[Archived] THE BATTLE FOR PROMOTION....WON.

[DE.]

6 minutes ago, Glosrover said:

did they play a full strength team??

They had a guy with a fractured cheekbone playing in a mask, so yeah, I imagine so!

[Bigdoggsteel]

18 minutes ago, Glosrover said:

did they play a full strength team??

I presume so. Be pretty stupid to work so hard to get to a final, only to play a weakened side. If they didn't want to win it, they should have gotten knocked out early like us 

[AlanK]

2 hours ago, 47er said:

Never at any point do I think or did I suggest TM should go in the summer and I cannot see how you could have reached that conclusion (apart from you getting involved in the often febrile atmosphere on here I thought you decried).Interestingly you are agreeing with Linguino but he has the opposite view to you!. 

Nor do I think we are top in spite of TM and that its entirely down to the players and nowhere did I suggest it.

I do think he can get away with the over-cautious attitude he  has and not be  not punished so much for it in this league. I don't think that approach will work higher up, hence I don't see him as a long-term manager for us.

I hope I'm wrong by the way, because he has brought some integrity back to the club which his successor may not have.However in my ideal world, he would continue to play a role in the club to support a more imaginative manager. 

Got to admit I agree with Paul.

And to talk of replacing the guy who has done nothing but good for us whether it be in the long or short term is just not something we even need to contemplate right now. 

 

[DE.]

Unless Venky's invest a fairly significant amount of money I don't see us doing much more than trying to survive should we get promoted. I'd actually be quite confident of TM keeping us up in that instance, as I think his cautious approach would get us the points needed. A lot of it wouldn't be pretty but much like this season (so far) I think we'd get the job done. For that reason alone I'd hope that TM sticks around. 

[ChrisPriceBaldSpot]

I think if we do go up then counter attacking football against the better teams will suit us down to the ground. I think mid table in the championship is more than doable. TM will have them working on a different style of play over the summer and I am sure 3 at the back will be on the cards. Our squad has the players to play that formation now. Keeping Armstrong for another year must be priority number one as his pace will be deadly on the break. 

[JBiz]

5 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

If we step up a division we'll need to significantly improve performances all across the board individually and collectively.   

Do you not think this years individual and collective performances are a huge improvement on last year? Remember, it was only on GD that we dropped, I think this exact squad playing to this level would be easy mid table in the championship.

I agree that opposition is far less talented and expensive here, but I also think that playing more “football” teams as opposed to set piece specialists and hardmen might suit some of us.

Either way we will need reinforcements... let’s start speculating on that after promotion is mathematically secure though  

[Mike E]

My summer would start with renewing Graham's contract, enquiring about Armstrong and Chapman, and looking at a hard nut cb and a 'street' target man to  gradually take over Graham.

Don't know who I'd look at striker-wise, but think a return for Hanley would be a decent cb move. Esp' alongside a mobile partner like Lenihan and the Scotland captain.

[Admiral Nelsen]

2 minutes ago, Mike E said:

My summer would start with renewing Graham's contract, enquiring about Armstrong and Chapman, and looking at a hard nut cb and a 'street' target man to  gradually take over Graham.

Don't know who I'd look at striker-wise, but think a return for Hanley would be a decent cb move. Esp' alongside a mobile partner like Lenihan and the Scotland captain.

 

Agree about Graham, Armstrong & Chapman. I'm pretty happy with our CB options though, assuming nobody gets sold. Mulgrew & Lenihan are more than capable at that level, and Downing & Williams and if needed, Wharton, are decent back up. Hanley would be class, but I'd guess he'd take up a fair amount of our budget, even on loan.

Maybe if Mowbray wants to play 3 at the back we could do with an extra body there, but otherwise I'd be looking to use whatever money we have further up the pitch. 

 

[AllRoverAsia]

21 minutes ago, Mike E said:

My summer would start with renewing Graham's contract, enquiring about Armstrong and Chapman, and looking at a hard nut cb and a 'street' target man to  gradually take over Graham.

Don't know who I'd look at striker-wise, but think a return for Hanley would be a decent cb move. Esp' alongside a mobile partner like Lenihan and the Scotland captain.

Danny wants to stay and says he never wanted to leave after relegation. He is already in talks re contract extension. Good news.

[G Somerset Rover]

Not a chance of Hanley moving back unfortunately; their fans love him at Norwich - been immense by all accounts.

[Dreams of 1995]

50 minutes ago, Biz said:

Do you not think this years individual and collective performances are a huge improvement on last year? Remember, it was only on GD that we dropped, I think this exact squad playing to this level would be easy mid table in the championship.

I agree that opposition is far less talented and expensive here, but I also think that playing more “football” teams as opposed to set piece specialists and hardmen might suit some of us.

Either way we will need reinforcements... let’s start speculating on that after promotion is mathematically secure though  

I think you are under estimating the Championship, Biz.

We have a core group of players that you'd believe would be good enough to compete in the Championship (Raya, Mulgrew, Lenihan, Smallwood?, Dack, Bennett and Graham) but the rest are either untested, loan players or not good enough.

As you say we are speculating way beyond our current position but it's fair to assume that Williams, Gladwin, Whittingham, Caddis, Evans(?), Downing, Ward (even though he is on loan atm) & Conway will all need replacing with better players. Likewise Armstrong, Payne, Chapman and Antonson will either need signing or replacing.

The one thing that has been noticeable to the ever present fans this season is the huge gulf in quality between League 1 and the Championship. There are periods of the game in which mid-table Championship clubs would have put us to the sword. Mowbray had limited time to put together a squad capable of achieving promotion this season and, by the looks of it, he will achieve that. I think we'll see, or at least I think we need, substantial player turnaround in order to become a mid-table Championship team again.

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Biz said:

Do you not think this years individual and collective performances are a huge improvement on last year? Remember, it was only on GD that we dropped, I think this exact squad playing to this level would be easy mid table in the championship.

I agree that opposition is far less talented and expensive here, but I also think that playing more “football” teams as opposed to set piece specialists and hardmen might suit some of us.

Either way we will need reinforcements... let’s start speculating on that after promotion is mathematically secure though  

Given the big drop in the standards of this division - no not really. Maybe we would have just stayed up, Dack would have gotten us the goals from midfield that might have made a difference. This season we've been winning by playing well for 45 minutes at the most, you can't do that in the Championship.

I like Mowbray as a bloke and he's a great figurehead for the club. He's managed to unite the different factions at Rovers by and large more or less on his own. We owe him lots. However sentiment only takes you so far. We don't look a well coached team to me, individual skills have papered over the cracks in our lack of cohesive team play. We still seem to be quite brittle under pressure. Hanging on by our fingertips at home to the mighty Southend isn't how I thought we'd be playing now.

I'd like to keep Mowbray as manager but I'd like a change in the first team coaching staff.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Mike E said:

My summer would start with renewing Graham's contract, enquiring about Armstrong and Chapman, and looking at a hard nut cb and a 'street' target man to  gradually take over Graham.

Don't know who I'd look at striker-wise, but think a return for Hanley would be a decent cb move. Esp' alongside a mobile partner like Lenihan and the Scotland captain.

Pointless signing Chapman until he's had a good half season back playing. I'd have him back on a loan but I wouldn't consider a permanent signing.

[rigger]

13 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Pointless signing Chapman until he's had a good half season back playing. I'd have him back on a loan but I wouldn't consider a permanent signing.

It may be the only time that we could afford him. Take a risk!

[JBiz]

Just now, Dreams of 1995 said:

I think you are under estimating the Championship, Biz.

We have a core group of players that you'd believe would be good enough to compete in the Championship (Raya, Mulgrew, Lenihan, Smallwood?, Dack, Bennett and Graham) but the rest are either untested, loan players or not good enough.

As you say we are speculating way beyond our current position but it's fair to assume that Williams, Gladwin, Whittingham, Caddis, Evans(?), Downing, Ward (even though he is on loan atm) & Conway will all need replacing with better players. Likewise Armstrong, Payne, Chapman and Antonson will either need signing or replacing.

The one thing that has been noticeable to the ever present fans this season is the huge gulf in quality between League 1 and the Championship. There are periods of the game in which mid-table Championship clubs would have put us to the sword. Mowbray had limited time to put together a squad capable of achieving promotion this season and, by the looks of it, he will achieve that. I think we'll see, or at least I think we need, substantial player turnaround in order to become a mid-table Championship team again.

 

I don’t agree on a few of those. Particularly Williams who is an asset to our squad imo and he’s furthered this by looking the part as a CB. I think that LCB position in a three at the back system is perfect for him.

Evans is a tricky one too- there’s been times when I would’ve completely agreed with you but I think he does offer an option. If I was the manager though I would replace him if it was possible (potentially Byrne from Oldham) but I’d still value him as a squad central option a league above. Same with Downing. Certainly filled a gap for us this season!

Ive also been ever present this season, and I haven’t seen this huge gulf. There is certainly a gap between the bottom and the top (just like in all leagues) but as the championship this season is showing, the better teams in league 1 last season have done better than a few basket case jobs in the division above.

The main point I was originally making in relation to TS’s post; I think our team is better now than 12 months ago, even if it is a division below.

26 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Given the big drop in the standards of this division - no not really. Maybe we would have just stayed up, Dack would have gotten us the goals from midfield that might have made a difference. This season we've been winning by playing well for 45 minutes at the most, you can't do that in the Championship.

I like Mowbray as a bloke and he's a great figurehead for the club. He's managed to unite the different factions at Rovers by and large more or less on his own. We owe him lots. However sentiment only takes you so far. We don't look a well coached team to me, individual skills have papered over the cracks in our lack of cohesive team play. We still seem to be quite brittle under pressure. Hanging on by our fingertips at home to the mighty Southend isn't how I thought we'd be playing now.

I'd like to keep Mowbray as manager but I'd like a change in the first team coaching staff.

I admit and agree there are times (like Saturday) when we’ve looked brittle, but 12 months ago that game would’ve never ended 1-0. 

It takes a long time to turn that mentality around. You can see it and feel it in the ground still, the tension won’t dissipate till we’ve shown we can consistently get results at home. I don’t think this is about cohesion and coaching, I think it’s about confidence and experience.

For example, I don’t think the tactic on 60 minutes went to “shut up shop lads and sit deep”.. it’s a natural reaction to pressure in games when you're struggling for possession(especially with a narrow lead)! A confident Dack in his pomp takes that ball down on the edge of our own box, looks up and hits a channel to counter - a greener Payne panicked, tried an overhead clearance and put us back under the cosh!

 

[JBiz]

Just to add, the damage done losing thousands of fans and dropping like a stone so far, extends past 100m+ of debt!

It is not merely a coincidence, that our away performances have been better overall for a long time, even going back to 2014! If I’m statistically incorrect on that, I apologise profusely- but I know I’m not the only fan who thinks we’ve played better on the road in recent years, even if performances aren’t backed up by results!

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

29 minutes ago, rigger said:

It may be the only time that we could afford him. Take a risk!

It's big risk. He's already got a history of these sorts of injuries.

[blueboy3333]

2 hours ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I think you are under estimating the Championship, Biz.

We have a core group of players that you'd believe would be good enough to compete in the Championship (Raya, Mulgrew, Lenihan, Smallwood?, Dack, Bennett and Graham) but the rest are either untested, loan players or not good enough.

As you say we are speculating way beyond our current position but it's fair to assume that Williams, Gladwin, Whittingham, Caddis, Evans(?), Downing, Ward (even though he is on loan atm) & Conway will all need replacing with better players. Likewise Armstrong, Payne, Chapman and Antonson will either need signing or replacing.

The one thing that has been noticeable to the ever present fans this season is the huge gulf in quality between League 1 and the Championship. There are periods of the game in which mid-table Championship clubs would have put us to the sword. Mowbray had limited time to put together a squad capable of achieving promotion this season and, by the looks of it, he will achieve that. I think we'll see, or at least I think we need, substantial player turnaround in order to become a mid-table Championship team again.

 

I think you may be overestimating it. Mowbray did well last season points-wise with the cluster-ferk he inherited from Coyle. As someone said the other day, we would have finished 9th if his 10 week points haul had been extrapolated over a full season. He did it with the same back five as we have now (Raya Nyambe, Williams, Lenihan, Mulgrew), we've swapped Lowe for Smallwood and brought Dack in who is a far better player than anything we had last season in his position. Minus Gallagher and the odd brief cameo from Joao and Emnes and we have as good a squad now than last season in the Championship.

Millwall and Sheff Utd are doing very well in the the Championship with pretty much the same squads they had in League 1. Cardiff look to be going up after nearly going down last season. Not much has changed in their squad.

There's nothing to fear in the Championship.

[benhben]

2 hours ago, Biz said:

The main point I was originally making in relation to TS’s post; I think our team is better now than 12 months ago, even if it is a division below.

 

I am far happier with our team now than the last 3 or 4 years. When you look at the teams we put out last season I very rarely felt any excitement or connection. A number of journeymen on high wages. And some just bad players. 

Now we have a younger more exciting team who seem to care more. The only downside is a couple of our best are loan players. 

[Stuart]

2 hours ago, Biz said:

Just to add, the damage done losing thousands of fans and dropping like a stone so far, extends past 100m+ of debt!

It is not merely a coincidence, that our away performances have been better overall for a long time, even going back to 2014! If I’m statistically incorrect on that, I apologise profusely- but I know I’m not the only fan who thinks we’ve played better on the road in recent years, even if performances aren’t backed up by results!

Not sure that’s statistically true but I agree it does feel that way.

[Speedie's Gonna Get Ya]

8 hours ago, 47er said:

What about the word "Dyche"?

Indeed and (dare I say it) well worth researching. Good management from him and above. Their ethos is no accident.

[USABlue]

On 4/8/2018 at 10:03, philipl said:

My forecast is we have one or two horror defeats waiting for us plus a scraped draw in the run in.

We have fantastic resilience but some day soon its not going to be enough for us. We have vulnerabilities and at least one opponent will roll the lucky dice and convert our weaknesses into goals.

That said, we are comfortably the better equipped side in every game from now to season end so we go into every game as the winners presumptive. Put the Rovers squad alongside the squad of every team from now to season end and you are going to pick at least seven Rovers players in every game from the combined squads.

My current forecast is therefore W3 D1 L2 or 95 points- our incredible run of recent wins has brought our needed win percentage down to 50% with six to go.

If Shrewsbury achieve W6 D0 L0 in their last 6 they get to 99 points. They need 100% wins and still are probably going into the play offs as the gap is four points and goal difference. Rovers achieving W4 D2 L0 and automatic promotion is our's unless the Shrews average six wins by more than 3.5 and all our wins are by no more than 1 goal.

Wigan can get to 104 points and we can get to 103 points... and still not go up as Champions which I would guess will set a record which could stand for at least a century.

Never mind yesterday's performance but this tells explains just what a monster result yesterday's win was. Gillingham and Doncaster will be just as big for us. 

 

 

That's how I feel too.

[jim mk2]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

I think you may be overestimating it. Mowbray did well last season points-wise with the cluster-ferk he inherited from Coyle. As someone said the other day, we would have finished 9th if his 10 week points haul had been extrapolated over a full season. He did it with the same back five as we have now (Raya Nyambe, Williams, Lenihan, Mulgrew), we've swapped Lowe for Smallwood and brought Dack in who is a far better player than anything we had last season in his position. Minus Gallagher and the odd brief cameo from Joao and Emnes and we have as good a squad now than last season in the Championship.

 

I think Tommy Hoban of Watford was a regular defender under Mowbray last season

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

4 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Given the big drop in the standards of this division - no not really. Maybe we would have just stayed up, Dack would have gotten us the goals from midfield that might have made a difference. This season we've been winning by playing well for 45 minutes at the most, you can't do that in the Championship.

I like Mowbray as a bloke and he's a great figurehead for the club. He's managed to unite the different factions at Rovers by and large more or less on his own. We owe him lots. However sentiment only takes you so far. We don't look a well coached team to me, individual skills have papered over the cracks in our lack of cohesive team play. We still seem to be quite brittle under pressure. Hanging on by our fingertips at home to the mighty Southend isn't how I thought we'd be playing now.

I'd like to keep Mowbray as manager but I'd like a change in the first team coaching staff.

The way I see it is this.  We have a league one side with a smattering of championship quality which has been enough to get us promoted*    Next year, without major investment, we will have a smattering of championship quality with a league one side.  

*not taking this for granted?

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, jim mk2 said:

I think Tommy Hoban of Watford was a regular defender under Mowbray last season

I thought he spent a lot of the season injured Jim. I could be wrong, I'm trying hard not to think too much about last season.