Loan Window

[neophox]

Think we may get Brereton on a loan to buy deal if not someone else nicks him..

[roversfan99]

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16413310.they-werent-the-only-bids-rovers-boss-on-the-transfer-window/?ref=mac

Lets debunk a couple of myths.

“It was always the same,” Mowbray said of his budget.

“The budget was agreed when I went over to India in the summer and the budget has always been the budget."

Seems that Nixons theory that Venkys "killed a few chickens recently" to give us a sudden boost in the budget was actually a lie.

"Mowbray was disappointed he wasn’t able to add to the three permanent signings made before the window closed on Thursday."

People have been ridiculed for showing frustration, showing disappointment at how the window went. I even said to @chaddyrovers that I bet even Mowbray is disappointed to not sign players, and so it has proved. So rather than pretend that everything went to plan, and that everything is hunky dory, it didnt and theres proof.

He also said the following:

“It’s just frustrating that we had the opportunity to spend some money to try and improve this club long-term for the next four or five years, we missed the opportunity, it didn’t quite happen.

“But this short-termism of loans we will try and add some players who will excite the fans and help the team as we go on as when injuries and suspensions come, as the team will have to push harder than last year, some bodies will break down as we go on, we need to have some experience and quality waiting in the wings to make sure we don’t fall off the pace.”

That doesnt suggest that signing everyone on loan with an obligation to buy is necessarily what he has planned. Hence the phrase "short-termism."

"I’m sure if we’re doing okay then that funding will still be there for the next window." - just hope the money doesnt vanish.

[tomphil]

Nixon in shooting from hip to try and explain something he knows nothing about to make himself sound ITK again shocker !

Now it becomes even clearer why the FUD chief was so supportive of Kean/Coyle etc... he's a billybullhitter just like them.

[briansol]

2 hours ago, imy9 said:

Maddison is not in the starting 11 or bench for Peterborough...

He is not match fit at all. Haven't been involved in pre-season at all, and I'm very unsure if he has even trained much since he's been expected to go all season. Wasn't part of their Portugal trip. I we sign him I wouldn't expect him to be fit for a few weeks.

[danger19_80]

No real explanation as to why the Brereton and Freeman bids went in so late still

[briansol]

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16413310.they-werent-the-only-bids-rovers-boss-on-the-transfer-window/?ref=mac

Lets debunk a couple of myths.

“It was always the same,” Mowbray said of his budget.

“The budget was agreed when I went over to India in the summer and the budget has always been the budget."

Seems that Nixons theory that Venkys "killed a few chickens recently" to give us a sudden boost in the budget was actually a lie.

"Mowbray was disappointed he wasn’t able to add to the three permanent signings made before the window closed on Thursday."

People have been ridiculed for showing frustration, showing disappointment at how the window went. I even said to @chaddyrovers that I bet even Mowbray is disappointed to not sign players, and so it has proved. So rather than pretend that everything went to plan, and that everything is hunky dory, it didnt and theres proof.

He also said the following:

“It’s just frustrating that we had the opportunity to spend some money to try and improve this club long-term for the next four or five years, we missed the opportunity, it didn’t quite happen.

“But this short-termism of loans we will try and add some players who will excite the fans and help the team as we go on as when injuries and suspensions come, as the team will have to push harder than last year, some bodies will break down as we go on, we need to have some experience and quality waiting in the wings to make sure we don’t fall off the pace.”

That doesnt suggest that signing everyone on loan with an obligation to buy is necessarily what he has planned. Hence the phrase "short-termism."

"I’m sure if we’re doing okay then that funding will still be there for the next window." - just hope the money doesnt vanish.

Very interesting in many ways and quite a few myths debunked as you say. Main takeaways for me:

- The money was always there, and much more than imagined. I thought 3-5, but budget must have been about 10 mill+ given the players bought and bids. 

- Fair play to Venky's. They have obviously provided the money and responsibility to the manager to spend them without running the process through them.

- Wages seems to be our biggest obstacle. We can spend big on transfer fees, but averages wages. 

- Mowbray has aimed very high on targets and failed. The way he speaks about the Rothwell and Davenport transfers suggest he was aiming his main money on far bigger players:

“With due respect to Joe Rothwell and Jacob Davenport, they are a few hundred grand who will develop in to top players I’m sure.

“But we tried to add some more ready players that would help us be at the top end of the table.”

- Mowbray seems reluctant to spend on a stop-gap player, even if we might be lacking in options. So we will probably see some loans. 

[islander200]

32 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16413310.they-werent-the-only-bids-rovers-boss-on-the-transfer-window/?ref=mac

Lets debunk a couple of myths.

“It was always the same,” Mowbray said of his budget.

“The budget was agreed when I went over to India in the summer and the budget has always been the budget."

Seems that Nixons theory that Venkys "killed a few chickens recently" to give us a sudden boost in the budget was actually a lie.

"Mowbray was disappointed he wasn’t able to add to the three permanent signings made before the window closed on Thursday."

People have been ridiculed for showing frustration, showing disappointment at how the window went. I even said to @chaddyrovers that I bet even Mowbray is disappointed to not sign players, and so it has proved. So rather than pretend that everything went to plan, and that everything is hunky dory, it didnt and theres proof.

He also said the following:

“It’s just frustrating that we had the opportunity to spend some money to try and improve this club long-term for the next four or five years, we missed the opportunity, it didn’t quite happen.

“But this short-termism of loans we will try and add some players who will excite the fans and help the team as we go on as when injuries and suspensions come, as the team will have to push harder than last year, some bodies will break down as we go on, we need to have some experience and quality waiting in the wings to make sure we don’t fall off the pace.”

That doesnt suggest that signing everyone on loan with an obligation to buy is necessarily what he has planned. Hence the phrase "short-termism."

"I’m sure if we’re doing okay then that funding will still be there for the next window." - just hope the money doesnt vanish.

From reading that it sounds like it will be loans with no option to buy.

Although I'm a fan of Brereton I wouldn't be keen on him just coming on loan as it will only benefit Forest and the player long term not us.

If it's just loans with no view id rather more experience.

Nixon was saying all summer that we only had a very limited budget so obviously when he heard that we were bidding relatively big money came up with the Chicken killing story to cover his back.

Hopefully with this article it will put to bed the theory by some that we didn't bid 4 or 5 million for players and they weren't pretend bids.

Edited August 11, 2018 by islander200

[roversfan99]

3 minutes ago, briansol said:

Very interesting in many ways and quite a few myths debunked as you say. Main takeaways for me:

- The money was always there, and much more than imagined. I thought 3-5, but budget must have been about 10 mill+ given the players bought and bids. 

- Fair play to Venky's. They have obviously provided the money and responsibility to the manager to spend them without running the process through them.

- Wages seems to be our biggest obstacle. We can spend big on transfer fees, but averages wages. 

- Mowbray has aimed very high on targets and failed. The way he speaks about the Rothwell and Davenport transfers suggest he was aiming his main money on far bigger players:

“With due respect to Joe Rothwell and Jacob Davenport, they are a few hundred grand who will develop in to top players I’m sure.

“But we tried to add some more ready players that would help us be at the top end of the table.”

- Mowbray seems reluctant to spend on a stop-gap player, even if we might be lacking in options. So we will probably see some loans. 

 

1 minute ago, islander200 said:

From reading that it sounds like it will be loans with no option to buy.

Although I'm a fan of Brereton I wouldn't be keen on him just coming on loan as it will only benefit Forest and the player long term not us.

If it's just loans with no view id rather more experience.

Hopefully with this article it will put to bed the theory by some that we didn't bid 4 or 5 million for players and they weren't pretend bids.

One thing I differ on with you 2 is I still feel like its premature to credit Venkys for their intentions.

I judge them on what they do, not what they plan/intend to do. Historically they are very volatile in terms of one minute wanting to invest, then turning off the tap. Therefore, assuming the money is spent in the loan to buy market, or in Jan, then I will happily credit them then. If the money doesnt even materialise at a later day, then such inconsistencies do not warrant praise. If they do spend the money I will happily praise them.

I dont think theres anything stopping us getting loan to buys in the rest of the window. If Brereton is the man, or whoever, agree a loan with obligation to buy, youve essentially bought him, and credit shall be forthcoming. Mowbrays comments about short-termism are a concern.

In theory, reasonable wages but fees on players that can develop are a viable system, lets see if it works in practice, ultimately that depends on if they are consistent with it, and then if they are, if Mowbray can sign the correct players.

We ideally need a striker in the squad next week, as well as a winger.

[blueboy3333]

37 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16413310.they-werent-the-only-bids-rovers-boss-on-the-transfer-window/?ref=mac

Lets debunk a couple of myths.

“It was always the same,” Mowbray said of his budget.

“The budget was agreed when I went over to India in the summer and the budget has always been the budget."

Seems that Nixons theory that Venkys "killed a few chickens recently" to give us a sudden boost in the budget was actually a lie.

"Mowbray was disappointed he wasn’t able to add to the three permanent signings made before the window closed on Thursday."

People have been ridiculed for showing frustration, showing disappointment at how the window went. I even said to @chaddyrovers that I bet even Mowbray is disappointed to not sign players, and so it has proved. So rather than pretend that everything went to plan, and that everything is hunky dory, it didnt and theres proof.

He also said the following:

“It’s just frustrating that we had the opportunity to spend some money to try and improve this club long-term for the next four or five years, we missed the opportunity, it didn’t quite happen.

“But this short-termism of loans we will try and add some players who will excite the fans and help the team as we go on as when injuries and suspensions come, as the team will have to push harder than last year, some bodies will break down as we go on, we need to have some experience and quality waiting in the wings to make sure we don’t fall off the pace.”

That doesnt suggest that signing everyone on loan with an obligation to buy is necessarily what he has planned. Hence the phrase "short-termism."

"I’m sure if we’re doing okay then that funding will still be there for the next window." - just hope the money doesnt vanish.

LOL, Nixon has some brass neck. He just makes it up as he goes along. As you say, the frustration was real and is evident from the manager too. A couple of clowns  coming on here and telling everyone to stop being 'negative' is shown up be the idiocy it always was. 

[Tom]

At least he’s disappointed - better than just pretending all is going to plan as some prefer to do.

Need a striker in this week 

[islander200]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

 

One thing I differ on with you 2 is I still feel like its premature to credit Venkys for their intentions.

I judge them on what they do, not what they plan/intend to do. Historically they are very volatile in terms of one minute wanting to invest, then turning off the tap. Therefore, assuming the money is spent in the loan to buy market, or in Jan, then I will happily credit them then. If the money doesnt even materialise at a later day, then such inconsistencies do not warrant praise. If they do spend the money I will happily praise them.

I dont think theres anything stopping us getting loan to buys in the rest of the window. If Brereton is the man, or whoever, agree a loan with obligation to buy, youve essentially bought him, and credit shall be forthcoming. Mowbrays comments about short-termism are a concern.

In theory, reasonable wages but fees on players that can develop are a viable system, lets see if it works in practice, ultimately that depends on if they are consistent with it, and then if they are, if Mowbray can sign the correct players.

We ideally need a striker in the squad next week, as well as a winger.

I wasn't crediting Venkys was just making a point that we have now heard it from the horses mouth that we did in fact have the figures mentioned on deadline day and it wasn't a ploy to make the fans think we were trying in the market.

The only time i'l thank Venkys is when they accept an offer from someone to buy the club 

[FGS5635]

22 minutes ago, Tom said:

At least he’s disappointed - better than just pretending all is going to plan as some prefer to do.

Need a striker in this week 

Arguably TM's best quality. He calls a spade a spade rather than chucking out cliche after cliche

[Neal]

Harry Chapman on the bench with no minutes again today... Surely something can be done there. 

[FGS5635]

1 minute ago, Neal said:

Harry Chapman on the bench with no minutes again today... Surely something can be done there. 

Todays game was crying out for him having the last 25-30mins and giving us some width

[Stuart]

12 hours ago, danger19_80 said:

No real explanation as to why the Brereton and Freeman bids went in so late still

Surely tactical to see if they would accept a lower offer as the deadline approached. They didn’t blink first, we missed out.

But it suggests we don’t have the kind of war chest that allows you to go out and make deals early in the window

Edited August 12, 2018 by Stuart

[FGS5635]

I think the 2nd window and the loan to buy option means teams/players didnt feel pressured into a late decision like they would normally around deadline day

[Stuart]

Just now, FGS5635 said:

I think the 2nd window and the loan to buy option means teams/players didnt feel pressured into a late decision like they would normally around deadline day

Providing we don’t leave it until the 31st!

[Neal]

3 minutes ago, FGS5635 said:

Todays game was crying out for him having the last 25-30mins and giving us some width

Having had a quick look, Chapman was in the squad with no Fletcher, Huggil or Gestede in the squad... He's not getting a kick for them as it is, never mind when they're fit! Add the fact he's in the last year of his contract, I can't see him signing another one for them. 

[FGS5635]

Just now, Stuart said:

Providing we don’t leave it until the 31st!

True. But I think unless you overpay, the selling club/player are the ones that drag it to the last day thinking something better is coming.

Then late on people suddenly have a choice to make in no time

Also think players didnt know where they stood with current clubs in the 1st window with only 1 game played. Normally by the 31st you know if your likely toplay every week or not

[Stuart]

Just now, FGS5635 said:

True. But I think unless you overpay, the selling club/player are the ones that drag it to the last day thinking something better is coming.

Then late on people suddenly have a choice to make in no time

Also think players didnt know where they stood with current clubs in the 1st window with only 1 game played. Normally by the 31st you know if your likely toplay every week or not

I think we played exactly that game and the ‘selling clubs’ called us on it.

[FGS5635]

2 minutes ago, Neal said:

Having had a quick look, Chapman was in the squad with no Fletcher, Huggil or Gestede in the squad... He's not getting a kick for them as it is, never mind when they're fit! Add the fact he's in the last year of his contract, I can't see him signing another one for them. 

Has to be worth a punt. We are so narrow at times.

If he doesnt fancy a wideman and wants number 10 types drifting inside naturally, then he needs full backs brave enough to attack in the final 3rd and them provide the width

[FGS5635]

1 minute ago, Stuart said:

I think we played exactly that game and the ‘selling clubs’ called us on it.

Quite possibly. Im sure TM will look at this window and learn from it.

It must have been quite a long time since he had a window with decent funds.

Everyone can look at them self and find ways to improve, the manager is no different in that regard

[islander200]

6 minutes ago, Neal said:

Having had a quick look, Chapman was in the squad with no Fletcher, Huggil or Gestede in the squad... He's not getting a kick for them as it is, never mind when they're fit! Add the fact he's in the last year of his contract, I can't see him signing another one for them. 

They are still trying to bring in Bolaise and Besic on loan if they get them then no chance he will get any minutes for them this season 

[JHRover]

2 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16413310.they-werent-the-only-bids-rovers-boss-on-the-transfer-window/?ref=mac

Lets debunk a couple of myths.

“It was always the same,” Mowbray said of his budget.

“The budget was agreed when I went over to India in the summer and the budget has always been the budget."

Seems that Nixons theory that Venkys "killed a few chickens recently" to give us a sudden boost in the budget was actually a lie.

"Mowbray was disappointed he wasn’t able to add to the three permanent signings made before the window closed on Thursday."

People have been ridiculed for showing frustration, showing disappointment at how the window went. I even said to @chaddyrovers that I bet even Mowbray is disappointed to not sign players, and so it has proved. So rather than pretend that everything went to plan, and that everything is hunky dory, it didnt and theres proof.

He also said the following:

“It’s just frustrating that we had the opportunity to spend some money to try and improve this club long-term for the next four or five years, we missed the opportunity, it didn’t quite happen.

“But this short-termism of loans we will try and add some players who will excite the fans and help the team as we go on as when injuries and suspensions come, as the team will have to push harder than last year, some bodies will break down as we go on, we need to have some experience and quality waiting in the wings to make sure we don’t fall off the pace.”

That doesnt suggest that signing everyone on loan with an obligation to buy is necessarily what he has planned. Hence the phrase "short-termism."

"I’m sure if we’re doing okay then that funding will still be there for the next window." - just hope the money doesnt vanish.

Glad you covered all these points and saved me the job. Basically confirms that contrary to some opinions the window didn't go as hoped/planned. 

I'm particularly concerned by the final comment - it seems there is no guarantee that whatever money was available will still be in future - Venkys all over - it seems Mowbray knew he needed to get it spent this summer whilst the positivity was there and having failed to do so it might not be there again.

Also in mentioning loans he makes no reference to loans with agreements to buy. He refers to short term loans which suggests to me that those who come in on loan will merely be here on that basis and not as permanent down the line.

 

[islander200]

5 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Glad you covered all these points and saved me the job. Basically confirms that contrary to some opinions the window didn't go as hoped/planned. 

I'm particularly concerned by the final comment - it seems there is no guarantee that whatever money was available will still be in future - Venkys all over - it seems Mowbray knew he needed to get it spent this summer whilst the positivity was there and having failed to do so it might not be there again.

Also in mentioning loans he makes no reference to loans with agreements to buy. He refers to short term loans which suggests to me that those who come in on loan will merely be here on that basis and not as permanent down the line.

 

But you admit the money was there and we did bid for players at the prices reported.Mowbray confirmed this. 

I agree with the other points from reading that it looks like only loans and I wouldn't be surprised In the slightest if the money goes missing 

And in fairness not many people have said the window went as planned ,I mean pretty obvious the squad is lacking

Edited August 11, 2018 by islander200