[Archived] Rovers v Burnley

[JHRover]

Nothing really to do with what Burnley have, what Dyche is, what business they do.

The reason they are so far ahead of us is almost entirely because of the business Rovers have done over a period of 7 years. We have collapsed on and off the pitch, whilst they have slightly improved because of a good managerial appointment.

If we had learnt lessons or were serious about putting right what has gone wrong then we could catch back up to Burnley quite quickly and there would be nothing they could do about it. Unfortunately we haven't learnt any lessons, nothing has changed except we're even more in debt and in a lower league.

Just like how we're now in the shadow of PNE and Bolton and the way things are going also Wigan, Fleetwood and Bury. 

It isn't because all those clubs suddenly execute master plans or strike gold. Just they are all reasonably well structured clubs with some sort of aim/purpose and plan to achieve it whilst we drift into the abyss and will continue to do so.

[davefarnworth]

Where's John McNamee when we need. Worst ever place since he saved us. Do Venkys read? Probably not 

[sympatheticclaret]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

I think its pushing it to the extreme to attribute or compare Dyche's managerial abilities to Brian Cloughs. Just because he spent time at Forest whilst Clough was losing the plot there. He never made a single first team appearance and was swiftly shipped out to Chesterfield where he began a journeyman career in the lower leagues.

The other things you list - training ground, scouting etc. are things all managers should have involvement in. Not something unique to Burnley.

Not suggesting for a moment that Dyche is Clough reincarnated, merely that he had a good grounding at Forest. To be fair, he's picked up players..Arfield, Boyd, Barnes, Vokes etc very cheap, and moulded them into a decent outfit, adding in quality for which he's paid decent money, a la Clough...

As ever, hope you get your Club back...Venky's Out !!

[Fraserkirky]

It wasn't as bad as the Doncaster game, no way.

I think tonight's game was useful, in that there are a few players that have really wrecked their chances of getting in the first team. Should make team selection much easier this weekend. Caddis is def second choice to Nyambe, Williams better watch his back as there is no way Doyle is worse, bet Conway is a better left back than Williams,Whittingham better get comfy on the bench next to Antonsson and Gladwin. Chapman a must start, as is Bennett. Samuel is first choice no question. 

We need a centre half badly and if Joao is available get him in asap.

[grizfoot]

I honestly don't think it was down to a lack of commitment, just a lot of the players playing tonight simply not good enough in comparison to the level of the opposition. Found it a bit baffling Burnley took their foot off the gas in that second half when they could have really put us to the sword like West Ham did a few seasons back. 

Player watch: Raya, good shot-stopper needs to work on aspects of game. Whittingham, Gladwin and Antonsson all looked poor. Smallwood is a battler, Chapman and Samuel both lively. Feeney is still naff, Williams seems to be getting worse, Caddis is a trier but limited, Mulgrew is still a class above.

Going forward I feel like our full-back problem is such that if we can get away with playing three at the back, and having Evans & Smallwood shielding them. It may very well be the way forward. For me these are clearly the best eleven players we have at moment, although I wouldn't be too quick to write off Graham but it does seem like he's been frozen out at the moment.

--------------------- Raya -------------

--- Nyambe -- Lenihan --- Mulgrew

 --------Smallwood ---- Evans ----

Bennett --------------------------- Conway

 ---------- Dack -------- Chapman ----

----------------- Samuel -----------------

[rossyrover]

Been to Ewood must admit that Burnley are a class above us and they have caught the Rovers at a low period in the quality of player available to the club and the gap between a premiership Burnley and a division one Rovers was there for all to see, looking back over the match Cannot understand why Mowbray has signed Antonsson a striker who looks on this performance to slight and easily knocked off the ball what we needed was a six foot plus player who can hold the ball up,I hope I am wrong but Whittingham reminds me of Danny Murphy and Gladwin looks a poor player things looked better when Conway,Bennett and Samuel came on anyway onto the mighty MK Dons.  

[cesus]

3 hours ago, JHRover said:

Will the Burnley player(s) who tackled the pitch invader be dealt with by the FA?

Whilst there's no excuse for a fan running onto the pitch to confront a player, I'm not sure how a Burnley player grabbing hold of the individual and throwing him to the floor can be overlooked by the 'authorities'.

Are you for real?! You are a good poster but jeeeez, the Burnley players would be protected under Common Law self defence never mind worrying about breaking any FA rules!

[Fraserkirky]

56 minutes ago, grizfoot said:

 

--------------------- Raya -------------

--- Nyambe -- Lenihan --- Mulgrew

 --------Smallwood ---- Evans ----

Bennett --------------------------- Conway

 ---------- Dack -------- Chapman ----

----------------- Samuel -----------------

I presented the exact same team last week. 

Still think we need another tall striker to lead the line if we are going to just punt it up every time.

[Stuart]

6 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

I thought Burnley looked a class apart for most of the match.  We had little or no threat until Bennett, Conway and Samuels came on.  Bennett may not be everyone's cup of tea but he puts in a shift every game, week in and week out.  Just a pity a number of the others can't do the same.  Raya kept us in the game with some outstanding saves but too many players looked very ordinary tonight even by Third Division standards.  Whittingham looks a shadow of the player he was at Cardiff.  Antonsson looks anything but suited to the rough and tumble of life in League One - if only we could find another Mike Hickman to play up front.  Not sure what Gladwin's position is supposed to be but he is another new arrival who looks no better than those we released.  Williams surely must be dropped to give Jack Doyle a chance and likewise Caddis if Nyambe is fit.  We look weak in defence, lack creativity in midfield and carry no threat up front.  I like Mowbray but to me he is overthinking everything at the moment.  Our players are playing in the Third Division (sorry, League One) because they aren't good enough to play at a higher level at the moment.  Keep the system simple and I'm sure we will get more out of them.  Sadly, Burnley are now light years ahead of us and are likely to be so for the foreseeable future.  MK Dons is, sadly, a far more important game as far as the Rovers are concerned. 

Whilst I understand the emotion, the only thing I would say is - and not just to you - is that I'm not sure we should judge players brought in for League One football based on their performances agains a PL side. Yes, underdogs can win now and again but this was never going to be out night. I said at the time that drawing Bumley was bad news, the reason being that it was a PL v L1 game which actually meant something to the PL team.

I absolutely hate losing to that lot but it was a done deal when the draw was made. I wasn't even that angry after the game. It was fully expected. This is exactly why I would have played a weaker side. Tbf Raya was excellent for the most part but even Bumley rested their No.1. We'd have save more face with Nuttall up front and Tomlinson in centre mid - and might have worked a bit harder too.

As for the pitch invaders, they should have life bans from the club. They do nothing but damage to us. It's one thing blaming security but people need to be made to take more responsibility for their own behaviour. Same goes for fans caught with flares. They should be treated like they have brought a bomb into the stadium. Yes, the world has moved on a Dyche put it but not in terms of one man gripping another man, in terms of incendiary devices and their dangers.

[perthblue02]

Yarkshire Derby for the twohats in the next round, home to Leeds

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Tony Mowbray...."You could feel the Premierleauge quality"

Unfortunately Tony Rovers fans have long forgotten what that feels like,confined to our memory.

*** HUGE SIGH*** 

Three points and nothing less this weekend required.

 

[1864roverite]

What can I say? Despite some saying there was a huge gulf between us I disagree. Yes dingle fc were organised and mobile BUT they had a team worth some £35m and then some on the pitch at times against a very poor relation monetary wise. I thought our midfield did quite well although we did get stretched as the game wore on.

My observations? Well I think Raya is a little too small for the goal. Good shot stopper but is he that commanding?

Williams got stretched all over and he had a bad game IMO.

Rovers could and should have gone for it from the off, with 2 up front who knows what they could have achieved as when young Samuels came on we were much better and aggressive going forward. The young Swede was so isolated but ran his socks off with little or no support.

Impressed with Gladwin, Chapman and Smallwood against international players.

I am not forlorn about losing this game 2-0, in fact if that is all bumley can muster against us then it doesn't bode well for them.

Finally, the moron and his sidekick who ran on the pitch and confronted the dingle players, your an absolute disgrace as a human being, you brought all of us, the fans and the club down to your level and for me, you pair of buffoons should be banned for life and take first place when the shredder comes into play. A pair of absolute tits, embarrassing yourselves by getting slapped by the dingle players, detained by jobsworths and now having to appear before a court to answer for your drunken idiotic actions.

Take the rest of our idiotic scumbag supporters with you and stay away, you are not wanted in Ewood.

[Waggy76]

I agree in with everything you say in bold type....

With one caveat the Wigan game our last ever in Prem , that was our chance in front of the world ......

 

[AllRoverAsia]

The 'fans' on the pitch and the 'flares' sadly serve to endorse the Police view of such games.

I was listening to Talksport as the 'fan' incident was taking place and the Riverside Stand layout was criticised as being too open, and therefore very difficult to Police/ Steward. I believe that to be an accurate assessment.

A great shame it was omitted from the main Ewood redevelopment and this incident will speed its demise.

Being somewhat sight challenged if I was ever near someone chucking a flare I know what would happen next.

[TBTF]

8 hours ago, blackburnforever said:

why all the negativity just got back from match. Good effort ok we got beat but lets be positive we want out of this league and championship football next season so lets get behind the team, we know where we want to be so lets bring positivety to the games and see the picture we wish to create ie championship football next season come on everybody be fair,

And from what ''qualities'' you saw tonight just how the hell do you think we are heading back to the championship? Manager is useless, doesn't know what he is trying to do , made worse by the players he has brought in who don't look capable either. Then he messes about with the formations to the point where we have zero goal threat . The whole thing is an almighty mess both on and off the pitch. 

[Blow-in]

9 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

 Bennett couldn't have looked more disinterested if he tried.

Thought Raya was outstanding tonight and Samuel looked excellent when he came on. On the evidence to date we'd better hope he doesn't get injured as he's our only decent out and out forward.

Williams, Caddis and the new lad from Leeds up front whose name I can't spell particularly poor I thought.

From the point of view of the League worrying to me that Mowbray is still trying to scratch around to find a formation and method of play which suits the players he's signed. Even more worrying is his insistence on playing with one up front when every man and his dog can see We're completely toothless playing like that.

I thought Raya was poor on both the goals, and made a few comfortable saves that any keeper should have made. Bennett came on made tackles and could have scored it was not a great performance but it was better then most on the field.

I worry about our back 4 we give up far too many chances and Raya is not the kind of keeper who will win you games. Thank God for Chris Wood tonight or it would have been embarrassing he was my Rover's MOM 

[K-Hod]

8 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Rubbish. He played a couple of decent crossfield balls but when one of his team mates had the ball there was no movement in him whatsoever. Just strolling about hands on hips without a care in the world

Fair enough if you don't rate the bloke, but it's just plain wrong to say Bennett 'couldn't have looked more disinterested if he tried'.

The lad always puts a shift in and last night was no different.

 

[arbitro]

Having slept on it I think Mowbray has to accept totally the blame for our poor start. Against Southend and Doncaster we had Graham playing yet we persisted in playing short passes around the defence and midfield with very little played to Graham either to his feet or head. Last night we had Antonsson playing as a lone striker and we banged high balls to him despite him having no physical presence. Tarkowski and Long will be taking aspirin today for their headaches after continuously heading the ball. At least when Samuel came on he was able to put himself about.

Like many I believe Mowbray is a decent man but I think he is getting close to the last chance saloon. On Saturday at Bradford he pretty much got it right but last night it was two steps back as far as I'm concerned. He needs to stick to the basics, play the best players in their best positions and stick to a system that is tried and tested at this level.

[Parsonblue]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Whilst I understand the emotion, the only thing I would say is - and not just to you - is that I'm not sure we should judge players brought in for League One football based on their performances agains a PL side. Yes, underdogs can win now and again but this was never going to be out night. I said at the time that drawing Bumley was bad news, the reason being that it was a PL v L1 game which actually meant something to the PL team.

I absolutely hate losing to that lot but it was a done deal when the draw was made. I wasn't even that angry after the game. It was fully expected. This is exactly why I would have played a weaker side. Tbf Raya was excellent for the most part but even Bumley rested their No.1. We'd have save more face with Nuttall up front and Tomlinson in centre mid - and might have worked a bit harder too.

As for the pitch invaders, they should have life bans from the club. They do nothing but damage to us. It's one thing blaming security but people need to be made to take more responsibility for their own behaviour. Same goes for fans caught with flares. They should be treated like they have brought a bomb into the stadium. Yes, the world has moved on a Dyche put it but not in terms of one man gripping another man, in terms of incendiary devices and their dangers.

I wouldn't disagree with much of that Stuart.  I was simply looking at things after the first five competitive games and I honestly think that the manager is setting the team up in a way which doesn't get the best out of what we have.  On paper these players should be good enough to be challenging at the top of League One - forget Burnley, they are Premier League and now clearly a class apart from ourselves.  Totally agree that some of the youngsters should have been given an opportunity before now, particularly at Coventry.  Personally, I'd like to see the likes of Tomlinson, Doyle, Travis, Nuttall etc given chances in League games.

[Giant]

Some over the top reaction on here because it was Burnley who beat us, and the pain runs deep. Folk switch from total euphoria to total despair. A sense of realism needed.

[Gone to seed]

What  did we really expect? Dyche has had 5 years and funding to get his team doing what he wants it to. Bumleh have a premier league budget for transfer fees and wages. We are bumping along the bottom of the pond hoping blindly to stumble across gems, but mostly finding the pondlife you'd expect at the bottom of the pond. For me, I'd have given the likes of Nuttall the chance to play last night, as the reality is that there was only ever one outcome based on playing a bunch of bottom feeders and crocks against a well oiled and well drilled and well paid group of players from a higher standard. The only way to have changed that script would have been to have done something unexpected. TM appears to be willing to try something different (e.g. his 3 at the back tippy tappy passing 'system' versus the sweat and spit of normal League 1 opposition). The question is, why did he go for the obvious and conventional last night?

Baffling.

Anyway, let's move on.

Venkys out! Backwards stawt!

[Hasta]

I keep reading "well we were playing Burnley". We don't keep passing the ball to their men, tonking it out of play and mis-controlling it so that it goes for a throw in because we are playing a Premier League team. We do that because the players simply aren't very good.

Starting off positive, we know that aside from the defence we can field a better team than that thankfully.

I like Samuel. 3 goals in 3 starts and last night he challenged and won for headers, the ball stuck a little, was direct and tried to bring other people into play.

Conway is one of the few people with a serious football brain we have. He knows when to turn round and play it back or when to keep trying to go forward. There is intention rather than aimlessness in his forward passing and he doest give the ball away as much as the rest of them.

Chris Wood's finishing was so bad it was funny.

Aside from that it was diabolical. Someone said the Doncaster game was worse. In that game we knocked the ball around, had possession but couldn't do anything with it. Then let them score with 3 mistakes. In this game we got destroyed all over the pitch and couldn't do many of the basics right.

Raya is never going to be a top class keeper. Good shot stopper but a little too small - and goals like those last night a decent keeper would have done better on. He's not awful but he's probably plying his trade at the right level.

Williams got player of the year last year didn't he. That says how bad we must have been.

Caddis just kept letting people run in behind. Smallwood started well but deteriorated second half. To be fair in the first half he probably tired himself out doing the work of others. 

Do you know Ben Gladwin is 25 years old and has only made 70 league start in his career? I think last night you saw why.

A lot of this season now rests on Samuel showing the promise he has done so far,  and Dack living up to the hype.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

What worries me is that not very  long ago we gave Man Utd  a real game at home in the FA Cup yet last night we couldn't put in a performance in what someone else described as a free hit.

No matter who we bring in the decline continues. At any other club the chairman would be having the manager in this morning and he'd be telling him the sort of home truths that many people on this site have mentioned.

At this club nobody will be bothered and things will just drift as long as normal. I'd be surprised if the Chicken Chokers knew we'd played last night.

 

My rugby league team appointed an Aussie coach years ago. I went to a " meet the fans " do were one fan stood up and said to the new coach - " Just two things you need to do Steve , beat Oldham and beat Oldham ". Hornets and Oldham being deadly rivals and in the same division that season.

We played them in the traditional pre season " Friendly ", he used it to play every player at the club, substitutes galore,  they took it seriously, we got hammered and the new coach never recovered from that start.

[Sparks Rover]

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

 

Impressed with Gladwin

Really? What impressed you about his performance? , I watch him and it gives me hope that my lad can still make a living in the game.  Sorry mate, he is a shocking player.

[Mercer]

5 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

What worries me is that not very  long ago we Man Utd  a real game at home in the FA Cup yet last night we couldn't put in a performance in what someone else described as a free hit.

No matter who we bring in the decline continues. At any other club the chairman would be having the manager in this morning and he'd be telling him the sort of home truths that many people of this site have mentioned.

At this club nobody will be bothered and things will just drift as long as normal. I'd be surprised if the Chicken Chokers knew we'd played last night.

Playing wise, I think this is the worst collection of players since Ken Furphy's early days.  Even in the darkest days of the early Furphy era, I didn't feel as much despair.  They wouldn't have given Burnley such an easy ride as that spineless lot did last night.