[Archived] Gillingham away 17.3.18

[OJRovers]

I don’t think anyone is expecting us to win every game, and an away draw after 4 wins isn’t bad on paper - however the frustration with Mowbray is his stubbornness and negative set up. 

Conway and Evans are only in the team because they are defensively reliable, but the problem is that they don’t offer much against teams that just sit back.

Apart from Armstrong, the rest of the midfield is just there to protect the defence.

It needs freshening up next game, I’d be tempted to play:

Raya

Caddis Downing Mulgrew Williams

Bennett Smallwood Lenihan Bell

Armstrong

Graham

Problem is that hell will freeze over before he drops Evans.

[AllRoverAsia]

5 hours ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

err no it hasn't we didn't play for 16 days a couple of weeks ago.

Correct. Plus we have bailed out of all the Cups pretty damm quick unlike Wigan and Shrews.

Add in the injury time outs some have had and just plain days off that TM seems to favour.

I do not accept the 'knackered' theory.

How many have played every game and then in full. Not too many I would wager.

[Stuart]

2 hours ago, K-Hod said:

Whilst I understand that after a game emotions are at their highest, some of the baiting on here last night was as poor as Rovers' performance sounded.

I thought we'd moved past the days of 'happy clappers' and 'tremblers' but evidently not.

Can we turn it in going forward please?

How very even handed. Did you also spot how it came about and from whom?

There are people out there who think it’s a great laugh to pop up on the board and create waves - then disappear again for months.

Things are going to get pretty tense as we head towards the final run in - especially if we underperform as badly as we did last night. Compare and contrast Wigan who have no such nerves, nor feel the need to aim for one goal and the shut up shop.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, OJRovers said:

I don’t think anyone is expecting us to win every game, and an away draw after 4 wins isn’t bad on paper - however the frustration with Mowbray is his stubbornness and negative set up. 

Conway and Evans are only in the team because they are defensively reliable, but the problem is that they don’t offer much against teams that just sit back.

Apart from Armstrong, the rest of the midfield is just there to protect the defence.

It needs freshening up next game, I’d be tempted to play:

Raya

Caddis Downing Mulgrew Williams

Bennett Smallwood Lenihan Bell

Armstrong

Graham

Problem is that hell will freeze over before he drops Evans.

I agree the " engine room " is the problem.  The central midfield is the key to most games. Ideally you want a defensive player in there, an attacking player in there and another player who can do a bit of both roles when needed.

At the moment Dack, who's our attacking player in there,  is struggling. Smallwood is feeling a long season and Evans blows cold more often than he blows hot. Both of Evans and Smallwood appear to be more suited to the defensive role but we can't afford two players in that role. We need the guy who can fill both roles. That's why I'd play Bennett in there and bench Evans. I'd also start with Travis at right back. If Smallwood starts to struggle again move Travis into midfield and bring on Caddis.

[K-Hod]

13 minutes ago, Stuart said:

How very even handed. Did you also spot how it came about and from whom?

There are people out there who think it’s a great laugh to pop up on the board and create waves - then disappear again for months.

Things are going to get pretty tense as we head towards the final run in - especially if we underperform as badly as we did last night. Compare and contrast Wigan who have no such nerves, nor feel the need to aim for one goal and the shut up shop.

I did and it's been dealt with. Any further questions on this will have to be via PM where I'll be happy to discuss (not just with you, but anyone).

 

[Doaksie]

As I said before kick off last night, Bennett is wasted at right back. Particularly playing a side in the bottom half of the table who don't offer much going forward. Why is Caddis not trusted there? Or Travis?

Evans and Smallwood are far too ponderous and negative in the middle of the pitch. Particularly as the tension levels of the side increase, and we desperately somebody to grab the game by the scruff of the neck.I think we need all our proactive players involved over the rest of the season. It's too late for the Gillingham game, but he needs to get Bennett further up the pitch. I honestly believe it will make the difference in our remaining games.

[JBiz]

Just now, DE. said:

We only had one shot until something like the 60th minute. That's not just 'lacking a creative spark' is it?

Ofcourse it could be. If the opposition has 3 big central defenders and a packed midfield, it doesn’t matter what your intentions are, you need to be dynamic and creative to break it down.

 

 

[jim mk2]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Reading those latest results for Gillingham I can see why they set up like an " away " team and were happy to play for a point. I was a bit puzzled at first as to why a home team that are as good as safe would be prepared to not give it a go. Looking at those scores tells me why.

 

I think they were afraid of us as high-scoring league leaders and set up their team accordingly. They also raised their game and worked very hard. We're a bit of a counter attack side too so in effect you had 2 away teams playing each other. Not surprising that it ended 0-0. 

We were poor but still got a point. 

[JHRover]

Bennett was just hitting some form infront of goal after a long barren spell with his duo against Wimbledon and Wigan, and since then has been relocated to RB.

[DE.]

2 minutes ago, Biz said:

Ofcourse it could be. If the opposition has 3 big central defenders and a packed midfield, it doesn’t matter what your intentions are, you need to be dynamic and creative to break it down.

 

 

I could accept this if you were talking about the Bury or Bradford match, but not last night, sorry. We did not give the impression of an attacking team at all. I'm not sure if this was Mowbray's instructions or whether the players just had a collective mental block, but despite having a decent amount of the ball we never had the urgency an attacking side requires. 

[JBiz]

Just now, DE. said:

I could accept this if you were talking about the Bury or Bradford match, but not last night, sorry. We did not give the impression of an attacking team at all. I'm not sure if this was Mowbray's instructions or whether the players just had a collective mental block, but despite having a decent amount of the ball we never had the urgency an attacking side requires. 

Neither of those teams played 5 at the back and three centre mids to my knowledge either. 

You watched the game? 

[DE.]

Just now, Biz said:

Neither of those teams played 5 at the back and three centre mids to my knowledge either. 

You watched the game? 

I wasn't referencing the formations, more the implication that we were trying to be attacking. Against Bradford I believe at one point we had 11 shots to nil in our favour but hadn't scored and didn't look like scoring. That would be what I would define as having attacking intent but missing a creative spark. As usual Dack broke that deadlock. Last night wasn't the same. We were missing much more than just creativity. 

Unfortunately, yes I did. Second half initially then rewatched the first half later, but wish I hadn't bothered in all honesty. I really wish iFollow had some form of commentary though as sometimes it's hard to work out who's got the ball (a lot of our players look similar from a distance).

[robbojohnno]

The last 3 games are of huge concern to me, particularly last night. Mowbray got lucky for me in our biggest game of the season against Shrewsbury at home that both Evans and Whittingham were injured so he had to either play a youngster or Bennett in cm. He played Bennett who was fanastic. Committed, full of energy, box to box etc. EVERYTHING that Evans and Whittingham had not provided all season. We won the game deservedly and from there kicked on. 

Now we are in April and Tony has got extremely nervous and reverted back to type. Evans an ever present in midfield and Smallwood now horrendously out of form. Add that to playing an aging, limited Conway on one wing and Armstrong out if position on the other and we are giving those Shrewsbury lads a HUGE boost. I hope Tony can sort this out and he has done a decent job this year but I have a horrible feeling we end the season in similar form to how we started with some mystifying tactical/selection choices. 

This is not a Mowbray out post and I still wanted him to see the season out when we hit very rocky form in the first 3 months. I just think the signs are worrying based on the last couple of weeks.

[G Somerset Rover]

51 minutes ago, Doaksie said:

As I said before kick off last night, Bennett is wasted at right back. Particularly playing a side in the bottom half of the table who don't offer much going forward. Why is Caddis not trusted there? Or Travis?

Evans and Smallwood are far too ponderous and negative in the middle of the pitch. Particularly as the tension levels of the side increase, and we desperately somebody to grab the game by the scruff of the neck.I think we need all our proactive players involved over the rest of the season. It's too late for the Gillingham game, but he needs to get Bennett further up the pitch. I honestly believe it will make the difference in our remaining games.

Exactly this. Bennett in CM dictates the team to play at a much higher tempo. TM must clearly not rate or trust Travis or a Caddis to play RB, but for me he’s dropping a big rollock. It appears the only other one he does trust there is Nyambe so let’s hope he’s back sooner rather than later so Bennett can player further up the pitch. I’m with you, in that if this happens we can get the necessary points rather than relying on the ponderous and horribly out of form Smallwood and Evans to see us over the line. Unfortunately as well as being a decent manager, he’s a stubborn bugger is TM, so I wouldn’t be surprised to see him persevere with Bennett at RB and Evans/Smallwood CM.

[ruggles1995]

it was poor last night. Conway looked lost outwide, he kept coming short when bennet had it, so we never stretched them down the right. With bennet coming short he invited his marker and other gills players on to us.

Bennet couldnt deliver a pizza last night, his crossing was shocking.

Build up play was slow

too many sideways backward passes

Not enough support for Graham.

Samuel is absolutley awful, his positional sense is dreadful. If Graham picks up any injuries we will be struggling.

In my view we didnt need 2 holding midfielders. When payne was coming on I expected him and dack to play together and take off evans or smallwood. Then when samuel came on I thought he was going to partner graham, but he replaced him. Too many like for like changes. Either 2 up top or 2 attacking midfielders were needed last night. He did neither. That was my only worry, the fact we couldnt do a plan B.

 

Also hate the fact we try and play worldy switches when its neither in the players locker or never on or whether a simple bloody 5 yard pass on!

 

Yes its only 1 game, but thats my view on that gillingham game.

[Vinjay]

23 hours ago, roversfan2001 said:

How do you manage to put a negative spin on everything? It's incredible. 

Maybe you can call it negative spin but when the club puts out tweets like this afternoon on "how delighted we are to have been named family club of the year" that is grating to me. The club is owned by a family that shows complete disregard for families, kids, etc who support Rovers and only show up for Liz. Its just the insincerity of it and maybe I'm paranoid but my thoughts are where's the next Agnew? Where's the next Anderson? Where's the next spin doctor? Official accounts should be responsive to questions (even stupid ones I guess like asking if the original tickets were still viable last night) and deliver essential information. Why do we need to know in this age of information overload that it's 15 mins until kick off? OK I'm not saying there shouldn't be some personality and a joke now and then but the whole "oh aren't we such a great family club" thing is nonsense. Not only is it a lie but it's also why sharks sense blood. It never has been a "family club" (there's no such thing or if there is all clubs in England are) but the whole "nice image" hurt in the past. Even now I've said that it's important to keep the club on their toes. Its good to be winning and I'm not trying to dampen things but we can't forget the level of debt, etc. You might say "well we haven't forgotten it" but you don't want the club to believe that! As I've said there's no conscious effort on my part (I'm just being myself) but some people need to adopt that tone for the good of the club. Not saying act miserable and bombard the club with abuse but a little less levity is a good thing. The club needs to be micro managed with an iron fist or the same mistakes could be made. If nobody at the club will do it then we should take it upon ourselves to police the situation.

Sounds like a thrilling trip for those who had the privilege of travelling...again. Obviously though winning runs usually come to an end sooner rather than later. At least in this case it wasn't completely empty handed.

[Vinjay]

Noticed the club said "happy birthday to Dominic Samuel who turns 24 today". Nothing wrong with that its a simple tweet which shows some respect to one of the players in a toned down manner. I'm almost surprised though that they didn't post a clip of Samuel being presented with a big birthday cake shaped like a blue and white heart. Plus a chorus of school children giving a rendition of "happy birthday to you" in the background. All part of the big social media improvement! 

[G Somerset Rover]

By all accounts they were planning to post a video of him blowing out the candles on his cake but he missed.

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, OJRovers said:

I don’t think anyone is expecting us to win every game, and an away draw after 4 wins isn’t bad on paper - however the frustration with Mowbray is his stubbornness and negative set up. 

Conway and Evans are only in the team because they are defensively reliable, but the problem is that they don’t offer much against teams that just sit back.

Apart from Armstrong, the rest of the midfield is just there to protect the defence.

It needs freshening up next game, I’d be tempted to play:

Raya

Caddis Downing Mulgrew Williams

Bennett Smallwood Lenihan Bell

Armstrong

Graham

Problem is that hell will freeze over before he drops Evans.

Evans has been in good form and he was good last night from fans Ive spoken to who were at the game. 

Bell wide left? Lenihan centre back? 6 defenders in that team. 

No Dack or Payne? 

Or maybe try 2 striker up with number 10 in behind. The team below is just me freshing up the team. 

                          Raya

         Lenihan Mulgrew Williams

   Bennett Travis Whittinghan Bell

                         Payne  

                 Samuel Armstrong        

Subs:- Luetwiler Downing Evans Smallwood Graham Dack Conway Antonsson

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

Bennett was just hitting some form infront of goal after a long barren spell with his duo against Wimbledon and Wigan, and since then has been relocated to RB.

Hasnt Bennett been outstanding at right back?.

Even some fans have been asking for him to play there all season. 

[arbitro]

18 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Evans has been in good form and he was good last night from fans Ive spoken to who were at the game. 

Bell wide left? Lenihan centre back? 6 defenders in that team. 

No Dack or Payne? 

Or maybe try 2 striker up with number 10 in behind. The team below is just me freshing up the team. 

                          Raya

         Lenihan Mulgrew Williams

   Bennett Travis Whittinghan Bell

                         Payne  

                 Samuel Armstrong        

Subs:- Luetwiler Downing Evans Smallwood Graham Dack Conway Antonsson

Hasnt Bennett been outstanding at right back?.

Even some fans have been asking for him to play there all season. 

Bennett has been fine but in the opinion of many fans he is wasted there. In the performance of the season so far against Shrewsbury he was the stand out player in central midfield and did really well in the subsequent games he played there. Evans and Smallwood are too similar and don't have the energy and dynamism that Bennett has. His mobility gets him all around the pitch and he tackles and passes well.

I would have him back in that position on Saturday and leave Smallwood out as his standards have slipped remarkably in the last couple of months.

[Lihamylly]

18 hours ago, The Big Picture said:

Fool, ignore an entire season just to make that comment...

This is thread for the Gillingham match, not for the entire season.  We played poorly tonight, thus rightfully critisized. The season has been great.

[Exiled in Toronto]

Too much emphasis on Mowbray IMO. I can’t think of any tactical plan in the world that can reliably deliver away wins when the only player that shines is the goalie. Smallwood and Evans were both very poor,  Evans much more so than his last 2-3 games and Smallwood has looked pants for week. I fully expect Bennett in there on Sat.

I think we all agreed Conway had earned a start over Antonsson, but he didn’t grasp it. Dack was unfit, but Payne didn’t do much either when he came on. Graham looked like an ex-prem player not fancying being booted up the arse for 90 mins in Gillingham on a wet Tuesday night, so the Gills could crowd out Armstrong with impunity. And Charlie had two free kicks but didn’t really test the keeper much. Would some different players have done better? Maybe, maybe we’d have lost 3-0.

10 points out of 12 when playing poorly used to be a sign of a promotion team. And if I were Shrewsbury I’d find it demoralizing that we rack up points no matter how we play.

Onward to the Gas

[JBiz]

2 hours ago, DE. said:

I wasn't referencing the formations, more the implication that we were trying to be attacking. Against Bradford I believe at one point we had 11 shots to nil in our favour but hadn't scored and didn't look like scoring. That would be what I would define as having attacking intent but missing a creative spark. As usual Dack broke that deadlock. Last night wasn't the same. We were missing much more than just creativity. 

Unfortunately, yes I did. Second half initially then rewatched the first half later, but wish I hadn't bothered in all honesty. I really wish iFollow had some form of commentary though as sometimes it's hard to work out who's got the ball (a lot of our players look similar from a distance).

Good point about Dack, we’ve missed him for the past two matches really, according to the radio he was off his game last night - but that’s not “setting up not to lose” if he has one or two poor performances or has to be replaced, is it? He’s not dropping off because he is being told to be “negative” is he? It’s a result of his fitness and/or other teams trying to negate his impact.

For plan B, it’s perfectly understandable that we may expect to be more effective (I don’t think Payne is a number 10) but I don’t think that the drop off in performances is simply down to tactical decisions about “not losing”! That’s what I initially disagreed with and still will.

I would categorically say that I believe the overall tactic hasn’t changed much since November, only the way we are working in it! It is my opinion, all the suggestions the manager is causing a poorer performance by directly requesting a more defensive tactic, are wrong.

My rationale for a dip in the last two? Dack. Other reasons for looking nervous, maybe they are feeling the pressure? 

I notice not many of those concerned with the recent performances have even suggested that pressure is a factor, the expectation of getting across that finish line is definitely going to be hard for some, especially those who played in our relegation season! I think that may be why Whittingham returned (w/o seeing him in training).. perhaps some experience is needed to guide us over the line! 

[Exiled in Toronto]

Just now, Biz said:

Good point about Dack, we’ve missed him for the past two matches really, according to the radio he was off his game last night - but that’s not “setting up not to lose” if he has one or two poor performances or has to be replaced, is it? He’s not dropping off because he is being told to be “negative” is he? It’s a result of his fitness and/or other teams trying to negate his impact.

For plan B, it’s perfectly understandable that we may expect to be more effective (I don’t think Payne is a number 10) but I don’t think that the drop off in performances is simply down to tactical decisions about “not losing”! That’s what I initially disagreed with and still will.

I would categorically say that I believe the overall tactic hasn’t changed much since November, only the way we are working in it! It is my opinion, all the suggestions the manager is causing a poorer performance by directly requesting a more defensive tactic, are wrong.

My rationale for a dip in the last two? Dack. Other reasons for looking nervous, maybe they are feeling the pressure? 

I notice not many of those concerned with the recent performances have even suggested that pressure is a factor, the expectation of getting across that finish line is definitely going to be hard for some, especially those who played in our relegation season! I think that may be why Whittingham returned (w/o seeing him in training).. perhaps some experience is needed to guide us over the line! 

I’m glad this message board wasn’t around when we lost six in a row at this time of year under Kenny, including a completely abject 0-2 surrender at Port Vale. Or when we lost at home to City then again abjectly 0-2 at Upton Park when the league title was in our grasp. Or when Gordon Lee’s team won 2 of the last 8 to limp over the line. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

We've got more experience than most teams in that team we fielded last night. Having said that experience isn't always a positive. Sometimes you need a bit of youthful enthusiasm. 

If you'd have asked me to take a pen in a shoot out as an18 year old player I'd have said " No Problem, I'll go first if you like ". As a 28 year old player I wouldn't have been so keen.