Championship 2018-19

[frosty]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Biesla has no experience of football in England. Will be culture shock for him.

Neither did two out of the three managers to win promotion from the Championship this season (well, Jokanovic did, but before he went up with Watford a couple of years back he didn't).

Bielsa would be a hell of a coup for a team that have been in the Championship (or lower) for almost 15 years. He's highly unpredictable so it could either go extremely well or it could quite easily all end in tears by about November (or earlier - check his Lazio episode). It'd be definitely worth the risk though.

[JacknOry]

58 minutes ago, ossyian said:

Was Don Revie a top international footballer ? ???

6 caps i think.

 

This is where some are going a little off with this - we are talking established England players that have gone on to be top managers. People have mentioned Clough - which..hello of course he was one of the very best but had 2 caps for England. Venables similar.

Look at the likes of Pep, Ziidane, Frank Rijkard, Luis Enrique,  Cruyff, Simeone and the like that have gone on to become successful managers. 

i just wonder if foreign players are just mentally smarter than our players and know the game. In the modern era we have not really had any former 'top' England international to go into management and do well.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, ossyian said:

Was Don Revie a top international footballer ? ???

No, good player but not that good.

[JacknOry]

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

To be fair, it seems that under Heckingbottom, theyve actually gone backwards compared to under Christensen, his record albeit only over 16 games is incredibly poor, the fans seem unanimous in their response, its like with Lambert, patience is only good if you see signs of progression, and as I said and the stats prove, they have slid further under Heckingbottom.

Not sure you can go down the "not another foreign manager" route either, I know you like promoting British managers but theyve given many a chance over the last few years, Redfearn, McDermott, Hockaday, Monk, Evans and now Heckingbottom and it hasnt worked for any of them.

Bielsa seems to be a bit of a firecracker but hes a bit of a tactical revolutionist whose managed some big clubs and is highly respected by managers including Guardiola and Pochettino, so maybe it would be a far more exciting appointment than someone like McLaren, Lee Johnson, Dean Smith, or than a total novice like a Lampard or a Gerrard.

Agree, think they were in playoff contention when he took over. He then won just 4 games in 16. Hardly enough to earn the gig for longer IMO. 

[Mattyblue]

They’ve had 20 managers since winning the title 26 years ago.

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, frosty said:

Neither did two out of the three managers to win promotion from the Championship this season (well, Jokanovic did, but before he went up with Watford a couple of years back he didn't).

Bielsa would be a hell of a coup for a team that have been in the Championship (or lower) for almost 15 years. He's highly unpredictable so it could either go extremely well or it could quite easily all end in tears by about November (or earlier - check his Lazio episode). It'd be definitely worth the risk though.

So Jokanovic did have championship experience then before they went up..

Wolves spent alot of money to go up. Plus have a super agent helping them. 

I rather have an manager with knowledge of this league. I feel Heckingbottom was dealt a very poor hand by the owner.

I think the risk is far too much for me. Failed at Lille and lasted 2 days at Lazio..yes 2 days

Edited June 1, 2018 by chaddyrovers

[frosty]

9 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

So Jokanovic did have championship experience then before they went up..

Wolves spent alot of money to go up. Plus have a super agent helping them. 

I rather have an manager with knowledge of this league. I feel Heckingbottom was dealt a very poor hand by the owner.

I think the risk is far too much for me. Failed at Lille and lasted 2 days at Lazio..yes 2 days

My point with Jokanovic was that when he was appointed at Watford, people would have said then that it was a risk as he didn't 'know the league'. Yet straight up they went......

Wagner is another one, Stam was a penalty kick away from going up (in both of their first full seasons managing in England). Carvalhal got in the play offs a couple of times. And that's just off the top of my head in the last couple of years.

I've acknowledged it could go pear shaped with Bielsa but if you're a Leeds fan then it'd be hard to say no to somebody of that stature. Especially when whoever they appoint will probably be out the door within a few months anyway.

[Norbert Rassragr]

That last point is very true Frosty. If Biesla has a bad month or two, he'll be out and someone else will come in . The rate they're going it's only a matter of time before Coyle is hired.

[roverandout]

10 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

So Jokanovic did have championship experience then before they went up..

Wolves spent alot of money to go up. Plus have a super agent helping them. 

I rather have an manager with knowledge of this league. I feel Heckingbottom was dealt a very poor hand by the owner.

I think the risk is far too much for me. Failed at Lille and lasted 2 days at Lazio..yes 2 days

Owen coyle had experience of this league..how did that work out?

[chaddyrovers]

27 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Owen coyle had experience of this league..how did that work out?

But he on a special list dont hire at all cos he's clueless

Edited June 2, 2018 by chaddyrovers

[47er]

27 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Owen coyle had experience of this league..how did that work out?

TBF Chaddy said "knowledge" of this league not experience.

How you could have experience of this league without gaining the knowledge is beyond me but Coyle managed it.

[roversfan99]

18 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Very unfair on Heckingbottom IMO. no chance to bring his own players he wanted, working with unbalance squad, far too many foriegn players.

Christiansen started well but things went bad after a couple of months  

They had Rosler, Christiansen and Milanic in the past 4 seasons aswell. 

Leeds in last few years have gone nowhere. 

Biesla has no experience of football in England. Will be culture shock for him. Yes they have some managers who has been successful but alot more failures. 

Lee Johnson and Dean Smith have both done good jobs at their clubs. I would prefer one of those than someone like Biesla. McClaren is McClaren. 

My point is, that yes he didnt bring in any players, but with the same players that Christensen had, who was deemed to be underachieving, he was doing considerably worse thn him.

Find it strange that you think Bielsa, a manager with a good CV is written off, yet you are so sure Lampard is a good appointment, a man with no managerial or coaching experience at all.

[scotchrover]

On 01/06/2018 at 19:12, davulsukur said:

Like us, Leeds are just one owner decision from being a laughing stock.

Sunderland have impressively carried the flag for a while and now Leeds could take it off them with another awful manager appointment.

Leeds are just not destined for success anymore. Anytime they get any positivity, it’s quickly stamped out. 

Disagree- West Brom and Swansea are closer to that than Leeds. Leeds will go under the radar because it’s been common practice for many years to hire and fire.

West Brom have foreign owner who doesn’t really know what’s going on at the club. They’re broke, meaning they’re currently in limbo. I’ll bet some decision there are Venky-like in summer!

Swansea have a number of owners which are currently at war with each other. The fans absolutely detest the Yanks for the lack of investment, despite millions coming in from the TV deal. Add to the fact they’ve avoided relegation a good few times by the skin of their teeth, just like Sunderland did, they could well be heading down again.

Common denominator in all of this? Foreign owners! With all this new TV money, why are there very few British owners? 

[chaddyrovers]

6 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

My point is, that yes he didnt bring in any players, but with the same players that Christensen had, who was deemed to be underachieving, he was doing considerably worse thn him.

Find it strange that you think Bielsa, a manager with a good CV is written off, yet you are so sure Lampard is a good appointment, a man with no managerial or coaching experience at all.

Last 2 jobs Bielsa has had, only 2 days at Lazio and massive disappointment at Lille. Winning 5 drawing 5 and losing 9. Not that good. 

Did I say Lampard was a good appointment? Or did I said its good to see Lampard willing to take a job in Championship and not think hes too good for this league. Lampard has been coaching sessions at Chelsea with the youth sides plus appointed Morris as his number 2 who experience coach tho not 1st team level. 

On Christiansen, was he doing that much of a bad job or the same with Heckingbottom. 

Surely what Leeds united is a manager who is there longer than 1 year or more..

In my opinion they will never get anywhere cos they dont get a manager time and let them build a squad. Far too much short term thinking with zero consideration of the long term

Edited June 2, 2018 by chaddyrovers

[roversfan99]

46 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Last 2 jobs Bielsa has had, only 2 days at Lazio and massive disappointment at Lille. Winning 5 drawing 5 and losing 9. Not that good. 

Did I say Lampard was a good appointment? Or did I said its good to see Lampard willing to take a job in Championship and not think hes too good for this league. Lampard has been coaching sessions at Chelsea with the youth sides plus appointed Morris as his number 2 who experience coach tho not 1st team level. 

On Christiansen, was he doing that much of a bad job or the same with Heckingbottom. 

Surely what Leeds united is a manager who is there longer than 1 year or more..

In my opinion they will never get anywhere cos they dont get a manager time and let them build a squad. Far too much short term thinking with zero consideration of the long term

Bielsas record is almost identical to Heckingbottom at Lille and Leeds respectively. One deserved more time and ones a massive disappointment? Not saying the 2 jobs are remotely similar but that seems inconsistent and hypocritical.

The point im making is their problem is not a lack of time, its the poor managers theyve appointed in the first place. If they appoint a good, suitable manager, then time in the job will result from his success. Short term success promotion is just as valid a system as giving someone 25 years, as long as you continue to appoint competent managers, Chelsea continue to win trophies, then replace managers at the sniff of any drop in standards, look at Watford, continually changing managers and never getting dragged anywhere near the bottom.

You cant just keep a man in a job long term if you arent seeing signs that he is the man to bring you success long term. Patience doesnt solve everything.

I feel like you obsess over "giving people time" a bit too much, its not always the answer and should only be allowed if the club feel that the manager is producing results and signs to suggest that he is the manager they need. Heckingbottom has a really poor record at Leeds, yes only over 16 games but Leeds have gone noticeably downhill even since Christiansens reign, which was also considered to be not good enough. So hed be saying

You also seem to have a desperation to avoid foreign managers, which is unfair as much as wed all like loads of English managers, if it was at my club I couldnt give a crap what nationality our manager is, I just want a successful one.

[chaddyrovers]

38 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

The point im making is their problem is not a lack of time, its the poor managers theyve appointed in the first place. If they appoint a good, suitable manager, then time in the job will result from his success. Short term success promotion is just as valid a system as giving someone 25 years, as long as you continue to appoint competent managers, Chelsea continue to win trophies, then replace managers at the sniff of any drop in standards, look at Watford, continually changing managers and never getting dragged anywhere near the bottom.

You cant just keep a man in a job long term if you arent seeing signs that he is the man to bring you success long term. Patience doesnt solve everything.

I feel like you obsess over "giving people time" a bit too much, its not always the answer and should only be allowed if the club feel that the manager is producing results and signs to suggest that he is the manager they need. Heckingbottom has a really poor record at Leeds, yes only over 16 games but Leeds have gone noticeably downhill even since Christiansens reign, which was also considered to be not good enough. So hed be saying

You also seem to have a desperation to avoid foreign managers, which is unfair as much as wed all like loads of English managers, if it was at my club I couldnt give a crap what nationality our manager is, I just want a successful one.

But Heckingbottom wasn't a poor choice tho. He done excellent at Barnsley. 

Watford and Chelsea might will have successful but look at other clubs who havent like Swansea, Leeds, Birmingham, etc. 

I believe in given a manager a proper chance and time. You appoint a manager for a reason so why backtrack so quickly. Unless it was a mess and you are in bottom 3 and manager who record is awful or things are well behind the scenes like De Boer at Palace or Coyle here or Coleman/Grayson at Sunderland. 

Leeds hire and fire policies over the last few years have achieve nothing but disappointment and failure to make the playoffs. 

I have nothing against foriegn managers at all but I prefer an British manager. I know if Mowbray was to leave tomorrow I know who my 3 choices shortlist would be. No foriegn manager would be on that list. Just for record I hope Mowbray doesnt anywhere for a number of years to come

Edited June 2, 2018 by chaddyrovers

[islander200]

6 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

But Heckingbottom wasn't a poor choice tho. He done excellent at Barnsley. 

Watford and Chelsea might will have successful but look at other clubs who havent like Swansea, Leeds, Birmingham, etc. 

I believe in given a manager a proper chance and time. You appoint a manager for a reason so why backtrack so quickly. Unless it was a mess and you are in bottom 3 and manager who record is awful or things are well behind the scenes like De Boer at Palace or Coyle here or Coleman/Grayson at Sunderland. 

Leeds hire and fire policies over the last few years have achieve nothing but disappointment and failure to make the playoffs. 

I have nothing against foriegn managers at all but I prefer an British manager. I know if Mowbray was to leave tomorrow I know who my 3 choices shortlist would be. No foriegn manager would be on that list. Just for record I hope Mowbray doesnt anywhere for a number of years to come

Who's your shortlist?

[blueboy3333]

On ‎31‎/‎05‎/‎2018 at 17:10, chaddyrovers said:

I think Lampard will do well there. Its good to see him taking on a Championship club instead of waiting for PL job like Shearer. Its very annoying he take a job when he had a chance. I remember him being interview after Hughes left and he was interested in Rovers job after Kean left. Didnt Kenny Dalglish recommend him to Shebby Singh?

 

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Did I say Lampard was a good appointment? Or did I said its good to see Lampard willing to take a job in Championship and not think hes too good for this league. Lampard has been coaching sessions at Chelsea with the youth sides plus appointed Morris as his number 2 who experience coach tho not 1st team level.

It was only 2 days ago FFS!

 

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, islander200 said:

Who's your shortlist?

1st choice - Damien Johnson

2nd choice - Gareth Ainsworth

3rd choice - Simon Grayson

4th Choice - Paul Heckingbottom

Edited June 2, 2018 by chaddyrovers

[JacknOry]

3 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

But Heckingbottom wasn't a poor choice tho. He done excellent at Barnsley. 

Watford and Chelsea might will have successful but look at other clubs who havent like Swansea, Leeds, Birmingham, etc. 

I believe in given a manager a proper chance and time. You appoint a manager for a reason so why backtrack so quickly. Unless it was a mess and you are in bottom 3 and manager who record is awful or things are well behind the scenes like De Boer at Palace or Coyle here or Coleman/Grayson at Sunderland. 

Leeds hire and fire policies over the last few years have achieve nothing but disappointment and failure to make the playoffs. 

I have nothing against foriegn managers at all but I prefer an British manager. I know if Mowbray was to leave tomorrow I know who my 3 choices shortlist would be. No foriegn manager would be on that list. Just for record I hope Mowbray doesnt anywhere for a number of years to come

I have known a lot of hypocrites, but you my friend - are the most boring of the lot.

Lampard will do well with no experience.

Beisla will fail despite an impressive CV

Heckingbottom deserved more time despite 4 wins in 16 games (form far worse  than the previous manager with same squad)

[roversfan99]

21 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

But Heckingbottom wasn't a poor choice tho. He done excellent at Barnsley. 

Watford and Chelsea might will have successful but look at other clubs who havent like Swansea, Leeds, Birmingham, etc. 

I believe in given a manager a proper chance and time. You appoint a manager for a reason so why backtrack so quickly. Unless it was a mess and you are in bottom 3 and manager who record is awful or things are well behind the scenes like De Boer at Palace or Coyle here or Coleman/Grayson at Sunderland. 

Leeds hire and fire policies over the last few years have achieve nothing but disappointment and failure to make the playoffs. 

I have nothing against foriegn managers at all but I prefer an British manager. I know if Mowbray was to leave tomorrow I know who my 3 choices shortlist would be. No foriegn manager would be on that list. Just for record I hope Mowbray doesnt anywhere for a number of years to come

There are hypocrisy, inconsistencies and holes throughout your arguments.

I never said Heckingbottom was a poor choice in terms of his previous job, but in hindsight he was for Leeds because his results were really poor at Leeds. That would be like saying that Coyle wasnt a bad appointment here because he once got Burnley promoted. As @JacknOry agrees, there is a clear decrease in results from the previous manager, who himself was deemed to be underperforming. 

You mention De Boer, you said it was correct to sack him after 4 games if im not mistaken. It doesnt make any sense that in an isolated incident, you think thats the right decision to show absolutely no patience, and that 4 games is enough to judge and 16 isnt for Heckingbottom.

Your point on Swansea/Leeds/Birmingham doesnt prove me wrong. Its all in the quality of manager, and the 3 you mentioned have continiously appointed poor manager after poor manager, and as I keep saying, thats where the issue lies. The quality of managers, if they got a manager that came in and pushed thim up the table, having a positive impact, do you still think they would sack him after a few months? The line in bold should read "Leeds' choices of managers appointed over the last few years have achieve nothing but disappointment and failure to make the playoffs."

To be honest, I dont get why you prefer British managers, you wouldnt be allowed to have that attitude if you was a chairman, and even if youd prefer a British manager, you have to judge all managers irrespective of their nationality. Which goes back to my De Boer point, your insistence that he was rightly sacked after 4 games makes a mockery of your almost exclusively "give a manager more of a chance" mantra.

Why you have a 3 man shortlist (with 4 names on it) as a potential Mowbray replacement doesnt make any sense either considering that there is no sign of him leaving soon, you dont want him to leave soon, and circumstances will most likely change massively when that time comes, but thats beside the point.

 

[Butty]

58 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

1st choice - Damien Johnson

2nd choice - Gareth Ainsworth

3rd choice - Simon Grayson

4th Choice - Paul Heckingbottom

Jesus god help us if Mowbray was to leave anytime soon.  

[ChrisPriceBaldSpot]

10 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

1st choice - Damien Johnson

2nd choice - Gareth Ainsworth

3rd choice - Simon Grayson

4th Choice - Paul Heckingbottom

What about ZZ

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

10 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

1st choice - Damien Johnson

2nd choice - Gareth Ainsworth

3rd choice - Simon Grayson

4th Choice - Paul Heckingbottom

I'm a big fan of Johnno also. I'm not sure he's management material yet but I think he'd make a cracking first team coach. Somebody will take a punt on him if he carries on being so successful.

[thorpefleet]

Looking at other big clubs i.e Leeds took  two to 3 seasons to get back out of league 1! So hoping Tony stays put until the club is financially fit again.

I am also suprised that Villa have managed to escape fair play regulation what clauses have been alright for them to spend while we were hit hard as was leeds ?

Now I am wondering who Tony will bring in to strengthen our squad .

I can only see a 14th  place next season with what we have or thereabouts.

thanks again for all your postings and keeping me up to date!!