[Archived] THE BATTLE FOR PROMOTION....WON.

[arbitro]

A really good interview with Paul Hurst. I like him. He seems to be a grounded individual without an edge. He does mention the playoffs though and that Shrewsbury might be in them.

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11761/11326363/will-shrewsbury-bounce-back-paul-hurst-on-their-championship-push

[AlanK]

2 hours ago, Paul said:

If you say so. Your post, as I recall as I’m not going to look for it, was open to interpretation mainly, in my view, that you don’t see Mowbray as our long term manager. That’s how I read it and that is what I explained. 

The difference is I didn’t criticise you only saying what I understood. I didn’t accuse you of having an agenda etc.

I asked den his a question about his opposite view to the vast majority. Nothing else. It’s hard to understand why people get so exercised about this - unless of course they are the ones with an agenda.

Last comment on this for me as this type of exchange achieves nothing. 

Don't even bother trying to explain Paul

It's obvious you were looking for a balanced view. I can't really understand why that is so difficult for others to believe. I've tried doing similar things on here years ago and even now it's still the same name that crops up that would rather question others motives rather than just add something to the topic.

[blueboy3333]

13 hours ago, Paul said:

Where did I say I "want to believe" Den's opinion? I said I was interested in the "counter argument." I also said I've taken great note of a poster who I know has a deep knowledge of the game and was there. I asked Den if he went because I've heard him talk, in real life, about football on numerous occasions and I value his opinion based on the knowledge I know he has. 

There is nothing in this to suggest I want to believe what these two posters have to say but I have very much taken on board their opinions. Many of the other posts surrounding last night are from people I don't know, they could be ones with agendas.

Generally I associate "having an agenda" as a rather negative turn of phrase. I'm struggling to understand why I should be feeling negative. As you have chosen, again, to suggest words which I didn't write I have the feeling the person who is close to having an agenda is not me.

Your post was open to interpretation, just as you believe 47'ers was earlier in the season. If you don't like people 'suggesting' what you have written then don't do it to others.

 

[blueboy3333]

4 minutes ago, AlanK said:

Don't even bother trying to explain Paul

It's obvious you were looking for a balanced view. I can't really understand why that is so difficult for others to believe. I've tried doing similar things on here years ago and even now it's still the same name that crops up that would rather question others motives rather than just add something to the topic.

Paul likes to tell people what they have seen at a football match is wrong. He did it to me against Bradford. He isn't looking for a balanced view, he's looking for a view that correlates with his own and he views as positive. He calls it taking 'great note'. Obviously this is only my interpretation based on what is written.

As for the highlighted bit, who are you referring to?

 

[AggyBlue]

 

How can anyone be looking for a balanced view from someone who didn't go to the game?

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, AggyBlue said:

 

How can anyone be looking for a balanced view from someone who didn't go to the game?

 

If we just left it to people who actually went to Tuesdays game there'd be about 6 people posting on here.

[AggyBlue]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

If we just left it to people who actually went to Tuesdays game there'd be about 6 people posting on here.

That's not what I said is it?

Of course anyone can discuss the game afterwards.

I attend every game and I won't post my opinions on matches anymore, I don't blame others for not doing either. The messageboard has brought that on itself.

 

[K-Hod]

Good grief, that escalated quickly!

All views welcome, as long as people aren't deliberately being dicks.

[Dreams of 1995]

This weekend is probably the better set of fixtures for us. Wigan play Rotherham and Shrewsbury play Charlton (after the Bradford game tonight, of course) which are both games they could easily lose. We have a fixture in Bristol Rovers that you'd expect us to win but as we know anything can happen.

The weekend after and the ball is in the other court. A difficult game vs Peterborough whereas Wigan and Shrews play Fleetwood & Bury respectively.

The results this weekend are hugely important. I think whichever team loses next is going to be the team that finishes 3rd. 

[thorpefleet]

Well  it is  that good old fashion roller coaster ride again.    Despite T.M hard job to turn it all around (and the team of course) ,  Its looking like 2nd place is the best outlook.

I hope we dont fall to third tonight

Fingers crossed we dont have to see the playoffs. 

[Lucimo]

10 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

This weekend is probably the better set of fixtures for us. Wigan play Rotherham and Shrewsbury play Charlton (after the Bradford game tonight, of course) which are both games they could easily lose. We have a fixture in Bristol Rovers that you'd expect us to win but as we know anything can happen.

The weekend after and the ball is in the other court. A difficult game vs Peterborough whereas Wigan and Shrews play Fleetwood & Bury respectively.

The results this weekend are hugely important. I think whichever team loses next is going to be the team that finishes 3rd. 

Can't see anything other than a shrews win at Bradford. They are utter crap which surprises me as I thought Grayson would turn them into promotion candidates via playoffs. Hope I'm wrong though 

[den]

5 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

This weekend is probably the better set of fixtures for us. Wigan play Rotherham and Shrewsbury play Charlton (after the Bradford game tonight, of course) which are both games they could easily lose. We have a fixture in Bristol Rovers that you'd expect us to win but as we know anything can happen.

The weekend after and the ball is in the other court. A difficult game vs Peterborough whereas Wigan and Shrews play Fleetwood & Bury respectively.

The results this weekend are hugely important. I think whichever team loses next is going to be the team that finishes 3rd. 

It gets more interesting by the day. All we need to know is that every time we win, it gets much harder for Shrewsbury.  As fans all we can do now is get behind the team. Criticism of the manager/ tactics is fair enough, but IMO the players turning out for us now are doing the best they can. If it turns out to not be good enough, then so be it. From here on in, what will be, will be. This group of players in my opinion,  couldn’t have done much more. If we don’t go up then I wouldn’t be blaming them.  That would rest with the club.

for someone like me who’s criticised virtually everyone at the club including management and players for the last 8 years, that’s quite a turnaround.

[oldjamfan1]

3 minutes ago, thorpefleet said:

 

I hope we dont fall to third tonight

 

Impossible

[Hanks]

3 minutes ago, thorpefleet said:

Well  it is  that good old fashion roller coaster ride again.    Despite T.M hard job to turn it all around (and the team of course) ,  Its looking like 2nd place is the best outlook.

I hope we dont fall to third tonight

Fingers crossed we dont have to see the playoffs. 

We are 5 points clear of Shrewsbury so if we only draw at Bristol and they won their next two games we would still be second.

[DE.]

I've believed for a while that Wigan would go up as champions, so 2nd place wouldn't be a disappointment for me at all. It really doesn't matter as long as we go up. Our form has sustained despite questionable performances throughout the season so we should have enough to get us over the line. 

We'll see tonight just how much Sunday's defeat has taken out of Shrewsbury. If Bradford do take points off them we would have to suffer a serious implosion not to go up automatically.

 

[Dreams of 1995]

35 minutes ago, den said:

It gets more interesting by the day. All we need to know is that every time we win, it gets much harder for Shrewsbury.  As fans all we can do now is get behind the team. Criticism of the manager/ tactics is fair enough, but IMO the players turning out for us now are doing the best they can. If it turns out to not be good enough, then so be it. From here on in, what will be, will be. This group of players in my opinion,  couldn’t have done much more. If we don’t go up then I wouldn’t be blaming them.  That would rest with the club.

for someone like me who’s criticised virtually everyone at the club including management and players for the last 8 years, that’s quite a turnaround.

It's hard to criticise when you are in contention to win the league. Once the dust has settled you can always look at things with a more balanced view.

Promotion and all of the silly losses, bad tactics and terrible start to the season is forgotten. If we end up in the play offs then it becomes very difficult not to level some criticism at Mowbray or the players. For all the club has done wrong it isn't them that gets the points on the board and, for the large part, they've operated as a club should do this season. Our results on the pitch are entirely the fault of the manager, coaches and players, for the good and the bad.

I said it at the time and I say it now - I hope the pre-October results don't turn out to hurt us. Add wins against Oldham x2 and Southend (teams we should have beaten) and you are looking far more comfortable. The irk at them losses is that, largely, the team that played is the very players both of us agree have given their all. It does beg questions as to the quality of the team.

But, for all the negativity that post may seem to highlight, I am here for the ride and am very much enjoying going into every game expecting a win. I hope we lift the trophy in the end but ultimately as long as I am watching Championship football next year I don't particularly care.

 

 

[HowieFive0]

9 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

It's hard to criticise when you are in contention to win the league. Once the dust has settled you can always look at things with a more balanced view.

Promotion and all of the silly losses, bad tactics and terrible start to the season is forgotten. If we end up in the play offs then it becomes very difficult not to level some criticism at Mowbray or the players. For all the club has done wrong it isn't them that gets the points on the board and, for the large part, they've operated as a club should do this season. Our results on the pitch are entirely the fault of the manager, coaches and players, for the good and the bad.

I said it at the time and I say it now - I hope the pre-October results don't turn out to hurt us. Add wins against Oldham x2 and Southend (teams we should have beaten) and you are looking far more comfortable. The irk at them losses is that, largely, the team that played is the very players both of us agree have given their all. It does beg questions as to the quality of the team.

But, for all the negativity that post may seem to highlight, I am here for the ride and am very much enjoying going into every game expecting a win. I hope we lift the trophy in the end but ultimately as long as I am watching Championship football next year I don't particularly care.

 

 

Not directed at you Dreams but i dont get the emphasis on the bad start we had.Yes ,not the best starts but the season is played over 46 games. If we d had a decent start yet we d kept losing  one game in seven throughout the season and still in the same position as we are now would that be acceptable ?

People keep going on about how Wigan have blown away teams and been clinical but why are they not 20 points clear of us ? The only thing Wigan has blown (and Shrewsbury for that matter) are points /games in hand .Yet we re still second and in a very good position for promotion.I think sometimes its too easy (and i include myself in this !) to be hyper critical of your own team whilst thinking other teams are so much better than us. As the table states we re on a par with the other two teams at the very least. Im sure Shrews/Wigan fans look at our one defeat in 30 ? games and go "bloody hell they re unbeatable" yet we re a little bit more dismissive and talk up Shrewsburys ability to keep bouncing and back and how  Wigan dismiss sides  in a clinical fashion. 

As long as we get more points than one of the other two then we ll be promoted and thats the name of the game at the start of the season however the team has performed throughout.

 

[oldjamfan1]

2 minutes ago, HowieFive0 said:

Not directed at you Dreams but i dont get the emphasis on the bad start we had.Yes ,not the best starts but the season is played over 46 games. If we d had a decent start yet we d kept losing  one game in seven throughout the season and still in the same position as we are now would that be acceptable ?

People keep going on about how Wigan have blown away teams and been clinical but why are they not 20 points clear of us ? The only thing Wigan has blown (and Shrewsbury for that matter) are points /games in hand .Yet we re still second and in a very good position for promotion.I think sometimes its too easy (and i include myself in this !) to be hyper critical of your own team whilst thinking other teams are so much better than us. As the table states we re on a par with the other two teams at the very least. Im sure Shrews/Wigan fans look at our one defeat in 30 ? games and go "bloody hell they re unbeatable" yet we re a little bit more dismissive and talk up Shrewsburys ability to keep bouncing and back and how  Wigan dismiss sides  in a clinical fashion. 

As long as we get more points than one of the other two then we ll be promoted and thats the name of the game at the start of the season however the team has performed throughout.

 

Agree 100% with this

[JHRover]

39 minutes ago, HowieFive0 said:

Not directed at you Dreams but i dont get the emphasis on the bad start we had.Yes ,not the best starts but the season is played over 46 games. If we d had a decent start yet we d kept losing  one game in seven throughout the season and still in the same position as we are now would that be acceptable ?

People keep going on about how Wigan have blown away teams and been clinical but why are they not 20 points clear of us ? The only thing Wigan has blown (and Shrewsbury for that matter) are points /games in hand .Yet we re still second and in a very good position for promotion.I think sometimes its too easy (and i include myself in this !) to be hyper critical of your own team whilst thinking other teams are so much better than us. As the table states we re on a par with the other two teams at the very least. Im sure Shrews/Wigan fans look at our one defeat in 30 ? games and go "bloody hell they re unbeatable" yet we re a little bit more dismissive and talk up Shrewsburys ability to keep bouncing and back and how  Wigan dismiss sides  in a clinical fashion. 

As long as we get more points than one of the other two then we ll be promoted and thats the name of the game at the start of the season however the team has performed throughout.

 

I agree with all of that apart from the bad start part. Yes a season is 46 games and its not how you start but how you finish but the reality is that for a side expecting top 2 our start to the season was poor. If we do miss out I'm sure those first 10 games will be the ones identified as our undoing as we struggled to live up to pre-season expectations and it wasn't until November/December we put together form that launched us back into the pack. As you say we've done well to go on this run and catch up to Shrewsbury and Wigan but the reason we're not home and dry already is because our first 10 were pretty poor.

Wigan and Shrewsbury have from the word 'go' been in the top 2 and only our recent arrival at that party has seen them knocked out of it. If we maintain our form of Xmas to now I'm sure we'll at least keep hold of 2nd. But there's no room for error which is frustrating because despite a fantastic run of form and odd slip ups from the others we're still in a finely balanced situation and can't afford many errors, and that is because the other two established such a lead over us early on.

[oldjamfan1]

Just now, JHRover said:

I agree with all of that apart from the bad start part. Yes a season is 46 games and its not how you start but how you finish but the reality is that for a side expecting top 2 our start to the season was poor. If we do miss out I'm sure those first 10 games will be the ones identified as our undoing as we struggled to live up to pre-season expectations and it wasn't until November/December we put together form that launched us back into the pack. As you say we've done well to go on this run and catch up to Shrewsbury and Wigan but the reason we're not home and dry already is because our first 10 were pretty poor.

Wigan and Shrewsbury have from the word 'go' been in the top 2 and only our recent arrival at that party has seen them knocked out of it. If we maintain our form of Xmas to now I'm sure we'll at least keep hold of 2nd. But there's no room for error which is frustrating because despite a fantastic run of form and odd slip ups from the others we're still in a finely balanced situation and can't afford many errors, and that is because the other two established such a lead over us early on.

I think the point is though that any side can look back over the course of 46 games and point to something that could have been better. In our case, it was the start we made. That in itself is far from unusual as a side adjusts to life in a new division, and I would much rather start poorly then finish strongly than vice versa. If I were a Shrewsbury fan I would see Rovers as relentless just now and they have two absolute must-win games coming up, just to keep on our coat tails going into the final 4 matches. Bloody football eh? 

[OJRovers]

We need to pick up the performances between now and the end of the season not just to get promoted but to take forward to next year.

People often talk about promoted teams going into the new league full of confidence with a habit of winning. I know we have been winning but the last few performances would have been punished heavily in the Championship. On the flip side, look at Wigan, you can see them being better at the moment than a lot of Champ teams.

Feels like we're going to flop over the line if we do manage it.

[Boz]

How about a little bit of calm and bring some figures to the party?

It is generally said that two points per match (3 points for home matches and then 1 on your travels), throughout the season will do the trick, though 92 this season in Div 1 might not perhaps be enough.

So to extrapolate forward from where things currently stand ...

Wigan 98 - played 40 with 86 points, 3 home and 3 away remaining fixtures = 12

Rovers 95 - played 41 and 86 points, 2 home and 3 away = 9

Salop 95 - played 40 and 81 points, 4 home and 2 away = 14

So with a 17 superior goal difference, all might be well in our world. 

Though squeaky bum time all the same and those Bantams are welcome to  help out tonight .

Rovers can feel free to buck these stats and win all their fixtures, which would be the decent thing to do, especially to us long suffering supporters, however we all know that this is Rovers . 

[darrenrover]

4 wins and a draw would see us home as things currently stand, as worst case scenario. After tonight it still could remain the same but could only require 3 wins and a draw.

I can't see Shrewsbury winning their remaining 6 in any event if truth be known.

The worry has been more of the performances of late rather than the results: we've looked distinctly jaded and lacking in tempo and ideas.

It doesn't call for us to press the panic button but to remain calm and refocus, with perhaps a couple of changes in personnel and positions to the starting line up.

I'd much rather be in our position than Shrewsburys!

COYB!!

[Dreams of 1995]

1 hour ago, HowieFive0 said:

Not directed at you Dreams but i dont get the emphasis on the bad start we had.Yes ,not the best starts but the season is played over 46 games. If we d had a decent start yet we d kept losing  one game in seven throughout the season and still in the same position as we are now would that be acceptable ?

People keep going on about how Wigan have blown away teams and been clinical but why are they not 20 points clear of us ? The only thing Wigan has blown (and Shrewsbury for that matter) are points /games in hand .Yet we re still second and in a very good position for promotion.I think sometimes its too easy (and i include myself in this !) to be hyper critical of your own team whilst thinking other teams are so much better than us. As the table states we re on a par with the other two teams at the very least. Im sure Shrews/Wigan fans look at our one defeat in 30 ? games and go "bloody hell they re unbeatable" yet we re a little bit more dismissive and talk up Shrewsburys ability to keep bouncing and back and how  Wigan dismiss sides  in a clinical fashion. 

As long as we get more points than one of the other two then we ll be promoted and thats the name of the game at the start of the season however the team has performed throughout.

 

Ultimately you are always going to drop points over the course of a season, particularly in a league with 46 games + 3 cup competitions. You aren't afforded the rest Premier league teams get and even the gap between games in that league is questioned.

My point lies in that once the dust has settled from the league whichever club doesn't get automatic promotion is going to rue those spells that they lost games. The frustrating thing for Rovers is that our bad form happened very early on in the season where tiredness can't really be blamed. The rigours of the league seem to be catching up on us now but we are still not losing. I don't buy this excuse that players were getting used to the league - out of the starting 11 that played the opening game against Southend the majority of them had played at this level of the Championship for periods of their careers. I think Mulgrew and Raya were the only two which hadn't, from the top of my head. If we had come close to either Wigan or Shrewsbury's opening form we'd be well ahead on points now.

In conclusion though it's fair to say that the finish will be an exciting one for the neutral. A few twists and turns to come but I believe it will be the next team to lose that finishes 3rd.

 

[JBiz]

4 hours ago, K-Hod said:

Good grief, that escalated quickly!

All views welcome, as long as people aren't deliberately being dicks.