[Archived] THE BATTLE FOR PROMOTION....WON.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Norbert Rassragr said:

Personally I think Cattermole is either past it, or at that point in his career we'd be signing another Danny Murphy.

Or another Whittingham ?

[Bbrovers2288]

Carttermole without doubt is an upgrade on anything we have defensively in midfield. Some of you need to open your eyes with Smallwood, after an initial bright start he has faded badly to become one of our worst and least effective players, if he stays it’s for a sub place. Can I remind you he couldn’t secure a place in the same Rotherham team that went down without a whimper. Should’ve said Whittingham to be going too. We need a mixture of steel and experience badly, team just now is far too lightweight, as Wigan showed when they eventually overpowered us.

think u will find the majority of that list are either out of contract or being relegated. Mcgeady wouldn’t have been mega bucks at Preston for example. 

Funnily enough the ones u said weren’t ridiculous - the pboro lads- are the most expensive quoted. Go figure. 

As for Hanley, if you believe he is a good defender then god help you, the Aberdeen boy has took his place in Scotland team and ten times better.

those thinking that’s a 50 mill budget don’t know football and I said those are players to enquire about not sign them all. So clearly didn’t understand post. For the record I don’t play football manager

[Bbrovers2288]

5 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Or another Whittingham ?

He has just turned 30, so no not really 

[dallydally]

From the start of December until now

Top Six

1 Blackburn Rovers 22-51

2 Plymouth Argyle 20-46

3 Rotherham United 22-43

4 Wigan Athletic 20-41

5 Shrewsbury Town 21-41

6 Bristol Rovers 22-34

COYB!!!

•  

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Bbrovers2288 said:

He has just turned 30, so no not really 

I've always liked Cattermole as a player, he's a bit in the Savage mould. Having said that he'll be on big bucks at Sunderland and he's not exactly set the world on fire up there. Maybe a return to Lancashire would do him good. I could see Wigan wanting him back.

[Bigdoggsteel]

25 minutes ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Carttermole without doubt is an upgrade on anything we have defensively in midfield. Some of you need to open your eyes with Smallwood, after an initial bright start he has faded badly to become one of our worst and least effective players, if he stays it’s for a sub place. Can I remind you he couldn’t secure a place in the same Rotherham team that went down without a whimper. Should’ve said Whittingham to be going too. We need a mixture of steel and experience badly, team just now is far too lightweight, as Wigan showed when they eventually overpowered us.

think u will find the majority of that list are either out of contract or being relegated. Mcgeady wouldn’t have been mega bucks at Preston for example. 

Funnily enough the ones u said weren’t ridiculous - the pboro lads- are the most expensive quoted. Go figure. 

As for Hanley, if you believe he is a good defender then god help you, the Aberdeen boy has took his place in Scotland team and ten times better.

those thinking that’s a 50 mill budget don’t know football and I said those are players to enquire about not sign them all. So clearly didn’t understand post. For the record I don’t play football manager

McGeady was on loan at Preston, so I am pretty sure they weren't paying all his wages. Talented player, one of Irelands most talented in a long time, bad moves cost him a decent career. However, if you think you have seen inconsistent, think again until you have watched McGeady. 

As for your dig about saying I would have the Peterborough lads, well big difference between signing 2 up and comers in their mid 20s as opposed to ,say, Fabio, as you suggested among others.   

Fans were complaining about us having players on 25,000 a week in the championship, more than half the players you named are definitely on more than that. You don't need a PHD in footballanomics to know we don't need or want to go down that route again. 

In my opinion we should be looking at good league 1 players and then casting our net to Scotland and even Ireland to begin with, combining these with the some of the under 23s who are ready to step up.  I would much rather a young hungry team than going down the route of signing cast offs from Sunderland 

[Bbrovers2288]

Sunderland are skint and will need to rip up contracts of a lot of their players, they have had a shocker of a season but there is still talent there. Don’t personally think mcgeady is out of our reach but il respect your opinion. Fabio is out of contract so you would be saving a fee, if he wanted ridiculous wages then yea fair enough move on however we do still need a left back. We will no doubt also utilise the loan market again although this has given us some success I still like players to be our own 

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 minutes ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Sunderland are skint and will need to rip up contracts of a lot of their players, they have had a shocker of a season but there is still talent there. Don’t personally think mcgeady is out of our reach but il respect your opinion. Fabio is out of contract so you would be saving a fee, if he wanted ridiculous wages then yea fair enough move on however we do still need a left back. We will no doubt also utilise the loan market again although this has given us some success I still like players to be our own 

I agree, the more we own ourselves the better. I like Oviedo at Sunderland, so I would take a look at him, left back as well. Signing McGeady would be a lottery. Him and Chapman on the wings could be a revelation though. It would just depend on what McGeady we got

To be honest, you did make some valid suggestions. I think saying you would sell Smallwood made me focus on the negatives  

If we can somehow sign Armstrong up early , it would be huge. I would even take him on loan again if needs be. A front 4 of Chapman, Dack, McGeady and Armstrong sounds pretty tasty 

[Joar]

I'm sure there are some gems in league 1 that could take the step up to the championship. I've not seen Callum Camps play (except half of the Tottenham replay, where he seemed at least full on energy and running), but he can't be half bad? I guess it might be unfair on both him and Travis/Tomlinson to bring in a young central midfielder though.

Preston haven't done too badly by bringing in players from the Irish Premiership either, even if the step seems big. Granted Maguire and Horgan are more squad players atm, but they can't have cost too much, and there might be potential there. The prob is I've never seen any of them play, so guess you would need som people with good knowledge of the league and playyers. Didn't Reading sign Shane Long and  Kevin Doyle from Cork back in the day also?

[Bbrovers2288]

First thing I would do to start us off would be get graham on a new deal, but after that second priority would be Armstrong yea. Of the other loans, I like Payne but he is very small and can be bullied out of games to the point of being a passenger so for me it’s a no. Antonsson Just isn’t a very good footballer to the point of I don’t know what he brings, a def no for me. 

I get your feelings towards Smallwood, loved him at start of the season but his levels have dropped drastically and I like a midfield hardnut to grab games by the scruff of the neck and berate others round about them who aren’t pulling their weight. Think mark Hughes in our prom season, David Dunn laterally. Smallwood seems like too nice a guy to do that and when he is off, he is off. Iv given up Evans despite some recent form. Do think the team needs some steel for when backs are up against the wall, champ can be blood and guts at times when we will be under the cosh and if we have a soft underbelly we will be punished a lot more than we were this season 

[G Somerset Rover]

58 minutes ago, dallydally said:

From the start of December until now

Top Six

1 Blackburn Rovers 22-51

2 Plymouth Argyle 20-46

3 Rotherham United 22-43

4 Wigan Athletic 20-41

5 Shrewsbury Town 21-41

6 Bristol Rovers 22-34

COYB!!

Plymouth are the buggers that every team in the play-offs will want to avoid. All being well it shouldn't be a concern of ours though!

[Bbrovers2288]

Just now, Joar said:

I'm sure there are some gems in league 1 that could take the step up to the championship. I've not seen Callum Camps play (except half of the Tottenham replay, where he seemed at least full on energy and running), but he can't be half bad? I guess it might be unfair on both him and Travis/Tomlinson to bring in a young central midfielder though.

Preston haven't done too badly by bringing in players from the Irish Premiership either, even if the step seems big. Granted Maguire and Horgan are more squad players atm, but they can't have cost too much, and there might be potential there. The prob is I've never seen any of them play, so guess you would need som people with good knowledge of the league and playyers. Didn't Reading sign Shane Long and  Kevin Doyle from Cork back in the day also?

Without doubt there is and I’d be happy for us to make a move on a few of them. Player that really impressed me was Harrison from Bristol rovers 

[Bigdoggsteel]

5 minutes ago, Joar said:

I'm sure there are some gems in league 1 that could take the step up to the championship. I've not seen Callum Camps play (except half of the Tottenham replay, where he seemed at least full on energy and running), but he can't be half bad? I guess it might be unfair on both him and Travis/Tomlinson to bring in a young central midfielder though.

Preston haven't done too badly by bringing in players from the Irish Premiership either, even if the step seems big. Granted Maguire and Horgan are more squad players atm, but they can't have cost too much, and there might be potential there. The prob is I've never seen any of them play, so guess you would need som people with good knowledge of the league and playyers. Didn't Reading sign Shane Long and  Kevin Doyle from Cork back in the day also?

Preston signed Andy Boyle too. I would say they got him, Horgan and Magure for a combined fee of less than £100,000. Horgan is probably the best of the bunch, Maguire has been injured a fair bit this season, but has scored a few since getting back. Although this has coincided with a bit of a blip in Prestons form. 

It is a huge step up though as you say. Chris Forrester(Peterborough) and Richie Towell(Rotherham on loan from Brighton) were the stand out players in the league when they moved to England and neither have set the world alight really. I actually thought Towell would do ok in the Premiership, but now he is in League 1. I would put the standard on par with League 2 and maybe I am being a bit generous. You have 1 or 2 teams then playing Europa league, it's kind of a weird set up. Standard is improving as coaching methods get better and some money is being put in. Teams struggle to get decent crowds though. Most Irish people support English clubs, apart from some die hard League of Ireland fans.

Ya, Reading signed Doyle and Cork said they would throw Long in as part of the deal. Long was more involved with hurling at the time. Worked out well for both parties that deal. 

It wouldn't do Rovers any harm to have a scout over here anyway. Relatively cheap exercise. 

[DE.]

I used to think Cattermole was decent, but a Sunderland fan at work absolutely hates him and thinks he's massively overrated outside of Sunderland. Judging by their forums that's a fairly common consensus so I'd be wary of signing him now. As long as we keep Dack and don't bring back Jason Lowe I think I'll be satisfied with our summer business. We'll surely activate Graham's 12 month extension too?

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, DE. said:

I used to think Cattermole was decent, but a Sunderland fan at work absolutely hates him and thinks he's massively overrated outside of Sunderland. Judging by their forums that's a fairly common consensus so I'd be wary of signing him now. As long as we keep Dack and don't bring back Jason Lowe I think I'll be satisfied with our summer business. We'll surely activate Graham's 12 month extension too?

 

That's some good expectation management  

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Carttermole without doubt is an upgrade on anything we have defensively in midfield. Some of you need to open your eyes with Smallwood, after an initial bright start he has faded badly to become one of our worst and least effective players, if he stays it’s for a sub place. Can I remind you he couldn’t secure a place in the same Rotherham team that went down without a whimper. Should’ve said Whittingham to be going too. We need a mixture of steel and experience badly, team just now is far too lightweight, as Wigan showed when they eventually overpowered us.

think u will find the majority of that list are either out of contract or being relegated. Mcgeady wouldn’t have been mega bucks at Preston for example. 

Funnily enough the ones u said weren’t ridiculous - the pboro lads- are the most expensive quoted. Go figure. 

As for Hanley, if you believe he is a good defender then god help you, the Aberdeen boy has took his place in Scotland team and ten times better.

those thinking that’s a 50 mill budget don’t know football and I said those are players to enquire about not sign them all. So clearly didn’t understand post. For the record I don’t play football manager

Cattermole will be on massive wages and hes a constant in a Sunderland team falling like a stone. I appreciate that you can pick gems from relegated sides but you seem to want to devour the whole carcas once their slim survival chances die off.

I do believe Hanley is a very good Championship defender. Thats after watching his consistently excellent performances for us that led to a player of the season award. That said, i dont think centre back is our main priority as I am more than happy with Mulgrew and Lenihan, nor do I think we could afford or attract him back after his form at Norwich.

I do think we need a good quality central midfielder as one of our main priorities but I would keep Smallwood to add bite alongside him.

I know we are in League 1 but you seem a bit too eager to disband a squad thats accumulating a very impressive consistent haul of points. We will need strengthening but also to utilise the core thats getting us success in the first place.

[Bbrovers2288]

Well because we can’t afford to be slow on the uptake this year, last time we done that in the champ we ended up with some last min panic signings and we all know how that ended....., 

At the moment we have a lg 1 squad, and we need to add experience. We are on a good run granted but we aren’t blowing opposition away, and every game we have spells of giving the opposition the initiative , which we can’t afford in the league above. Mulgrew is another year older and was never blessed with pace even in his heyday. End of the day we have two converted mids playing at the back, bit risky to rely on that in my opinion. I’d like a no nonsense centre half.

if Cattermole wants massive wages then fair enough move on, but he won’t be inundated with offers so either he accepts he paycut and stays in champ or good luck in league 1. 

Few folk have got caught up in our moderate success this year thinking we are good enough already for champ, as said at the start we can’t afford to stay still. A fairly big upgrade needed in my opinion 

[DE.]

A fairly big upgrade needed to challenge for promotion/playoffs, probably - but to survive? I don't think so. It's not like Ipswich, Preston, Sheff Utd or Millwall  have significantly better squads then we do, but they're all doing just fine. The fact is, along with Wigan and Shrewsbury we aren't just top of the table, we're totally dominating this league. We've only lost 5 out of 40 matches, despite playing poorly for a decent chunk of the season, which suggests our team is actually well above L1 standard.

[JBiz]

2 hours ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Carttermole without doubt is an upgrade on anything we have defensively in midfield. Some of you need to open your eyes with Smallwood, after an initial bright start he has faded badly to become one of our worst and least effective players, if he stays it’s for a sub place. Can I remind you he couldn’t secure a place in the same Rotherham team that went down without a whimper. Should’ve said Whittingham to be going too. We need a mixture of steel and experience badly, team just now is far too lightweight, as Wigan showed when they eventually overpowered us.

think u will find the majority of that list are either out of contract or being relegated. Mcgeady wouldn’t have been mega bucks at Preston for example. 

Funnily enough the ones u said weren’t ridiculous - the pboro lads- are the most expensive quoted. Go figure. 

As for Hanley, if you believe he is a good defender then god help you, the Aberdeen boy has took his place in Scotland team and ten times better.

those thinking that’s a 50 mill budget don’t know football and I said those are players to enquire about not sign them all. So clearly didn’t understand post. For the record I don’t play football manager

Smallwood offers a lot more than just what he does with the ball. I’m surprised you have the front to say others “don’t know football”, especially considering most opinions of Smallwood attribute him as the nastier leader in the centre we’ve craved for years.

Cattermole? Did you sleep through the past 8 years? Do you think we need more journeymen midfielders looking for a paycheck? He certainly was an upgrade on any team at this level 5 years ago, I’m not sure you could say the same now.

You also describe performances, victories as “rubbish”... to me that is just ridiculous. Might not have been a perfect 90 minutes or a hammering that you expect, but you don’t lose you 1 in 30 playing “rubbish” consistently.

Beating teams 2-1 away with nervy spells is not “rubbish”. Do you understand the term pressure?

Ofcourse we can improve but perhaps it’s terminology you need to rethink- Rubbish is what Coyle and Kean consistently churned out. Unorganised, below par effort, incompetent and uncreative crap. Room for improvement with this lot but “rubbish”?

Hanley - one of the best centrebacks we’ve had for a few years, in my opinion. Certainly not Phil Jones level, he ain’t clever enough but Grant was a brave centrehalf who started his career here. Him and Duffy had a decent partnership, and I’d rate Grant way above Sean’s level.

 

 

[Fraserkirky]

The boy Lyndon Gooch at Sunderland is the one we should be after. Right winger

[Bigdoggsteel]

45 minutes ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Well because we can’t afford to be slow on the uptake this year, last time we done that in the champ we ended up with some last min panic signings and we all know how that ended....., 

At the moment we have a lg 1 squad, and we need to add experience. We are on a good run granted but we aren’t blowing opposition away, and every game we have spells of giving the opposition the initiative , which we can’t afford in the league above. Mulgrew is another year older and was never blessed with pace even in his heyday. End of the day we have two converted mids playing at the back, bit risky to rely on that in my opinion. I’d like a no nonsense centre half.

if Cattermole wants massive wages then fair enough move on, but he won’t be inundated with offers so either he accepts he paycut and stays in champ or good luck in league 1. 

Few folk have got caught up in our moderate success this year thinking we are good enough already for champ, as said at the start we can’t afford to stay still. A fairly big upgrade needed in my opinion 

We are in League 1, but I would say our squad is better than the one we had in the Championship. So was that squad a Championship squad? 

If we played a number of Under 23s, would we have an Under 23s squad? 

I don't think its as simple as saying our squad is this or that. As it stands we are beating whats in front of us. I would fancy our chances against plenty of Championship teams 

[OJRovers]

Nolan at Shrewsbury would be a good signing if we could get him. I can’t believe anyone is seriously suggesting Catermole after our experience with Murphy, Etuhu, Whittingham. Plenty of better midfielders out there!

[Fraserkirky]

This squad is better than the one we went down with last year, no doubt. 

When we go up we need to establish how we are going to play next year and what are targets are. Then we make the tough decisions on personnel. I think we have some good players at the club but there are a few who have found their standard.

[Dreams of 1995]

Just now, OJRovers said:

Nolan at Shrewsbury would be a good signing if we could get him. I can’t believe anyone is seriously suggesting Catermole after our experience with Murphy, Etuhu, Whittingham. Plenty of better midfielders out there!

Let's not let Murphy, Etuhu and Whittingham cloud your judgement on experienced midfielders. Sometimes things don't work out.

Cattermole has been injured for the past 2 season anyway. He's not been an ever present in a failing side like some claim. As a matter of fact I'm pretty sure he became one of Allardyce's and Dick Advocaat's key men, in seasons when Sunderland did the miraculous and survived beyond all expectation. He's also signed a 5 year deal not so long back and will be on big wages so there's about 1% chance he will end up here.

He's nowhere near as bad as people are making out. I wouldn't trust the Sunderland fans' word as they practically despise any player that has played for them over the past 3 years.

I think it was Gary Neville that has said you get players that play in the Premier League but then you get "Premier League" players and Cattermole has spent his entire career there. To me that would suggest he's far better than most here are giving him credit for.

He's not going to sign for us anyway so it's an irrelevant argument.

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

8 minutes ago, OJRovers said:

Nolan at Shrewsbury would be a good signing if we could get him. I can’t believe anyone is seriously suggesting Catermole after our experience with Murphy, Etuhu, Whittingham. Plenty of better midfielders out there!

Agree with the sentiment , but you are being very, very harsh on Whittingham including him with those two wasters.