[Archived] Brockhall training Complex-ACV Declined

[J*B]

10 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

How much is Brockhall land worth to a housebuilder? Anyone hazard a guess? 

Average house price on Brockhall is £414,000. I reckon you could do 1,500 houses on all the land owned by Rovers. 

[JHRover]

1 minute ago, Skiptonrover said:

Selling is only a option when there's a willing buyer available with the debt attached it will be as attractive as Christmas time to a turkey.

Selling is only going to be possible when the sellers have the sense to massively reduce or wipe out their debts.

[J*B]

Just now, JHRover said:

Difficult though because the Oystons are based locally and have their business interests in Lancashire. Worth remembering that it wasn't the actions of the supporters which got them to put the club up for sale, infact reading what I have about the Oystons it might have made it less likely. It was the litigation brought about by a millionaire shareholder and the Oyston's antics in taking money out which came back to bite them.

This mob at Rovers have managed to go through the best part of £250-300 million in losses/parachute cash/player sales in the space of 6 years and all they have to show for it are 2 relegations.

It cannot be denied that Blackpool fans have made Oystons life hard work. They've hit the club, their businesses, their social circle, their favourite bars and restaurants. They've also worked closely with the other shareholder (can't spell his name!) to encourage a legal battle, which has eventually seen the club put up for sale. 

Harder to do here, but there are people.

[Skiptonrover]

8 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Selling is only going to be possible when the sellers have the sense to massively reduce or wipe out their debts.

What I meant is, that's very unlikely to happen. I can't for the life in me predict they business strategy or the future. Does the debt get wiped in administration/liquidation? Maybe the plan is run it into the ground take the money & run. 

[JHRover]

4 minutes ago, Skiptonrover said:

What I meant is, that's very unlikely to happen. I can't for the life in me predict they business strategy or the future. Does the debt get wiped in administration/liquidation? Maybe the plan is run it into the ground take the money & run. 

I don't suspect there's much money to take and run with. Clearly Brockhall is the big one and they might have plans to cash in on that but there are covenants in place at least on one of the two sites which stipulate it needs to be used for recreational purposes. That probably wouldn't prevent it being sold to another club or for sports development but would certainly make residential development difficult.

Ewood Park won't be worth much. Even if they managed to find a way to sell it for development the value of land in that part of the world even for a retail park or housing estate wouldn't be massive. Then there's the ACV issue which wouldn't stop them but would complicate matters.

If they want to get out of this they only have two realistic options. One is to absorb the debt themselves/massively reduce it and then sell the club on a debt free basis, the other is to cease funding and drop the club into administration, which would see them lose decision making control. Either way the only route to getting their debt paid back is to get to the Premier League = isn't going to happen.

[47er]

3 hours ago, philipl said:

By far the most depressing development for Rovers in a very depressing year.

Venky's are not going to use expensive lawyers to kill this initiative without an intention regardless of what was said in Court.

 

People who know the price of everything but the value of nothing.

[Tom]

If selling Brockhall was their last stand and act of defiance before buggering off then I think a lot of us would take that at this point.

We'd be in trouble but they'd be gone at least 

[Boz]

The value of the land must be devalued to make any thought of it's redevelopment unthinkable.

A pledge from as many as possible to guarantee that they will never subscribe to any development, either now or in the future, this way we would be effectively blighting the land and it's value/financial development opportunity.  If they could not sell any houses it would impact on the land value and make a developer think twice.

[Vinjay]

2 hours ago, JHRover said:

Difficult though because the Oystons are based locally and have their business interests in Lancashire. Worth remembering that it wasn't the actions of the supporters which got them to put the club up for sale, infact reading what I have about the Oystons it might have made it less likely. It was the litigation brought about by a millionaire shareholder and the Oyston's antics in taking money out which came back to bite them.

This mob at Rovers have managed to go through the best part of £250-300 million in losses/parachute cash/player sales in the space of 6 years and all they have to show for it are 2 relegations.

Of course its because of Belokon but it seems the fans are grabbing all the credit for themselves. As for the fans "persuading" him to take legal action what nonsense. Why the hell would he have needed any persuasion? 

Look at the contrast here with the club bringing in a heavyweight legal firm. There's nobody to counter it. 

 

[JHRover]

Just now, Vinjay17 said:

Of course its because of Belokon but it seems the fans are grabbing all the credit for themselves. As for the fans "persuading" him to take legal action what nonsense. Why the hell would he have needed any persuasion? 

 

Like in virtually every walk of life the only way the rich and powerful get their comeuppance for their wrongdoing is if other rich and powerful people go after them.

Blackpool fans have quite rightly been on the Oyston's case for years but only when Belokon with his millions, expensive lawyers and high court action came along did a breakthrough occur. Lucky them, assuming a sale goes through to a suitable buyer and the Oystons are consigned to history. I wouldn't be cracking open the champagne quite yet if I were a tangerine as there are plenty of hurdles to overcome before Oyston is gone and they have a suitable new owner.

[Vinjay]

How did the local residents respond to this and were they even consulted? I said when talk of the ACV attempt began that one of the pivotal requirements would be getting local residents on side. Has anyone objected to this other than Venkys? I'm guessing one of the objectors wasn't "Ribble Valley Inns" who also happen to be the owners of a great big manor up Langho way. Any future development up there may well have some positive impact on their business...hmmmm. Not to mention their precious catering contract that was extended until 2022 just last year by their business partners...VENKYS!

If the council didn't even consult the community then they have acted illegally as far as I'm concerned. Clear grounds for appeal.

[perthblue02]

Maybe the idea is to sell off Brockhall and get the players to fly over to the super duper academy that is probably still under construction in Pune to train, will be great for the millions of fans of India's premier league team., also an ideal opportunity for the likes of Cheston to fly over with the squad to kiss Desai's ring (after a very informative powerpoint presentation).

Anyway a land deal  involving the Queen of Pune looks like it is getting the full Venkys smoke and mirrors treatment

http://cityoflavasa.blogspot.com.au/2013/?view=classic

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

CROOKS.

You can't help but feel a very hard Rain is going to fall on this club in the near future.

Que a mass shrugging of shoulders over Tea and a return t' Tripe 'n' Chips amongst the apathetic populace of Blackburn.

[booth]

And still they will shout... "Get behind the lads!"

Oblivious to the fact it won't make a difference when the club is hamstrung by much greater adversity than the fans could ever muster.

[perthblue02]

15 minutes ago, booth said:

And still they will shout... "Get behind the lads!"

Oblivious to the fact it won't make a difference when the club is hamstrung by much greater adversity than the fans could ever muster.

You missed FFS! at the end 

[Crimpshrine]

16 hours ago, Ozz said:

The Rovers Trust application to have Brockhall listed as an ACV has been rejected. The club brought in some national heavyweight legal firm to squash the application.

 

http://www.roverstrust.com/2017/11/12/bid-protect-brockhall-rejected/

 

I think this says it all about the owners. Imagine the brownie points they could have gained by agreeing to the proposal and announcing  that they really do want to protect Jack's legacy.

But no , they would rather upset every single Rovers fan and make it obvious that their own interests come first.

I believe there are covenants regarding brockhall that will make it difficult to sell for development but they clearly want to keep all options open.

They really need to explain their intentions at the next 'supporters consultation' meeting.

I know people will argue that Venky's are not asset strippers in the true sense of the phrase but they are doing  a bloody good impression! 

[Boaty]

5 hours ago, J*B said:

Average house price on Brockhall is £414,000. I reckon you could do 1,500 houses on all the land owned by Rovers. 

and you think houses on an estate of 1500 will be worth anything like 414000? 

[Boaty]

2 hours ago, Vinjay17 said:

How did the local residents respond to this and were they even consulted? I said when talk of the ACV attempt began that one of the pivotal requirements would be getting local residents on side. Has anyone objected to this other than Venkys? I'm guessing one of the objectors wasn't "Ribble Valley Inns" who also happen to be the owners of a great big manor up Langho way. Any future development up there may well have some positive impact on their business...hmmmm. Not to mention their precious catering contract that was extended until 2022 just last year by their business partners...VENKYS!

If the council didn't even consult the community then they have acted illegally as far as I'm concerned. Clear grounds for appeal.

Heres an idea Vijay, why don't you go ahead and appeal? of course you will not, you will continue to come on here and complain about it like all the others do whilst achieving nothing. moaning about ACVs and how fans have got their heads buried in the sand. load of nonsense.

[JHRover]

5 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

I think this says it all about the owners. Imagine the brownie points they could have gained by agreeing to the proposal and announcing  that they really do want to protect Jack's legacy.

But no , they would rather upset every single Rovers fan and make it obvious that their own interests come first.

I believe there are covenants regarding brockhall that will make it difficult to sell for development but they clearly want to keep all options open.

They really need to explain their intentions at the next 'supporters consultation' meeting.

I know people will argue that Venky's are not asset strippers in the true sense of the phrase but they are doing  a bloody good impression! 

The Jack Walker Trust settlement was supposed to be a barrier to prevent cowboys turning up and wrecking his legacy, that didn't achieve anything other than the worst takeover in football history. Rather than protecting the club it actually did the complete opposite and ensured it passed into the worst hands imaginable having tried and failed to pass it on to the suspect Ali Syed who was swiftly exposed on Panorama and bankrupted Racing Santander.

So whilst it should be a reassurance that legal obstacles exist to prevent bad things happening to the club, we know from very recent experience that such obstacles can be swiftly overcome should the need arise. £20 million changes hands and no questions are asked as one set of villains disappear into the sunset and the other set proceed to wreck the club. Due diligence - what a joke.

[tomphil]

Covenants can get over turned, money and demand for housing talks. Harrods hampers, free corporate at matches and maybe invites to the most exclusive parties in Pune might help swing things in the right direction.

Oh and don't forget free AKON concert tickets !

[Vinjay]

21 minutes ago, Boaty said:

Heres an idea Vijay, why don't you go ahead and appeal? of course you will not, you will continue to come on here and complain about it like all the others do whilst achieving nothing. moaning about ACVs and how fans have got their heads buried in the sand. load of nonsense.

I've already assumed they have more than one brain cell and will look into the possibility of an appeal. I'm suggesting this is just one of the potential grounds to make a case for it. If the residents (AKA the community) haven't been consulted over this then we have to ask WHY? What would convince the council to turn a blind eye about asking the community for their views? It shouldn't take a genius to work out the answer.

Maybe I'm a bit apathetic as people have accused others of being though I've suggested things that can't be mentioned on this forum. What is the endgame in all this? I keep asking myself whether Jack would have wished he hadn't bothered. That's one of the things that's stopped me doing more what's the excuse for others? I'm disillusioned with the football industry as a whole with corrupt scum like UEFA poisoning everything with their crooked FUP.

Also I don't like being singled out by you. 

[J*B]

31 minutes ago, Boaty said:

and you think houses on an estate of 1500 will be worth anything like 414000? 

Well theres 3k houses there already, so I'm not sure what difference another 1.5k would make. Saying that, i'm not an estate agent, so if anyone can put a better figure on it, go ahead.

[toogs]

57 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

They really need to explain their intentions at the next 'supporters consultation' meeting.

Agree. However those meetings aren't fit for purpose. They will just put Tony in the firing line to divert discussion elsewhere.  And some fans fall for it. 

[Vinjay]

Just now, toogs said:

Agree. However those meetings aren't fit for purpose. They will just put Tony in the firing line to divert discussion elsewhere.  And some fans fall for it. 

Or his replacement.

[Stuart]

7 hours ago, JHRover said:

I said a while back that in some ways it is 'easier' for them to own us in League One than the Championship. I'm not suggesting that they want us to be in League One, or that they deliberately put us here or will deliberately keep us here, as I find those theories too far fetched, but I don't believe there is much incentive, to them getting us back to the Championship, unless they really do have serious ambitions of getting back to the Premier League.

If the aim is to get out of this league and then exist as a selling club in the Championship without investment then as you say, there's no point to Venkys of doing that.

As we saw last summer, a spend of £1 million in this league makes you the rich boys and promotion favourites, makes the fans happy and enables you to outspend everyone else in this league. Venkys signed up to £5 million a year spend in the Premier League when they bought the club so £1 million on new players falls within the budget and also kept grief to the minimum for a few months.

Contrast to the Championship where Wolves have been spending £15 million on one player, Sheffield Wednesday have been throwing money around, Derby too. Middlesbrough £50 million. Its a bit more expensive to compete in that league where wages are going through the roof and other foreign owners are arriving and competing to go up.

Likewise there is less scrutiny in League One, less media involvement, its easier to operate the club with the skeleton structure they've always desired, the wage bill can be brought down to much lower levels whilst still putting out a competitive side in the league.

Its become very expensive to maintain a competitive side in the Championship, not so in League One.

Does make you wonder though: Why bother?

Do they really think the have any chance of getting their money back? Can they really be so spiteful as to run the club into the ground? It’s much more likely that they have simply lost interest completely rather than any real plan or acceptance. Just an agenda item in a quarterly meeting, and a budget signed off each year.

Personally, if it was my business, I’d be looking to offload BRFC to whomever gave me a quid to take on the losses as soon as possible, just to save losing money. Regardless of lower costs there is no business sense in any of this. Unless of course a sale could introduce risk to their other businesses and/or personal wealth.