World Cup 2018

[speeeeeeedie]

Regardless of perceived slights and perceived bad refereeing decisions the best team won the tournament. France were just too strong for Croatia. They have good players all over the park, including match winners in Griezmann and Mbappe. They will be there or thereabouts for the next one too.

It was an excellent world cup. Some great games, good performances, and progress from England. 

I only missed watching 3 games. Kick off times were great for me. My top 4 are; France, Belgium, Croatia, Uruguay. 

Modric was given the player of the tournament award. I agree with that. I'd have Hazard at number 2. That big lad up front for Russia had a great run too. Certainly not top class, but was excellent.

 

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by speeeeeeedie

[joey_big_nose]

Very fair article here https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44808192

Stats in this volume really don't lie. Southgate got some elements very right - three at the back, going for Pickford, choosing Maguire over Cahill, the set piece routines, selecting Trippier over Walker at wing back.

However when you're getting less shots on target per game than Costa Rica and Tunisia there is a critical need to go back to the drawing board on midfield and attack.

For what it's worth I'd look at moving Sterling into midfield and just play Kane up there on his own. I think it may perversely help us slightly, although it would depend on the midfield effectively supporting the striker. Also Kane's lack of mobility is a barrier to going it alone up top, but potentially that was just due to injury.

Also I'd swap one of Alli or Lingard for a passer - probably Shelvey. He's got his faults but I think Alli and Lingard are too similar, and Alli in particular has been poor.

Alternatively we could drop Walker and go 442/451. That would let us play Shelvey, Alli and Lingard. But I think we won't do that as 3 cb has worked pretty well. I could easily see us lose the composure and control of possession 3 at the back has given us.

One good thing is we are going straight into competitive games with Spain and Croatia (the new Nations League) so we should be able to experiment a bit against high quality opposition.

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by joey_big_nose

[jim mk2]

 

27 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

 

One good thing is we are going straight into competitive games with Spain and Croatia (the new Nations League) so we should be able to experiment a bit against high quality opposition.

 

 

 

And there's the rub. We've become flat track bullies who beat low-rated opposition but always come up short against the best  teams.  We lost to Belgium twice in Russia.  Until we start to beat the likes of Spain, Belgium and Croatia the best we can ever hope for is quarter-finals. 

We need a creative central midfielder to play alongside Henderson.  Shelvey's just about the only England-qualified player in the Premier League at the moment who could do the job. 

 

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by jim mk2

[Audax]

Yes, France was the best team there, yes, the officiating tended to put Croatia on their back heel and have to chase the game.

I believe 3 European teams could have defeated Brazil,  those being France, Croatia and Belgium though, Switzerland did draw in the group stage, one South American team likely could have too, Uruguay. I'd rank the teams something like this.

1. France

2. Croatia

3. Belgium

4. Uruguay

5. Brazil

6. Russia* (as the host nation)

7. England

8. Sweden

9. Spain

10. Switzerland

11. Portugal

12. Japan

13. Denmark

14. Argentina

15. Mexico

16. Colombia

Russia probably would not have done as well in a neutral venue, I basically have 6th place as a tie between England and Russia. England need to up their game to where they would be one of those teams that could defeat Brazil as well. This was a roadblock in the past. Not as much of one currently. All IMHO.

The above are the round of 16 teams.

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Audax

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

57 minutes ago, Audax said:

Yes, France was the best team there, yes, the officiating tended to put Croatia on their back heel and have to chase the game.

I believe 3 European teams could have defeated Brazil,  those being France, Croatia and Belgium though, Switzerland did draw in the group stage, one South American team likely could have too, Uruguay. I'd rank the teams something like this.

1. France

2. Croatia

3. Belgium

4. Uruguay

5. Brazil

6. Russia* (as the host nation)

7. England

8. Sweden

9. Spain

10. Switzerland

11. Portugal

12. Japan

13. Denmark

14. Argentina

15. Mexico

16. Colombia

Russia probably would not have done as well in a neutral venue, I basically have 6th place as a tie between England and Russia. England need to up their game to where they would be one of those teams that could defeat Brazil as well. This was a roadblock in the past. Not as much of one currently. All IMHO.

The above are the round of 16 teams.

 

I'd take Spain, Portugal and Argentina to beat England most of the time. We aren't a top ten team at the moment. As long as we allow Premier League clubs to fill their teams with foreigners we never will be either. 

[Husky]

2 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

 

 

 

And there's the rub. We've become flat track bullies who beat low-rated opposition but always come up short against the best  teams.  We lost to Belgium twice in Russia.  Until we start to beat the likes of Spain, Belgium and Croatia the best we can ever hope for is quarter-finals. 

We need a creative central midfielder to play alongside Henderson.  Shelvey's just about the only England-qualified player in the Premier League at the moment who could do the job. 

 

 

If Dack was more Ronaldo than Rooney, perhaps he could step up to the plate.

If only I was his agent: "Drop the drink and the bints and let's give it a go".

Edited July 16, 2018 by Husky

[Husky]

I could only imagine the headlines if this was 'English Ooligans'. No class those violent French thugs. . .

2 dead in French WC Football Riots

 

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Husky

[perthblue02]

6 minutes ago, Husky said:

If Dack was more Ronaldo than Rooney, perhaps he could step up to the plate.

 

and then fall over it , roll about for an hour and then chase the ref to give the plate a card?

[DE.]

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/44847460

Strange comments from Lovren here. Granted France didn't exactly play scintillating football, but they were hardly playing anti-football either. Croatia's "beautiful football" mostly came through the genius of Modric. Take him out of the team and I imagine they'd play somewhat differently. 

[Husky]

20 minutes ago, DE. said:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/44847460

Strange comments from Lovren here. Granted France didn't exactly play scintillating football, but they were hardly playing anti-football either. Croatia's "beautiful football" mostly came through the genius of Modric. Take him out of the team and I imagine they'd play somewhat differently. 

Nothing that Courtois and Hazard hadn't previously stated to be fair.

Anti-Football France

[DE.]

Just now, Husky said:

Nothing that Courtois and Hazard hadn't previously stated to be fair.

Anti-Football France

When did counter attacking football become anti-football? It's been around for decades and some of the best teams in history have played a counter attacking style. Belgium and Croatia need to realise that being defensively solid isn't a crime, it's actually extremely important if you want to win things. Playing pretty football is pointless if you can't keep your opponents from scoring against you. 

[Audax]

Per the news, fans in Montreal Canada poured out into the streets.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/thousands-of-france-fans-pour-onto-montreal-streets-after-4-2-world-cup-nvictory/ar-AAA73fx

Canada produces some of the best hockey players in the world, it sure seems to me that per football, they could be competitive. They have a whole slew of Italians, those from the former Yugoslavia as well besides, obviously, many of British ancestry.

 

 

 

[joey_big_nose]

2 hours ago, Husky said:

Nothing that Courtois and Hazard hadn't previously stated to be fair.

Anti-Football France

I thought it was a fair accusation in the Belgium France game where France totally strangled it. But in the final, France were very entertaining in the second half. It's hard to score 4 with anti football. They arguably could have got another 2.

Sour grapes unfortunately.

 

 

[Audax]

7 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I'd take Spain, Portugal and Argentina to beat England most of the time. We aren't a top ten team at the moment. As long as we allow Premier League clubs to fill their teams with foreigners we never will be either. 

One should consider making their own list,  it's sort of based on how the games went beyond the group stage at the World Cup and I was looking at Speedee's prior post above. Spain was knocked out of the round of 16. Besides that, then, that would start to effect where one puts Russia since Russia defeated Spain.

I think England would compete quite well versus Argentina and Portugal.

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Audax

[joey_big_nose]

12 hours ago, Audax said:

One should consider making their own list,  it's sort of based on how the games went beyond the group stage at the World Cup and I was looking at Speedee's prior post above. Spain was knocked out of the round of 16. Besides that, then, that would start to effect where one puts Russia since Russia defeated Spain.

I think England would compete quite well versus Argentina and Portugal.

 

Sides I expect England would lose by a couple of goals to : Spain, Brazil, France, Germany (if they turned up), Belgium

Sides England would have a tight game with, and probably lose in extra time or penalties :  Portugal, Argentina, Italy (I know they didn't qualify!),  Uruguay, Croatia

Everyone else I would expect us to just about beat. Though I wouldn't be mega confident with the like likes of Colombia, Switzerland, Poland etc who are not far off us in terms of quality.

[Audax]

9 hours ago, joey_big_nose said:

Sides I expect England would lose by a couple of goals to : Spain, Brazil, France, Germany (if they turned up), Belgium

Sides England would have a tight game with, and probably lose in extra time or penalties :  Portugal, Argentina, Italy (I know they didn't qualify!),  Uruguay, Croatia

Everyone else I would expect us to just about beat. Though I wouldn't be mega confident with the like likes of Colombia, Switzerland, Poland etc who are not far off us in terms of quality.

Again, this is all easy to say, however a real ranking of the tournament would then have to take in account of, for example,

Brazil and Switzerland drawing.

Mexico defeating Germany, South Korea defeating Germany.

Russia winning the penalty shootout against Spain and advancing.

I'm sure, when FIFA rankis the tournament, it will already have been done actually, they will have the 8 finalists more or less from those who advanced from the round of 16. And we know, in the tournament, England finished 4th, period.

One should post their own rankings based on the tournament and see how it looks,  let's see? Germany number 6 yet they were defeated by South Korea and Mexico?  Er, okay.

Oh, and Iceland drawing mighty Argentina and Messi.

I think people should again, repeating, put up their own World Cup rankings.

Croatia whipped Argentina, 3-0.

Good luck!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 17, 2018 by Audax

[joey_big_nose]

1 hour ago, OnePhilT said:

We beat Sweden in normal time in the knockout stages and reached the semifinal. Croatia didn't beat anyone in normal time in the knockout stages, yet reached the final. I don't think there's anything to read into it.

Well France who got to the final without needing to go to extra time then easily beat Croatia.

I'd say teams that can on average win games in the 90 mins are better than those that need the extra time to do it.

Edited July 18, 2018 by joey_big_nose

[Husky]

Can't seem to find the designated England thread (is there one?) so I'll continue to post here.

How many of you actually know that the England are currently playing in the U-19 European Championship? It wasn't even mentioned on all the sports news I saw on various channels. It wasn't even listed on the latest scores on BBC - just a bunch of those crass CL preliminary qualifiers.

England are basically trying to defend the title with a reserve team - as most clubs didn't want to release their England players from pre-season tours etc. Seriously, what do clubs get from players playing in these largely nonsense pre-season games over letting their youngsters play in a proper competitive finals tournament? Nothing to be gained from beating say Boreham Wood 8-0 or some rank amateurs 22-0 etc. etc.

For those that don't know. England won their first game 3-2 against Turkey. If you see Turkey's 2nd goal you'll see that England have already found the new Kyle Walker, so the future looks good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icvj2pWz9_g

Ukraine beat France 2-1 in the other game in England's group. Check out the Phil Jones like tackle at 01:33.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv3RhfiKAlo

 

Edited July 19, 2018 by Husky

[Oldgregg86]

All the games are on Sky sports

[AllRoverAsia]

5 hours ago, Husky said:

Can't seem to find the designated England thread (is there one?) so I'll continue to post here.

How many of you actually know that the England are currently playing in the U-19 European Championship? It wasn't even mentioned on all the sports news I saw on various channels. It wasn't even listed on the latest scores on BBC - just a bunch of those crass CL preliminary qualifiers.

England are basically trying to defend the title with a reserve team - as most clubs didn't want to release their England players from pre-season tours etc. Seriously, what do clubs get from players playing in these largely nonsense pre-season games over letting their youngsters play in a proper competitive finals tournament? Nothing to be gained from beating say Boreham Wood 8-0 or some rank amateurs 22-0 etc. etc.

For those that don't know. England won their first game 3-2 against Turkey. If you see Turkey's 2nd goal you'll see that England have already found the new Kyle Walker, so the future looks good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icvj2pWz9_g

Ukraine beat France 2-1 in the other game in England's group. Check out the Phil Jones like tackle at 01:33.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv3RhfiKAlo

 

Watching it online. Ukraine tomorrow with France on Monday. Both ko 4.30 pm uk time.

http://www.live-footballontv.com

England and other countries are blaming UEFA for scheduling these games during preseason and not during an international break, saying PL clubs want to take a close look at their youngsters in a full preseason including on tour. Probably right too.

Lancs romped it v Leics, biggie tomorrow!

[joey_big_nose]

19 hours ago, Husky said:

Can't seem to find the designated England thread (is there one?) so I'll continue to post here.

How many of you actually know that the England are currently playing in the U-19 European Championship? It wasn't even mentioned on all the sports news I saw on various channels. It wasn't even listed on the latest scores on BBC - just a bunch of those crass CL preliminary qualifiers.

England are basically trying to defend the title with a reserve team - as most clubs didn't want to release their England players from pre-season tours etc. Seriously, what do clubs get from players playing in these largely nonsense pre-season games over letting their youngsters play in a proper competitive finals tournament? Nothing to be gained from beating say Boreham Wood 8-0 or some rank amateurs 22-0 etc. etc.

For those that don't know. England won their first game 3-2 against Turkey. If you see Turkey's 2nd goal you'll see that England have already found the new Kyle Walker, so the future looks good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icvj2pWz9_g

Ukraine beat France 2-1 in the other game in England's group. Check out the Phil Jones like tackle at 01:33.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv3RhfiKAlo

 

I knew we were champions of one youth world cup. I didnt realise we are champs of both youth world cups (u17 and u20) and the u19 European cup.

Maybe really things are looking up?

[AllRoverAsia]

England v Ukraine u19s followed by the T20 War of the Roses with most of the England players available.

Purrrrrrfect........ unless it rains here and knackers my data connection

[not exactly Scarface]

The team reached a semi-final but somehow lost 3 games during the tournament.   Just seems bizarre in a sense.  

Were England good enough to win it ?   Hard to say really.   You look at the calibre of opposition along the way and we never really played any real competition until the Croatia game.    If they had won and played France they probably would have lost as well but it's all hypothetical after the event.

Pickford was inspired, Kane is a dangerous player and there's a number of kids coming through but we don't have the ambition or flair of other contending nations and appear to lose our nerve on the very biggest occasions.      If one good came out of it you don't have the "It's coming home" nausea anymore.     England or not that worn a bit thin by the end and perhaps some got a little carried away with it all.     

Shame in a sense it's over but it was far from the best tournament we've ever seen.    Too many big name nations out in the earliest stages and that VAR crap spoiled things considerably.  ?

 

 

[Husky]

3 hours ago, AllRoverAsia said:

England v Ukraine u19s followed by the T20 War of the Roses with most of the England players available.

Purrrrrrfect........ unless it rains here and knackers my data connection

How about if it rains in Manchester? ?

[Husky]

On 16/07/2018 at 01:34, joey_big_nose said:

Sessegnon looks a certainty for caps, the rest need to establish themselves at their clubs to see if they have the required credentials.

From what I have seen of Sessegnon, he almost seems wasted at left back/wing back. Obviously when half your main job is to defend it will end up curtailing your attacking play, as well as knackering you out more (especially in major tournaments where the games come thick and fast with the potential of extra time).

And we all know, blablabla, England have always been short of a decent left-winger . . . always.