[Archived] Rotherham V Rovers

[JHRover]

I'm not panicking. But nor am I particularly confident in how we are going about our business in games. Maybe I'm a bit of a worrier and sit on the negative end of the scale but I can't just shrug my shoulders having dropped 6 points from winning/winnable positions in the space of a week. We can point to unbeaten runs and this that and the other but there's only one stat that really counts.

Rotherham aren't a good side. They offered nothing until we lost the plot. But then again we also offered nothing so a draw was probably fair on the balance of the game. 0-0 or 1-1 about fair. Likewise we saw vs Scunthorpe that another team hailed as a quality force in this league weren't really anything to be impressed with yet we conspired to twice relinquish a lead against them.

 

[chaddyrovers]

18 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

We were away to a good side and they managed to scrape a draw in the last minute. No need for panic stations. 

Exactly. Some fans are panicking. Just like they were before we went on our unbeaten run  

[Bigdoggsteel]

18 minutes ago, Gavlar Somerset Rover! said:

Gladwin? Going away from our club with a little luck!

Ya,he hasn't been good. Still,only room for improvement and he is coming into a much improved team. Could be our back up to Dack. I would throw him on near the end of games we are winning,build his confidence up.

 

17 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I'm not panicking. But nor am I particularly confident in how we are going about our business in games. Maybe I'm a bit of a worrier and sit on the negative end of the scale but I can't just shrug my shoulders having dropped 6 points from winning/winnable positions in the space of a week. We can point to unbeaten runs and this that and the other but there's only one stat that really counts.

Rotherham aren't a good side. They offered nothing until we lost the plot. But then again we also offered nothing so a draw was probably fair on the balance of the game. 0-0 or 1-1 about fair. Likewise we saw vs Scunthorpe that another team hailed as a quality force in this league weren't really anything to be impressed with yet we conspired to twice relinquish a lead against them.

 

Rotherham are alright,but I will admit when I heard Moore was gone back to Ipswich,I thought we could win it. I agree it's worrying about dropping points we should have won. Dack even mentioned this in an interview after the game,so the players know it. If we turned a couple of those draws into wins,we could be almost top though,so it's fine margins. A few decent signings now and I think we will do enough to push on second half of the season. We have definitely made mistakes first half,but the team looks to have learnt how not to lose,which is good. 

Questions is,can Shrewsbury and Wigan keep their form up? Both are due a slip,particularly the Shrews. We just need to keep the heads,keep plugging away and take our chances when they come. Then hold our position. Mowbray has been here before. I believe he will deal with this well. 

[chaddyrovers]

50 minutes ago, Tom said:

Funny thing is nobody would be complaining if Mowbray did his job well and adapted in play to see the game out, he changed it and drew pressure and we conceded.

I called it at the time of the sub so did many others 

From people posts at the game we were being pressure from around 70 mins. So Mowbray changed around 85 mins for Ward on. Graham looks shattered. Also they push a big centre half forward. 

I watched most of the game on phone via facebook. Miss the goal and last 10 mins. 

But the fact we got a point. 

Lets focus on the Shrewsbury game. I wouldnt be playing some key players against Hull. 

 

[DE.]

Nobody is panicking, that's just an easy way to dismiss legitimate concerns. Also the term "unbeaten run" is starting to do my head in. You could draw every game in a season and be 46 games unbeaten, but you'd likely still be relegated at the end of the campaign. 

[DE.]

Oh, and speaking of unbeaten runs, anybody remember Huddersfield's record breaking 25 game unbeaten run in this league in 2010/11?

They came third and lost in the playoff finals. We need to focus on winning games and getting into the automatic spots, because the playoff is a lottery I'd rather not be a part of.

[Tom]

48 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

We were away to a good side and they managed to scrape a draw in the last minute. No need for panic stations. 

And if we end up in the play offs you'll say 'we have a good chance of going up still no need to panic' 

Then if we bottle it and don't go up 'we were close this season we will go up next season, no need to panic'

 

Whilst it's not panic stations a team aiming for automatic promotion shouldn't drop 6 points from 12 we are far from out of the race but making it harder for ourselves 

[Bigdoggsteel]

8 minutes ago, Tom said:

And if we end up in the play offs you'll say 'we have a good chance of going up still no need to panic' 

Then if we bottle it and don't go up 'we were close this season we will go up next season, no need to panic'

 

Whilst it's not panic stations a team aiming for automatic promotion shouldn't drop 6 points from 12 we are far from out of the race but making it harder for ourselves 

Am,no I wouldn't say the second of those things because at that point it would be too late. Promotion is the aim. My point was we are still on for that. Point totally missed there by yourself

If we are in the play offs,it would really depend on how we were playing going into them. As it stands I would be confident,but they are a lottery,so as I said ,automatic promotion is the aim and we are still very much within touching distance of that. A few signings in January and lenihan back will give us a huge boost. 

[JBiz]

59 minutes ago, DE. said:

Oh, and speaking of unbeaten runs, anybody remember Huddersfield's record breaking 25 game unbeaten run in this league in 2010/11?

They came third and lost in the playoff finals. We need to focus on winning games and getting into the automatic spots, because the playoff is a lottery I'd rather not be a part of.

Primary part of winning games is making yourself hard to beat DE... 

You aren’t the only one who skims past that.

[Bigdoggsteel]

13 minutes ago, Biz said:

Primary part of winning games is making yourself hard to beat DE... 

You aren’t the only one who skims past that.

Exactly. It sounds like some fans want us to gamble in games we are drawing and go all out for a win. If we concede and lose ,I am sure they will be so understanding then

To be fair to Mowbray,I think by and large he does always encourage the team to go for wins. It appears to me that missed chances are the difference between turning draws into wins at the moment. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Bringing on Ward to stiffen the defence was a gamble. Gambles come in all forms. 

[DE.]

28 minutes ago, Biz said:

Primary part of winning games is making yourself hard to beat DE... 

You aren’t the only one who skims past that.

Other than literally compiling an average of our stats over the last ten games on another thread and highlighting that we concede too many goals, I agree I should stop skimming past that.

[JBiz]

Just now, DE. said:

Other than literally compiling an average of our stats over the last ten games on another thread and highlighting that we concede too many goals, I agree I should stop skimming past that.

I appreciate such content, however in reply to the part about unbeaten runs - it’s important we keep it up.

[GreenRover]

Shrewsbury is a big test for the boys but days like that can bring the best out of them. They must be aware that a win here is very important psychologically so hopefully all guns blazing for it. Not sure about the Hull game but would be great to win that too for confidence. I think the fans have a big part to play against Shrewsbury. We should be willing them on every second. Think it will be a great game so booked my flights last night to come over from Ireland. Can't wait. COYB?⚪️

[DE.]

Just now, Biz said:

I appreciate such content, however in reply to the part about unbeaten runs - it’s important we keep it up.

Three draws is the equivalent of one win and two defeats, which maybe puts the "unbeaten" tag in a bit more perspective.

We're already conceding more goals than the teams around us, so unbeaten or not we need to address that if we're going to turn draws into wins - which is how we'll get into the automatic places. Another reason to think about the way we play is our over-reliance on Dack, which I think almost all of us agree on. If he gets injured or suspended right now we could be in real trouble if we don't sort out our defending. It's all on Mowbray to deal with. He's done well to rebound from our poor early season form, but can he make that final push to get us where we need to be?

[tomphil]

We actually usually respond better to a defeat now and again it seems to fire them up and refocus them and Mowbray gets a bit bolder. We got into the winning habit so get back to that rather than being happy to draw games all the time and harp on about unbeaten runs etc.

A points a point yes but these are coming from wins being thrown away not a point being gained although with all the variables over the festive period it could have been worse I suppose.

Have a good rest, get Hull game out the way then back to upping the ante the mantra must be win games to chase a top two spot not lets just try and hold 3rd place !

[briansol]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

From people posts at the game we were being pressure from around 70 mins. So Mowbray changed around 85 mins for Ward on. Graham looks shattered. Also they push a big centre half forward. 

I watched most of the game on phone via facebook. Miss the goal and last 10 mins. 

But the fact we got a point. 

Lets focus on the Shrewsbury game. I wouldnt be playing some key players against Hull. 

 

I knew we were doomed when Ward was brought on. That man is a liability, can't wait for Lenihan to get fit.  Ward lost his man on the corner allowing him to flick on, and why don't we have someone to protect the post?

Mowbray has to share the blame. 3 men at the back didn't work. Downing and Ward went for the same balls and didn't know how to position themselves. In addition it meant that we were one man short in midfield inviting pressure and crosses into the box. 

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

The Shrewsbury game is taking on the importance of the Rovers v Plymouth  game in the 1970's. I hope it's as good with the same result.

[tomphil]

Ward seems to put the wobbles up everyone he's one of those players. 

[den9112]

3 hours ago, arbitro said:

Mowbray wasn't prepared to try and get a second goal when we were clearly on top. He cost us yesterday not just in my opinion but lots of other fans who were there.

Correct.....Both I and my Brother both looked at each other as soon as we saw Ward getting ready to come on, and we both came to the same conclusion , get ready for a late equalizer.

TM a good man he may be , a manager with knowledge on basic tactics in Div 3  he is not , needs to stop bottling it 

 

 

 

[AggyBlue]

We need to keep at it for 90 minutes. I don't think we are ruthless enough to achieve automatic promotion.

The ward substitution clearly cost us two points. For me we needed fresh legs in midfield rather than overcrowding at the back.

You don't concede if you keep the ball in your opponents half, it's not hard Tony.

[Boz]

It's nice to be able to actually comment on a live game...

I start from the premise that man for man,  with our wages budget and recent history would suggest that we should be at the very least a match for the opposition, without taking away how they might perform on the day. So it seems to be ,given the unbeaten run and how we have climbed the table as the season progresses, fingers crossed that it continues.

However yesterday was a match we should have won, with Rotherham there for the taking. I cannot really single out any of the usual targets who might have under performed, I thought on the whole most of the players did their roles. Defense looked solid until the late onslaught , with Williams standing out for me,. Midfield did ok, though I'd like to see better ball retention and a higher quality in possession, plus both wide players, whilst working hard I hope for more creative output, Conway at times did get beyond his man and put in a cross but these are too few and far between, thanks goodness the ref blew at half time, we were attacking down the left until Conway stopped, back tracked, came inside, then backwards to try to find a pass to a defender, but a misplaced pass to their attacker instead! 

Graham and Dack up front both performed, very happy to see DG's hold up play and work rate, if our midfield had more composure on the ball to find Dack, we would be even better.  I wasn't unhappy with the first two substitutions, Nyambe for Caddis and Samuel for Conway.  Bennett looked much better playing down the left alongside Williams. Samuel's pace seemed like it might trouble them, though his hold up play requires significant improvement, go and watch DG and show more battling. 

The final substitution, Ward for Graham, whilst to a certain degree was understandable in that they were throwing the kitchen sink at us, so yes I can to a certain degree understand why we might look to match them with a big centre half. I cannot criticise Ward, partly I couldn't see to the other end with all the players too, but to my mind it was more down to our (Tony Mowbray's) mindset. When we are sat on a one goal lead, we should expect the opposition, especially away from home attacking their supporters, to throw everything at us. We end up sitting too deep inviting them on, although TM did indeed seem to be encouraging them to get out. In my view it's more down to our ball retention, keep hold of the ball and pass it around, move up the pitch with the ball into their corners, running the clock down, not helped by Samuel unable to fulfill the same DG role, but I would have put on another midfield player rather than Ward, Tomlinson was an option and would have been my preferred choice.

So possibly two points lost, but then also a point away from home and the unbeaten run continues. I just hope that we don't rue a few of these last minute lost points. 

[Gav]

3 hours ago, DE. said:

 Also the term "unbeaten run" is starting to do my head in. 

You couldn't make this up....

After 7yrs of absolute rubbish served up week in week out, relegations and dark magic, the term unbeaten run is doing your head in 

Seriously DE?

Would you rather we lost a few instead? 

 

[DE.]

10 minutes ago, Gav said:

You couldn't make this up....

After 7yrs of absolute rubbish served up week in week out, relegations and dark magic, the term unbeaten run is doing your head in 

Seriously DE?

Would you rather we lost a few instead? 

 

You've missed the point Gav, possibly intentionally. It's not the fact we're unbeaten that's frustrating, it's every suggestion for improvement being met with "BUT WE'RE ON AN UNBEATEN RUN LOL". Yes, myself and others suggesting the need for improvement get it, but being on an unbeaten run doesn't mean we should stop striving to become better. If anything we should continue to push forward rather than get comfortable and begin to regress. 

[NinjaTattoo]

51 minutes ago, Suhail Slayer said:

I have said this before and will say it again. This all reminds me of last season.

TM came in and everyone felt like things had improved (me included). Except we didn't move up the table and got relegated. FACT.

That was not because of the improvement and the points we picked up. It was because of the points we threw away.

 

Now we have seen a great spell of wins where we should be in the top 2 by now. Except we have not moved up the table, the gap has opened back up and other teams have caught us up.

That is not because of the wins we have had. It is because of the wins we have thrown away. Same situation again.

The manager has to be blamed for Northampton. If he isn't happy with Antonnson taking the penalty, he gets his INSTRUCTION onto the pitch for someone else to take it. Poor leadership to allow that to happen.

I won't comment on his substitutions because I wasn't there but what I know is the points we have thrown away will be the reason we fail.

3rd and 6th are the same thing. 3 in 4 chance of failure = another new manager, massive cuts, accepting mid table 3rd division until we regress further and go down again.

We must be top 2 !!!!!!!!

Tony's next appraisal is end of January and so far it is looking like we will have wasted 2 months of the season and gone backwards not forwards.

 

Spot on 10000%

I keep going over the stick or twist thread and find it disappointing that peoples choices of either sticking or twisting have flip flopped. Everyones got a right to change their mind BUT results of the poll are just going to swing either way depending on the current results on the pitch.

I still say TM isn't the man for the job and I stick by my ideology.

I hate to say that majority of fans are pacified so easy in such a short term of events without seeing the flaws, as quoted above 3rd-6th is the same and I for one wouldn't like to see our hopes pinned on a 4/1 shot even if we are favs, its taken nearly half the season to be on track of the points per game ratio and whilst our current form is good it wouldn't take much to get sucked into 7th.