[Archived] Portsmouth v Rovers

[philipl]

12 hours ago, BlackburnEnd75 said:

Samuel has been a massive disappointment for me. Showed some early promise, has some attributes but doesn't appear to have the application. I'd like to say maybe its just a confidence thing (He looks a sulker to me) but actually its more likely that he's not got it going on upstairs and I'd be surprised if he turns it around for us now especially if we end up playing in the Championship next season.

I don't like singling players out but there was a particular attack when the ball ricocheted around the 6 yard box before going out for a corner.

I was astonished to see:

1) Samuel not involved in the action to score

2) the ball went past him at a gentle pace with no Pompey defender near

3) Instead of recovering the ball and driving it in from well inside the box he half-heartedly shepherded the damned thing out for a corner

He had time to think, this wasn't an instantaneous choice of action...

Seriously, what did he think he was doing?   

[JHRover]

4 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I agree, however in the case of lack of effort, I think the player needs to shoulder some of the responsibility. Do you think he ran around enough or put the effort in? 

'Running around' is only useful if done at the right time in the right areas of the pitch. Players can run around in midfield all day long, clocking up the miles and achieve very little. Our old friend Jason Lowe being the prime example. I've no idea how much distance Samuel covered in comparison to his colleagues. It appeared to be less but might not have been.

Samuel probably could have done more running but I wonder how far that would have really got us. It also depends on what Mowbray instructed him to do. It may be he was told to stay up top and await service from midfield as the lone striker.

At the end of the day if Samuel puts that chance away in the first half and puts us 1-0 up then he gets applauded off by Rovers fans for putting us ahead and I doubt there's any mention of how far he runs. The keeper saved his shot and he gets cheered off when substituted and there's an inquest into his effort and attitude. Fine margins and I'd sooner give him a chance in the team than the Varneys and Browns we've had in recent years.

[Bigdoggsteel]

18 minutes ago, JHRover said:

'Running around' is only useful if done at the right time in the right areas of the pitch. Players can run around in midfield all day long, clocking up the miles and achieve very little. Our old friend Jason Lowe being the prime example. I've no idea how much distance Samuel covered in comparison to his colleagues. It appeared to be less but might not have been.

Samuel probably could have done more running but I wonder how far that would have really got us. It also depends on what Mowbray instructed him to do. It may be he was told to stay up top and await service from midfield as the lone striker.

At the end of the day if Samuel puts that chance away in the first half and puts us 1-0 up then he gets applauded off by Rovers fans for putting us ahead and I doubt there's any mention of how far he runs. The keeper saved his shot and he gets cheered off when substituted and there's an inquest into his effort and attitude. Fine margins and I'd sooner give him a chance in the team than the Varneys and Browns we've had in recent years.

True. I just hope he sets out to prove those fans wrong and doesn't lose confidence 

[FGS5635]

I think his confidence is already long gone. His sending off earlier in the season seemed a turning point for him. Lost his way quite a lot since then.

I think you need a certain level of maturity and selflessnes to play the lone striker role. Not sure he has either at the moment

[Tom]

I think Samuel is ok as a second choice striker, his heading especially is a strong point however the service our strikers get isn't great from the wings.

Grahams superb header recently was assisted by Samuel but they don't get many put on their head.

I could see him having a sulk about not playing though which could be an issue 

[JacknOry]

He started off fairly decently but since then he has been a disappointment. Ever since he got sent off in fact. It also coincides with Graham coming back to form and him struggling to get in the team. When he does get in it is usually out of position.

Agree that jeering him off is not going to help the situation.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Do any of you follow him on Instagram? Plenty of videos of him singing and shaping into the camera while driving alone. Looks so stupid. 

If we are to go up, we need everyone fighting for the team and their place in that team. I hope he bucks up and knuckles down for the remaining games. Every goal will be crucial. 

[JacknOry]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Do any of you follow him on Instagram? Plenty of videos of him singing and shaping into the camera while driving alone. Looks so stupid. 

If we are to go up, we need everyone fighting for the team and their place in that team. I hope he bucks up and knuckles down for the remaining games. Every goal will be crucial. 

Nah not on instagram but have seen him on Twitter - the one with Dack springs to mind. In a way its good to see the players obviously bonding well but sometimes it can be a bit too much - they are paid to play football, not become social media stars.

Also, if he is a confidence player, too much social media is not going to help as there are some dickheads out there that will not be slow in critiscing him on there.

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

Nah not on instagram but have seen him on Twitter - the one with Dack springs to mind. In a way its good to see the players obviously bonding well but sometimes it can be a bit too much - they are paid to play football, not become social media stars.

Also, if he is a confidence player, too much social media is not going to help as there are some dickheads out there that will not be slow in critiscing him on there.

No, I don't mind the ones with Dack. In them they have the phone on the dashboard I think. On Instagram its him driving alone with the phone in his hand miming singing. The car is moving and he just looks idiotic. 

[JacknOry]

10 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

No, I don't mind the ones with Dack. In them they have the phone on the dashboard I think. On Instagram its him driving alone with the phone in his hand miming singing. The car is moving and he just looks idiotic. 

Ah not seen that.

Does sound pretty idiotic. Seems he loves the money and status but is not too overly concerned with developing. Would explain his apparent sulkiness, seems to expect things his way without working for it. Needs to be careful as he is hardly a natural talent in the mold of Messi and he is not so young anymore.

Work hard, learn, improve and you could become a regular Championship and possibly Premier League striker one day. You're only worth what your last contract is and there is a thin line between getting another here or finding yourself on much less in a lower league.

[Miker]

Does Samuel really merit being singled out for criticism? He's contributed 11 goals (8 goals and 3 assists) this season in 30 games and a number of those have been as a substitute or playing out of position.  

Hes certainly not playing as well as he was before his red card, but some of the animosity towards him on here is a bit over the top. Graham, Antonsson and Samuel have all had off games this season but have managed to share the goal scoring load between them. 

[JacknOry]

38 minutes ago, Miker said:

Does Samuel really merit being singled out for criticism? He's contributed 11 goals (8 goals and 3 assists) this season in 30 games and a number of those have been as a substitute or playing out of position.  

Hes certainly not playing as well as he was before his red card, but some of the animosity towards him on here is a bit over the top. Graham, Antonsson and Samuel have all had off games this season but have managed to share the goal scoring load between them. 

Don't think there is true animosity, if he playing better we wouldn't even be discussing this.

At the same time though, considering he only cost a couple of hundred grand less than Dack, I think fans are allowed to voice an opinion on his performances.

8 goals is not bad of course but there is more to judge a player on. 

Just hope he kicks on as he is falling further down the pecking order each month. Was on equal terms with Graham who has now cemented the starting spot and is now in my opinion behind Armstrong up top too. When Antonnson comes back he then has competition there too. I have admitted he has been shoehorned into some positions but i get the feeling that this is to justify the spend rather than being there on merit.

[JHRover]

I think there's an element of scapegoating in play. Along with him being the lone striker it leaves him open to it more than in other positions. When needing a goal and struggling to create chances if our sole striker isn't winning balls and chasing things down relentlessly he is going to be identified by some as the problem. If you're a forward for a team expecting to win regularly and you don't have much of the ball you'll be criticised. If you're a defender and make one mistake every game but are consistent the rest of the time then you'll avoid getting stick.

Once Portsmouth had equalised and we were left needing another goal his efforts fell into the spotlight. The way we play, and have done all season, is that the defence and midfield enjoy loads of possession but the striker is often cut off from that and appears to be a passenger for large periods.

[Mike E]

43 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

Don't think there is true animosity, if he playing better we wouldn't even be discussing this.

At the same time though, considering he only cost a couple of hundred grand less than Dack, I think fans are allowed to voice an opinion on his performances.

8 goals is not bad of course but there is more to judge a player on. 

Just hope he kicks on as he is falling further down the pecking order each month. Was on equal terms with Graham who has now cemented the starting spot and is now in my opinion behind Armstrong up top too. When Antonnson comes back he then has competition there too. I have admitted he has been shoehorned into some positions but i get the feeling that this is to justify the spend rather than being there on merit.

Thought Samuel was less than half the Dack fee? Samuel was 300k and Dack was 750k, weren't they?

Either way, I feel a player shouldn't be judged on their fee, as that is a decision between clubs, not the players themselves.

[Dreams of 1995]

Sometimes Samuel falls foul of the style of football we play. The ball is held up in the midfield area for far too long - side to side passing which can lead to some frustrating runs being made by the centre forward with no end product. Graham seems to benefit more from this style of play because he has a natural ability to link up. His partnership with Dack is fairly strong because he can both hold the ball up and pick the pass for Dack's surging run or, on the other hand, find that half yard of space for Dack to give it him. He's a more accomplished player than Samuel, of course due to his age.

Ultimately though Samuel won't miss forever. He's shown early in the season he has the ability to hit the back of the net and I think in the coming months he's going to get more chances to show he can. I don't buy this lack of effort and I certainly wasn't happy with the jeering when he got subbed. He's a striker in a bad run of form - perhaps this could be because our style of play has changed since he was scoring goals. We've become much more comfortable in possession and our goals tend to come from link up play as opposed to quick, direct breakaway football.

There's certainly much, much worse players in our squad that have cost us goals and at times games.

[roversfan99]

https://www.getreading.co.uk/sport/sport-opinion/curious-case-dominic-samuel-never-13362740

Interesting read from the summer. 

For all the potential he has shown in brief spells, he has simply not delivered and in the end, Reading's patience ran out.

Managers have come and gone since McDermott, but none really took to Samuel.

Nigel Adkins was critical of the player's attitude, as was current boss Jaap Stam. Samuel never a key part in Steve Clarke's plans when he was manager.

I remember having discussions with @chaddyrovers earlier in the season who was championing Samuel, hes never convinced me.

There are some attributes that some players would use to their advantage, hes quick, hes powerful, hes strong, that give people including myself at times glimmers to cling onto from time to time.

He reminds me a bit of Leon Best, I can forsee managers taking a chance on him as he does have many attacking attributes, but he will never have the attitude or consistency to achieve very much.

Hopefully we can get shut in the summer.

[Tony Rover]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

https://www.getreading.co.uk/sport/sport-opinion/curious-case-dominic-samuel-never-13362740

Interesting read from the summer. 

For all the potential he has shown in brief spells, he has simply not delivered and in the end, Reading's patience ran out.

Managers have come and gone since McDermott, but none really took to Samuel.

Nigel Adkins was critical of the player's attitude, as was current boss Jaap Stam. Samuel never a key part in Steve Clarke's plans when he was manager.

I remember having discussions with @chaddyrovers earlier in the season who was championing Samuel, hes never convinced me.

There are some attributes that some players would use to their advantage, hes quick, hes powerful, hes strong, that give people including myself at times glimmers to cling onto from time to time.

He reminds me a bit of Leon Best, I can forsee managers taking a chance on him as he does have many attacking attributes, but he will never have the attitude or consistency to achieve very much.

Hopefully we can get shut in the summer.

Lad’s definitely not a Leon Best, he’s having a poor run of form. Hoping he’ll come good again, didn’t start off too bad if you remember. 

[roversfan99]

Just now, Tony Rover said:

Lad’s definitely not a Leon Best, he’s having a poor run of form. Hoping he’ll come good again, didn’t start off too bad if you remember. 

Hope not, and I'm not necessarily saying as bad, more in terms of his mainly physical attributes and promise wont be matched by consistency due to his attitude and lack of work ethic.

[Tony Rover]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

Hope not, and I'm not necessarily saying as bad, more in terms of his mainly physical attributes and promise wont be matched by consistency due to his attitude and lack of work ethic.

Leon Best is a @#/? lets just get that one out there. Samuel definitely needs to up his game but comparing him to Best is hard on the lad. 

[robfranlong81]

Slightly off topic but noticed on ifollow that the lads threw their shirts into the crowd at the end of the game on Tuesday night. 

If anyone has one they’re looking to sell let me know. ??

[roversfan99]

2 minutes ago, Tony Rover said:

Leon Best is a @#/? lets just get that one out there. Samuel definitely needs to up his game but comparing him to Best is hard on the lad. 

Like I said, not as bad as Best, just in terms of attitude outweighing what he does have going for him.

[Stuart]

5 hours ago, JHRover said:

I think there's an element of scapegoating in play. Along with him being the lone striker it leaves him open to it more than in other positions. When needing a goal and struggling to create chances if our sole striker isn't winning balls and chasing things down relentlessly he is going to be identified by some as the problem. If you're a forward for a team expecting to win regularly and you don't have much of the ball you'll be criticised. If you're a defender and make one mistake every game but are consistent the rest of the time then you'll avoid getting stick.

Once Portsmouth had equalised and we were left needing another goal his efforts fell into the spotlight. The way we play, and have done all season, is that the defence and midfield enjoy loads of possession but the striker is often cut off from that and appears to be a passenger for large periods.

I’m not sure there is much scapegoating going on. The worst players this season have been Gladwin, Ward, and probably prematurely Hart but in all cases we have seen these players less and less.

In previous seasons some of these players have continued to be selected to the detriment of the team and results. In all cases you have to ultimately blame the manager but if poor players are continually paraded then they are going to get stick.

In short, Samuel has had it easy.

[Pedro]

He looks to be a poor man's Marcus Bent. He has a bit of pace, a bit of heading ability but very poor one on one and  absolutely lashes every chance which comes his way.

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

https://www.getreading.co.uk/sport/sport-opinion/curious-case-dominic-samuel-never-13362740

Interesting read from the summer. 

For all the potential he has shown in brief spells, he has simply not delivered and in the end, Reading's patience ran out.

Managers have come and gone since McDermott, but none really took to Samuel.

Nigel Adkins was critical of the player's attitude, as was current boss Jaap Stam. Samuel never a key part in Steve Clarke's plans when he was manager.

I remember having discussions with @chaddyrovers earlier in the season who was championing Samuel, hes never convinced me.

There are some attributes that some players would use to their advantage, hes quick, hes powerful, hes strong, that give people including myself at times glimmers to cling onto from time to time.

He reminds me a bit of Leon Best, I can forsee managers taking a chance on him as he does have many attacking attributes, but he will never have the attitude or consistency to achieve very much.

Hopefully we can get shut in the summer.

Samuel is still young enough and somebody I wouldn't be getting rid of at all. His pace would be an assets in the championship. 

5 goals in  26 apps in the league and his last goal was against Bristol Rovers where we were 1 nil down when the double sub of Graham and Samuel change the game and Samuel got the winner and won the penalty for Mulgrew to score. He also has 4 assist also. 

have you ever met Samuel? I suggest you do because you start comparing him to people like Leon Best 

[roversfan99]

9 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Samuel is still young enough and somebody I wouldn't be getting rid of at all. His pace would be an assets in the championship. 

5 goals in  26 apps in the league and his last goal was against Bristol Rovers where we were 1 nil down when the double sub of Graham and Samuel change the game and Samuel got the winner and won the penalty for Mulgrew to score. He also has 4 assist also. 

have you ever met Samuel? I suggest you do because you start comparing him to people like Leon Best 

Why would it when its not proving enough of an asset to be effective in League 1?

No i havent, nor Leon Best, neither have you Im guessing so its a moot point either way.

My point has been taken out of context. Basically, in particular in the last couple of months, he has appeared languid, disinterested, stroppy and at times lazy in my opinion. As I've just shown, previous managers have discarded him due to his attitude.

The reason I mentioned Leon Best is, he has had brief spells in his career where he has put in enough to get himself a few goals, at Coventry and Newcastle, obviously culminating in us wasting alot of money on him. He's quite a physical handful but his application throughout his career has meant that managers can justify his signing based on the brief spells I mentioned, but in the end hes been underwhelming at the vast majority of clubs that hes been too.

I hope that he starts putting in 100% effort and proves all the managers that have managed him before wrong, and goes on to be a success at Rovers.