharton/New CB/Doyle

          Smallwood/Mulgrew

Conway        Dack         Chapman

.                 Samuel

lenihan ls leaving so no point in putting him in

Bennett at right back is a shout, he's twice the player of both Caddis and Nyambe.

[jim mk2]

2 hours ago, onlyonejackwalker said:

 

A tad ironic the calls to focus on defence and clean sheets, hump it forward, 4-4-2, get a target man in, play free-kicks long into the box and fight for second balls. Pity our fans didn't get it with Allardyce in charge. 

  Too right. Gav still doesn't get it.

[J*B]

36 minutes ago, RV Blue said:

Bennett at right back is a shout, he's twice the player of both Caddis and Nyambe.

Played right wing back for Bristol City well.

[roversfan99]

21 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

And that is enough for you to conclude that he can be first choice left back for a side striving for promotion?

This is my point! Having a competent left back, or a third competent centre back, is surely more important than signing so many attacking players, baring in mind Mowbray has a budget to adhere to, albeit a much bigger one than anyone else in the division.

Yesterday, we had Conway, Antonsson, Feeney, Chapman, Dack, Samuel and Gladwin all not in the side. 5 of them were signed by Mowbray. And even if we had played 4 at the back, we would have still had to field Ward and Williams, both of whom are not good enough. So if hes got limited finance, or limited places in his squad, then surely prioritise a left back and a centre back over 1 or 2 of them.

So this means either:

Mowbray isn't in control of signings (I'm not saying this is the case, nor do you know otherwise, regardless of what you claim)...

or Mowbray has made a mess of his summer recruitment (not in terms of the quality of signings, but the types of players he has brought in)

 

@chaddyrovers please can you answer this.

Just find it quite embarrasing for Mowbray that he signed so many players yet 2 games in and without barely any injuries, hes playing players (Nyambe, Whittingham, Gladwin at LWB, Samuel wide v Southend etc) out of position, and people are suggesting other players (Bennett RB, Mulgrew LB) to cover positions in which we are woefully short in.

Also, you said that you'd have Doyle as first choice left back yet then said Williams should start at Bradford. Another contradiction.