Venkys London Ltd accounts

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, davulsukur said:

What point are you actually trying to make with all these wind up posts?

Good question ! Actually I am not on a wind up but just gently trying to point out that it is simple to advocate sacking a manager - harder to come up with someone who would want to come to the club where there is a significant likelihood that they would do better - and harder still to imagine that the owners would identify them.

For the record I don't think that there looks to be much of a chance that Tony Mowbray will get the club in to promotion contention - but then I don't think he will take us down either. I'd rather hang on with him and hope that he gets lucky and that one or two of the younger players break through to give us a shot. I appreciate that is a minority view - at least on this message board.

[Leonard Venkhater]

38 minutes ago, JHRover said:

So did Paul Jewell at Wigan, Phil Brown at Hull and Aidy Boothroyd at Watford. Shall we give one of them a ring next time round?

and Owen Coyle for.....

[JHRover]

Just now, Mashed Potatoes said:

Good question ! Actually I am not on a wind up but just gently trying to point out that it is simple to advocate sacking a manager - harder to come up with someone who would want to come to the club where there is a significant likelihood that they would do better - and harder still to imagine that the owners would identify them.

For the record I don't think that there looks to be much of a chance that Tony Mowbray will get the club in to promotion contention - but then I don't think he will take us down either. I'd rather hang on with him and hope that he gets lucky and that one or two of the younger players break through to give us a shot. I appreciate that is a minority view - at least on this message board.

Since the end of last season Swansea, Huddersfield, Stoke, Middlesbrough, Hull, Birmingham, West Brom, QPR, Millwall, Luton, Fulham, Reading, Derby and Forest have all changed manager. 

Almost all of those sides have improved or at worst stood still. Only really Middlesbrough gone backwards.

There are loads of good managers in the world that would love the chance to manage Rovers. 

This narrative that nobody would come here or there are no decent options out there is a complete cop out.

If it isnt working then you make a change. You don't stick with something that isnt working because you can't be bothered looking for a replacement.

People like Waggott are paid fortunes to supposedly run the club. He should have a list of options. If he doesn't then he isn't really a Chief Executive.

[tomphil]

Apart from doting a few i's and crossing a few t's on official documents i doubt Waggot has much to do with the football side unless he's told or asked.  Venus doing players contracts ?  WTF is all that about, why do we need a Director of Football Operations that works UNDER the manager but over the CEO ?

Between them they've got the inside of the club stitched up now by the looks of it. I'm sure that it runs a bit better than it was but is it running in the right way .....

Edited November 10, 2019 by tomphil

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, JHRover said:

Since the end of last season Swansea, Huddersfield, Stoke, Middlesbrough, Hull, Birmingham, West Brom, QPR, Millwall, Luton, Fulham, Reading, Derby and Forest have all changed manager. 

Almost all of those sides have improved or at worst stood still. Only really Middlesbrough gone backwards.

There are loads of good managers in the world that would love the chance to manage Rovers. 

This narrative that nobody would come here or there are no decent options out there is a complete cop out.

If it isnt working then you make a change. You don't stick with something that isnt working because you can't be bothered looking for a replacement.

People like Waggott are paid fortunes to supposedly run the club. He should have a list of options. If he doesn't then he isn't really a Chief Executive.

Not sure that all those clubs you mention are doing as well as you suggest (Derby ?) but that is not quite the point. I think the difference between myself plus a few others on one hand and yourself and others on the other hand is that I try to focus on what I think "would" happen whereas you focus on what you think "should" happen(where you and I probably do not differ greatly). My belief is that "good managers" will always have a choice where they work and based on the get-out clause that Paul Lambert made sure he had before he joined us  unfortunately with the present owners we will be a long way back in the queue. Additionally the owners track record with appointments suggests that there is a significant likelihood of someone worse than Tony Mowbray.

I don't know how much Steve Waggott is paid - but whilst he might have the title of Chief Executive I doubt if he has the powers or authority usually invested in someone with that position.

[JHRover]

Just now, Mashed Potatoes said:

Not sure that all those clubs you mention are doing as well as you suggest (Derby ?) but that is not quite the point. I think the difference between myself plus a few others on one hand and yourself and others on the other hand is that I try to focus on what I think "would" happen whereas you focus on what you think "should" happen(where you and I probably do not differ greatly). My belief is that "good managers" will always have a choice where they work and based on the get-out clause that Paul Lambert made sure he had before he joined us  unfortunately with the present owners we will be a long way back in the queue. Additionally the owners track record with appointments suggests that there is a significant likelihood of someone worse than Tony Mowbray.

I don't know how much Steve Waggott is paid - but whilst he might have the title of Chief Executive I doubt if he has the powers or authority usually invested in someone with that position.

So in a nutshell we do nothing, cross our fingers and hope things improve and we can limp our way to safety.

Meanwhile another £20 million loss comes along.

If we get relegated there may not be any coming back from that. I can't accept sitting back, doing nothing and hoping for the best.

 

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, JHRover said:

So in a nutshell we do nothing, cross our fingers and hope things improve and we can limp our way to safety.

Meanwhile another £20 million loss comes along.

If we get relegated there may not be any coming back from that. I can't accept sitting back, doing nothing and hoping for the best.

 

Yes that is what we do - as I said above I know it is a minority position.

Regarding the money it is owed to the owners and the debt is now so huge there is no realistic way of it being repaid from within the club's operations so it is their problem.

Aren't we all doing nothing really ? Posting on a message board is an amusing distraction once in a while but is not going to change anything.

[DE.]

Just now, Mashed Potatoes said:

Aren't we all doing nothing really ? Posting on a message board is an amusing distraction once in a while but is not going to change anything.

We aren't talking about what we should personally be doing, though, we're talking about what we feel the club should be doing in the current circumstances. Doing nothing in the face of clear decline and hoping for the best isn't what I'm looking for from the club's leadership, and I think it's fair to say that even if personally I can do very little to effect the ultimate outcome.

[Stuart]

2 hours ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Tony Mowbray has already delivered Premier League football for West Brom

And he’s already said that he has changed his style from that season because it was too successful exciting attacking.

[Leonard Venkhater]

Mashed Potatoes

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Posted 1 hour ago

  1 hour ago, JHRover said:

So in a nutshell we do nothing, cross our fingers and hope things improve and we can limp our way to safety.

Meanwhile another £20 million loss comes along.

If we get relegated there may not be any coming back from that. I can't accept sitting back, doing nothing and hoping for the best.

 

 

 

Edited November 10, 2019 by Leonard Venkhater

[Leonard Venkhater]

 

 

 

 

 

3

1 hour ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Yes that is what we do - as I said above I know it is a minority position.

Regarding the money it is owed to the owners and the debt is now so huge there is no realistic way of it being repaid from within the club's operations so it is their problem.

Aren't we all doing nothing really ? Posting on a message board is an amusing distraction once in a while but is not going to change anything.

Provoking, but a good point imo.

I think most Rovers fans feel more powerless than ever. There is no fight left in the fanbase-partly a result of being worn down by the events, since 2010.

This is a slow, lingering death.

If and when the Venky's do pull the plug, there will be even fewer people, who will be even more worn down. A deliberate strategy?

[Herbie6590]

This thread has gone way off topic...plenty of other places on here to discuss Venky’s, Tony, results etc etc

[Herbie6590]

 

I'll do a quick review on here once they are published...any accountants who log on here feel free to contribute to the debate... 

 

[Vinjay]

Are you really expecting anything significantly different? More share capital, bowing down to FUP, etc.

[awhom111]

It will be the first time that the Brereton transfer hits any published accounts so we may get more insight there.

[Herbie6590]

I think we should not expect much spending in January....

[Herbie6590]

[Herbie6590]

[Herbie6590]

These numbers confirm that owning a Championship football club is akin to playing high stakes roulette. The only way you might see a return on the investment is by winning promotion to the promised land of the Premier League. Otherwise, it’s a very expensive hobby. 
Venky’s continue to bankroll the losses and without that support, Rovers would be insolvent. It’s hard to see how the club can spend significantly without contravening FFP based on these numbers.

To echo Rich Sharpe’s recent Tweets, the academy is the way forward, develop your own, sell them on at a profit. 
 

One can only assume that the signings of Brereton & Gallagher were predicated on the basis that they would grow, develop and be sold on at a profit. The importance of spending such large sums wisely is brought into sharp focus. The absolute imperative of growing Matchday & non-Matchday income is clear to see.

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

What a sorry state of affairs. We're utterly dependent on the rats that have destroyed our club and with Mowbray at the helm and only academy players to develop we're not getting promoted anytime soon. 

[Mashed Potatoes]

43 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

These numbers confirm that owning a Championship football club is akin to playing high stakes roulette. The only way you might see a return on the investment is by winning promotion to the promised land of the Premier League. Otherwise, it’s a very expensive hobby. 
Venky’s continue to bankroll the losses and without that support, Rovers would be insolvent. It’s hard to see how the club can spend significantly without contravening FFP based on these numbers.

To echo Rich Sharpe’s recent Tweets, the academy is the way forward, develop your own, sell them on at a profit. 
 

One can only assume that the signings of Brereton & Gallagher were predicated on the basis that they would grow, develop and be sold on at a profit. The importance of spending such large sums wisely is brought into sharp focus. The absolute imperative of growing Matchday & non-Matchday income is clear to see.

Spot on.The immediate significance is that FFP constraints will mean that little or no money can be spent in the transfer market and there is a need to reduce the size of the squad to bring wages down ; it may even be necessary to make a profit in the transfer market which will be that much harder with the club's most valuable asset in Bradley Dack injured until the autumn of next year. 

Those who constantly demand the firing of the manager need to think long and hard as to what sort of manager would be attracted to the club as things will be for the next couple of years; names like Houghton and Hughes are for the birds, I'm afraid.

[Crimpshrine]

Shows what a hash they have made of everything. The policy to spend big on young British players to sell on at a profit has totally backfired and we are stuck with expensive flops.

The risk of that policy has been highlighted by the only saleable asset being injured and may potentially be worth nothing in 18 months.

They are treating the club as some sort of hedge fund without really understanding anything about the football side. Problems all of their own making.  

[tomphil]

At some point we are facing austerity again unless they offload some for big fees to re-invest. Otherwise like before the taps will have to be turned down in order to comply with FFP.

And lets not blame it all on that, whilst Vs can clearly afford to fund it and obviously don't really care about the numbers there still needs to be a sensible balance.  Throwing huge money on certain players and big wages on others whilst we flounder around isn't really the way forward.

Might as well have a shit or bust approach for a season or two if you are going to end up embargoed anyway.

 

[tomphil]

Just now, Crimpshrine said:

Shows what a hash they have made of everything. The policy to spend big on young British players to sell on at a profit has totally backfired and we are stuck with expensive flops.

The risk of that policy has been highlighted by the only saleable asset being injured and may potentially be worth nothing in 18 months.

They are treating the club as some sort of hedge fund without really understanding anything about the football side. Problems all of their own making.  

Only Venkys could STILL be stupid enough to fall for that, they continue to have their pants pulled down in full view of everyone.

[G Somerset Rover]

4 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

Shows what a hash they have made of everything. The policy to spend big on young British players to sell on at a profit has totally backfired and we are stuck with expensive flops.

Bang on. Gallagher looks a huge waste, whilst we may as well have burnt the £7 million on Brereton and saved everyone the hassle.

Edited December 31, 2019 by Gavlar Somerset Rover!