[Archived] THE BATTLE FOR PROMOTION....WON.

[blueboy3333]

41 minutes ago, MGPensioner said:

Recent Play Off Winners (league position)

 

Millwall (6)

Barnsley (6)

PNE (3)

Rotherham (4)

Yeovil (4)

Huddersfield (4)

Peterborough (4)

 

Nobody should be thinking that the play offs are OK and because we finish 3rd and have Bradley Dack and a Cat A academy, that we will go up.

Top 2 or bust. 9 MUST WIN games to go.

 

Much of football is about confidence & mentality.

I imagine missing the top 2 at the final hurdle can be disappointing & demoralising.

Whilst going on a run and just getting in the play offs can give confidence and positiveness to any team.

Watch out for Pompey or Rotherham going up ? NO WAY MUST WE GET OUR SELVES IN THAT LOTTERY !!!

 

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/10275474/football-league-play-offs-is-third-place-a-curse-or-is-that-a-myth

 

[roversfan99]

 

 

2 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

8 games to go, 1 point difference and 1 team would be clear favourites to go up? I think some are cracking under the pressure

Agreed, after the Shrewsbury win at Scunthorpe many people almost wrote us off, people saying we were play off bound, people taking wagers on it. 

Wigan have a clear advantage in that based on both points and games, they have margin for error over the other 2 teams in that they can afford a slip up and it still would be in their hands. It could barely be any closer between us and Shrewsbury, we have a very slim advantage but its neck and neck.

I do thinks its natural to be nervous but what people must appreciate is that Shrewsbury and Wigan will be cursing our consistency in the same way. All 3 teams have been consistently miles ahead of the other teams.

[Rover_Shaun]

We have to win a game in hand to realise that advantage. As it stands we are at a disadvantage.

[darrenrover]

I've a sneaking feeling that we'll finish equal on points with Shrewsbury and go up in second place on goal difference. Rotherham to go up as play off winners.

Same 3 relegated last season to return at the first time of asking.

[Mark45]

German Blackburn Rovers supporters have always faith in Tony, club will see promotion comfortably.

In Tony we trust.

[mhead]

Can you just imagine HOW nervous we were in April/May 1995?

Sleep was difficult; working was impossible. Thanks  to God for Ludo.

[JHRover]

A few weeks ago the play-offs looked a daunting ask, but really if the worst comes to the worst and we finish 3rd whilst disappointing we should have enough in our ranks to deal with those sides. There's a reason we're miles ahead of the rest and that's because we've been better than them all by some distance. Scunthorpe have lost the plot and sacked their manager so anything could happen there. Whilst they might get a new manager bounce they could equally continue to flounder. Rotherham have as expected started to fall with 3 defeats in their last 4. Plymouth have been on a brilliant run since Christmas but nobody is telling me they have a better side or squad than we do. The only one I might be apprehensive about is Peterborough due to the Evans factor but again man for man we have a stronger squad than they do.

Not saying we should be looking forward to the play-offs or that 3rd in this awful league should be considered a success, but it shouldn't be game over if we do end up there and have to do it the hard way.

We should be finishing in the top 2. The play-offs are a get out of jail card which has to be used successfully. If in August I had been offered 3rd with 9 games to go and promotion in our own hands with us needing to match or better Shrewsbury with no other contenders I'd have taken it. If we can't match or better Shrewsbury over 9 games when the pressure is on with this squad and experience then we've only ourselves to blame.

[JHRover]

32 minutes ago, Rover_Shaun said:

We have to win a game in hand to realise that advantage. As it stands we are at a disadvantage.

We have the advantage. We can finish on more points than Shrewsbury can mathematically get. They need us to drop points, we don't need them to. If we fail to beat Bradford then it is their advantage until they drop points.

We probably will drop points because we've done it all season, that's why all the talk of 1 defeat in 26 is tiresome because we've drawn a lot and that's why we're not comfortably clear by now.

[Threepenny Bit Foot]

I think we'll finish on 93 points, a close second to Wigan and 5-6 points ahead of Shrewsbury. Keep the faith!

[jim mk2]

Just now, JHRover said:

A few weeks ago the play-offs looked a daunting ask, but really if the worst comes to the worst and we finish 3rd whilst disappointing we should have enough in our ranks to deal with those sides. There's a reason we're miles ahead of the rest and that's because we've been better than them all by some distance. Scunthorpe have lost the plot and sacked their manager so anything could happen there. Whilst they might get a new manager bounce they could equally continue to flounder. Rotherham have as expected started to fall with 3 defeats in their last 4. Plymouth have been on a brilliant run since Christmas but nobody is telling me they have a better side or squad than we do. The only one I might be apprehensive about is Peterborough due to the Evans factor but again man for man we have a stronger squad than they do.

Not saying we should be looking forward to the play-offs or that 3rd in this awful league should be considered a success, but it shouldn't be game over if we do end up there and

We should be finishing in the top 2. The play-offs are a get out of jail card which has to be used successfully. If in August I had been offered 3rd with 9 games to go and promotion in our own hands with us needing to match or better Shrewsbury with no other contenders I'd have taken it. If we can't match or better Shrewsbury over 9 games when the pressure is on with this squad and experience then we've only ourselves to blame.

 

Far too much complacency and Rovers exceptionalism here.

Argyle for one made us look distinctly ordinary in the 2-0 defeat at Home Park where our defensive frailties were on show again. Playoffs are one off events where form over the season counts for nothing and it's all down to how the team plays on the day.

I don't fear the play-offs like some but I'm well aware that anyone can win and if we don't play well we'll be out. 

[JHRover]

Just now, jim mk2 said:

Far too much complacency and Rovers exceptionalism here.

Argyle for one made us look distinctly ordinary in the 2-0 defeat at Home Park where our defensive frailties were on show again. Playoffs are one off events where form over the season counts for nothing and it's all down to how the team plays on the day.

I don't fear the play-offs like some but I'm well aware that anyone can win and if we don't play well we'll be out. 

I don't see how it is complacency. I think we should be better than them. We were in the Championship last season and have recruited for promotion, nothing less. Argyle were in League Two last season, would be happy with survival and don't expect much more than that.

I know how football works and I know favourites don't always win and I know it all comes down to how a team plays on the day, but by any measure we should be strong favourites over the likes of Argyle and if they beat us it is time to start looking at our own failings as to why our squad and manager cannot overcome these sides with their reputations.

Ultimately the play-offs are cup games. Upsets can and do happen but it remains 11 v 11 and we have the strongest 11 of any of those going into it. We play to our capabilities and potential then there's nothing to fear.

[jim mk2]

20 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I don't see how it is complacency. I think we should be better than them. We were in the Championship last season and have recruited for promotion, nothing less. Argyle were in League Two last season, would be happy with survival and don't expect much more than that.

I know how football works and I know favourites don't always win and I know it all comes down to how a team plays on the day, but by any measure we should be strong favourites over the likes of Argyle and if they beat us it is time to start looking at our own failings as to why our squad and manager cannot overcome these sides with their reputations.

Ultimately the play-offs are cup games. Upsets can and do happen but it remains 11 v 11 and we have the strongest 11 of any of those going into it. We play to our capabilities and potential then there's nothing to fear.

I don't understand how because we were in the Championship last season and Argyle were in League Two makes us automatically better than them. Some would argue they are a club on the way up and we are a club on the way down so they have the momentum and they do not so therefore should be stronger than us.

As for the Argyle "would be happy with survival and don't expect much more than that" this is the Rovers exceptionalism (and arrogance) I was referring to.  Knowing the vagaries of the game, I cannot see how someone who claims to "know how football works" could make such a statement.

To repeat, if we agree that how the league table finished is irrelevant in the play-offs how can we be "strong favourites" to beat Argyle when they taught us a lesson at Home Park in the clubs' last meeting ? 

[JHRover]

1 minute ago, jim mk2 said:

I don't understand how because we were in the Championship last season and Argyle were in League Two makes us automatically better than them. Some would argue they are a club on the way up and we are a club on the way down so they have the momentum and they do not so therefore should be stronger than us.

As for the Argyle "would be happy with survival and don't expect much more than that" this is the Rovers exceptionalism (and arrogance) I was referring to.  Knowing the vagaries of the game, I cannot see how someone who claims to "know how football works" could make such a statement.

To repeat, if we agree that how the league table finished is irrelevant in the play-offs how can we be "strong favourites" to beat Argyle when they taught us a lesson at Home Park in the clubs' last meeting ? 

If you don't think that we have a better squad of players than they do then that's fair enough. I would then suggest that something has gone very, very wrong at this club if we can compete in the Championship one year, retain our best players/strengthen our squad at considerable expense and yet you think Plymouth Argyle have managed to assemble a better side than us on buttons having been competing in the 4th tier last season. That's what makes it relevant. If you're suggesting that it is right that they can come up from Lge 2 and do a better job than we can at getting promoted from Lge 1 then I think something has gone wrong at Rovers.

Can't have it both ways. We should be better than them, I think we are, if you think that we aren't that's up to you but the natural follow up to that is that we've squandered a lot of money under this manager in the last 12 months.

Momentum? Over 37 games we're 19 points above them. So regardless of form we've shown ourselves to be considerably better than them this season, so far.

If you'd have offered Plymouth supporters survival after promotion this season the majority would have been happy with that. As would most supporters at most clubs promoted to a higher division. I suspect you'd be more than happy with Championship survival next season if we went up and wouldn't be expecting or demanding a promotion push, so what's the difference?

I don't agree the table is irrelevant. As I've explained, so far this season we've shown ourselves to be substantially stronger than Plymouth. By any measure we have a stronger squad, I'm sure 99% of 'experts' in football would agree with that. I know they beat us at their place. Doncaster thrashed us at home. Doesn't mean they are better than us.

As I say, if you don't think we do have a stronger squad than Plymouth perhaps we should be asking questions of our manager and his recruitment as to why armed with the biggest budget in League One history he's managed to end up with a team that you think shouldn't be favourites to overcome Plymouth.

I suspect if you go down to the bookies in May they'll agree we'll be strong favourites, and rightly so.

[Lancaster Rover]

The players we have makes us automatically better than them, much in the same way Barcelona are better than us due to having players of higher ability.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Lancaster Rover said:

The players we have makes us automatically better than them, much in the same way Barcelona are better than us due to having players of higher ability.

The players ability counts for jack shit, without the correct attitudes. Mowbray and some of the senior pros have improved that immeasurably since clown shorts left 

[JHRover]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

The players ability counts for jack shit, without the correct attitudes. Mowbray and some of the senior pros have improved that immeasurably since clown shorts left 

I agree that without the right attitude it counts for nothing. Which is the responsibility of the management team.

If Plymouth have a more capable squad than us, or have a better attitude than us, then our manager takes responsibility for that.

Of course it can happen, on the day, but shouldn't if we do our side of the bargain properly.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, JHRover said:

I agree that without the right attitude it counts for nothing. Which is the responsibility of the management team.

If Plymouth have a more capable squad than us, or have a better attitude than us, then our manager takes responsibility for that.

Of course it can happen, on the day, but shouldn't if we do our side of the bargain properly.

The odd game can go against any team, look at City losing to Wigan. 

Do things right ,with good players and you will win more than you lose. So hopefully we get on the right side of that on the final table and avoid the opportunity for a slip up in the play offs. 

The players are saying the right things and it sounds like they are extremely focused. I'm not one for exaggerating, but ,while keeping focused is important for the payers, promotion is absolutely enormous for the club. Up there with the year we got promoted under King Kenny , if not even bigger. 

[jim mk2]

31 minutes ago, JHRover said:

If you don't think that we have a better squad of players than they do then that's fair enough. I would then suggest that something has gone very, very wrong at this club if we can compete in the Championship one year, retain our best players/strengthen our squad at considerable expense and yet you think Plymouth Argyle have managed to assemble a better side than us on buttons having been competing in the 4th tier last season. That's what makes it relevant. If you're suggesting that it is right that they can come up from Lge 2 and do a better job than we can at getting promoted from Lge 1 then I think something has gone wrong at Rovers.

Can't have it both ways. We should be better than them, I think we are, if you think that we aren't that's up to you but the natural follow up to that is that we've squandered a lot of money under this manager in the last 12 months.

Momentum? Over 37 games we're 19 points above them. So regardless of form we've shown ourselves to be considerably better than them this season, so far.

If you'd have offered Plymouth supporters survival after promotion this season the majority would have been happy with that. As would most supporters at most clubs promoted to a higher division. I suspect you'd be more than happy with Championship survival next season if we went up and wouldn't be expecting or demanding a promotion push, so what's the difference?

I don't agree the table is irrelevant. As I've explained, so far this season we've shown ourselves to be substantially stronger than Plymouth. By any measure we have a stronger squad, I'm sure 99% of 'experts' in football would agree with that. I know they beat us at their place. Doncaster thrashed us at home. Doesn't mean they are better than us.

As I say, if you don't think we do have a stronger squad than Plymouth perhaps we should be asking questions of our manager and his recruitment as to why armed with the biggest budget in League One history he's managed to end up with a team that you think shouldn't be favourites to overcome Plymouth.

I suspect if you go down to the bookies in May they'll agree we'll be strong favourites, and rightly so.

 

Nothing much has "gone wrong" at Rovers this season. In fact, we're having a very good, enjoyable season.  But just because Plymouth (and Shrewsbury) have assembled teams on "buttons", doesn't mean they shouldn't be competing with the likes of us who have spent a few bob. Thankfully, this is not the Premier League and wages do no roughly equal where a team finishes in the table.

There's no way "we should be better than them" - again, the arrogance from our bygone PL era. And I don't think Mowbray has squandered any money should we fail to go up - by and large he's bought well. Failure  to go up however will be an indictment of his management and coaching. 

To be honest, I'd have taken survival for us this season after our indifferent start, but I suspect that Argyle fans (a feisty lot) would have expected far better results than was the case until a few months ago. Should we gain promotion I would see survival next season as the main aim. The difference is I don't think Mowbray is good enough in the higher division. 

Of course, the table is irrelevant in the play-offs. In any case, and as a clear warning for Rovers, the play-offs have a history of the team finishing 6th overcoming the team finishing 3rd. 

We may or may not be "strong favourites" with the bookies. Again, it's irrelevant when the whistle blows in the play-offs. 

 

[Mattyblue]

9 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

 

 

To be honest, I'd have taken survival for us this season after our indifferent start

 

You'd have taken 3rd division survival, in September? After going down from the higher league with an unheard of high points tally of 51 points (and that was with Coil till Feb), after keeping hold of the players we wanted (plus some decent looking additions)?

Yes, yes Blackburn Rovers fans shouldn't demand anything anymore, but surely you have higher expectations than that?

[jim mk2]

It didn't look good at the start did it ? And there was a large section of fans who wanted Mowbray to be sacked. 

[JHRover]

14 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

 

Nothing much has "gone wrong" at Rovers this season. In fact, we're having a very good, enjoyable season.  But just because Plymouth (and Shrewsbury) have assembled teams on "buttons", doesn't mean they shouldn't be competing with the likes of us who have spent a few bob. Thankfully, this is not the Premier League and wages do no roughly equal where a team finishes in the table.

There's no way "we should be better than them" - again, the arrogance from our bygone PL era. And I don't think Mowbray has squandered any money should we fail to go up - by and large he's bought well. Failure  to go up however will be an indictment of his management and coaching. 

To be honest, I'd have taken survival for us this season after our indifferent start, but I suspect that Argyle fans (a feisty lot) would have expected far better results than was the case until a few months ago. Should we gain promotion I would see survival next season as the main aim. The difference is I don't think Mowbray is good enough in the higher division. 

Of course, the table is irrelevant in the play-offs. In any case, and as a clear warning for Rovers, the play-offs have a history of the team finishing 6th overcoming the team finishing 3rd. 

We may or may not be "strong favourites" with the bookies. Again, it's irrelevant when the whistle blows in the play-offs. 

 

 

Ultimately if we don't go up then things will have gone disastrously wrong and winning a few games on the way won't make up for that. A very good, enjoyable season only really means anything if we end it with promotion, otherwise it is a failure, potentially a very damaging failure. This is our best and possibly only chance to get up. Look at our esteemed owners for evidence on that front. If we don't go up Mowbray will have blown it big style.

Why is it arrogance to think that Blackburn Rovers with this squad should be better than Plymouth fresh out of League Two? Presumably if Accy Stanley get up and we don't you won't be expecting us to be better than them either? That's a dangerous and slippery slope to get onto.

There should be pressure and expectation on us. This club and its history means we should be expectant. It isn't delusional or disrespectful. Its the reality of supporting a big club at this level. We should be getting promoted. Failure to do so amounts to one of two things - either we haven't performed to the level we should or the squad Mowbray has assembled at substantial cost isn't as good as it should be.

If Plymouth or anyone else overcome us in the play-offs I do not believe it will be because they are better than us. And if it is then Mowbray has some questions to answer.

Some people seem to enjoy playing us as the plucky underdogs who are up against the odds all the time. We are the big boys and need to have the standards and expectations of them.

[Mattyblue]

it was a poor start jim, but my main worry was us not making the top 6, not going down to the 4th division!

[JHRover]

15 minutes ago, meadows said:

We could win eight & draw one and not go up, making it one defeat in 35. How would that be ‘things going disastrously wrong’?

 

Not going up would be failure. I'm sure anyone at the club would agree. The manager and players aren't being judged on how many games they avoid defeat in.

The disaster aspect comes into play because of what is likely to come next.

With Venkys track record and financial situation at the club we would be reliant on them not repeating the mistakes of last time we missed promotion.

It also hasn't escaped my attention that there will be an exodus of players, which again could spell disaster unless Venkys quickly get the chequebook out (unlikely in my opinion).

Gary Bowyer delivered long unbeaten runs in the Championship. We lost 5 in 28 in his first full season as manager. Meant nothing in the end as he was criticised by some for too many draws and we ended up missing out on promotion. Venkys decided to reduce their overheads, with disastrous results. Unless someone knows what the owners are going to do next my policy is to look at what they did last time - sell everyone and not invest - the result being further avoidable decline and relegation.

 

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

On 24/03/2018 at 07:22, Paul said:

I never gamble so I’m just asking out of interest. How is it people can gamble on our rivals to win? All I want today is to see Wigan and Shrewsbury lose. I guess your ideal outcome would be for both to lose and to have a successful day betting?

Why not bet on other games then you’d get double the pleasure? Backing rivals to win is surely a waste as you can’t really want them to win?

Please don’t think I’m critical I simply don’t understand how people can effectively bet against their own team. 

Just because I gamble on our rivals winning doesn't mean I want them to win, it's me trying to soften the blow if/when they do win with a bit of cash. 

I will bet on a Wigan/Shrewsbury double every game until the end of the season now with 75% of my winnings from the previous week. My initial stake was £20 so this is all I will lose - if/when one of them doesn't win I will more than likely stop gambling on it as it's job done. However if they do the unthinkable and win every week on roughly the odds I got this weekend I would end up with over £40,000. Question is will I have the balls to be gambling £000's on a Wigan/Shrewsbury double if it get's to that stage!

I'd would obviously still rather Rovers went up but that kind of money will certainly help soften the blow.

[jim mk2]

2 hours ago, JHRover said:

 

Why is it arrogance to think that Blackburn Rovers with this squad should be better than Plymouth fresh out of League Two? Presumably if Accy Stanley get up and we don't you won't be expecting us to be better than them either? That's a dangerous and slippery slope to get onto.

There should be pressure and expectation on us. This club and its history means we should be expectant. It isn't delusional or disrespectful. Its the reality of supporting a big club at this level. We should be getting promoted. Failure to do so amounts to one of two things - either we haven't performed to the level we should or the squad Mowbray has assembled at substantial cost isn't as good as it should be.

If Plymouth or anyone else overcome us in the play-offs I do not believe it will be because they are better than us. And if it is then Mowbray has some questions to answer.

Some people seem to enjoy playing us as the plucky underdogs who are up against the odds all the time. We are the big boys and need to have the standards and expectations of them.

It's arrogance because we're no better than Plymouth or any other club.  How dare the likes of "little" clubs like Shrewsbury or Plymouth challenge Rovers, don't they know their station in life which is to be subservient to the great Blackburn Rovers? 

There's expectation on us only because of past glories - which are rapidly fading from view. It is disrepectful to "expect" to roll over other teams. I would also remind you that "bigger" clubs than Rovers have spent long periods at this level. I'm sure their fans found it a humbling experience - and are the better for it. Some of our fans need to learn to respect our opponents - even at this "lowly" level.