Thursday deadline.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, JeffRover said:

Ultimately Mowbray can’t win in this situation. We all know that we need a nasty centre half. If he goes out and gets one permanent some will moan about ‘wasting the budget’, but if we get a loan some will say ‘why are we relying on loans?’ and ‘we should have kept Wharton instead’. Who’d want to be a football manager eh?

True, he can't please everyone. Fans want new signings, but also youth to be given the chance. Only 11 go out on the field though. It's like our loans here last season, I remember Antonnsson getting a lot of slack,  but now when mentioned its because he was an important member of the team who hasn't been replaced. Fans can move the goalposts to suit their arguments very easily. 

Mowbray just has to treat it like water off a ducks back. At the end of the day, results are what he will be judged on. 

[Paul Mani]

5 hours ago, JHRover said:

Unfortunately in Chelsea's case there are lots and lots of other Todd Kanes. Players who will have been lured to Chelsea as kids, moulded in Chelsea's academy and then spend their careers being farmed out all over the place. Kane will be 25 by the time he leaves Hull at the end of his loan and will have never kicked a ball in anger for Chelsea whilst moving round countless loan clubs.

As there are big drawbacks to ourselves relying on loan players, there are drawbacks to these sort of players who waste their careers with a nomadic existence when if they had put down roots at a decent Championship club or lower Premier League club there is every chance that over a few years they would develop into first team players.

The drawback to Rovers on relying upon loans is we have a nomadic existence ourselves where we cannot properly plan or develop a squad or identity because each and every summer we are waiting until the 11th hour until we discover who, if anyone, we are able to borrow, rather than seizing control of our destiny by owning our players.

Tammy Abraham - now 20 - last 2 years on loan at Swansea and Bristol City, 2 appearances for Chelsea

Ola Aina - now 21 - 3 appearances in 3 years at Chelsea, last season on loan at Hull

Lewis Baker - now 23 - never kicked a ball for Chelsea, last 3 years out on loan at Sheff Weds, MK Dons, Vitesse, Middlesbrough and now Leeds

Jeremie Boga - 1 appearance in 3 years at Chelsea - 3 years on loan at Rennes, Granada and Birmingham

Fankaty Dabo - 0 appearances - loans at Swindon and Vitesse

Michael Hector - 0 appearances - loans at Reading, Frankfurt and Hull

Tomas Kalas - now 25 - 2 appearances - loans at Vitesse, Cologne, Middlesbrough x 2 and Fulham x 2

Todd Kane - 24 - 0 appearances - loans at PNE, Rovers, Bristol City, Forest, Nijmegen, Groningen, Oxford and Hull

Kasey Palmer - 0 appearances - loans at Huddersfield x 2, Derby and Rovers

Plenty of others on the list.

Yes mate, but your initial point wasn’t about Chelsea. It was about ‘Todd Kane’ and whilst it’s happened at Chelsea as you have pointed out, that is more about Chelsea’s business model rather than the players.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

He's a better option than we have now. Rated highly by one of the best coaches in the world. Has half a dozen international appearances + a dozen PL appearances to his name combined with a few cup appearances here and there.

More experience at a higher level than Rothwell. Definitely would have been an excellent option on the left.

He's also Liverpool's youngest every goalscorer and Wale's second youngest goalscorer - only Bale beats him. I'd take him here any day of the week.

Better than what we have now? Come off it. Would he really start ahead of Bennett, Samuel or Palmer over the course of a tough 46 game Championship season? 

Where are you getting "a dozen" Premier league appearance from? He has 6, mostly off the bench. In fact he has more caps for Wales than appearance for Liverpool. Totally unproven in the championship and ,as I said, 18 years of age. 

I would take him here no doubt, but don't be getting carried away about him. He isn't actually Gareth Bale. 

[Dreams of 1995]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Better than what we have now? Come off it. Would he really start ahead of Bennett, Samuel or Palmer over the course of a tough 46 game Championship season? 

Where are you getting "a dozen" Premier league appearance from? He has 6, mostly off the bench. In fact he has more caps for Wales than appearance for Liverpool. Totally unproven in the championship and ,as I said, 18 years of age. 

I would take him here no doubt, but don't be getting carried away about him. He isn't actually Gareth Bale. 

If Dominic Samuel was as good Ben Woodburn he'd be playing for his country at every level since he was 15 and be coveted by great managers such as Klopp.

Take the Rovers goggles off please. Irrelevant anyway as he's off to Sheff Utd. Good luck to the lad.

As a side note, Samuel has only played roughly 20 games in this division spread over 6 years. Let's not bark about experience and then start using him as an example.

[Bigdoggsteel]

10 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

If Dominic Samuel was as good Ben Woodburn he'd be playing for his country at every level since he was 15 and be coveted by great managers such as Klopp.

Take the Rovers goggles off please. Irrelevant anyway as he's off to Sheff Utd. Good luck to the lad.

As a side note, Samuel has only played roughly 20 games in this division spread over 6 years. Let's not bark about experience and then start using him as an example.

Carefully sidestepped my mentioning of Bennett and Palmer though, didn't ya  

Woodburn has more potential than Samuel did when he was 18, but as things stand Woodburn is 18. A child. You are talking about him like Sheffield united have signed the answer to all of our problems. An unproven 18 year old is most definitely not better than what we have 

Edited July 31, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[JeffRover]

Has Duane Holmes gone anywhere yet? Sky linked us with him a while back.

Edited July 31, 2018 by JeffRover

[RevidgeBlue]

14 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Better than what we have now? Come off it. Would he really start ahead of Bennett, Samuel or Palmer over the course of a tough 46 game Championship season? 

Where are you getting "a dozen" Premier league appearance from? He has 6, mostly off the bench. In fact he has more caps for Wales than appearance for Liverpool. Totally unproven in the championship and ,as I said, 18 years of age. 

I would take him here no doubt, but don't be getting carried away about him. He isn't actually Gareth Bale. 

Oh do give over.

Woodburn wouldn't be better than Bennett, Samuel or Palmer up front?. Rightyho.......

If we unexpectedly signed him you'd change your tune instantly and hail it as the coup of the century!

 

 

 

[Dreams of 1995]

12 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Carefully sidestepped my mentioning of Bennett and Palmer though, didn't ya  

No sidestepping. Bennett and Palmer are more experienced in this league. But that's 2 men for 2 positions. If one of them gets injured that leaves Samuel - Woodburn is 100% better and more experienced at a higher level.

Palmer is an excellent player, no doubt. He's a great signing. He's also better than anything we have here permanently. 

If you believe Palmer and Bennett alone are good enough for this division and we wouldn't be better off by bringing in players like Woodburn out on them wings then you're either delusional or lying. Besides, is Bennett even an out and out winger anymore? I preferred him in centre midfield personally.

[Bigdoggsteel]

19 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Oh do give over.

Woodburn wouldn't be better than Bennett, Samuel or Palmer up front?. Rightyho.......

If we unexpectedly signed him you'd change your tune instantly and hail it as the coup of the century!

 

 

 

I said I would be happy to have him. What do you mean upfront? He plays midfield. No, I don't think he would be a better option than Bennett, Palmer or Samuel 

I definitely wouldn't hail it as the coup of the century for the reasons I have outlined, mostly due to the fact he is 18. When was the last time an 18 year old had a exceptional season in the Championship before Sessagnon at Fulham? 

Edited July 31, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Bigdoggsteel]

9 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

No sidestepping. Bennett and Palmer are more experienced in this league. But that's 2 men for 2 positions. If one of them gets injured that leaves Samuel - Woodburn is 100% better and more experienced at a higher level.

Palmer is an excellent player, no doubt. He's a great signing. He's also better than anything we have here permanently. 

If you believe Palmer and Bennett alone are good enough for this division and we wouldn't be better off by bringing in players like Woodburn out on them wings then you're either delusional or lying. Besides, is Bennett even an out and out winger anymore? I preferred him in centre midfield personally.

My point was that he isn't a better option as a starter than what we have, as you stated he was. I would take Woodburn and be very happy with the signing though, no doubt.

I like Bennett in the centre too, but I think he will be back on the right this season. His versatility is great. 

[dallydally]

19 minutes ago, JeffRover said:

Has Duane Holmes gone anywhere yet? Sky linked us with him a while back.

At Scunthorpe and yet another midfielder. We have enough of those

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Coyle was 85-90% to blame. We lost our opening game 4-1 to Norwich and even then it was apparent the players were under prepared. How many games did we lose 3-2 under him? Compare our centre midfield options then to now. We also didn't have a Dack. 

There was a noticeable improvement in the time Mowbray managed us in the Championship. Last season was different as League 1 required a different approach. 

We could have course get involved in a relegation battle, but we could just as easily be involved outside the play offs. 

If we'd have had Dack and the Raya of last season I think we would have stayed up that season.

[Dreams of 1995]

4 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I said I would be happy to have him. What do you mean upfront? He plays midfield. 

I definitely wouldn't hail it as the coup of the century for the reasons I have outlined, mostly due to the fact he is 18. When was the last time an 18 year old had a exceptional season in the Championship before Sessagnon at Fulham? 

Tammy Abraham.

Kasey Palmer

Lewis Cook

In fact, the list is endless at how many young lads have had exceptional seasons in the Championship..............lol

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

Tammy Abraham.

Kasey Palmer

Lewis Cook

In fact, the list is endless at how many young lads have had exceptional seasons in the Championship..............lol

Name 3 more so  

I said 18 year olds too, not just young lads in general! Samuel is a young lad to me ?

Edited July 31, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Butty]

53 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I don't think the mood has completely changed, if anything it's getting progressively more negative. Oh Sorry, I can't use the N word. I mean people are being cautious. 

You say we need 2 wingers and 2 strikers, which is there or thereabouts, but then you say we have signed,and I quote "NONE of those". What about Palmer? 

This "Big nasty" centre back you want, I am not sure if our recruitment has stretched as far as Wakefield. Would you not want Mulgrew and Lenihan starting anyway? 

Palmer isn't a winger he's definitely more of an attacking mid. He'll probably play on the left or right of the three behind the striker for us but he's definitely more comfortable centrally. So, arguably we haven't signed any of those players we needed. Time yet though..

[islander200]

Rich Sharpe tweeting that a story on Armstrong coming shortly.

Davenport likely to be out with injury for Ipswich 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Butty said:

Palmer isn't a winger he's definitely more of an attacking mid. He'll probably play on the left or right of the three behind the striker for us but he's definitely more comfortable centrally. So, arguably we haven't signed any of those players we needed. Time yet though..

He will play where Antonnsson or Armstrong played last season, so inside forward/winger

Hasn't been mentioned but I assume we are paying his wages? I wonder is there a fee involved too 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

3 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Self-confidence is always good  Irrationality is worrying however 

I saw him play once and I could see something there. He's been injured ever since.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, islander200 said:

Rich Sharpe tweeting that a story on Armstrong coming shortly.

Davenport likely to be out with injury for Ipswich 

Ok, well its time to get carried away so. Surely that means we are signing him? Otherwise Sharpe can feck right off 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 minutes ago, islander200 said:

Rich Sharpe tweeting that a story on Armstrong coming shortly.

Davenport likely to be out with injury for Ipswich 

Bloody hell, he didn't take long to jump on the treatment bench.

[Dreams of 1995]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Name 3 more so  

The lads I named were all teenagers.

Another one was Wilfired Zaha. Lookman was great at Charlton. Will Hughes at Derby.

As I said, the list is endless of teenagers that have had success at this level.

[islander200]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ok, well its time to get carried away so. Surely that means we are signing him? Otherwise Sharpe can feck right off 

Someone just asked him "Anything on Armstrong or anyone else"..his reply was "story on him coming shortly"

[JeffRover]

1 minute ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ok, well its time to get carried away so. Surely that means we are signing him? Otherwise Sharpe can feck right off 

This is gonna be a huge anticlimax. This transfer window is agony.

[Butty]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ok, well its time to get carried away so. Surely that means we are signing him? Otherwise Sharpe can feck right off 

My guess is the story will be something along the lines of us being priced out of a move. Be nice if it's something different though! 

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

The lads I named were all teenagers.

Another one was Wilfired Zaha. Lookman was great at Charlton. Will Hughes at Derby.

As I said, the list is endless of teenagers that have had success at this level.

We were saying "had exceptional seasons" you have now downgraded to "had success"  Not sure any of those 3 were exceptional, but I will give them to you because I am in a good mood. Still, far more teenagers struggle than succeed, so lets see with Woodburn.